359 réponses à ce sujet

[Destructo-Bot]

People have more faith in Valve because they don't have to support the salaries of a number of C-level executives getting millions of dollars of compensation, plus a colossal heap of upper management, plus needing to create value for shareholders. Valve consists of a bit over 100 employees in total last I recall.

They do it because they love to do it and they get to call the shots regarding their baby. Not because their shareholders want to have a new product they can milk dry.

[Clonedzero]

Modifié par Clonedzero, 15 juin 2011 - 04:56 .

[goofyomnivore]

Those TOS are horrid. I ordered a hard copy for PC, but if they require Origin. I will send it right back for a refund.

[Chiefje]

http://www.rockpaper...eam/#more-62297

[Pepper4]

charmingcharlie wrote...

I don't think people appreciate just how bad the terms are with Origin.  The terminating your account after 24 months is the least of your worries.  Apparently the TOS of Origin only gives you the right to access your purchases for 12 months. 

Sounds lovely doesn't it, at the moment I am still keeping my retail Mass Effect 3 pre-order going.  However if Mass Effect 3 requires the use of Origin I will cancel it in a heart beat.  I don't pay £60 - £70 just to play one game for 12 months.

http://tos.ea.com/le...sale/US/enl/PC/

You can find the term in the "Perfomance of Contract" section.

wtf?
This is making no sense.

[AbsolutGrndZer0]

Seems many of you have never used the EADM (now called Origin, but it's pretty much the same as it's always been) before. Unlike Steam, you do not have to be running Steam to play, only to download. My Origin downloader is kept closed except when I wish to download a game I've purchased (AND even the ones I bought retail, I entered my CD key and downloaded a FREE DIGITAL VERSION and play that (again, once installed, the downloader is kept closed) so I don't have to bother with CDs and such.

While it being exclusive to Origin is not great for those that like Steam (and I don't think it should be exclusive to Origin), please make sure you are informed enough about Origin to know the things I've mentioned above, before you say you don't like it because it must be kept running while you play or such things that are not true about EADM/Origin.

Also, note this from the ToS...

The products and services
that we make available on the Websites may be downloaded or accessed
for at least one year after you have completed your purchase.

Emphasis is mine, but note it.  IT's not saying after a year you can't download it any more... it's saying that if for some reason the game is no longer sold and therfore no longer available a day after you bought it, you still have a year to download it contractually.  It's been over a year since I bought Sims 3, and I can still download it.  I'm pretty confident EA isn't going to suddenly say "OK NO MORE MASS EFFECT SALES EVAR!!!!" and make the game unavailable.  The only way the game is going to become unavailable is if EA shuts down the entire company, at which point the game will be non-downloadable when they don't pay their internet service provider(s).

Modifié par AbsolutGrndZer0, 15 juin 2011 - 05:19 .

[Oniyaki]

I will be cancelling my pre-order if Origin is required for the retail version.

[AbsolutGrndZer0]

Oniyaki wrote...

I will be cancelling my pre-order if Origin is required for the retail version.

I'm 99% sure it won't be, since its not a LAUNCHING platform like Steam is. As I said, I have Sims 3, Sims 3 Ambitions, Sims 3 NightLife, Mass Effect, Mass Effect Pinnacle Station, Mass Effect 2, Dragon Age Origins, Dragon Age Awakening, and Dragon Age 2 all downloaded via EADM (Now Origin) and NONE of them require the program to be running after installation, unlike Steam.

People that are against Origin, for whatever reason, need to stop with the misinformation campaign they are running here (and I am not speaking to you directly Oniyaki, you could be a victim of the misinformation).  If you don't like Origin, fine.  But, even if you do buy the ME3 CE from them, you will not be required to run Origins for anything other than download and installation and that needs to be made clear to everyone.

[dreman9999]

Pepper4 wrote...

charmingcharlie wrote...

I don't think people appreciate just how bad the terms are with Origin.  The terminating your account after 24 months is the least of your worries.  Apparently the TOS of Origin only gives you the right to access your purchases for 12 months. 

