45 réponses à ce sujet

[moneycashgeorge]

First Off, the Good Things

1. I think unquestionably the best thing about the presentation was the visuals. The visuals were astounding. Seeing the Normandy fly by and then return for an airstrike was incredible. Having a Reaper laser destroy the building you are in and making you fall to ground level looked thrilling and realistic. Clearly they paid attention to the cinematic moments in games like Uncharted 2 and have implemented them perfectly

2. The shooting gameplay looks very much improved. Guns look and sound perfect. Changing cover looks perfect. Rolling is a great addition. Animations in general look great

3. Enemy behavior is also a lot better. The enemies appear to move around alot more, unique enemies like shield carrying ones (thought it didn't look exactly Mass Effect-ish) and Mech Enemies should be a great challenge to fight.

4. The scale. Mass Effect 3 looks like its going to surpass God of War 3 as the biggest scaled game ever. It is jaw dropping how they have brought Reapers into the game environment so beautifully. I hope that, unlike God of War 3, it is not just occassional.

5. So many characters returning. We've only seen a few videos, but already we know that Ashley, Kaiden, Garrus, Wrex, Mordin, Anderson, and Legion will be in the game and part of missions. That is great news and a big step up from the tiny cameos many characters were relegated too in ME2.

6. Seeing long awaited locations. From what I gathered, Earth, the Quarian Homeworld, and the Salarian Homeworld will all be featured. Hopefully the Turian and Asari homeworlds will be as well.

And now the Bad Things.....

1. Kinect. This feature looks totally useless at the moment. The same effect could be done with the headsets that all Xbox's come with. I sincerely hope that Microsoft subsidised the Kinect feature's development so no resources were wasted. They probably did.

2. The omni-blade. From a lore perspective, I hate it, but there's another thread for that. From a gameplay perspective, I am very suspicious that it will be totally unbalanced. There appears to be no limit on its use, and it appers to be able to kill any enemy that you are next to. What are shotguns for then? I'm not going to condemn it until I have more information, but I'm not optimistic

3. Running to jump over random pits. Why was this included? Just in the short demo this happened twice. It appears totally pointless and boring. Was it just to show how good Shepard is at jumping?

4. On rails shooting section. I hope this doesn't happen a lot. It also looked to be fairly pointless, though  I guess it was to show off how durable the Reaper-Crab was. And wasn't it weird that Shepard called the Reaper-Crab a "living Reaper"? It obviously looked much smaller than the Sovereign style reapers, so was it a full Reaper or a Reaper minion?

5. General lack of powers/RPG aspects/customization. I realize that this was just a reveal demo and that being spectacular and showing the improved mechanics was the focus, but I hope this doesn't mean RPG has been put on the backburner. But I always knew my hopes that Mass Effect 3 would truly have deep and complex RPG mechanics were pipepdreams.

[Bogsnot1]

moneycashgeorge wrote...

4. On rails shooting section. I hope this doesn't happen a lot. It also looked to be fairly pointless, though  I guess it was to show off how durable the Reaper-Crab was. And wasn't it weird that Shepard called the Reaper-Crab a "living Reaper"? It obviously looked much smaller than the Sovereign style reapers, so was it a full Reaper or a Reaper minion?

If you listen to the whole dialogue, he says something along the lines of  "Its not a Reaper base, but an actual Reaper"

[moneycashgeorge]

^ Yea sorry I mis-quoted. But my point was that we've never seen "small" reapers before, so its different.

[Uhh.. Jonah]

I only agree with 6 (bad side) and agree with all of the good things you mentioned, but we a lot of time for them to show us the good stuff.

Modifié par Uhh.. Jonah, 08 juin 2011 - 08:42 .

[Tamahome560]

moneycashgeorge wrote...

2. The omni-blade. From a lore perspective, I hate it, but there's another thread for that. From a gameplay perspective, I am very suspicious that it will be totally unbalanced. There appears to be no limit on its use, and it appers to be able to kill any enemy that you are next to. What are shotguns for then? I'm not going to condemn it until I have more information, but I'm not optimistic

From the lore perspective it makes perfect sense and I have explained it to you in the other thread

[moneycashgeorge]

^ Yea well i disagree

[whywhywhywhy]

I might skip me3 from what I seen

[Gorskijesih]

moneycashgeorge wrote...

