2247 réponses à ce sujet

[Mr. MannlyMan]

Still not seeing why some of you think that saying "people change over time" is adequate in explaining Ash's new look (and, yeah, it is a radically different look".

That's a first; for every other series that's ever done this (sexualizing a major female character despite how non-oversexed and practical she was in previous installments) that I've been involved with, I've always heard "sellout", "cheap", "retcon", "sexism", "stupid", "out-of-character" as fan complaints, but I don't think I've ever heard someone make the argument that it works, "Because she might've had some character development in the interim, when we weren't looking."

That's pretty ****** poor, fellas. ****** poor excuse. I mean, has anyone here actually taken a literature class or taken it as a post-secondary course? Most of the writers probably have, at one point or another. Are you telling me that they don't know the difference between good character development, lazy character development, and a character retcon? Who do you think was more likely to say, "We need to make Ashley more sexy in the next game!"? The producers, or the writers? : / Because I very much doubt the producers would have approved this character redesign if they didn't want Ashley to be totally over-sexualized (and producers tend to have pretty good knowledge about the characters as well, so it's not like they would approve this with no prior knowledge of the character, either).

God, use some common sense and stop grasping at straws. IF that is Ashley's new armor, it's a character retcon that will probably have some crappy character development thrown in to try to explain it. This isn't the first time it's happened in a series, and this won't be the last thread to criticize it, either.

[ADLegend21]

I don't care what she looks like, all my Shepard's will be all over her most fo the time so she might not ahe time to keep anything on her XD

[aftohsix]

Mr. MannlyMan wrote...

 IF that is Ashley's new armor, it's a character retcon that will probably have some crappy character development thrown in to try to explain it.  

You accuse people of grasping at straws but then you jump to a radical conclusion based on jack squat.

If I wear a t-shirt and jeans for a week and then one day show up to work in a suit am I suddenly a different person?  Your logic sucks and you know it.

[Sora Shepard]

 I've asked if you or any woman would do the same things in wedges (as depicted on Ashely) as you would in sneakers.  Can you do that?  Comfortably as you would with sneakers?  Would you get the same stability? 

Nope.

[Mr. MannlyMan]

Armor. I'm saying that IF it's her new armor, it sucks for her character.

Ashley likes big guns, big armor. That's been her personality all along, we've got plenty of ammo to argue that. And would you ever wear dress pants, a dress shirt and a tie to a combat arena?

[aftohsix]

Mr. MannlyMan wrote...

Armor. I'm saying that IF it's her new armor, it sucks for her character.

Ashley likes big guns, big armor. That's been her personality all along, we've got plenty of ammo to argue that. And would you ever wear dress pants, a dress shirt and a tie to a combat arena?

Nope.  I'm done.  Post more pictures of shoes if you need.

*SPOILER ALERT*  ZOMG Retcon is back in full force for Mass Effect 3.


EDIT:  You guys do the character of Ashley a disservice by equating her personality to what she wears however.  Is Ashley a badass because she likes big guns and big armor or is she a badass because of who she is?

You seem to argue its only the clothes and the rifle.

Modifié par aftohsix, 07 juin 2011 - 06:47 .

[SalsaDMA]

ERJAK2 wrote...

The unimportance of this issue relative to what's going on in the game is rather entertaining.

Not really.

The characters are at the heart of what makes ME epic. Take away the care and attention to those, and you end up with just another shooter...

[Kogaion]

goddamnit ..why do Bioware do this kind of thing? they learn nothing from ME2 posts about how stupid is to go to war in high heels with big ****** and cleavages???

[SalsaDMA]

aftohsix wrote...

Mr. MannlyMan wrote...

 IF that is Ashley's new armor, it's a character retcon that will probably have some crappy character development thrown in to try to explain it.  

You accuse people of grasping at straws but then you jump to a radical conclusion based on jack squat.

If I wear a t-shirt and jeans for a week and then one day show up to work in a suit am I suddenly a different person?  Your logic sucks and you know it.

No, your comparison sucks, as does your attention to the detail that is called Ashleys character which is rather important in the context of this discussion.

[billywaffles]

Hah! Miranda, you can rot after watching Ash!

[aftohsix]

SalsaDMA wrote...

