506 réponses à ce sujet

[yaw]

I'm not homophobic in the slightest, and I've persued same-sex relationships in these games but... why was everyone bisexual in DA2?

I think someone's sexuality, if it's dealt with, is part of someone's character.

Zevran, for example, we know is bisexual due to his libidinousness, the things was required to do in the crows, and his 'get your pleasures wherever you can find them, as there may not be chance tommorow' attitude to life. Even though he confesses to prefering women, he's decided that gender isn't an issue for him. That's part of his character.

Although it's not explicitly said, you gradually come to the conclusion that Leliana loved Marjolaine romantically, as opposed to just admiring her as a mentor or friend. If we just assumed that Leliana was straight, this is a interesting thing to find out and it adds a bit of depth to her story. Her betrayal story becomes just that bit more tragic when we realise "ah... she was in love with this woman!".

I liked the fact that I could build a really strong sisterly relationship with Morrigan. When I chased her down in Witch Hunt it was because I was her friend. She was upset when she left me because she we had such a strong friendship.
You're sure of this because she's straight. If she were bisexual, it would be confusing, because even if you'd never flirted there's the possibilty that she might be romantically interested. Sexuality just changes the situation. 

Again, I'm not being homophobic. I'm bisexual myself. And if there was the option to romance Morrigan as a female I would have gone for it, but as it turns out, this was preferable.

I just think it's better to have some bisexual, some straight, even some purely homosexual characters all mixed up, instead of having access to every single LI. 

[SicoWolf-]

Sexuality has been discussed to death. Then beaten with a stick. And then beaten some more.

Please leave the poor horse alone.

[Bejos_]

This came up tangentially in another thread ...
My answer is that the characters aren't really all bisexual-- each play-through is a world-state of its own, and, depending on who you end up with and how you got to them, you can assume/surmise which of the remaining characters have what sexuality. So if you end up with same-sex X, it's easy to imagine that most everyone else is straight, with maybe one bisexual character thrown in. If you end up with opposite-sex Y, it's easy to imagine that at least one character in the group is gay or bisexual.
Or whatever mix is to your liking.
But yeah, this really has been beat around the head enough times, heh.

[Cutlass Jack]

Why do these threads always start with "I'm not Homophobic?"  
(and just teasing, you avoided the usual followup of going into a homophobic rant afterwards.)

More seriously, I don't see the issue. I had a perfectly fine friendship with Anders (up until a spoilerish part of the plot) with no hint of romance at all. The fact he could have swung my way didn't factor at all into my game.
And you certainly could have a 'sisterly' relationship with Aveline with no risk of romance at all if that's what you were after.

Shifting things back to Origins, my relationship with Morrigan was pure friendship and better for that. Even though there could have been a romance. Neither game was like ME2 where if you didn't pursue a romance you didn't get the friendship line.

Modifié par Cutlass Jack, 04 juin 2011 - 01:59 .

[neppakyo]

I'm bi-sexual. I like women and women strippers. Wait, I think thats suave-sexual. Hmm. give-it-up-for-our-next-dancer-sexual?

The only problem in DA2 was the rush job on the game, and lack of time to make the romances better. Hawke could do a sneeze-fart, and anders would be right there trying to get into his cod-piece.

[Cutlass Jack]

neppakyo wrote...

I'm bi-sexual. I like women and women strippers. Wait, I think thats suave-sexual. Hmm. give-it-up-for-our-next-dancer-sexual?

I think thats Buy-sexual.

[yaw]

Bejos_ wrote...

This came up tangentially in another thread ...
My answer is that the characters aren't really all bisexual-- each play-through is a world-state of its own, and, depending on who you end up with and how you got to them, you can assume/surmise which of the remaining characters have what sexuality. So if you end up with same-sex X, it's easy to imagine that most everyone else is straight, with maybe one bisexual character thrown in. If you end up with opposite-sex Y, it's easy to imagine that at least one character in the group is gay or bisexual.
Or whatever mix is to your liking.

Actually... you do have a point. Unless one or more of the characters you were going to imagine was straight hits on your character. But if you manage to avoid it alright then it shouldn't be a problem.

Modifié par yaw, 04 juin 2011 - 02:17 .

[neppakyo]

Cutlass Jack wrote...

I think thats Buy-sexual.

*snaps fingers* Thats it!

And you're Pirate-Sexual *nod nod*

[Zjarcal]

Bejos_ wrote...

This came up tangentially in another thread ...
My answer is that the characters aren't really all bisexual-- each play-through is a world-state of its own, and, depending on who you end up with and how you got to them, you can assume/surmise which of the remaining characters have what sexuality.

And you would be wrong.

David Gaider wrote...

I will say that one element of the reaction to this I find interesting is the idea that so many people believe a character's sexuality actually changes because their exposure to it changes.

