359 réponses à ce sujet

[vader da slayer]

Knight486_79 wrote...

How come EA is allowing Direct 2 Drive to sell ME3, but not Steam? D2D is already taking pre-orders for the delux digital download.

thats the thing it isn't EA not putting it on Steam, its Valve not letting EA put it on Steam. Valve changed the DLC policy to state that if you release a game on steam all its related DLC has to go through them as well. Since EA already has their own system in place it would require them to do so big rewrite/additoin to the already existing game code to allow Steam to handle the DLC along side their standing delivery method. And since EA isn't going to go through that trouble just to appease a single distributor Valve (not EA) pulled the "offending" titles down (DA2 Tiger woods and some others).

EA is releasing a few games on steam still since those wont have DLC with them (iirc the new Alice in wonderland is on steam and is an ea game).

People are so quick to blame big bad EA beause they are punishing poor little Valve (which is actually a massive company in itself) for pulling their games down when in truth its Valve's greediness to try and force a single publisher to make its developement companies do a ton of work just to fall in line with some stupid policy change.

also to those saying they'll find a way around origin a few words of advice

1) all patching and DLC Is through origin so have fun finding a way to get those without someone embeding some fun and excitement of their own into them. (remember bobsmith12345 that is giving out the DLC for ME3 for free probably can't be tried in a court of law in your country but EA can be)

2) in order to remove the neccassary first time checks (that all games will do) and any other origin requirements you would have to decomplie the games executible file most likely which in and of itself highly illegal. then modify the code you get back (which won't be the source code) which is also illegal. then compile it and hope that it works. if it does work you then might hand it out to your friends which is again illegal.

Modifié par vader da slayer, 08 décembre 2011 - 09:00 .

[Gaomon]

JMKnave wrote...

It was obvious from the E3 presentation that EA were pushing Origin.com heavily. And it all comes down to greed.

They see Steam doing well with their game distribution business model and sitting on a large market share and now EA wants a piece of that. It's very likely that as competition between Steam and Origin.com grows, EA will only release digital download versions of the games they publish to their game distribution company only. Unfortunately, we as gamers will see these games held for ransom by EA. Personally, I am not a fan of EA's business practises in the last several years.

I'm on Valve's Side.

Long Live Valve.

But I could care less for deluxe or anything than just buying the regular ME3 on steam. But if it was to be on steam then I will get that.

[Gaomon]

Stevedroid wrote...

Just FYI, it has been confirmed that Origin will be the only place to get the Digital Deluxe (aka Collector's) edition by Bioware's head of marketing, on his twitter account:

#Origin is the exclusive retailer for the digital CE of #ME3

The fact that he specifically says the CE will be exclusive suggest that the normal version of Mass Effect 3 will be sold at other digital retailers and Steam would certainly have to be one of them.

So at least we have that, but I want the DDE on Steam - or at least I did, until I learned it was $80 - the same price as the physical Collector's edition that comes with a real art book, comic, and lithograph, whereas you get PDFs with the digital version.  While I don't mind non-CE versions being the same price digitally as physically (because I don't have any affinity for boxes or CDs), I do mind paying the same for some PDFs of things that are real books in the physical CE.

So it looks like I'll be getting the physical CE and then I'll probably rebuy the game on Steam a year later when it goes on sale for $10, just because I'm type-A about having games on Steam.

If i had my own compeny and chooised EA (Witch I would never if i did just a example) and EA are putting my game for orgin only. I would break the law and just put it on steam behind EA's back. And care less If i get arriested for it. At least it be payback.

[Mordikye-NAF]

Yeah, I can honestly say, I won't get ME3 if it's not on steam. I was going to buy both DA:OU, DA 2, and Crysis 2 on Steam, but they all got pulled before I could. Well, I know I can buy DA:OU on steam, but I won't as I can't buy DA:2 there any more, and will not start the series if I can't finish it in the same place. I'm currently in this boat with the ME series and am kinda pisses. I'm all for a cracked shelf copy over having to deal with Origin.
I really think as much as EA is trying to say that it's a big issue to not be able to control their patch content and DLC, no other developer seems to be having this issue. On top of that. Being a dev, building a wrapper around a content update so it can be delivered as a separate installer to distribute to a 3rd party is one) been an industry standard for years and two) not hard. They are just wanting a piece of a pie that Valve has spent years earning and EA has been using for years.

