54 réponses à ce sujet

[Phoenix_Loftian]

Personally, I think it was the Arishok. He seemed like a respectable Super-communist who honestly got fed-up with Kirkwall due to the attacks and Kirkwall's own terrible problems.

Even the trigger for the attack, the elves, seemed reasonable. I mean, I certainly couldn't blame those elves. Sure, that seems like an excuse but also take into account that the Chantry did EVERYTHING in it's power - kill Qunari, kill the Viscount's own son, and rally as much lunatic fringe groups as possible to oppose the Qunari for... waiting.

It wasn't as if they were told to leave Kirkwall after landing, nor had they actually made any military demands.

And yes, Petrice's involvement isn't really the entire Chantry but the fact is she did do a lot and she went unchecked because Elthina did what she always does best - shut her eyes and pretend the problem can resolve itself without taking her responsibilities seriously. It took the son of a Viscount's death for her to do anything and at that point it was pretty much too late to resolve the issue since the kid had willingly joined the Qunari.

The Architect started off interesting but after it was revealed that he made the Mother, caused the fifth blight, and basically didn't have any accountability for his actions? Well... yeah, I think the dude's just plain crazy and trying to justify his own loneliness since the Mother made a good point. The Architect wasn't looking to 'free' the Darkspawn, he wanted to 'correct' the Darkspawn. The difference? He wasn't trying to give them liberty - not truly, he wanted to change their goals so they didn't just do what some voice in the Fade kept telling them to do. He also flat out lies to you about why he sent the Darkspawn in the beginning of the game. The First was sent to capture the Warden, not to relay a message.

Anyway, just my personal opinion as a comparison. I'm pretty sure the Architect is actually stronger if you go by the levels of the game but that in itself is pretty empty.

[Original Panther Swift]

Architect is my vote. Such deception in his plans compared to the Arishoks. When he sent 2 adult dragons to slay me and closed the passage behind him I knew I was in trouble. Knocked me out cold with his magic also, where as the Arishok was all brawn and if you stayed away from him he could not spear you and hold you in the air... ouch-

[Shadow Raziel]

Original Panther Swift wrote...

Architect is my vote. Such deception in his plans compared to the Arishoks.

I would have to agree with you. I felt a bit like Faust making the deal with the Architect in awakenings.

[Original Panther Swift]

We didn't have much choice on the matter my friend. I was intrested in the female Elf's sister beyond reason at the time also DA1. Cough, vanity ")

[ElvaliaRavenHart]

I'm going with the Architect, he is truly evil. I also believe he lied and he wanted to rule the darkspawn. I don't think he understands what truth is or he doesn't understand what truth fully means. At least the mother understood truth more so than him. She exposed his truth in regards to the blight.

Was the Architect an Imperium Archon at one point and he was turned into a darkspawn? This is a question I've always asked myself when playing DAA. He said he was born the way he was...really what broadmother birthed him?

[Amagoi]

It's not really a fair contest, IMO. I love both characters. The Arishok got a much better presentation and characterization than the Architect did. He was absolutely fascinating in a way the Arishok wasn't in The Calling, but was just... flat in Awakening. Overall though, the Arishok is a better antagonist. Neither are really evil. They just have totally different morals and viewpoints than your typical human/elf/dwarf.

[themonty72]

Hum, neither was a villain as far as Im concern

[dragonflight288]

I would call neither villain but both antagonists.

The Architect generally wants to help his people or end the war with all other races. His methods however, are extreme and exceptionally deadly. Attempting to turn all of Thedas into ghouls, making intelligent darkspawn who may or may not want intelligence, and may go insane after receiving it (ie, the mother), has powerful magic and dealing with him is certainly like dealing with the devil or demons. We know that the decision will turn around and kick us in the butt eventually.

Whereas the Arishok was all about the Qun. The demands of the Qun kept him in line in Kirkwall far more than the city guard or the templars did. He demonstrated a great deal of patience and honor (which is debated by people who don't understand war, or the mindset of a general) while following his code. But doing so could easily have destroyed entire sections of Kirkwall (the poison he allowed the locals to think were explosives, as the poison doesn't effect Qunari, which I think is a very clever tactic.) His presence inspired a lot of problems in act 2 (Sister Petrice acted on her own, but it was in response to a 'perceived' threat to the chantry), and his mindset as a general allowed him to nearly conquer Kirkwall in less than a day.

Overall, I would say the Architect is a better antagonist because his plans affected more than a city.

[Shadow Raziel]

dragonflight288 wrote...

I would call neither villain but both antagonists.

The Architect generally wants to help his people or end the war with all other races. His methods however, are extreme and exceptionally deadly. Attempting to turn all of Thedas into ghouls, making intelligent darkspawn who may or may not want intelligence, and may go insane after receiving it (ie, the mother), has powerful magic and dealing with him is certainly like dealing with the devil or demons. We know that the decision will turn around and kick us in the butt eventually.