And now the Bad Things.....

1. Kinect. This feature looks totally useless at the moment. The same effect could be done with the headsets that all Xbox's come with. I sincerely hope that Microsoft subsidised the Kinect feature's development so no resources were wasted. They probably did.

2. The omni-blade. From a lore perspective, I hate it, but there's another thread for that. From a gameplay perspective, I am very suspicious that it will be totally unbalanced. There appears to be no limit on its use, and it appers to be able to kill any enemy that you are next to. What are shotguns for then? I'm not going to condemn it until I have more information, but I'm not optimistic

3. Running to jump over random pits. Why was this included? Just in the short demo this happened twice. It appears totally pointless and boring. Was it just to show how good Shepard is at jumping?

4. On rails shooting section. I hope this doesn't happen a lot. It also looked to be fairly pointless, though  I guess it was to show off how durable the Reaper-Crab was. And wasn't it weird that Shepard called the Reaper-Crab a "living Reaper"? It obviously looked much smaller than the Sovereign style reapers, so was it a full Reaper or a Reaper minion?

5. General lack of powers/RPG aspects/customization. I realize that this was just a reveal demo and that being spectacular and showing the improved mechanics was the focus, but I hope this doesn't mean RPG has been put on the backburner. But I always knew my hopes that Mass Effect 3 would truly have deep and complex RPG mechanics were pipepdreams.

First off, I agree with the good things you listed.

But I disagree with many of the bad ones.

1. Kinect sound control is, if you ask me, awesome. You can literally tell your squad what to do in real time without pausing. Besides, it's not something you HAVE to use, so you can just ignore it if it irks you.

2. On this I sort of agree, though I don't know a lot about how omni-tools/holograms work, but I'm skeptical in their ability to cut things. We'll probably see in game, though.

3. How can this possibly be a bad thing? It adds variety to the things Shepard can do, making combat less monotonous or linear.

4. The on-rails section is I think more of a device that allows you to always keep your eyes on that reaper during the chase, cause that is important from a cinematic point of view, and you can actually do something instead of it just being a cutscene. Shep was going to be on that Geth truck anyhow, would you rather he just sit there?

5. This is because the RPG elements take time to fully develop, and since we're a long way from release, they simply haven't polished them enough to show them. I'm sure we'll see more of these in the future.

[Khayness]

Tamahome560 wrote...

From the lore perspective it makes perfect sense and I have explained it to you in the other thread

You can't handwave TPS trend even if Mordin explains it in-game.

It's still going to be mostly imitation, than improvement.

[kaiki01]

moneycashgeorge wrote...

3. Running to jump over random pits. Why was this included? Just in the short demo this happened twice. It appears totally pointless and boring. Was it just to show how good Shepard is at jumping?

4. On rails shooting section. I hope this doesn't happen a lot. It also looked to be fairly pointless, though  I guess it was to show off how durable the Reaper-Crab was. And wasn't it weird that Shepard called the Reaper-Crab a "living Reaper"? It obviously looked much smaller than the Sovereign style reapers, so was it a full Reaper or a Reaper minion?

3. I would guess it was priming players for future levels where the map design has more x-y-z dimensionality & complexity that may have Shepard climbing up, jumping down, or jumping across chasims. I doubt they threw in that bit and that will be all we see in ME3 of Shepard doing that type of movement.

4. Some people like rail shooters, so the point would be entertainment.

[Phaedon]

6. Seeing long awaited locations. From what I gathered, Earth, the Quarian Homeworld, and the Salarian Homeworld will all be featured. Hopefully the Turian and Asari homeworlds will be as well.

They will. See? I told you about stickying the confirmed features thread!

6. Seeing long awaited locations. From what I gathered, Earth, the Quarian Homeworld, and the Salarian Homeworld will all be featured. Hopefully the Turian and Asari homeworlds will be as well.

Brenon Holmes says that when a new feature is added, then the budget and staff, doesn't get re-assigned accordingly, more resources are brought in by EA.

