556 réponses à ce sujet

[Da Mecca]

We got to get the kids into the game first(Even though its M-rated...)

Then we'll see the RPG.

If it's still there.

[ink07]

Mr.BlazenGlazen wrote...

Its called sarcasm.

Don't say. I didn't notice.

Except your sarcasm is directed at people complaining about the game being a shooter, like they are clamoring for it to be more like FF which isn't even the case.

But 2/10 for effort. Keep trying, and I'm looking forward to your Tali fanfic soon.

Modifié par ink07, 06 juin 2011 - 10:46 .

[jakal66]

crackseed wrote...

PoliteAssasin wrote...

crackseed wrote...

Ixalmaris wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

I'm going with Chris here. You are pretty stupid if you're judging a whole game based on a three-minute video.

Or by the 10 minute video linked here
http://social.biowar...3/index/7552001

There is a lot more than just 3 minutes of gameplay out there. And what do all the trailers and demos have in common? Action.

A few posts above someone said ME is both, action and rpg. We have seen enough action, where is the other part, the rpg?

I'll definitely nod with this a bit - where all the worrying and naysaying will get solid traction is when there's more time to show off and all we keep getting is action/talk sequences. If Bioware DOES want to sell this to everyone, especially after said promises, some of these later ME3 segments at E3 NEED to show off the promised additions.

I cannot disagree with that  I'm simply saying people need to be patient and stop jumping the shark so much and wailing that Bioware has sold out.

The RPG fans have been waiting for Bioware to come through ever since ME2's streamlining. The Shooter fans seem to be content with the way things are. Wouldn't you agree that it would be more reasonable to appeal to the RPG fans at the beginning of the conference than the shooter fans who loved ME2? Bioware has shown that the shooter fanbase is their priority, as they are much larger and provide more sales for them. We on the other hand are treated like second class citizens.

-Polite

Polite - be careful. You're trying to speak for RPG fans. Who gave you that right? I am a die hard RPG fan. I have played Bioware games since BG1 and Icewind Dale. I loved ME2. I loved ME1. I do not feel that Bioware erred too heavily with ME2, though I WOULD agree that they streamlined a BIT too much, but they made a bold call based on our feedback on ME1 and if you asked me - which system would I prefer? I would go with ME2 everytime, even if I feel it should have had a bit more RPG elements in it. But when I looked at the laughable trainwreck that was ME1's inventory and lackluster weaponry system, I'm glad they experimented how they did.

So no, you do not speak for me as an RPG fan - and I enjoyed ME2 and welcome ME3 bringing back more elements, but I also realize that Bioware is willing to make tough choices in the interests of making the game...better.

Are you really going to tell me that ME1's "RPG elements" like the inventory and completely deceptive weaponry system [not talking about mods - but the actual advancement of weapons] is better then ME2's non-inventory and more defined weaponry?

Don't think so So please, do not speak for me as an RPG fan - I want Bioware to improve and fix the mistakes they make, but I also want them to continue to do what they do best - make insanely bad-ass stories combined with enjoyable gameplay/RPG trappings.

why does he need your permission to state that serveral people and he have this opinion.
Saying RPG fans is generalization I know but I assume that most RPG fans, true RPG fans were disappointed with ME2 and to some level, unless they changed a lot,will be  with ME3. Being disappointed doesn't mean the game sucked.It means it didn't fullfill their expectations.
So in my opinion you're the oddball, and he's actually not speaking about you, it depends a lot on what you consider an RPG fan.See that's my opinion, and I might be 100% wrong but I won't abstain from posting it.
It all depends from what perspective you see it. I don't consider myself an RPG fan, although I loved ME1 because it was the 1st ME game I played, I then played ME2 and I loved it as well.Then I went on playing DAo which I found to be an awsome game and trully the first RPG I ever played.I learnt to play ME1 in several playthroughs to really make use of the rpg elements.And there I noticed the difference, the real difference between one and the other.

But I love both, so my point is I don't think he was talking for you, he was talking for the many people who feel like him,and let's face it there a lot of them.But we throw the word RPG fan here too quick and we forget that that definition has more than one branch...what you may consider a true RPG fan is not perhaps my same point of view...who's to say right and wrong

[Jaron Oberyn]

OmiOmi wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

I'm sorry, you are asking "where is the roleplaying" in the (roughly) 3 minutes of in-game video you have seen so far?

