124 réponses à ce sujet

[jamesp81]

Why don't you feel the same about Wrex?  I don't see people talking about his very open racism.  He pretty much intimates to you in ME2 that, other than Shepard, they'd straight out kill any other aliens that showed up on their doorstep.  I never heard Ashley advocate the death penalty for trespassing against anyone, alien or not.

Disclaimer: Loved Wrex as a character though.  Hope we get him for a mission or two in ME3.

Modifié par jamesp81, 31 mai 2011 - 09:25 .

[ADLegend21]

Don't provoke them!!!!!!!!!!! plus the lst time Aliens were on Tuchanka pyjak's broke out and before that the genophage was dropped on them. If anyone's a comparison it's Tali and her feelings that the Quarians weren't wrong for trying to exterminate the geth without negotiating somehting first.

[Odoyle]

See this is exactly why Kasumi is the ultimate woman and needs to be an LI for ME3. She's the only one who isn't mental, snobby, or doesn't have a chip on her shoulder about "something". She's just Kasumi.

<3

Modifié par Odoyle, 31 mai 2011 - 09:36 .

[General User]

rac·ist[rey-sizt] – noun, adjective
1. 
What all you humans are.

Wrex is not human, therefore he is not a racist.


I'm actually only half kidding.  I think many people get on Ashley's case, even though she doesn't even come close to deserving it, because she is human.  She is more relatable, even if you don't like her. So when someone perceives a fault in her, even when their perception is grossly in error, they are more liable to come down even harder on her.

Modifié par General User, 31 mai 2011 - 09:54 .

[Collider]

Ashley brings up aliens in general more than any other squad mate.
I think being human does play into people getting on her case for it, yea. But I don't think the accusations of racism or prejudice are always unjustified.
Here are some Ashley quotes:

"Jealous? Of you? You're not even our species!"
"You want to get involved with some alien? Go ahead."

[Khran1505]

For starters, Wrex's absolute badass personality that goes with his voice and design is a major win for him. Not to mention it's not the fact he's racist, he just sees other species weaker than his own because let's face it, Krogan are a warrior race. They are pretty much space spartans. If you're weaker than they, you deserve no respect from them. Wrex was what you'd call "racist" towards Shepard at first because he had little to no knowledge of the guy or anything he ever did that deserves respect from his people.

Come retrieving his family armour, convincing him the genophage cure was a means of making Krogan slaves to Saren and helping make the rise of Clan Urdnot dominant on Tuchanka possible, he did more than enough to be respected by Wrex. Rather, they became actual friends. That's a damn honour as far as Krogans go.

Ashley on the other hand is an actual racist. Though not through some pure xenophobia because why the hell not, but because of first impressions with the Turians and how her grandfather surrendering to the Turians at Shanxi has marked her family from then onward as low-class soldiers. Her xenophobia stems from blaming aliens on her family's reputation and that humans should stand alone in the galaxy if they're ever going to survive.

[Someone With Mass]

Collider wrote...

Ashley brings up aliens in general more than any other squad mate.
I think being human does play into people getting on her case for it, yea. But I don't think the accusations of racism or prejudice are always unjustified.
Here are some Ashley quotes:

"Jealous? Of you? You're not even our species!"
"You want to get involved with some alien? Go ahead."

Pretty much this. 

[jamesp81]

Odoyle wrote...

See this is exactly why Kasumi is the ultimate woman and needs to be an LI for ME3. She's the only one who isn't mental, snobby, or doesn't have a chip on her shoulder about "something". She's just Kasumi.

<3

Some of her dialogue is truly hilarious.  I got a laugh out of her comments on Rana Thanoptis.  And Deadly Shadow Strike = LOL mode.

[jamesp81]

General User wrote...

rac·ist[rey-sizt] – noun, adjective
1. 
What all you humans are.

Wrex is not human, therefore he is not a racist.


I'm actually only half kidding.  I think many people get on Ashley's case, even though she doesn't even come close to deserving it, because she is human.  She is more relatable, even if you don't like her. So when someone perceives a fault in her, even when their perception is grossly in error, they are more liable to come down even harder on her.

Pretty much.  In scifi settings, people tend to be more judgmental of humans than aliens.  Any minor flaw in a human character is blown out of proportion, while aliens can often get away with murder....literally.