2. The omni-blade. From a lore perspective, I hate it, but there's another thread for that. From a gameplay perspective, I am very suspicious that it will be totally unbalanced. There appears to be no limit on its use, and it appers to be able to kill any enemy that you are next to. What are shotguns for then? I'm not going to condemn it until I have more information, but I'm not optimistic

Nope. I have made a post showing how it can not be in any way lore-breaking, and there's a ME writer who explained how it worked on Twitter.

3. Running to jump over random pits. Why was this included? Just in the short demo this happened twice. It appears totally pointless and boring. Was it just to show how good Shepard is at jumping?

It brings diversity. I still don't see how this is bad.

4. On rails shooting section. I hope this doesn't happen a lot. It also looked to be fairly pointless, though I guess it was to show off how durable the Reaper-Crab was. And wasn't it weird that Shepard called the Reaper-Crab a "living Reaper"? It obviously looked much smaller than the Sovereign style reapers, so was it a full Reaper or a Reaper minion?

Moment-to-moment gameplay.

5. General lack of powers/RPG aspects/customization. I realize that this was just a reveal demo and that being spectacular and showing the improved mechanics was the focus, but I hope this doesn't mean RPG has been put on the backburner. But I always knew my hopes that Mass Effect 3 would truly have deep and complex RPG mechanics were pipepdreams.

The point of E3 is to attract new customers. You want more RPG elements to be shown? Here is a trailer you might like:

IS Mass Effect going too far into pure Action? WHAT ABOUT THE ARR-PEE-JEE Elements?!

Well then do I have the perfect game for you! Here it is! A shot for shot description of the E3 trailer! In full detail! It's the trailer ever TRUE roleplayer wants to see!

It's an epic new action RPG. One
that has impressive next-gen graphics that border on painstakingly
beautiful, voice acting for thousands of lines of dialogue for even the
most minor of NPCs, a branching plot line that accounts for virtually
every decision and indecision the player makes, fluid, visceral combat
that redefines action . . . and they start their trailer with a menu
screen.

It's a customization screen for the local horse-seller;
mostly text, as the invisible user scrolls through boring UI menu
options detailing which style of horseshoe they want on their new mare.
CUT TO BLACK-

TEXT - "In an age long past . . ."

CUT TO - A
diablo-esque grid based gear menu. Someone is sorting their loot. They
hold their mouse pointer over two daggers that have the same appearance
but slightly different stats. They go back and forth trying to decide
which one they want for their build . . . CUT TO BLACK

TEXT - "A hero will rise . . . "

CUT
TO - A Blacksmith's list of wares. The user scrolls over the sell tab.
Sells off a few pieces of armor, all the same type. Obvious vendor
trash. Just as they're about to hit the "exit" button we CUT TO BLACK

TEXT - "A journey will commence . . . "

CUT
TO - Back to the inventory grid. The mouse pointer picks up one of the
daggers. Drags it to the trash icon, but doesn't let go yet. The dagger
floats there for a few seconds. The player's pensive. Should they throw
the dagger away? They hold there . . . and then put it back in their
inventory and mouse over the other dagger to read the stats again. CUT
TO BLACK

TEXT - "An Empire Will Crumble . . . ."

CUT TO - A
book of in game lore. The font makes it difficult to read as it's in
some kind of calligraphy. The shot holds on the page for about twenty
seconds, enough for us to read a couple of paragraphs but not enough to
finish the entire page. The player was just finishing up that page you
see. The book's page flips and we see two full pages of further text,
and we hold for ten more seconds while very faint music is heard in the
background. The kind of idle, generic, tavern you hear in any RPG inn.
After ten seconds, long enough to begin reading this massive wall of
text for which we have no frame of reference, and obviously in the
middle of probably twelve pages, we again CUT TO BLACK

TEXT - "An Evil Will Awake . . ."

CUT
TO - An obvious loading screen. A fairy's wings flap in the lower right
corner to let you know the game hasn't crashed. They animate in that
stuttering way all loading screen icons animate. A tootip fads in the on
the center of the screen. It reads "Did you know that there are 46
variations to your main combat style? Each with 3 different
specialization paths? Choose wisely! A Jack of All Trades is a Master of
. . . Gnome!" CUT TO BLACK.