As a side note: I'm sad Bioware is in the same bed as EA, i'm sure it would be a huge or impossible legal issue at this point for them to break off from EA, but I wish they could.

Modifié par Mordikye-NAF, 14 décembre 2011 - 11:59 .

[jess05]

My biggest issue with all of this is ..
I have well over 100 games. All on Steam. In fact, I had a couple Non-Steam titles such as Dead Space and Mirrors Edge, that I repurchased through Steam when on sale so that all my games were in one place.

So, now I have everything in one place. i have 1 single Digital Distribution Client (Steam) and all is well.
I do NOT want multiple DD clients on my machine. thats the reason I moved what few I had over to Steam. So everything was in one place.
Sadly, as much as I liked ME games, I'll pass on ME3 if its a Origin only title.

Plus, i like the Steam interface. Ive grown used to it over the last 6 years or so, and have it tweaked the way I like it. Origin is just odd and clunky IMHO.

Hopefully Bioware will ralize they are going to loose quite a few sales from this. Although Im sure there are many out there who could care less and already have like 4 different game managers running at all times. Im not one of those though.

[Effigial]

 Honeslty if it was a matter of price, I would just pay the extra money that ea looses to buy the collector edition. sooo lets say the collector edition is 79.99 I would pay 99.99+ just to get it on steam, and orgin makes some money on the side. 

[Arivle]

FERMi27 wrote...
Face it, people, if this game won't be available via Steam, you will get it on Origin. And EA knows that.

I agree. But only this one. And perhaps DA3. And I won't forget EA/Bioware literally blackmailed me to use their s..ty service. I already didn't buy SWTOR because of that. And I won't buy anything from EA what is not a must have title for me. Which - with the exception of ME/DA series - nothing is.

Modifié par Arivle, 18 décembre 2011 - 10:54 .

[Vertrucio]

Just remember that Valve, the company behind the now beloved Steam, did this exact same move you're so upset with.

Also, Steam when it started had way less features than Origin has now. I'm not a fan of Origin, but it's not as terrible as some other things. In fact, there are a lot of aspects of Steam that just haven't improved since the beginning, some of those aspects Origin has improved on.

Competition is a good thing, anyone that can't cut it, won't. And when they do, well then they force other competitors to improve.

[Knight486_79]

I agree with Jess. Life is much easier dealing with one manager especially when performance is a major factor with PC games. It's much simplier to have everything in one place and not have to worry about another manager leeching precious resources. I too, have consolidated my library. As a working adult, I have very little time to enjoy gaming like I used to. Sorting through my library and picking a title is a convenience many of us are willing to pay for. However, I do agree that Valve is to blame. EA is trying to sell Origin, but they are clearly working with Direct 2 Drive allowing them to sell not only ME3, but also the digital delux. I think EA would be glad to sell through Steam, but Valve would need to meet EA's terms. It does all come down to greed on both sides. EA doesn't want to give up the control over DLC and Valve won't accept that term. EA will not budge, they have no reason to. They are a large company that doesn't need Steam to survive. They proved that by forcing Origin down our throat. How can we as a community, push steam into rethinking their position on this? Buying the game elsewhere will hurt Steam in the long run, but not solve the problem. How about a petition or something like that? The Forum thing can only go so far.

[Knight486_79]

One more question. Has anyone here used direct 2 drive. I haven't. I'm assuming it uses a manager like the others?

[william.munden]

ye fact is  if the game isnt on steam or if doesnt come without origin i wont be bying it simple as that and i will urge other people to do the same but the difference is i trust valve,steam and i dont trust EA or bioware anymore  i have all mass effect games all the dlc i wanted the new starwars game i would have pr ordered them but i dont want the peice of crud that is origins on my pc so i wont be bying them thank you.

Modifié par william.munden, 20 décembre 2011 - 03:36 .