Anders isn't any different a person in a game with a male PC or a female PC, for instance, yet some people seem to think that because he doesn't mention his relationship with Karl to a female player it must never have happened... and he is therefore 100% straight as opposed to being 100% gay if it is mentioned. While the point of that is indeed to leave it free for the player to interpret for themselves, the part I find interesting is the assumption that the characters' personalities are somehow written differently based on the circumstance. I suspect that says a lot about how some people actually think about sexuality, which is if anything an interesting behavior to observe in the community.

Modifié par Zjarcal, 04 juin 2011 - 02:16 .

[yaw]

Zjarcal wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

This came up tangentially in another thread ...
My answer is that the characters aren't really all bisexual-- each play-through is a world-state of its own, and, depending on who you end up with and how you got to them, you can assume/surmise which of the remaining characters have what sexuality.

And you would be wrong.

David Gaider wrote...

I will say that one element of the reaction to this I find interesting is the idea that so many people believe a character's sexuality actually changes because their exposure to it changes.

Anders isn't any different a person in a game with a male PC or a female PC, for instance, yet some people seem to think that because he doesn't mention his relationship with Karl to a female player it must never have happened... and he is therefore 100% straight as opposed to being 100% gay if it is mentioned. While the point of that is indeed to leave it free for the player to interpret for themselves, the part I find interesting is the assumption that the characters' personalities are somehow written differently based on the circumstance. I suspect that says a lot about how some people actually think about sexuality, which is if anything an interesting behavior to observe in the community.

Oh, well, then I retract my previous post and we're back to square one.

I maintain my opinion that sexuality is a, small or large, part of someone's character, of their personality. And situations can differ depending on someone's sexuality, especially when strong relationships are concerned.

Saying that a person would be absolutely no different whether they were gay, straight, bi or whatever is just stupid. Whether or not someone likes cake changes who they are. Whether or not someone is racist changes who they are. And whether or not someone finds you attractive, and could be romantically interested, also changes who they are to you.

Modifié par yaw, 04 juin 2011 - 02:25 .

[Zjarcal]

yaw wrote...

I just think it's better to have some bisexual, some straight, even some purely homosexual characters all mixed up, instead of having access to every single LI. 

In an ideal game, where we had more than just four LIs, I could somewhat agree to an extent (though I'd still prefer for everyone to be available to everyone). But when you only have four LIs, making all romances accessible to all players grants more variety and allows you to actually have a choice if you want a homosexual relationship, as opposed to say Origins, were if you wanted to be a lesbian, you had to go for Leliana (just to clarify, I had ZERO problem with that because I adore Leli... ), or go for Zevran if you wanted to be a gay male, with no other choices available.

yaw wrote...

Saying that a person would be absolutely no different whether they were gay, straight, bi or whatever is just stupid. Whether or not someone likes cake changes who they are. Whether or not someone is racist changes who they are. And whether or not someone finds you attractive, and could be romantically interested, also changes who they are to you.

Ah, first of all, comparing homsexuality to racism is... 

And I disagree. While your sexuality may be part of who you are, it's not like your general views of life will change drastically just because you're straight, bi, or gay. I doubt Anders would've changed his stance on the mage/templar debacle due to his sexuality.

Whether someone finds you attractive could change how far they'd go for you, but not their core beliefs.

EDIT: And it's not like just because they're bi they will be automatically attracted to you. You still have to pursue the relationship.

Modifié par Zjarcal, 04 juin 2011 - 02:32 .

[mousestalker]

yaw wrote...

I'm not homophobic in the slightest, and I've persued same-sex relationships in these games but... why was everyone bisexual in DA2?

I think someone's sexuality, if it's dealt with, is part of someone's character.

Zevran, for example, we know is bisexual due to his libidinousness, the things was required to do in the crows, and his 'get your pleasures wherever you can find them, as there may not be chance tommorow' attitude to life. Even though he confesses to prefering women, he's decided that gender isn't an issue for him. That's part of his character.

Although it's not explicitly said, you gradually come to the conclusion that Leliana loved Marjolaine romantically, as opposed to just admiring her as a mentor or friend. If we just assumed that Leliana was straight, this is a interesting thing to find out and it adds a bit of depth to her story. Her betrayal story becomes just that bit more tragic when we realise "ah... she was in love with this woman!".

I liked the fact that I could build a really strong sisterly relationship with Morrigan. When I chased her down in Witch Hunt it was because I was her friend. She was upset when she left me because she we had such a strong friendship.
You're sure of this because she's straight. If she were bisexual, it would be confusing, because even if you'd never flirted there's the possibilty that she might be romantically interested. Sexuality just changes the situation. 

Again, I'm not being homophobic. I'm bisexual myself. And if there was the option to romance Morrigan as a female I would have gone for it, but as it turns out, this was preferable.

I just think it's better to have some bisexual, some straight, even some purely homosexual characters all mixed up, instead of having access to every single LI. 

The proper term is bifabulous.

The answer to your question is: Yes.

Now you know. 

[Mr.House]

neppakyo wrote...

I'm bi-sexual. I like women and women strippers. Wait, I think thats suave-sexual. Hmm. give-it-up-for-our-next-dancer-sexual?