TEXT - ". . . and Only You Can Save The World!"

CUT
TO - the armor grid again. The mouse goes back and forth between the
two daggers quickly. It stops over the one it didn't try to throw away
earlier for a couple of seconds . . . but then throws away the one it
almost did earlier. CUT TO BLACK.

TEXT - "The Elfwar Chronicles VII - The Obsidian Blades" FADE DOWN
FADE UP - TEXT - Coming Soon.

Again, check the confirmed features thread for more info on the RPG elements.

[Tamahome560]

moneycashgeorge wrote...

^ Yea well i disagree

You have every right to disagree but could you tell me why? Just curious as to what is wrong with the explanation that was proposed there or is it just simple ''I don't like it and won't accept any explanation for it'' that happens on BSN a lot

[DrDrCapone13]

moneycashgeorge wrote...

...

3. Running to jump over random pits. Why was this included? Just in the short demo this happened twice. It appears totally pointless and boring. Was it just to show how good Shepard is at jumping?

4. On rails shooting section. I hope this doesn't happen a lot. It also looked to be fairly pointless, though  I guess it was to show off how durable the Reaper-Crab was. And wasn't it weird that Shepard called the Reaper-Crab a "living Reaper"? It obviously looked much smaller than the Sovereign style reapers, so was it a full Reaper or a Reaper minion?

5. General lack of powers/RPG aspects/customization. I realize that this was just a reveal demo and that being spectacular and showing the improved mechanics was the focus, but I hope this doesn't mean RPG has been put on the backburner. But I always knew my hopes that Mass Effect 3 would truly have deep and complex RPG mechanics were pipepdreams.

Ok, I do agree with you on points 1 and 2 for the bad things, but I take issue with 3, 4, and 5. 

3. Yes, the jumping mechanic is a different and (slightly) unnecessary addition to ME3, but, in all honesty, I think it was a good idea. It makes the actions seem more streamlined, less like the battles are so linear. It made the gameplay seem more realistic, in my opinion. 

4. I honestly doubt the "rails" shooting section will be a major fixture in Mass Effect 3. It's more likely one of many new, small additions to the game akin to the cab chase scene in Lair of the Shadow Broker. Ultimately, it's used more for effect than anything, and I approve. 

5. I think it's far too early to be criticizing the "lack" of RPG features shown in the game. Really, we haven't seen enough of the game to make any major judgments on the state of different improvements besides obvious things like combat and visuals. RPG features are harder to discern from these kinds of short video segments. Give it time, I know they'll add back some of the RPG elements that many people miss from ME1. 

[onelifecrisis]

I agree with the good list.

As for the bad list, as you said, Microsoft probably subsidised (and then some) the Kinect feature's development (seriously, the dev cost of adding voice commands is practically zero anyway).

Lore-breaks aside, I'm sure the omni-blade will be balanced by the time the game ships.

Running to jump over random pits... yeah, it did look rather pointless. What concerns me more, though, is whether a mis-timed jump would ever result in a stupid insta-death. I hate those.

I agree with everything you said about the on-rails shooting section. As for the reaper, it's already been confirmed that they come in all shapes and sizes.

We pretty much already know what the RPG side of it will be; everyone will have the same powers as they did in ME2, but they'll be able to evolve them further.

Modifié par onelifecrisis, 08 juin 2011 - 08:55 .

[MegaBadExample]

I have to disagree. It was awesummmmmmmm.

[ZenoX]

Gorskijesih wrote...

moneycashgeorge wrote...

1. Kinect. This feature looks totally useless at the moment. The same effect could be done with the headsets that all Xbox's come with. I sincerely hope that Microsoft subsidised the Kinect feature's development so no resources were wasted. They probably did.

1. Kinect sound control is, if you ask me, awesome. You can literally tell your squad what to do in real time without pausing. Besides, it's not something you HAVE to use, so you can just ignore it if it irks you.