[outlaw1109]

didn't notice this before, but both ME1 and Two are now in Origin.....which is a little wierd as I didn't buy them through Origin....

Oh well....

Not that hard to add friends via origin, i guess, but would rather spend time playing....

Knight486_79 wrote...

One more question. Has anyone here used direct 2 drive. I haven't. I'm assuming it uses a manager like the others?

havent used it in awhile as most devs now sell digital PC copies, but when I did use it (2010, I think) it didn't have a manager, it was just buy a game, download, install, and the CD key was sent via email.

Modifié par outlaw1109, 20 décembre 2011 - 04:02 .

[ItsFreakinJesus]

Knight486_79 wrote...

One more question. Has anyone here used direct 2 drive. I haven't. I'm assuming it uses a manager like the others?

Now that it's owned by Gamefly, there's a download manager.  But normally, you buy it, hit a download link, and you're good to go.

If you get it from them, in all likelihood, you'll have to authenticate it through Origin regardless. 

[Hathur]

Knight486_79 wrote...

One more question. Has anyone here used direct 2 drive. I haven't. I'm assuming it uses a manager like the others?

I use direct2drive a lot, have for about 2-3 years and theyr'e a reliable, hassle-free outlet for digital games.

They do have a downloader program, but you can also download the file manually, though they do sort of try to hide this feature.

The downloader however is not like steam or Origin.. you don't need to keep it running to play the game, it literally is just used to download the game is all (and is useful if the download is interrupted since you can resume it after).

I pre-ordered my ME3 collector's edition digital from them (got it for $53 about instead of $79 thanks to a nice sale they had a week ago or so).

It's also $71 dollars there instead of $79 at Origin.

[Pkxm]

Hathur wrote...

Knight486_79 wrote...

One more question. Has anyone here used direct 2 drive. I haven't. I'm assuming it uses a manager like the others?

I use direct2drive a lot, have for about 2-3 years and theyr'e a reliable, hassle-free outlet for digital games.

They do have a downloader program, but you can also download the file manually, though they do sort of try to hide this feature.

The downloader however is not like steam or Origin.. you don't need to keep it running to play the game, it literally is just used to download the game is all (and is useful if the download is interrupted since you can resume it after).

I pre-ordered my ME3 collector's edition digital from them (got it for $53 about instead of $79 thanks to a nice sale they had a week ago or so).

It's also $71 dollars there instead of $79 at Origin.

Does D2D give you the game key so you can activate/download the game through Origin instead of their downloader? I just noticed D2D is merging with Gamefly and has their own digital client now, made a post about it here. I wonder if they give the key to activate ME3 DDE on Origin instead?

http://social.biowar...9834/88#8860202 

[Degrelecence]

I have been a long time fan of most of EA's subsidiary titles. I own a legitimate physical copy of ME, ME2, DAO, DAA, DA2, Crysis, Crysis 2, KotOR, KotOR2, Arkham Asylum, The Sims, Sims 2, and Sims 3 and ALL the XPacks for all 3, I also own every C&C game ever made, hell I even own Mirror's Edge... I didn't bother registering most of my games because I don't lose CDs. Obviously, when I finally found out about Steam I went and REbought (2nd copy) of about half those games because they weren't register-able. So I want to state this clearly for any dev who may or may not ever peruse this forum:

I think Origin is a blatant attempt to circumvent the free market, a manipulation of your customer base, and an insult as a long time fan. If you have a superior product, win on those merits, not by breaking long standing contracts and trying to force your customers into using your product. I will never EVER utilize Origin as I believe that supporting a blatantly malicious company, who clearly has no ethical dilemmas when money on the line, will set a bad precedence. If people support this software, the time will come when they cut off direct to drive, then possibly even physical copies. I have no doubt when they believe that they have the monopoly we will find inflated prices and built in advertisements. This program could honestly be the death of PC gaming. For the first time in my life, I am starting to see the value to consoles, but then, they will probably integrate Origin there too. Despite that the majority of my favorite titles are EA, I may never purchase an EA title again.