Seriously?

HELL YEAH SERIOUSLY

You guys did it to yourselves.  You're no longer a top developer known for quality.  You're no longer a top developer period.  So we have to ask about these things, and then even if you answer we have to take it with a grain of salt because you're also liars.  You brought this on yourselves.

Very bold statement, yet also very true. They did this to themselves. When you strip out a major component of a video game that your fanbase associates your company with, its bound to ****** off a lot of people.

-Polite

Modifié par PoliteAssasin, 06 juin 2011 - 10:47 .

[Crackseed]

Beef - I was not aware of that and I'd rather not drag this discussion onto KotOR 2, but if you want to PM me and give me some details on that I'd love to hear it. I'll have to look into it.

Anyway, yes - I think Bioware is doing TOO much. It's safe to say that while I have faith in them and they are still a day 1 buy for me, I am worried if they try tokeep this pace up with so many different spin offs and games we're going to be staring down something disastrous later >.>

[KainrycKarr]

Chris Priestly wrote...

ink07 wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

I'm sorry, you are asking "where is the roleplaying" in the (roughly) 3 minutes of in-game video you have seen so far?

Seriously?

Yeah, seriously. We are asking where are the Roleplaying elements in the 4 live demos + online trailers you have shown. It's not like you couldn't release an "RPG elements" trailer/mini feature for sites covering the event.

Try to keep up.

I'm not questioning that you all want more info on RPG mechanics, choice, dialog, etc.

I am quesitoning the OP who seemed to be saying that since we had not shown any RPG elements yet, we must have abandoned RPG.

Glad to know I was totally off base with my silly supposition and it was more the usual demand for MOAR.

Actually it was more asking why all the focus was on BOOM ACTION KER-BLOW! Which is, you know, fun and all, but why couldn't one of the demos, or even a full minute been dedicated to revealing some of these elusive rpg elements.

[TopcatPlayer]

Mr.BlazenGlazen wrote...

Instead of "Gears of Effect 3" they should turn it into "Final Massive Fantasy Effect 3". With anime animations and evil bad guys with black capes. Shepard will have a gunblade and Ashley's hair will be pink. Also Shepard's hair will be spiky.

no i think your thinking of what happened to Dragon Age 2, wrong forum LOLS

[Schneidend]

BeefoTheBold wrote...

1. OMG the Collectors are (spoiler)
2. Build a kick butt team
3. Suicide mission

1. OMG the reapers are coming
2. Find beacons
3. Kill Saren

See what I did thar?

[DrRedrum]

I get the explanation that you can't show much in "3 minutes of footage", because of this you gotta show off the new combat features to draw interest. I understand that. But maybe thats the problem.

Mass Effect 3 is supposed to be a top contender in the industry and is one of EA's dreadnoughts when it comes to sales in modern gaming. So why then, why would they give one of the most anticipated releases, your Mass effect 3, about the equivalent amount of time that a Need For Speed The Chase? I am not certain of the presentation times but they appear to be similar in length. (Please Correct me if someone picks up the times) Wouldn't that make one wonder where EA's priorities lie when it comes to their developers when they can't even give their purchased companies the time it takes to properly show off their games for all its features?

[Nohvarr]

Let's check, Bioware showed off the new more fluid combat, showed off the improved visuals, and gave an example of how certain people will join our squad as temps, help us in missions, or join us for the long haul. So they do all that, and people still complain because they didn't show them how the RPG elements will work even though they said that you can buy and SELL more stuff along with branching powers and improved armor customization.

Yeah, you can wave DA 2 in my face all you like it don't mean sithspit because that game wasn't made by the ME team. I'd suggest you simmer down and wait for them to do the class videos that are likely to come out closer to time.

As for tacticle play, check out the following

it shows a SOLDIER sneaking up on a guy to knife him in the back, think what an Infiltrator can do.