It's not like it's some revolutionary thing. A headset and some decent programming can do the same thing. And besides, what's the point in speaking out the Radial Dialogue lines... just to have Shepard say the real lines after. Feels stupid to hear the same thing twice.

[shinobi602]

I only saw good things.

God I love my taste in games. I'm almost never disappointed. =P

[Paul Sedgmore]

Phaedon wrote...

6. Seeing long awaited locations. From what I gathered, Earth, the Quarian Homeworld, and the Salarian Homeworld will all be featured. Hopefully the Turian and Asari homeworlds will be as well.

They will. See? I told you about stickying the confirmed features thread!

1. Kinect. This feature looks totally useless at the moment. The same effect could be done with the headsets that all Xbox's come with. I sincerely hope that Microsoft subsidised the Kinect feature's development so no resources were wasted. They probably did.

Brenon Holmes says that when a new feature is added, then the budget and staff, doesn't get re-assigned accordingly, more resources are brought in by EA.

2. The omni-blade. From a lore perspective, I hate it, but there's another thread for that. From a gameplay perspective, I am very suspicious that it will be totally unbalanced. There appears to be no limit on its use, and it appers to be able to kill any enemy that you are next to. What are shotguns for then? I'm not going to condemn it until I have more information, but I'm not optimistic

Nope. I have made a post showing how it can not be in any way lore-breaking, and there's a ME writer who explained how it worked on Twitter.

3. Running to jump over random pits. Why was this included? Just in the short demo this happened twice. It appears totally pointless and boring. Was it just to show how good Shepard is at jumping?

It brings diversity. I still don't see how this is bad.

4. On rails shooting section. I hope this doesn't happen a lot. It also looked to be fairly pointless, though I guess it was to show off how durable the Reaper-Crab was. And wasn't it weird that Shepard called the Reaper-Crab a "living Reaper"? It obviously looked much smaller than the Sovereign style reapers, so was it a full Reaper or a Reaper minion?

Moment-to-moment gameplay.

5. General lack of powers/RPG aspects/customization. I realize that this was just a reveal demo and that being spectacular and showing the improved mechanics was the focus, but I hope this doesn't mean RPG has been put on the backburner. But I always knew my hopes that Mass Effect 3 would truly have deep and complex RPG mechanics were pipepdreams.

The point of E3 is to attract new customers. You want more RPG elements to be shown? Here is a trailer you might like:
*snip*
Again, check the confirmed features thread for more info on the RPG elements.

Minor fix to your post but I agree on all the points you raised.

[Phaedon]

ZenoX wrote...
It's not like it's some revolutionary thing. A headset and some decent programming can do the same thing. And besides, what's the point in speaking out the Radial Dialogue lines... just to have Shepard say the real lines after. Feels stupid to hear the same thing twice.

On the other hand, you don't want the player to be talking for hours. It can be very tiresome, and they need several bottles of water to complete a single mission.

[KotOREffecT]

Indeed, very good things about Mass Effect 3 it was. Some of the bad things like jumping over pits and climbing ladders? Not so bad at all, it makes ME3 seem more open and epic like your doing more. How can that be bad? Ever watch movies, even Star Wars? There is so much going on esp the simple things like movement. So rolling over, climbing things, are def welcome.

Even the GodofWar style Reaper boss battle was damn epic and just gives ME3 that more Star Wars grand battle feeling. ME3 will be the ultimate experience, from simple convos about a characters past to epic style battles that rival that of movies and most games, how can you beat that?

[MrFob]

Good list is good.

Bad list:
Don't care about kinect (PC gamer). Would like the squad commands, other than that I ignore it.

I like the blade, to me it makes sense.

The jumping looks ok, nothing major IMO. Don't see how it is bad.

Agree on the rail shooting thing. It's fun once or twice but I hope they don't do it too often. Rather give us a vehicle to really drive like the MAKO/Hammerhead.

We'll see more powers/dialogue soon enough. It's marketing. I am not worried about it (yet).

All in all, I liked what I saw ... a lot. Can't wait for more info.

[darth_lopez]

Gorskijesih wrote...


