316 réponses à ce sujet

[Moiaussi]

It is possible that the collectors weren't expected to succeed. That they were either a final test for Shepard before the invasion or that they were being tested themselves. They certainly didn't seem a credible threat, and if Shepard could have taken them, they might have been able to trump up other targets for him. Think about it. Shepard was willing to chase whatever information he was fed and even accept outright lies and stay on. They could have had him take out targets that actually helped the Reapers.

When he gets brought in to trial, his usefulness is over and he is no longer isolated so his value as an unwitting double agent is likely ended.

I feel like I am doing the writers' job with that explaination though....

It is also possible that TIM is still in the process of being indoctrinated and was still resisting during ME2 but growing tensions between him and Shepard tip the scales.

Modifié par Moiaussi, 04 juin 2011 - 08:18 .

[CroGamer002]

I'll just bump this.

Mesina2 wrote...

It is still not known is Illusive Man hunting Shepard.

Only Cerberus is confirmed to hunt Shepard.


http://social.biowar...5/index/7388679

[kaiki01]

Saphra Deden wrote...

In ME1, yes, minor villains, in ME2, no.

Um...no. You learn about Pragia in ME2. So yes, still villains in ME2

[Khayness]

I just hope they won't use the same motivation Saren had.

Working for the Reapers = Humanity survives motivation would be very weak plot device this time around..

[magnuskn]

JeffZero wrote...

88mphSlayer wrote...

for the lulz

[The Illusive Man approaches the hologram of a stunned Shepard, his customary tune playing as he retains that expressionless face]

SHEPARD: "We're out here fighting a desperate war for survival and you're switching sides? Why the hell are you doing this?"

ILLUSIVE MAN: "For the lulz."

That should be "For the Evulz". 

[jwalker]

kaiki01 wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

In ME1, yes, minor villains, in ME2, no.

Um...no. You learn about Pragia in ME2. So yes, still villains in ME2

Yup.
In ME2, at best, you can see Cerberus as "the enemy of my enemy" kind of thing.
But this is good news. Probably this means Shepard might be able to get rid of them once and for all.
I just hope my sole survivors will get to blast away TIM with a shotgun

[Bluko]

Mesina2 wrote...

I'll just bump this.

Mesina2 wrote...

It is still not known is Illusive Man hunting Shepard.

Only Cerberus is confirmed to hunt Shepard.


http://social.biowar...5/index/7388679

Cerberus can't or wouldn't function without the Illusive Man. Also we know Kai Leng is going to be in ME3 likely as the antagonist equivalent to Saren. And Kai would never serve anyone but the Illusive Man. I also doubt Kai would attempt to take over Cerberus since with his superior skills he could have killed T.I.M. whenever he wanted to in person.

Now it may, and I really stress the may part, that we are dealing with a rogue Cerberus cell. But if that's the case why are both Commandos and Assassins involved? I doubt Cerberus has a legitimate paramilitary cell with that many troops. As I understand it Cerberus is made up of entirely free agents of varying skill. Also again Kai Leng is involved. And I doubt Kai Leng would ever work or assist someone like Shepard. For starters Kai Leng is an ex-N7 operative himself and as such probably isn't real fond of Shepard's heroics. Nevermind that Anderson, Shepard's mentor more or less, shot him.

Kai Leng pretty much exists to be Shepard's rival. 

Cerberus has never been meant to be the "good guys". They are no more pure of heart then say something like Mafia. Sure they might help you out in a pinch, but they may also shoot you in the back at some point later on. Expecting Cerberus to help fight the Reapers is about as asinine as expecting that the American Mafia would help contribute to the war effort during WWII.

[Seboist]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Except the mafia did contribute to the war effort...

Especially the Italian one in Sicily.

[Dave of Canada]

Barquiel wrote...

The writers took some random poll on BSN...

They didn't need to look at a poll, they simply had to look at the game's statistics tracker. Which does favor Paragon. The forums just (probably) show the majority attitude since the forums mostly consist of extreme paragon and anti-cerberus folk.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 04 juin 2011 - 09:02 .

[TheRevanchist]

Except the Pro Cerberus/ Renegade people tend to cry alot louder about things then paragoners

[Someone With Mass]

kylecouch wrote...

Except the Pro Cerberus/ Renegade people tend to cry alot louder about things then paragoners

That's because they want content for killing people they can avoid killing with ease.

[Moiaussi]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Anyway, why is it asinine to expect Cerberus to help us against the Reapers when they already have done so in ME2?

This. I neither like nor trust TIM, but it bothers me the extent ot which he is an idiot savant. The whole 'enemy of my enemy' thing applies to both sides. Even Stalin, who was arguably as bad in his own way as Hitler was more cooperative than TIM.

[Bluko]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Except the mafia did contribute to the war effort...

Yeah about that...

"Lucky" Luciano

Coincidence much you think? I mean even the ship involved is SS Normandie for crying out aloud. Axis Inflitration of the United States was pretty minimal at best, and the one time they did try to send Saboteurs to the U.S. they utterly failed. I'm pretty sure during WWII the Mob did what it always did, rackteering, etc.