In fact, here it is: I will happily continue to support the excellent standard for video game development that your subsidiaries have set by purchasing your wonderful games, if and only if, they are available through Steam. Every one that is not will be ignored. Unfortunately, I believe you will make that every series you have now, so I will let karma and the free market teach you a thing about respecting your consumers.

EDIT: Just as principal, I will go re-purchase Mass Effect 1 and 2 through Steam and Re-buy the DLCs for them through EA.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that I also own about half of the Need for Speed games The Sims Medieval, both Alice games, and both Dead Space games, not that it matters, but I had forgotten about them.

Modifié par Degrelecence, 22 décembre 2011 - 09:19 .

[Pkxm]

Degrelecence wrote...

I have been a long time fan of most of EA's subsidiary titles. I own a legitimate physical copy of ME, ME2, DAO, DAA, DA2, Crysis, Crysis 2, KotOR, KotOR2, Arkham Asylum, The Sims, Sims 2, and Sims 3 and ALL the XPacks for all 3, I also own every C&C game ever made, hell I even own Mirror's Edge... I didn't bother registering most of my games because I don't lose CDs. Obviously, when I finally found out about Steam I went and REbought (2nd copy) of about half those games because they weren't register-able. So I want to state this clearly for any dev who may or may not ever peruse this forum:

I think Origin is a blatant attempt to circumvent the free market, a manipulation of your customer base, and an insult as a long time fan. If you have a superior product, win on those merits, not by breaking long standing contracts and trying to force your customers into using your product. I will never EVER utilize Origin as I believe that supporting a blatantly malicious company, who clearly has no ethical dilemmas when money on the line, will set a bad precedence. If people support this software, the time will come when they cut off direct to drive, then possibly even physical copies. I have no doubt when they believe that they have the monopoly we will find inflated prices and built in advertisements. This program could honestly be the death of PC gaming. For the first time in my life, I am starting to see the value to consoles, but then, they will probably integrate Origin there too. Despite that the majority of my favorite titles are EA, I may never purchase an EA title again.

In fact, here it is: I will happily continue to support the excellent standard for video game development that your subsidiaries have set by purchasing your wonderful games, if and only if, they are available through Steam. Every one that is not will be ignored. Unfortunately, I believe you will make that every series you have now, so I will let karma and the free market teach you a thing about respecting your consumers.

EDIT: Just as principal, I will go re-purchase Mass Effect 1 and 2 through Steam and Re-buy the DLCs for them through EA.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that I also own about half of the Need for Speed games The Sims Medieval, both Alice games, and both Dead Space games, not that it matters, but I had forgotten about them.

Valve requires you to use Steam for their games so you might want to stop buying anything on Steam as well, and whatever game uses Steamworks. Steam is pretty much the same thing as Origin minus the scary privacy stuff. Some are claiming that Origin no longer snoops around outside its folders.
It does suck that gaming is headed in this direction. Forced application installs, tracking cookies/beacons (EA's battlelog uses them), invasion of privacy like tracking application usage, internet connectivity requirements all to play a video game is not cool. ME3 will be one of the last games I buy.

[Degrelecence]

Jsxdf wrote...
Valve requires you to use Steam for their games so you might want to stop buying anything on Steam as well, and whatever game uses Steamworks. Steam is pretty much the same thing as Origin minus the scary privacy stuff. Some are claiming that Origin no longer snoops around outside its folders.
It does suck that gaming is headed in this direction. Forced application installs, tracking cookies/beacons (EA's battlelog uses them), invasion of privacy like tracking application usage, internet connectivity requirements all to play a video game is not cool. ME3 will be one of the last games I buy.

You have a point... Steam does also force it's product on me, I can't argue that. I will say; however, that life-to-date Steam has done nothing but benefit me, getting me most games at prices I couldn't get even at the stores and Valve seems to barely be a video game developer. They really only make one game series and mods for it. Not that it justifies forcing the product, but at least it isn't a monopoly. 