1. Kinect sound control is, if you ask me, awesome. You can literally tell your squad what to do in real time without pausing. Besides, it's not something you HAVE to use, so you can just ignore it if it irks you.

Real time is Fairly Useless in a tactical RPG, it adds another degree of  difficulty not simplicity :/ the fact that the same thing can be accomplished in other, more effective, ways shows how useless it is. How is pausing better? easier to aim, time to throoughly think out moves, less casualties, more accurate, Less accidents/potential accidents.

problems with this 1) accidental regroup
2)accidental move
3) accidental etc....

See what i'm getting at here? When playing the game your mouth is literally free to do what ever the hell it feels like and could interfere with voice commands substantially. The fact that Tomclancy games haven't exactly perfected the voice control system (one they've used for a long long long time) should be a warning sign that this feature is probably for the worse :/

[Rolling Flame]

moneycashgeorge wrote...

And now the Bad Things.....

2. The omni-blade. From a lore perspective, I hate it, but there's another thread for that. From a gameplay perspective, I am very suspicious that it will be totally unbalanced. There appears to be no limit on its use, and it appers to be able to kill any enemy that you are next to. What are shotguns for then? I'm not going to condemn it until I have more information, but I'm not optimistic

3. Running to jump over random pits. Why was this included? Just in the short demo this happened twice. It appears totally pointless and boring. Was it just to show how good Shepard is at jumping?

5. General lack of powers/RPG aspects/customization. I realize that this was just a reveal demo and that being spectacular and showing the improved mechanics was the focus, but I hope this doesn't mean RPG has been put on the backburner. But I always knew my hopes that Mass Effect 3 would truly have deep and complex RPG mechanics were pipepdreams.

I agree with your other points, I really hope that on rail sequences are not common. They become very dull, very rapidly. 

While I share your gameplay concerns about the Onmi-blade, I believe that it won't be an overpowered tool on higher difficulties. Judging from the lack of protection on most of the enemies, I would guess that the demos were being played on Normal difficulty. Hopefully, on higher difficulties, enemies will be able to stand up to a stab.

I get the feeling that the random pits are a way to stop players from retreating into areas that they have already been through. A little more creative than dropping down a small cliff or something, I guess.

Finally, remember that, at E3, BioWare is trying to get new players to buy their game. Given the current trend of the market, which would excite the crowd more? Gameplay involving intense action, or watching someone allocate points? While I was hoping to see more use of the squad, I imagine BioWare would've wanted to show off Shepard's new tricks first.

[No1Codename47]

I agree with the good list....as for the bad list...sometimes we forget that ME is a videogame and some things will be done for video game purposes - like us now being able to use our Omni's for melee attack. We didn't get to see too much of the on-rails section. When done right they can be quite intense. One preview i've read mentioned about weapon modding, so there's a degree of RPG talk for you - apparently you do it at a work bench.....i assume they'll be one on the Normandy and you'll find some dotted around levels (kinda like in FO3)

As for Kinect people speculate about stuff we don't know about. Because people don't like it they assume the worst - i.e. that's it's taken up dev resources a hell of a lot. Until Bioware say so we have no proof of this. With the increased scale of levels, beefed up Ai, etc...it doesn't seem like Kinect is holding the game back. And it won't just be voice command, for one we'll be able to navigate the galaxy map using Kinect and i wouldn't be surprised if we'll be able to perform things like Push and Pull using Kinect. Point is, this isn't aimed at the OP, but Bioware are pushing ME3 so there's no need for people to hate on something that they probably won't even get the chance to use.

[MDT1]

@OP

I agree with your list but I differ a bit in the explanations.

While Kinect is no necessary feature I'd like it. My problem is that I fear it will be XBOX only and as PC player I see it as a feature I wont get because of xbox marketing reasons only.

I also hope Shotguns wont be made obsolete because of omni tool awesomeness...

Jumping adds to me only confusion to gameplay: "is this something I have to try to jump over or do I need to go the other way?" if its not totally obvious like in the demo.

I found the railroad scene nice and fitting but I agree, I wont like it every 10 minutes but I don't see that happen so I feel safe here.

Modifié par MDT1, 08 juin 2011 - 09:17 .