(Can't comment on the Silician Mob itself, since that was a different situation for them.)

Modifié par Bluko, 04 juin 2011 - 09:24 .

[Eshaye]

Mesina2 wrote...

I'll just bump this.

Mesina2 wrote...

It is still not known is Illusive Man hunting Shepard.

Only Cerberus is confirmed to hunt Shepard.


http://social.biowar...5/index/7388679

My retort to that is that Cerberus IS the Illusive Man. There's no one above him, he founded it himself and still pours his own money into it, IF TIM isn't actually trying to kill Shepard then it's a Cerberus cell(s) that's gone rogue. It's a possibility, but a slim one. 




***WARNING NOVEL SPOILERS****



It's important to note that in between ME2 and ME3 Cerberus was dealt an almost death blow by Kahlee Sanders, David Anderson and the Turians. By the start of ME3 Cerberus' most highly placed operatives in the Alliance have been arrested along with most of TIM's investors/supporters, TIM is reduced to rebuilding what he's lost, Kai Leng is pretty much his most potent and trusted weapon and his badassness is only rivaled by Shepard. 

If Shepard in ME3 turns their back on TIM there's no doubt in my mind that he will just throw everything he's got at Shep to minimize the potential damage he/she can cause to Cerberus. If you play Paragon in ME2 it's possible you're already responsible for forwarding some seriously damaging Cerberus info to the Alliance. 

Modifié par Eshaye, 04 juin 2011 - 09:34 .

[TheRevanchist]

Eshaye wrote...

Mesina2 wrote...

I'll just bump this.

Mesina2 wrote...

It is still not known is Illusive Man hunting Shepard.

Only Cerberus is confirmed to hunt Shepard.


http://social.biowar...5/index/7388679

My retort to that is that Cerberus IS the Illusive Man. There's no one above him, he founded it himself and still pours his own money into it, IF TIM isn't actually trying to kill Shepard then it's a Cerberus cell(s) that's gone rogue. It's a possibility, but a slim one. 




***WARNING NOVEL SPOILERS****



It's important to note that in between ME2 and ME3 Cerberus was dealt an almost death blow by Kahlee Sanders, David Anderson and the Turians. By the start of ME3 Cerberus' most highly placed operatives in the Alliance have been arrested along with most of TIM's investors/supporters, TIM is reduced to rebuilding what he's lost, Kai Leng is pretty much his most potent and trusted weapon and his badassness is only rivaled by Shepard. 

If Shepard in ME3 turns their back on TIM there's no doubt in my mind that he will just throw everything he's got at Shep to minimize the potential damage he/she can cause to Cerberus. If you play Paragon in ME2 it's possible you're already responsible for forwarding some seriously damaging Cerberus info to the Alliance. 

Except that books level of canon is ambiguous at best. Since it's written from the perspective of Udina being chosen as the Councilor. Also since if Anderson was chosen...he would never resign the post to help Khale destroy Cerberus. Drew said this himself...that book is only canon for people who picked Udina.

[Bad King]

kylecouch wrote...

Except the Pro Cerberus/ Renegade people tend to cry alot louder about things then paragoners

Really? I'd say they both cry at about the same volume.

Modifié par Bad King, 04 juin 2011 - 09:59 .

[Wulfram]

I don't like Cerberus, but having them fight on the side of the reapers would require something pretty big to justify.

Having them fight Shepard is less of a stretch, though.

[Moiaussi]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Bull honky. TIM provided all the tools, the money, the intel, and the strategizing. Shepard was just a grunt with a gun.

EDIT

It makes no sense for Cerberus not to fight the Reapers. Cerberus is all about protecting mankind and advancing it, no matter how misguided you might feel they are, that is their mission.

All of that could just as easily have been provided by the Council, other than maybe the intel. The intel could have been leaked by Cerberus or found by other means. The Quarians were already investigating and so were the Alliance (Tali on Freedom's Progress and the VS on Horizon respectively). For all we know an Alliance team showed up on Freedom's Progress just after Shepard left.

[Dean_the_Young]

And Shepard could have been replaced by, well, any other Shepard. A colonist. Or maybe a Spacer. Or an Earthborn? The alignment doesn't matter either.

Could, shoulda...

Wasn't.

Responsibility and credit isn't given to anyone who could have acted. By that false equivalence, anyone who could have genocided the Quarians is just as deserving for the credit as the Geth.

Acknowledgment goes to those who do act. Not those who could have, and might have done so later.

[Seboist]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

TIM didn't do jack ****. 

Bull honky. TIM provided all the tools, the money, the intel, and the strategizing. Shepard was just a grunt with a gun.

EDIT

It makes no sense for Cerberus not to fight the Reapers. Cerberus is all about protecting mankind and advancing it, no matter how misguided you might feel they are, that is their mission.

These rabid Paragons don't want to give Jack "Saviour of Humanity" Harper any credit.