.

A noted psychologist once said that "the function of any ethical system
in any given society is to sustain the life of that society. He
neglected to mention that any system can consider it's self ethical

[KnightofPhoenix]

I'll go for the Architect, only because I feel he is more of a "person", than the Arishok, who I think is more of a representation of the Qun (or at least its military wing), than a person perse.

Furthermore, I feel there is an element of tragedy in the Architect and I end up sympathizing with his goals, even if I ultimately do not trust him that much. With the Arishok on the otherhand, I was not really sure what he was doing and why the Tome was this important, and I didn't feel as much empathy towards him as the Architect.

[Cutlass Jack]

themonty72 wrote...

Hum, neither was a villain as far as Im concern

Yeah that was my feeling too. As in purposely being Villainous. They were really just occasional adversaries.

[Kaiser Shepard]

As a character, my vote goes to the Arishok. No doubt about that. I'm sort of big on the whole warrior tribe (if only from Kirkwall's perspective) that revolves around honor and traditions.

As for dealing with (and manipulating) the situation around him, my vote would go to the Architect. Sadly, I'm not big on working with "means to an end"-type leaders, so yeah.

Also, on a final note, I have to say how they handled that whole "Architect caused the Blight"-thing pretty badly, as you only learn that if you spare him. Result being that it changes the perspective of the entire expansion from just that to something like Arrival for ME2 (the extra content equalling or surpassing the original game in importance).

[Ivers0803]

I say the Architect, he is dangerous because of his ignorance. he does not know how the world works and genuinely wants to help, but does not realize what he is doing may be wrong, this makes him incredibly dangerous as well as something to pity. The Arishock throughout the game shows his distaste for the city, he is easy to read and follows a strict set of guide lines. He follows the Qun to the letter, even his battle plans was dictated by the Qun. He is predictable unlike the Architect.

[Rifneno]

The Arishok, by miles. The Architect wishes to spread free will and open minds, the Arishok wishes to eliminate them. I'm not even entirely sure the Architect IS a villain. I consider him a natural enemy in that his kind and my kind cannot peacefully co-exist, but I don't see him as "evil."

[Plaintiff]

The Architect is definitly more nuanced and complex than the Arishok. I don't know which I'd class the better villain, but the Architect is definitely the better character overall.

[Dormiglione]

Its really difficult to answer. Both character are really good written and extremly dangerous adversaries.

If you asked if i wanted to see more of the Arishok or the Architect, i would answer you: The Arishok.

But if you ask, who is more dangerous as adversary, then i would say: The Architect. He is extremly intelligent, has the backup of darkspawn, disciple that are acting intelligent and he is able very powerful magic.

Both characters had a very good story plot. Honestly, i would like to have a DLC for each of them.

[Zeevico]

The Arishok is more easy to relate to. The Architect is still alien and unrelatable. He's a monster--a sentient monster, but a monster nevertheless. Qunari are just big people with horns and a strange set of beliefs. As I prefer my antagonists to be relatable, the Arishok wins.

[HSHAW]

The Arishok, since I don't consider the Architect a villain, I view it as a dangerous but well meaning individual.

[Dormiglione]

HSHAW wrote...

The Arishok, since I don't consider the Architect a villain, I view it as a dangerous but well meaning individual.

 In my opinion none of them is a villain. I consider them both as worthy antagonists.

[Luckywallace]

Both of them were good antagonists but I think I prefer the Architect, if only for the fact he provided you with an extremely interesting choice at the end of Awakening while whatever Hawke decides still ends in the Arishok going on a kill rampage through Kirkwall.
Both were certainly a lot better than the Mages/Templars disaster in Act III.

[Foolsfolly]

Well since I didn't like the Architect at all this is simple.

The Arishok.

[SkittlesKat96]

I'd say the Architect. The Architect is an interesting and unique character who was really well written.

The Arishok is an interesting character who is well written but the thing is he kind of follows more cliches than the Architect, so even though he's only a slightly less better character than the Architect it still makes a difference.

I love both characters though still, I just like the idea of the Architect more though. Its interesting how he isn't really good or evil and how he doesn't really understand the concept of human suffering too well.

[Porenferser]

Both are good.
Both have a great design, interesting intentions, cool voices, eloquence, well-scrippted appearances and more.
But in the end, I think the Arishok is better.
Also, I don't wanna imagine how fugly the Architect (and his disciples) will look in the new Darkspawn-Look *shudders*

[Huntress]

The architect is a monster with speach, the Arishock is just another humanoid race.

The architect is evil for what his vision of Thedas should be, he and his kind have the plague that kill everything, they re-produce using humanoids-females and in the process this females transform into monster creatures, Arishock do not.

[Lord Gremlin]

Architect. Simply because Arishok is not vile, not a villain. It's like saying that communists or democrats are villains.
Architect on the other hand is planning mass genocide of all living creatures because of absolutely selfish desires.