933 réponses à ce sujet

[tmp7704]

Aradace wrote...

Again, better their current look than a blatant LotR ripoff.  If I wanted to play LotR, I'd go play LotRO or something.

I think if someone who wanted to play LoTR played DA, they'd be quite confused by the settings of the story being wildly different from what they knew from the books.

[NitaW]

I also prefer the DA:O version of the darkspawn, although I think that if the new version (of hurlocks, anyway) moved a bit differently, that might help them be taken seriously. The chipanzee/Putty Patrol hopping gait does nothing to make my Hawke (or me) shake in fear. The unhinged jaw thing would be a lot more daunting if there were sharp teeth included. Just IMO.

[AtreiyaN7]

While I'm okay with the current hurlock look because they more closely resemble their human origins, they could (and probably should) try something else. However, I don't want to see the DA:O hurlocks again - they really do look a bit too much like LotR orcs for my tastes.

[Aradace]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

While I'm okay with the current hurlock look because they more closely resemble their human origins, they could (and probably should) try something else. However, I don't want to see the DA:O hurlocks again - they really do look a bit too much like LotR orcs for my tastes.

QFT.
The old style is out of the question because of the blatant Tolkien ripoff.  But the new style is apparently out of the question as well because some folks find them too "cuddly".  The only solution?  Something new that isnt either of these options. 

[SkylinePigeon]

co-sign on the original post.

1) I don't understand why we're trying to hard not to make them look like generic fantasy enemies when they ARE generic fantasy enemies. But that's ok. People like fantasy because we enjoy and are comfortable with retellings of specific tropes. There is enough different in DA that the original Darkspawn designs don't have to be groundbreaking or anything.

2) the new designs look like 80s action figures. and not gruesome enough.

[TEWR]

and they flail their arms around like monkeys.


These must be the monkeys Sten encountered. Now we just need to see them fling their poo.

[Aradace]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

and they flail their arms around like monkeys.


These must be the monkeys Sten encountered. Now we just need to see them fling their poo.

Thanks for that image...Ill never think of the "Bolters" in the same way again.  Now, instead of them shooting bolts at me, Im going to think they're throwing poo at me lol.

[TEWR]

I just hope we never see their asses. They might be red and then I'll think of them as baboons.


actually.... considering they like S&M their asses probably are red. So they're baboons that like S&M.

[Lord Gremlin]

Yes, I loved original Darkspawn look, the new one is.. Bland. And by the way, during Return to Ostagar you actually meet heavily tattooed darkspawn.

[Aradace]

Lord Gremlin wrote...

Yes, I loved original Darkspawn look, the new one is.. Bland. And by the way, during Return to Ostagar you actually meet heavily tattooed darkspawn.

For me its not a bland vs not bland issue...It's a "JRR Tolkien ripoff" (Origins) vs "Hey, some of these guys look silly but at least its not LotR."

[TEWR]

what's wrong with it being somewhat similar (even though I see no similarities)? Dragon Age borrows from a lot of other fantasy sources, so why take issue with this one? Why's it matter? They aren't the same creatures. They have a different mindset, different M.O.s, different lore behind them.

This to me is a case of "If it's not broken, don't fix it" type of thing.


I mean, how does this:


   



look like this?






Ok, the last one is a pic of goblins according to the LotR wiki article on Orcs. I haven't seen the movies for quite some time and my Tolkien knowledge is rusty, but point is I see no resemblance.


*goes off to watch The Two Towers because he watched FotR not too long ago*

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 31 mai 2011 - 10:27 .

[Aradace]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

what's wrong with it being somewhat similar (even though I see no similarities)? Dragon Age borrows from a lot of other fantasy sources, so why take issue with this one? Why's it matter? They aren't the same creatures. They have a different mindset, different M.O.s, different lore behind them.

This to me is a case of "If it's not broken, don't fix it" type of thing.

There in lies the problem though.  If they are too similar to their Origins counterparts, then once again, I'd have to go with my LotR defense.  However, as I said earlier, some sort of middle ground does need to be reached.  Because if neither one is a complete option, then something new needs to come about.