[Crackseed]

jakal66 wrote...


why does he need your permission to state that serveral people and he have this opinion.
Saying RPG fans is generalization I know but I assume that most RPG fans, true RPG fans were disappointed with ME2 and to some level, unless they changed a lot,will be  with ME3. Being disappointed doesn't mean the game sucked.It means it didn't fullfill their expectations.
So in my opinion you're the oddball, and he's actually not speaking about you, it depends a lot on what you consider an RPG fan.See that's my opinion, and I might be 100% wrong but I won't abstain from posting it.
It all depends from what perspective you see it. I don't consider myself an RPG fan, although I loved ME1 because it was the 1st ME game I played, I then played ME2 and I loved it as well.Then I went on playing DAo which I found to be an awsome game and trully the first RPG I ever played.I learnt to play ME1 in several playthroughs to really make use of the rpg elements.And there I noticed the difference, the real difference between one and the other.

But I love both, so my point is I don't think he was talking for you, he was talking for the many people who feel like him,and let's face it there a lot of them.But we throw the word RPG fan here too quick and we forget that that definition has more than one branch...what you may consider a true RPG fan is not perhaps my same point of view...who's to say right and wrong

A good question - but when you use the term "The RPG fans" you sort of create an encompassing label. What defines one person as an RPG fan versus someone else as not? It sounds like saying "If you liked ME2, you're a shooter fan and not an RPG fan" when you create that kind of statement. That's where I was countering him on - and beyond that, your point stands perfectly. No one can speak for anyone else. Even if I have all my friends on my side, we hardly constitute a major demographic for ME2. We're simply a small slice of the pie that feels one way about the game - I simply think it's more safe to voice it as "This is how I see it and the people in my circle agree with me" rather then assigning a dangerous label like "The RPG fans" versus "The shooter fans who liked ME2" I hope that explains my point better.

[Chris Priestly]

Have people seen the newer Interview with Casey on Gametrialers? While still likely not enough RPG for you, it is pretty cool.

Keep it on continual play to see part 2.

[Occulo]

jakal66 wrote...

crackseed wrote...

PoliteAssasin wrote...


The RPG fans have been waiting for Bioware to come through ever since ME2's streamlining. The Shooter fans seem to be content with the way things are. Wouldn't you agree that it would be more reasonable to appeal to the RPG fans at the beginning of the conference than the shooter fans who loved ME2? Bioware has shown that the shooter fanbase is their priority, as they are much larger and provide more sales for them. We on the other hand are treated like second class citizens.

-Polite

Polite - be careful. You're trying to speak for RPG fans. Who gave you that right? I am a die hard RPG fan. I have played Bioware games since BG1 and Icewind Dale. I loved ME2. I loved ME1. I do not feel that Bioware erred too heavily with ME2, though I WOULD agree that they streamlined a BIT too much, but they made a bold call based on our feedback on ME1 and if you asked me - which system would I prefer? I would go with ME2 everytime, even if I feel it should have had a bit more RPG elements in it. But when I looked at the laughable trainwreck that was ME1's inventory and lackluster weaponry system, I'm glad they experimented how they did.

So no, you do not speak for me as an RPG fan - and I enjoyed ME2 and welcome ME3 bringing back more elements, but I also realize that Bioware is willing to make tough choices in the interests of making the game...better.

Are you really going to tell me that ME1's "RPG elements" like the inventory and completely deceptive weaponry system [not talking about mods - but the actual advancement of weapons] is better then ME2's non-inventory and more defined weaponry?

Don't think so So please, do not speak for me as an RPG fan - I want Bioware to improve and fix the mistakes they make, but I also want them to continue to do what they do best - make insanely bad-ass stories combined with enjoyable gameplay/RPG trappings.

why does he need your permission to state that serveral people and he have this opinion.
Saying RPG fans is generalization I know but I assume that most RPG fans, true RPG fans were disappointed with ME2 and to some level, unless they changed a lot,will be  with ME3. Being disappointed doesn't mean the game sucked.It means it didn't fullfill their expectations.

Personally, it's starting to sound like that time there was that guy who complained that Dragon Age II was neglecting their core demographic, the straight male, and how he was putting his opinions as something representative of most straight male gamers.

Modifié par Occulo, 06 juin 2011 - 10:52 .

[Murmillos]

BeefoTheBold wrote...
It's more than what we've been shown on Mass Effect 3.

We haven't seen any details on the roleplaying piece of ME3 is the general criticism. The ability to customize equipment is an example of an RPG element, and does indeed go further than what EA showed us during the E3 reveal today.