Origin isn't new to EA, they tried this before with the EA Download Manager, EA Downloader and EA Link, but all of them were terrible programs that couldn't compete with Steam. But Valve is one of the most succesfull video game developers around and they don't develop video games. EA even listed them as their "largest competetor." They make more then Bioware, Maxis, Westwood Studios, Crytek, and DICE. So, EA formed partnerships and/or purchased all of the aforementioned companies. Then they forced them to cancel longstanding contracts (yes, Valve took this to court, it is there now) in order to monopolize the gaming industry. I am sure, if they could afford it, they would have bought 2K, Activision, and Blizzard too.

That's the part that really bothers me. The blatent attempt to circumvent the free market.

Modifié par Degrelecence, 22 décembre 2011 - 09:43 .

[belwin]

vader da slayer wrote...

Knight486_79 wrote...

How come EA is allowing Direct 2 Drive to sell ME3, but not Steam? D2D is already taking pre-orders for the delux digital download.

thats the thing it isn't EA not putting it on Steam, its Valve not letting EA put it on Steam. Valve changed the DLC policy to state that if you release a game on steam all its related DLC has to go through them as well. Since EA already has their own system in place it would require them to do so big rewrite/additoin to the already existing game code to allow Steam to handle the DLC along side their standing delivery method. And since EA isn't going to go through that trouble just to appease a single distributor Valve (not EA) pulled the "offending" titles down (DA2 Tiger woods and some others).

EA is releasing a few games on steam still since those wont have DLC with them (iirc the new Alice in wonderland is on steam and is an ea game).

uhhh,
you forget that ME1, ME2 and DA:O are all still on steam.
and they have the old DLC system in place.

just my opinion,
but i side with valve.

Modifié par belwin, 22 décembre 2011 - 09:45 .

[Degrelecence]

belwin wrote...

uhhh,
you forget that ME1, ME2 and DA:O are all still on steam.
and they have the old DLC system in place.

just my opinion,
but i side with valve.

They tried to pull ME1, ME2, DAO, and almost every other game they have, but failed. 
Crytek released Crysis 2 on Steam, as per their contract, then EA released Origin and forced Crytek to go back and pull the game from Steam (one of three games I know about that this happened to). I am sure it is just coincidence that they broke that contract within 15 days of the release of Origin. When Sierra and Activision tried the same thing, they each lost about $2.4 million, a piece. Those lawsuits were over much smaller titles. I hope EA loses a lot more for this. It would seem that any game still in early release or slotted for future release, they figured they could get away with, but once Steam has already purchased a certain number of digital copies, it would be pretty hard to justify stealing them back.

[KroganRogue]

vader da slayer wrote...

thats
the thing it isn't EA not putting it on Steam, its Valve not letting EA
put it on Steam. Valve changed the DLC policy to state that if you
release a game on steam all its related DLC has to go through them as
well. Since EA already has their own system in place it would require
them to do so big rewrite/additoin to the already existing game code to
allow Steam to handle the DLC along side their standing delivery method.
And since EA isn't going to go through that trouble just to appease a
single distributor Valve (not EA) pulled the "offending" titles down
(DA2 Tiger woods and some others).

EA
is releasing a few games on steam still since those wont have DLC with
them (iirc the new Alice in wonderland is on steam and is an ea game).

People
are so quick to blame big bad EA beause they are punishing poor little
Valve (which is actually a massive company in itself) for pulling their
games down when in truth its Valve's greediness to try and force a
single publisher to make its developement companies do a ton of work
just to fall in line with some stupid policy change.
.

I sense a disturbance of bias in the force.

But after looking at how EA has been doing their business lately it's safe to say that you are indeed wrong sir.

Valve
Dollar to dollar has been offering far better value for it's customers
than Any other online digital distributor with the exception of pirates.
 But even so you have a strong community that is backing it as well
within the steam forums. EA is loosing customers by going the route in
which they carry by FORCING them to buy products on their software
distribution platform (which isn't good at). Forcing your customers to
do something you think is right towards your own self interest is wrong.