Edit: If I were the only person to make the LotR reference then I might agree with your examples...But since Im not...

Modifié par Aradace, 31 mai 2011 - 10:28 .

[TEWR]

They have different noses, mouths, eyes, facial structures, ears, body types. The only similarity I see is that darkspawn can't support hair and some Orcs can't either.

That's why I don't see it. I can understand "They certainly give off a vibe reminiscent of LotR" but I just can't understand "They look like Orcs/Uruk-Hai/Giant Eagles"


ok, the giant eagles bit is just a joke. no one take that seriously =P

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 31 mai 2011 - 10:36 .

[Shimmer_Gloom]

I immediately thought of Uruk-hai when I saw Hurlocks. No joke. It's mostly their stature, and their 'ugly' appearance. Of course they don't look exactly like Uruk-hai, but its close enough that when I saw Ostagar I immediately thought of Helms Deep. I understand them wanting to go in a different direction.

I'm cool with the clown thing. It was really the whole 'appear out of nowhere' bit that was scary. And they don't really do that in DAII. Which is a shame. That was their apeal. The 'drag them into the ground thing' was what REALLY separates them from orcs. Without that, it doesn't matter what they look like, they are still orc rip offs.

Its their place in the story more than what they look like imo. You are allways going to get orc comparison as long as they are a faceless horde of evil, ill equipped, monsters.

[Xerxes52]

First of all, the animation of the darkspawn in DA:O was much better than the "crazed chimp" animation in DA2.

And I would rather have the generic orc design from DA:O instead of the skeletor look in DA2.

But something like this:



Would be even better imo (from Pandorum btw).

[neppakyo]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

what's wrong with it being somewhat similar (even though I see no similarities)? Dragon Age borrows from a lot of other fantasy sources, so why take issue with this one? Why's it matter? They aren't the same creatures. They have a different mindset, different M.O.s, different lore behind them.

This to me is a case of "If it's not broken, don't fix it" type of thing.



Ok, the last one is a pic of goblins according to the LotR wiki article on Orcs. I haven't seen the movies for quite some time and my Tolkien knowledge is rusty, but point is I see no resemblance.


*goes off to watch The Two Towers because he watched FotR not too long ago*

Well, this one I left in the quote is obviously DA2 elves.

[Dariuszp]

 New Hurlock

Modifié par Dariuszp, 01 juin 2011 - 07:20 .

[Kilshrek]

I'll put it out here that claims of darkspawn being ripoffs of Tolkien orcs are quite off the mark.

This page gives you the early illustrations of orcs and their movie versions. Darkspawn, specifically hurlocks, can be seen above and compared to the images you find on the site I just linked. Hurlocks don't have ears, but orcs, by virtue of being corrupted elves maintain their pointy ears, have more grotesque and exaggerated facial features and in the case of goblins, more ape-like. The "new" hurlocks suddenly have an attack of ape, mimicking the goblins of LotR more than any breed of darkspawn in DAO did.

So if anything the DA 2 darkspawn are more ripoff of LotR than DAO darkspawn, who had a very original look. The only accusation I could throw at DAO in terms of copying LotR imagery would be the way the darkspawn arrived at Ostagar, because that's totally not Helm's Deep.

But aside from the blatant copying of the scene, hurlocks and orcs(specifically uruks) have almost nothing in common. Oh perhaps the heavily armoured bit, which is why they then went so drastically in the redesign, giving hurlocks a pauldron and a coif, and a leather strap to keep it decent. Another case of something that probably only needed a tweak, but got a great giant brush applied to it to completely cover what was there before.

edit : just edited a sentence to make it more comprehensible.

Modifié par Kilshrek, 01 juin 2011 - 12:56 .

[TEWR]

thank you Kilshrek.

 New Hurlock

That's actually more horrifying and threatening than DA2's version, so I'd gladly take that over DA2's darkspawn.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 01 juin 2011 - 12:34 .

[TEWR]

No we've degenerated into the abyss known as the second page!! I will not let this happen!!

[TEWR]

I will! By the power of Greyskull I will fight this with my very being!!!


Ironic, ain't it?