Doesn't necessarily mean that the final game of ME3 won't be MORE of an RPG than Ghost Recon, but it does serve as a good example of what people mean when they ask the question, "Um...so when do we get to see the RPG elements?"

The biggest area of concern after both ME2 and DA2 was the stripped down and removed RPG pieces. Bioware has assured us that they're aware of the concern. But they didn't show anything today that specifically addresses that concern. If anything, they left many people MORE concerned because their ME3 demonstration took much the same approach as games like Gears of War took.

And thats the point, maybe I derped the hyberboly just a tad too much, but thus being the Bioware forums, thus Bioware KNOWING that RPG has always been most of our concerns since after ME2 came out, and yet they still ignore us while continuing to parrot "Trust us, you haven't seen everything yet." which is quite a ironic thing to say if there isn't anything to show. This development team has been nothing but talk in regards to RPG mechanics since ME2 started, so sorry if we feel a little wary on everything they say when it comes to "Trust us."

You think that out of a 4-5 minute window, they could have thrown in 30-45 seconds (in either the Microsoft or EA showcase) a couple of talent tree's or the differences between the evolved powers (if evolved powers have more then two minor differences - as so far "confirmed") or even a quick glance at the weapon mod screen.

We keep asking "show us the RPG", and Bioware moderators keep going "Trust us." Well we did for ME2 and they broke it - hard. Its time they quit flapping their lips, wagging their fingers and own up for once.

If you don't care for RPG mechanics or always equate RPG to slow boring details, then you won't get or care what I've just said. But for those who don't find PRG "that scary role-playing that only nerds do", this is more unwelcome news.

[sympathy4saren]

Sidney wrote...

Seriously, you want to show all the white hot action of managing inventory? Maybe an exciting shot of the level up screen? Wait, people always oooh and ahhh at modifying your weapons!! Threads like this continue prove I grossly overestimated the intellect of RPG players.

You're right dudebro, let's shoot at stuff. Oh, its so super awesome man!!!! Shoot em up!!!! Oh yeah, so awesome dude, let's rock these alien baddies with my big guns....and my energy sword!!! Totally awesome sweet man!!!!

[BeefoTheBold]

Sent to you crackseed.

I'm going to wait and see on ME3. I'm hoping that folks like Casey Hudson are reading these posts and paying attention to the need to show us a bit more on the RPG side. In the meantime, I think we've more or less finished the discussion here with what we have to work with information wise.

[BeefoTheBold]

Chris Priestly wrote...

Have people seen the newer Interview with Casey on Gametrialers? While still likely not enough RPG for you, it is pretty cool.

Keep it on continual play to see part 2.

Thanks Chris. I'm going to go take a look.

[TopcatPlayer]

I think the shooter lovers are mistaking RPing for dialogue options, there's a lot more too it than that and choosing what colour your armour is. At least in ME1 you could choose whether you were going to just action shooter the game all the way through or whether you were going to dig in and make a complete character that hacked, and looted, and added stats to skills instead of powers while tanking out your support characters. The hallmark of Bioware games are meant to be choice, the fact that ME2 took away a lot of that choice understandably worries a lot of the fans and so the smart thing would have been to address the issue first.

[Crackseed]

Thank you sir, and yes - I think we're going to just be going round about - we know what this will come down to: Bioware needs to show us the revamped RPG elements with the additions coming back. We know the game is going to rock on the action/story point - now we need to know that all the feedback about RPG elements which should be back in is really coming true.

Should be an interesting week. Been a great debate too

[mgs00]

Forasou wrote...

I'm praying for the same quality of ME2...

lets hope your prayers aren't answered.  we need the game to improve not be the same horrible game with the same horrible story.

[Darthbill52]

crackseed wrote...

Beef - I was not aware of that and I'd rather not drag this discussion onto KotOR 2, but if you want to PM me and give me some details on that I'd love to hear it. I'll have to look into it.

Anyway, yes - I think Bioware is doing TOO much. It's safe to say that while I have faith in them and they are still a day 1 buy for me, I am worried if they try tokeep this pace up with so many different spin offs and games we're going to be staring down something disastrous later >.>

Ok I am not alone in that line of thinking either, yeah there are too many projects going on at Bioware, we allready had the warmed over DA II.  When i saw the e3 2011 reveal from Old republic it screamed to me like this is where we reveal the release date....wrong again.   Its nice to see I am not alone, but i think with the lack of hard hitting data, we just going to have to wait and see

[Jaron Oberyn]

crackseed wrote...