[Someone With Mass]

Odoyle wrote...

See this is exactly why Kasumi is the ultimate woman and needs to be an LI for ME3. She's the only one who isn't mental, snobby, or doesn't have a chip on her shoulder about "something". She's just Kasumi.

<3

Definitely. She's unique to say the least.

[PinkDiamondstl]

How many times are people gonna make these threads? Who cares if she's racist .I'm racist some times.only to gay people. That's all.

[Deanooo]

jamesp81 wrote...

Why don't you feel the same about Wrex?  I don't see people talking about his very open racism.  He pretty much intimates to you in ME2 that, other than Shepard, they'd straight out kill any other aliens that showed up on their doorstep.  I never heard Ashley advocate the death penalty for trespassing against anyone, alien or not.

Disclaimer: Loved Wrex as a character though.  Hope we get him for a mission or two in ME3.

I don't think this takes away my thoughts on ashlyer being racist, but yes it isn't just her, as it was said previously things are more blown out of proportion if a human says "dodgy" things.

[jamesp81]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Collider wrote...

Ashley brings up aliens in general more than any other squad mate.
I think being human does play into people getting on her case for it, yea. But I don't think the accusations of racism or prejudice are always unjustified.
Here are some Ashley quotes:

"Jealous? Of you? You're not even our species!"
"You want to get involved with some alien? Go ahead."

Pretty much this. 

We're also talking about the same woman who told Tali that helping Shepard take down Saren might improve the lot of the Quarians.

She makes more non-racist comments than allegedly racist ones.  The woman is not a racist.  Never was.  Even the VA said she wasn't intended to come across that way.  Chalk it up to bad writing if you wish, but interpreting Ashley as a xenophobe is a misreading of who she is.

But again, I'll put the question to you: how can you think Ashley is a racist, but Wrex gets a pass?  Wrex is easily the most racist person on the whole damned ME1 crew.  I still love the guy, but if he were human, he'd be right at home with Terra Firma or even an ethnic supremacist group.

[jamesp81]

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

How many times are people gonna make these threads? Who cares if she's racist .I'm racist some times.only to gay people. That's all.

I wanted to make a twist on the incessant OMGASHLEYISRACISTOMGOMG type threads.  If she's so damned racist, why do even far more racist characters get a pass?

Hell, I love Wrex and hope to have him back.  But if he were human, everyone who ever played ME1 would hate his ass.

[Collider]

Part of the reason that other squad mates "get a pass" is because they don't mention aliens as much as Ashley does.

[Odoyle]

Khran1505 wrote...

For starters, Wrex's absolute badass personality that goes with his voice and design is a major win for him. Not to mention it's not the fact he's racist, he just sees other species weaker than his own because let's face it, Krogan are a warrior race. They are pretty much space spartans. If you're weaker than they, you deserve no respect from them. Wrex was what you'd call "racist" towards Shepard at first because he had little to no knowledge of the guy or anything he ever did that deserves respect from his people.

Come retrieving his family armour, convincing him the genophage cure was a means of making Krogan slaves to Saren and helping make the rise of Clan Urdnot dominant on Tuchanka possible, he did more than enough to be respected by Wrex. Rather, they became actual friends. That's a damn honour as far as Krogans go.

Ashley on the other hand is an actual racist. Though not through some pure xenophobia because why the hell not, but because of first impressions with the Turians and how her grandfather surrendering to the Turians at Shanxi has marked her family from then onward as low-class soldiers. Her xenophobia stems from blaming aliens on her family's reputation and that humans should stand alone in the galaxy if they're ever going to survive.

So much truth right there.

[Someone With Mass]

jamesp81 wrote...
But again, I'll put the question to you: how can you think Ashley is a racist, but Wrex gets a pass?  Wrex is easily the most racist person on the whole damned ME1 crew.  I still love the guy, but if he were human, he'd be right at home with Terra Firma or even an ethnic supremacist group.

Considering that his whole race was pretty neutered by aliens, I think he's earned that right.

Ashley, or any other human? Not so much.