No, your comparison sucks, as does your attention to the detail that is called Ashleys character which is rather important in the context of this discussion.

Again I'll ask:

You guys do the character of Ashley a disservice by equating her personality to what she wears however.  Is Ashley a badass because she likes big guns and big armor or is she a badass because of who she is?

You seem to think it's what she's wearing and not who she is.

Why is it I always get the "straw man" response when I drop logic...

[Nashiktal]

aftohsix wrote...

Just a thought... If you knew someone who wore the same outfit day in and day out for over four years what would you think of them?

Why shouldn't the same logic apply to Ashley? Why would she continue to wear the EXACT hair style and armor she four years...

Good god people my wife changes her hairstyle and color every 8 months....

EDIT:  But keep talking about shoes and posting pictures trying to prove what the one grainy photo, which is a still, pulled from a cutscene is displaying.

So Ashley, a military soldier to the bone and blood, who has been through countless pitched battles, who has seen first hand the destructive nature of the reapers and collectors....

Responds to all of it by putting her hair down, (no problems there right? Who needs to worry about hair getting in your eyes when fighting a war? Psh.) wears a skin-tight outfit which just happens to show a good chunk of cleavage (Why worry about bullets when you can serve as masturbation fuel to appeal to all the gamers who didn't like me before, just read through this thread and you will see what I mean.), and essentially... be given the miranda treatment, only without the backstory to justify it.

It just makes no sense. Being a specter is no excuse after all. Especially when every specter we have seen (as few as they are) was wearing plenty of armor on them, even the flipping Asari! Then you couple it with the fact that all the other party members who used to wear lighter armor than ashely, including the origional fan service girl liara, are all getting heavier armor!!!!!

IT JUST DOESNT MAKE SENSE!

[Mr. MannlyMan]

Good God. Way to completely miss my point.

Would you wear a dress suit to a construction zone? If you were working in a third world country with lax regulations, would you wear one? Steel-toed workboots and a hard hat; would you ignore those so you could wear a dress suit? Would Ashley? Just because she's a Spectre (and she's fighting in a war zone with Shep, so her suit doesn't really suit the circumstance), doesn't means it's still in-character.

It doesn't just go against her character's practicality; it goes against the working lore, the setting (people working in a nuclear core don't wear a dress suit with lead padding, for example), and really, it's just insulting to women.

And yeah, I don't judge people based on what they wear; I judge them based on what they do. And I thought the whole point of having unique outfits was to reflect the character? So what series are you talking about here?

[aftohsix]

Nashiktal wrote...

IT JUST DOESNT MAKE SENSE!

Good god...  Neither does GIANT LIFE DESTROYING ROBOTS.  I'm just saying it's completely bogus to nitpick one thing like this and not literally every other piece of the lore if you're going to do that.

I prefer to just play the game and enjoy it for what it is.  Can Ashley still be a badass in a cleavage suit?  Hell yes she can.  Why you think her personality has to change I can't understand.  Help me.

[ricco19]

Can someone explain to me why "soldier" and "attractive" can't be synonymous? Why is it assumed that a gun-toting badass soldier girl can't also look like a model? Kind of a naive viewpoint in my opinion.

As a hardcore mass effect fan, I actually quite enjoy the new look. She's hot. As others have stated, there are most likely many more variations of armor you can put on her, and this is also likely a "casual" look and not her actual armor.

People need to chill out.

[TMA LIVE]

I kind of don't like that she's changed this much in what, under a year since Horizon? Maybe less?

Modifié par TMA LIVE, 07 juin 2011 - 06:58 .

[mya11]

I like the new look of Ashley and this hair, she is more pretty !!

Now, Miranda is not only girl with long hair, I hope shepard women has long hair same ashley

[Nashiktal]

aftohsix wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

IT JUST DOESNT MAKE SENSE!

Good god...  Neither does GIANT LIFE DESTROYING ROBOTS.  I'm just saying it's completely bogus to nitpick one thing like this and not literally every other piece of the lore if you're going to do that.

I prefer to just play the game and enjoy it for what it is.  Can Ashley still be a badass in a cleavage suit?  Hell yes she can.  Why you think her personality has to change I can't understand.  Help me.