Sounds lovely doesn't it, at the moment I am still keeping my retail Mass Effect 3 pre-order going.  However if Mass Effect 3 requires the use of Origin I will cancel it in a heart beat.  I don't pay £60 - £70 just to play one game for 12 months.

http://tos.ea.com/le...sale/US/enl/PC/

You can find the term in the "Perfomance of Contract" section.

wtf?
This is making no sense.

Ignore him. The part he is refrancing to is about product you buy and don't download.

"Performance
of the Contract:

The products and services
that we make available on the Websites may be downloaded or accessed
for at least one year after you have completed your purchase. 
Certain products and services will be available to you as soon as you
complete your purchase.  In some cases, we may also give you
the opportunity purchase a license for a software product prior to its
scheduled release date.  If you purchase a software license
prior to the release date of the applicable software, a portion of the
software will be immediately downloaded onto your computer.  On
the release date of the applicable software, your computer will
automatically download the remaining portion of the software that is
needed for you to install and use the software.  Our Websites
will inform you which type of software product you are
purchasing.  Our obligation to deliver the software product to
you shall be complete at such time as, and place where, you first
receive either the downloaded product or physical product, as
applicable.

If you have purchased services from us,
your right to access the applicable services will commence immediately
after we have sent our purchase confirmation
email."

That means that if you buy something from the store, you have a year to download it and any online servives for the game, aka online game play, can de stopped with in a year.
This mean as long as you download ME3 with in a year of buying it your fine.

How can anyone not get that from the terms.<_<

:ph34r:Opps, AbsolutGrndZer0  Ninjaed me.

Modifié par dreman9999, 15 juin 2011 - 05:36 .

[charmingcharlie]

AbsolutGrndZer0 wrote...

The products and services that we make available on the Websites may be downloaded or accessed for at least one year after you have completed your purchase.

Emphasis is mine, but note it.  IT's not saying after a year you can't download it any more... it's saying that if for some reason the game is no longer sold and therfore no longer available a day after you bought it, you still have a year to download it contractually.  It's been over a year since I bought Sims 3, and I can still download it.  I'm pretty
confident EA isn't going to suddenly say "OK NO MORE MASS EFFECT SALES EVAR!!!!" and make the game unavailable.  The only way the game is going to become unavailable is if EA shuts down the entire company, at which point the game will be non-downloadable when they don't pay their internet service provider(s).

That is YOUR interpretation of it, personally it sounds very much to me like you only have the ability to download that product for 1 year after that if you wish to download the game again you have to buy it again.  After all this isn't the FIRST time EA has done this, when they started the EA store up you could only download the game for 3 months unless you paid them extra to have the game available for download up to a year.

AbsolutGrndZer0 wrote...

I'm 99% sure it won't be, since its not a LAUNCHING platform like Steam is. As I said, I have Sims 3, Sims 3 Ambitions, Sims 3 NightLife, Mass Effect, Mass Effect Pinnacle Station, Mass Effect 2, Dragon Age Origins, Dragon Age Awakening, and Dragon Age 2 all downloaded via EADM (Now Origin) and NONE of them require the program to be running after installation, unlike Steam.

People that are against Origin, for whatever reason, need to stop with the misinformation campaign they are running here (and I am not speaking to you directly Oniyaki, you could be a victim of the misinformation).  If you don't like Origin, fine.  But, even if you do buy the ME3 CE from them, you will not be required to run Origins for anything other than download and installation and that needs to be made clear to everyone.

You are assuming that they are just going to keep utilising Origin like the EA downloader.  They ARE NOT, they are turning Origin into a steam like platform with achievements, cloud saving and auto updates.  Right now Origin just acts like the old EA downloader but that is going to change :-



Right now products you buy on Origin do not need to have Origin running, but that will change.

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 15 juin 2011 - 05:35 .

[Oniyaki]

AbsolutGrndZer0 wrote...
People that are against Origin, for whatever reason, need to stop with the misinformation campaign they are running here (and I am not speaking to you directly Oniyaki, you could be a victim of the misinformation).  If you don't like Origin, fine.  But, even if you do buy the ME3 CE from them, you will not be required to run Origins for anything other than download and installation and that needs to be made clear to everyone.

I know you mean no offense

I don't want to use Origin for the simple reason that most of my games I have are available on Steam. I like having everything in once place, and I don't need another company to have my personal/credit card info.  Nor another username/password to remember.