Polite - be careful. You're trying to speak for RPG fans. Who gave you that right? I am a die hard RPG fan. I have played Bioware games since BG1 and Icewind Dale. I loved ME2. I loved ME1. I do not feel that Bioware erred too heavily with ME2, though I WOULD agree that they streamlined a BIT too much, but they made a bold call based on our feedback on ME1 and if you asked me - which system would I prefer? I would go with ME2 everytime, even if I feel it should have had a bit more RPG elements in it. But when I looked at the laughable trainwreck that was ME1's inventory and lackluster weaponry system, I'm glad they experimented how they did.

So no, you do not speak for me as an RPG fan - and I enjoyed ME2 and welcome ME3 bringing back more elements, but I also realize that Bioware is willing to make tough choices in the interests of making the game...better.

Are you really going to tell me that ME1's "RPG elements" like the inventory and completely deceptive weaponry system [not talking about mods - but the actual advancement of weapons] is better then ME2's non-inventory and more defined weaponry?

Don't think so So please, do not speak for me as an RPG fan - I want Bioware to improve and fix the mistakes they make, but I also want them to continue to do what they do best - make insanely bad-ass stories combined with enjoyable gameplay/RPG trappings.

When I say RPG fanbase, its more general than individual. While not all of Bio's RPg fans dislike ME2, or their current course, the majority of them do. There's no arguing that. I do think that Me2 did well shooter wise, but it didn't have to be at the expense of the RPG elements. I agree that ME1's inventory was terrible, but stripping it out completely wasn't the answer to that. But maybe its like someone said on here a while ago, the fanbases Bioware's trying to put together are like oil and water, we just don't mix. Bioware had to choose, and they chose the consumer base that would yield the most profits.

-Polite

Edit: Removed big nest o quotes.

Modifié par Chris Priestly, 06 juin 2011 - 10:57 .

[KenKenpachi]

Chris Priestly wrote...

Have people seen the newer Interview with Casey on Gametrialers? While still likely not enough RPG for you, it is pretty cool.

Keep it on continual play to see part 2.

Its enough for me. And I don't care what fire I draw on myself, but serriously...you guys do good work and put up with more crap daily that I would tolerate for one hour. Some of my fellow "fans" would not be happy unless bioware took 50 steps back or ran its self into the ground. Even if you gave them a gold bar with the game, some would still **** about nothing.

Like I told someone else in PM, the thing is its selfish and stupid how some are with there demands. Devs everyone works for money, not your affection, like say your a hot dog vendor, now you can stay where you are and serve maybe 30 people a day and make only 30 bucks a day, and strugle, or you can go to a nicer part of town and make 100. I really have no problem if you do, I might not fallow you maybe if I like the area, but I'm not going to fallow your cart and go

"NO DO NOT EAT IT HE HAS HORRIBLE HOTDOGS NOT AS GOOD AS USED TO BE!!!! LEAVE NICE TOWN COME BACK MAKE EM HERE FOR ONLY US!!!"   No one with a brain thats even remotely functional or has any needs of its own would think its a good idea.


I've been a huge RPG player for years, and bio has not done anything majorly wrong in my book, and when it does I will leave, it won't get my money. I however won't stick around and whine endlessly and bring down everything it makes.

Modifié par KenKenpachi, 06 juin 2011 - 10:58 .

[Darthbill52]

Chris Priestly wrote...

Have people seen the newer Interview with Casey on Gametrialers? While still likely not enough RPG for you, it is pretty cool.

Keep it on continual play to see part 2.

I did see this live actually, and was quite impressed.   I think this the first of many Me3 featurettes.  Thanks for bringing this to the attention of the fans 

[Walker White]

AlanC9 wrote...

You've got a couple of big assumptions tucked in there. Not every long-term Bio fan likes CRPG conventions. For instance, I'm a big fan of RPGs, but I only tolerate CRPGs, which generally descend from bad RPG systems and implement the bad parts of those bad systems. So I guess you could say that I liked BG despite it being based on D&D, not because of it.

Maybe the Bio core fanbas was always me, and never you

QFT