Did you not talk to her, or bring her along in the first game? She gives you plenty of reasons why she wouldnt do this. Especially in battle.

Next thing we know, Miranda is going to tie her hair into a bun, start wearing heavy armor, and make fun of the fact Ashley is wearing light armor that wouldn't stop bullets.

Its not an issue with Ashley being sexy, its an issue with Ashley doing things, Ashley wouldn't do.

[Nohvarr]

[quote]solstickan wrote...

[quote]Nohvarr wrote...

Allow me to repost
 
-snip-
[/quote]

How are Ashley's shoes any similar to the sneakers shown?[/quote]

The actual height of the heel is about he same, as is the angle of the rise, and it's thickness. Ashley is not wearing wedge heels, as the design of her foot wear is no where near that slim in the rear.  

[quote]From that angle I gather they are slimmed up front, which not only cramps your toes but lessens your contact with the ground (= less stability). [/quote][/quote]

Actually not so much, check out the side shot, you'll notice that it curves around and does not come to a point as in the heeled shoe pics others have posted. Also I shall again repeat, raied heels help some people run better, other people have posted on this very forum that they use such heels when running, hiking etc. So yeah, Ash is wearing something that helps her in her jom who'd have thought it.

[quote]You guys really reach sometimes in your adamant defense of Bioware. How about this then, will ANY of the male characters have heels as high as the ones Ashley has, or toes as narrow as hers? Probably not. It's a femme thing, not an army thing.[/quote]

And you guys don't reach to prove that Bioware as somehow wronged you? When it became obvious that Ash wasn't wearing Miranda style heels people began to say it was a wedge heel ,which it's not, since the arch and heel look nothing like that found in a wedge heel. As for the toes, they're not as narrow as you're thinking, they curve a good bit more than what's seen in high heels.

As for it not being a military thing, considering we have a person on this forum pointing out that their military friends use such shoes, (admittedly Canadian...now where is Bioware from....) I'd say that puts holes in your argument.

[Nohvarr]

ZLurps wrote...

Spot on and soldiers do helluva lot of more than just run.
You want shoes that give you maximum stability and work in many kind of environments and you aren't the one who can always decide where the battle is going to happen. Even in a city, fallen bricks, shattered glass on pavements, all kind of rubble and depbris can be under your feets. You don't want shoes with heels, or wegdes or whatever they are called. You want something that protects your feet and ankles.

And those been few pics how Ashleys shoes looks like runnings shoes. To be honest, I don't see that either.

theelementslayer wrote...

They are very functional. I have a buddy in the army, only the canadian army but i mean it still a good army (stop the crazy assuming, its  called sarcasm guys) and guess what they are given to wear. Combat boots (large work boots) winter combat boots (large work boots insulated). And combat shoes, which low and behold look alot like what ash is wearing, except they are green. So stop assuming you guys know everything about everything. The game isnt released, they arent high heels, it aint a catsuit.

[Mr. MannlyMan]

^ And it became all about the shoes? When did this happen?

Look above. You don't the the heels are the only thing people think is similar to Miranda's? : /

[MACharlie1]

I wonder - would anyone have issue if Ashley wore low heels like Tela Vasir? I ask because I saw this over at Ashley's thread:

Ashley

And there is possibility. That zipper part in the middle is obviously where the jumpsuit would be.

[Nohvarr]

Mr. MannlyMan wrote...

^ And it became all about the shoes? When did this happen?

Look above. You don't the the heels are the only thing people think is similar to Miranda's? : /

 
Let's compare



vs



Notice that Ash is not wearing a one piece suit, that's it's formed from various pieces of armor placed along her hips shoulders and back. Also, Ash liked big armor and guns back before she traveled the galaxy and seeing what else was available. So after touring the galaxy and seeing all the possibilities your assuming her POV didn't change? And if she is a Spectre, the advanced training she recieved from teh citedel likely caused a change in how she approches a given situation.

[Nashiktal]

You're right, Ashley is actually worse than Miranda at this point.

UGH.

[Ice Cold J]

While we're on the topic (kinda, with "rubber suits" and all), has there been any mention of squadmates armor options, or are we just getting alternate appearance packs as the Collector's Edition seems to indicate?