And
most of this is indeed EA's fault. I've analyzed the patterns of how
they've been conducting business (especially how poorly they've done in
customer service) and the chips are not in their favor. I've had TWO
games from them in the past year that have had nothing but problems.
Dead space 2 was one of them, and Battlefield 3 was the other. You
cannot contact the developer it MUST be done through EA. Which stumbles
with bureaucracy trying to get anything done since their customer
service reps do nothing more than try to point fingers at your system
instead of contacting the actual developers to make a patch.


so it's safe to say that i will not be buying ME3 unless it is on steam as well as DLC. I've enjoyed the others Really much so and the series to death. But origin isn't cutting it, especially for how poor it performs.

[TheJiveDJ]

Hell, why doesn't EA just go the Apple route and open a store if they want complete control. Go one step further EA; pull all your games out of third party retail outlets! Then you can have all the control you want without those nasty retailers trying to convince your customers to go used.

I could see it now, a store for every publisher; EA Store, Ubisoft Store, Activision Store, Blizzard Store. Tell you what EA, why don't you just install a camera near my computer desk, at least the fact that you're spying on me will be out in the open.

LoL sorry for rant but Origin kinda grinds my gears. Obviously EA views Steam as a threat and is trying to choke them out. The only problem I see is that Steam is a well established brand, it has the highest market penetration of any digital game retailer, and offers a service that puts Origin to shame. You can't beat'em EA, so please, PLEASE, for the love of God just join them.

Modifié par TheJiveDJ, 23 décembre 2011 - 05:07 .

[Icinix]

I remember a time when you could buy a game in a store - and you installed the game, only the game, and could play the game without needing a third party or an internet connection.

Man they were good days.

I wish we could go back to them. Steam, Origin, Impulse etc - they're all like sticking needles through your eye. They're all as crap as each other.

Anyway - on topic - I don't think it will be on Steam anytime soon after release. But then again - it is still 7 / 8 weeks away. Anything could happen.

[Bluth54]

vader da slayer wrote...

Knight486_79 wrote...

How come EA is allowing Direct 2 Drive to sell ME3, but not Steam? D2D is already taking pre-orders for the delux digital download.

thats the thing it isn't EA not putting it on Steam, its Valve not letting EA put it on Steam. Valve changed the DLC policy to state that if you release a game on steam all its related DLC has to go through them as well. Since EA already has their own system in place it would require them to do so big rewrite/additoin to the already existing game code to allow Steam to handle the DLC along side their standing delivery method. And since EA isn't going to go through that trouble just to appease a single distributor Valve (not EA) pulled the "offending" titles down (DA2 Tiger woods and some others).

EA is releasing a few games on steam still since those wont have DLC with them (iirc the new Alice in wonderland is on steam and is an ea game).

People are so quick to blame big bad EA beause they are punishing poor little Valve (which is actually a massive company in itself) for pulling their games down when in truth its Valve's greediness to try and force a single publisher to make its developement companies do a ton of work just to fall in line with some stupid policy change.

You are incorrect about this, while Valve does now require that you sell your DLC through steam, you can also sell it through other sources:
http://steampowered....ameservices.php

Sell additional content from within your game to the customers who want
it most. Steamworks provides true in-game DLC, allowing customers to
select, buy, and use DLC — all without leaving the game. Additionally,
using Steamworks' DLC does not close off your other channels. You are
still free to sell the content at retail, either with other online sites
or through the Steam store.

EA is still free to sell their DLC through any other channels they want, even the awful Bioware points/DLC system they currently use.

Infact you don't even have to have DLC downloadable through steam, when you buy DLC for Batman Arkham City you get a code you put into Games for Windows Live and download it from that. Buying DLC through steam could just give you a code to put into your EA account...it would take almost no work to allow DLC to be sold through steam and activated on an EA account. It is EA's fault.

Not only that, but what's the big deal with Valve requiring DLC to be sold through steam? Should EA stop selling DLC on the 360 and PS3 because it's sold through Xbox Live and PSN and Microsoft/Sony get a cut.


I want to buy this game EA. I have over 500 games on Steam. I will not be buying this on Origin or any other platform. If it's not on Steam you're not getting my money.

I want to pay you EA/Bioware. Let me pay you. Put this game on Steam.

[Hiredguns23]

iceonica wrote...

3) Bigger library than Steam

Origin doesn't even touch the amount steam has....<_<