Modifié par Oniyaki, 15 juin 2011 - 05:37 .

[AbsolutGrndZer0]

I don't see where that says it will be required. I use a program called Raptr that does most of the things Origin does in that list, but it isn't required. I don't see where it says products bought with Origin will require it. Show me where it does, circle it on that list and repost it.

Plus, on the off-chance it does... Look a the other features... "CLOUD SAVES" do you know what that means?  It means your save games can be uploaded to their website, so if your hard drive burns out unexpectedly, you have your backups downloadable from them.  Plus, looks like with an M by it, that means Multiplatform, so possibly you could upload your Xbox 360 saves and download them on the PC? We'll see.

As for the "I don't want another account" arguement, if you are posting here you already have an account.  It's the same EA account you use to login to Dragon Age Origins, Dragon Age 2, Mass Effect 2, and most every other EA game.

Modifié par AbsolutGrndZer0, 15 juin 2011 - 05:45 .

[charmingcharlie]

AbsolutGrndZer0 wrote...

I don't see where that says it will be required. I use a program called Raptr that does most of the things Origin does in that list, but it isn't required. I don't see where it says products bought with Origin will require it. Show me where it does, circle it on that list and repost it.

The picture I posted is an example of how Origin is going to develop from a download program to a fully fledged steam like client.  No it doesn't implicitly say "hey we are going to make you use Origin for EA games" but it is hard to see how they can implement half those features without making games run through Origin.  Your take on things is that Origin is just a download manager, my point is that Origin is going to CHANGE from a download manager into something else.

AbsolutGrndZer0 wrote...
Plus, on the off-chance it does... Look a the other features... "CLOUD SAVES" do you know what that means?  It means your save games can be uploaded to their website, so if your hard drive burns out unexpectedly, you have your backups downloadable from them.  Plus, looks like with an M by it, that means Multiplatform, so possibly you could upload your Xbox 360 saves and download them on the PC? We'll see.

Oh wow "cloud saves" yeah steam has that and I have it TURNED OFF.  I already have my game saves backed up on 2 separate PC's.  As for Multiplatform cross play or whatever, I game exclusively on the PC I have never owned nor will I ever own a console so I really couldn't care less about whatever multiplatform rubbish EA are trying to foist on me.  In short none of the features in Origin interest me, so if EA is going to force me to use Origin I will simply refuse too.

[AlanC9]

charmingcharlie wrote...

That is YOUR interpretation of it, personally it sounds very much to me like you only have the ability to download that product for 1 year after that if you wish to download the game again you have to buy it again.  After all this isn't the FIRST time EA has done this, when they started the EA store up you could only download the game for 3 months unless you paid them extra to have the game available for download up to a year.

I think that's actually a more reasonable interpretation, given this :

Our obligation to deliver the software product to you shall be complete at such time as, and place where, you first receive either the downloaded product or physical product, as applicable.

So once you've DLd it once, EA's done.

[NausOracle]

All I know is that steam seems to be more secure (they added security features BEFORE all the hacks was going around)

and though it wouldn't kill me, some people regard convenience very highly ... so same to me as other people ... Steam or nothing.

I can understand competition, so though I would hate it, I can understand that ME3 will be on other platforms but the N7 CE is only on origin. I am kinda hoping for this. Origin only tells us that the CE is origin exclusive, the original version doesn't have that tag.

At least at THAT point it seems more like competition to me. I would hate it, but at least I could stomach it.

[Meshakhad2]

I will buy the game, no matter what. Provided Origin works properly, I will have no issue buying it via Origin. That's if I don't instead fork out the money for the CE, and if I'm going CE, it'll be physical.

The thing is, I already use a second digital download service - Impulse. A third won't make a difference.

[_ShadowHawk]

I prefer downloading my games but I'll buy physical discs retail rather than tie my games to a proprietary store to be able to run them. (I do use Impulse, as it lets the games run stand-alone but allows for a single interface for patch updates, installer backups, and re-downloads. You never *have* to run it and can even uninstall it without it affecting your installed games.)