[Hedera]

Khran1505 wrote...
Ashley on the other hand is an actual racist. Though not through some pure xenophobia because why the hell not, but because of first impressions with the Turians and how her grandfather surrendering to the Turians at Shanxi has marked her family from then onward as low-class soldiers. Her xenophobia stems from blaming aliens on her family's reputation and that humans should stand alone in the galaxy if they're ever going to survive.

This is one of the few well-reasoned arguments for Ashley being racist that I have ever seen.  I actually agree with most of what is said here.  I salute you for not calling her a xenophobic religious nutjob. 

That, however, doesn't make me hate Ash.  She has her flaws, but toward the end of the game, she is definitely more open to working with aliens.  Character development is important in understanding her motives.  I would also like to add that she is usually targeted as a racist because of her religion.  Many people on the internet have deep-seated anger at organized religion for reasons that are their own, and the fact that she says she believes in a higher power instantly puts her on their sh*tlist.  Then comes the exaggeration of her flaws and the desire to Virmire her.  

These are merely my observations, take them how you will.  If they aren't true, that's totally cool.  I am only human, after all.  Which makes me a racist.  Cool.

[Quole]

ADLegend21 wrote...

Don't provoke them!!!!!!!!!!! plus the lst time Aliens were on Tuchanka pyjak's broke out and before that the genophage was dropped on them. If anyone's a comparison it's Tali and her feelings that the Quarians weren't wrong for trying to exterminate the geth without negotiating somehting first.

I dont know how many times I have told you how that argument does not make sense. But its seems your unable to comprehend that.
 Btw Ashley is racist.

Modifié par Quole, 31 mai 2011 - 11:00 .

[Quole]

jamesp81 wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Collider wrote...

Ashley brings up aliens in general more than any other squad mate.
I think being human does play into people getting on her case for it, yea. But I don't think the accusations of racism or prejudice are always unjustified.
Here are some Ashley quotes:

"Jealous? Of you? You're not even our species!"
"You want to get involved with some alien? Go ahead."

Pretty much this. 

We're also talking about the same woman who told Tali that helping Shepard take down Saren might improve the lot of the Quarians.

She makes more non-racist comments than allegedly racist ones.  The woman is not a racist.  Never was.  Even the VA said she wasn't intended to come across that way.  Chalk it up to bad writing if you wish, but interpreting Ashley as a xenophobe is a misreading of who she is.

But again, I'll put the question to you: how can you think Ashley is a racist, but Wrex gets a pass?  Wrex is easily the most racist person on the whole damned ME1 crew.  I still love the guy, but if he were human, he'd be right at home with Terra Firma or even an ethnic supremacist group.

Soooo what you are saying is that shes racist towards some aliens but not others? How does that mean shes not racist?
Also Wrex being racist is actually justified, unlike Ashley.

Modifié par Quole, 31 mai 2011 - 11:03 .

[The dead fish]

It's been over 6 months I am on this forum. And I still do not have or see a strong and intelligent commentary on why they believe that Ashley is racist.

I only see the stubbornness for a character they dislike, a denial of certain words or certain facts, and ignorance, demonstrating that they have not tested everything in the game.

I'm still waiting...

Modifié par Sylvianus, 31 mai 2011 - 11:11 .

[ADLegend21]

mrsph wrote...

Because Wrex's entire species got neutered and is dying off because of the salarians and the turians.

Ashley's complaints about the other species are really petty compared to that.

Aliens are the reason Ashleys family is blacklisted, that's not petty at all. without the black lisitng she could easily be a lieutenant or even a commander with her technical scores and how well she ld the 212. Commander Williams does have a nice ring to it.

[ADLegend21]

Quole wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

Don't provoke them!!!!!!!!!!! plus the lst time Aliens were on Tuchanka pyjak's broke out and before that the genophage was dropped on them. If anyone's a comparison it's Tali and her feelings that the Quarians weren't wrong for trying to exterminate the geth without negotiating somehting first.

I dont know how many times I have told you how that argument does not make sense. But its seems your unable to comprehend that.
 Btw Ashley is racist.

you be trolling. Quarians attempted Genocide and failed but take no responsibility. they're wrong and theyr'e sore losers, deal with it.

[Someone With Mass]

Her family got a bad rep because of what the turians did during FCW. Boo-hoo.