The only problem in DA2 was the rush job on the game, and lack of time to make the romances better. Hawke could do a sneeze-fart, and anders would be right there trying to get into his cod-piece.

Maybe Anders likes your sneeze-fart though?

[mesmerizedish]

Wow. This? Again? Really?

Guise.

They're all bi.

Suck it up, just like Merrill's suckin' on my ****** like she wanted me, callin' me all the time, like Blondie, check out my crissy behind, it's fine all of the time.

[mousestalker]

My milkshake brings all the boys to the yard,
And they're like
It's better than yours,
Damn right it's better than yours,
I can teach you,
But I have to charge

I know you want it,
The thing that makes me,
What the guys go crazy for.
They lose their minds,
The way I wind,
I think its time

My milkshake brings all the girls to the yard,
And they're like
It's better than yours,
Damn right it's better than yours,
I can teach you,
But I have to charge

I know you want it,
The thing that makes me,
What the girls go crazy for.
They lose their minds,
The way I wind,
I think its time

La la-la la la,
Warm it up.
Lala-lalala,
The girls are waiting

La la-la la la,
Warm it up.
Lala-lalala,
The boys are waiting


That pretty much says it all   <3

[syllogi]

Filament wrote...

but who says sexuality must be a defining part of a person's personality? That's the same sort of logic that demands all camp people be gay...

This is the question I'd really like all of these type of posts to answer before they go on to complain about how many bisexuals there were in the game.

Personally, all my friends in high school except one were homosexual, and most of my friends in college.  HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE SO UNREALISTIC GEEZ.

[neppakyo]

TeenZombie wrote...

Filament wrote...

but who says sexuality must be a defining part of a person's personality? That's the same sort of logic that demands all camp people be gay...

This is the question I'd really like all of these type of posts to answer before they go on to complain about how many bisexuals there were in the game.

Personally, all my friends in high school except one were homosexual, and most of my friends in college.  HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE SO UNREALISTIC GEEZ.

San Fransico? *ducks and runs*

[TheBlackBaron]

yaw wrote...

I just think it's better to have some bisexual, some straight, even some purely homosexual characters all mixed up, instead of having access to every single LI.

/thread

Man, it's not everyday you get to do that with the original post.

[Zjarcal]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Wow. This? Again? Really?

Guise.

They're all bi.

Suck it up, just like Merrill's suckin' on my ****** like she wanted me, callin' me all the time, like Blondie, check out my crissy behind, it's fine all of the time.

I wubs you ish! <3

[Mr.House]

neppakyo wrote...

San Fransico? *ducks and runs*

[jlb524]

Not everyone is bi....

...and this game is chock full of heterosexuality at every turn...really.

[Bejos_]

yaw wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

This came up tangentially in another thread ...
My answer is that the characters aren't really all bisexual-- each play-through is a world-state of its own, and, depending on who you end up with and how you got to them, you can assume/surmise which of the remaining characters have what sexuality.

And you would be wrong.

David Gaider wrote...

I will say that one element of the reaction to this I find interesting is the idea that so many people believe a character's sexuality actually changes because their exposure to it changes.

Anders isn't any different a person in a game with a male PC or a female PC, for instance, yet some people seem to think that because he doesn't mention his relationship with Karl to a female player it must never have happened... and he is therefore 100% straight as opposed to being 100% gay if it is mentioned. While the point of that is indeed to leave it free for the player to interpret for themselves, the part I find interesting is the assumption that the characters' personalities are somehow written differently based on the circumstance. I suspect that says a lot about how some people actually think about sexuality, which is if anything an interesting behavior to observe in the community.

Oh, well, then I retract my previous post and we're back to square one.

I maintain my opinion that sexuality is a, small or large, part of someone's character, of their personality. And situations can differ depending on someone's sexuality, especially when strong relationships are concerned.

Saying that a person would be absolutely no different whether they were gay, straight, bi or whatever is just stupid. Whether or not someone likes cake changes who they are. Whether or not someone is racist changes who they are. And whether or not someone finds you attractive, and could be romantically interested, also changes who they are to you.

Hm, no, no, my point still stands. I wasn't saying that the characters are different in each playthrough. I'm saying that, due to the world being a "blank" world each time you play it, it's easy to interpret the cast differently in each playthrough. You know that there is a possibility for each of them to be bi, but if you don't pursue that direction (with the exception of Anders), they may as well not be. Trees falling in forests, and such. It's a bit like going to "Spiderman the Musical". You might be sitting so far back that you can't see the pulley wires, but that doesn't mean they're not there.

By the way, I assure you that your sexuality is a very strongly defining characteristic of your entire personality. At least in this day and age it is. When a person's every social interaction comments on that person's sexuality (hidden or not) and what that apparently says about them as a person and their worth, that person begins to be shaped by that social commentary. All because they are straight, bi, or gay.

I'll get off my high horse while I still can. Goodnight.

Modifié par Bejos_, 04 juin 2011 - 03:19 .