[bmwcrazy]

The good thing about Origin is that it lets you register most of the new EA titles that you already own, whether they are retail or Steam keys.

I activated my Steam version of DA, DA2, and ME2 on Origin just for fun.

[TSC_1]

From EA, according to RPS

“you talk about platform exclusives like Halo or Uncharted… EA’s going to have some of our own platform exclusives.”

“In the case of Star Wars we’re trying to build an audience for Origin. And it’s also an opportunity for us to better manage the downloads and how we bring people over from the beta and that sort of thing.”

“I think long-term you’ll see we believe in reach so we will have other digital retailers for our products because we want to reach as many audiences as possible. But at the same time if we can use exclusive content or other ideas to help grow our audience then we’re going to do that because we’re growing a platform.”

And, also from RPS, this puzzling tidbit:

THINGS ARE GETTING REALLY STRANGE NOW. Now being outside of UK office hours mean we’re yet to get our own EA response to why Crysis 2 vanished from Steam yesterday, but across-the-ponders have now received one. The upshot? Despite all this ‘only on Origin’ stuff, EA didn’t do it. So: who did?

Valve, apparently. Said an EA bod to GameFront, “It’s unfortunate that Steam has removed Crysis 2 from their service. This was not an EA decision or the result of any action by EA.”

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?

“Steam has imposed a set of business terms for developers hoping to sell content on that service – many of which are not imposed by other online game services. Unfortunately, Crytek has an agreement with another download service which violates the new rules from Steam and resulted in its expulsion of Crysis 2 from Steam.”

So, essentially, no useful information about ME3... just an even more confusing situation. Why is it so bloody hard for EA just to come out and tell us what they're doing and where the game will be made available?

[EternalPink]

Emoking wrote...

Terms and conditions you say? Why certainly, I say.

Or, almost... C&P'ing the entirety might be taking the mickey somewhat, but I'll highlight something here:

"If you have not used your
Entitlements or Account for twenty four (24) months or more and your
Account has associated Entitlements, your Entitlements will expire and
your Account may be cancelled for non-use.  Once you have
redeemed your Entitlements, that content is not returnable,
exchangeable, or refundable for other Entitlements or for cash, or other
goods or services."

(from http://tos.ea.com/le...TERMS/US/en/PC/ )

I'm fairly certain that Steam doesn't have such a restrictive limit to account usage. What's that, you haven't logged into your account for 2 and a half years because you've been travelling around the world? (which isn't an unlikely situation). Oh, sorry, your games have been revoked, with no refund.

Also, note the wording. Entitlements are what it calls DLC and pre-order items. Your entitlements will expire. Your account may be cancelled.

From the various arguements i've seen about EULA's i think you could challenge this since if your brought the right to use something then in theory you have the right to use it now, a days time, a years time, a decades time and then taking that from you would be considered theft under local law although the exact specifics would vary depending on where you are in the world.

Most people probably wouldn't have the receipts of purchase or the will to actually take it up in court but the law of the land wins in disagreements between the law of the land and EULA's

[MustOnen]

Poor EA, they seemed to be cool again but they pulled a total Activision **** maneuver and flushed all rep they had down the toilet.

Run Steam, Origin, Live, yet are still forced to use in game friends feature.
Oh boy the future of gaming.

BioWare, get me3 on steam.
I'd rather pay 50% more on Steam than use Origin alongside Steam. Seriously.

[Abirn]

Does EA not realize that regular OS installation is a good idea. There is a perfectly valid reason why steam lets you just re download anything you buy.

PC's are not consoles, They must be maintained. I just recently reinstalled Windows 7 to increase performance because of issues I was having. Why shouldn't I be able to re download the stuff I already bought.

[onelifecrisis]

Hmm, I decided to check out this origin thing. This is what I got on the origin store home page:

Server Error
Error: We are unable to perform the selected action. We apologise for the inconvenience.
Error Number:  SIT_000002

I didn't even try to "perform an action". WTG EA! You rock! <_<

Suffice it to say I don't think I'll be paying them for the privilege of testing their software for them.

Modifié par onelifecrisis, 15 juin 2011 - 11:06 .

[archurban]

Take a look at this!

http://www.gameinfor...exclusives.aspx

EA tries to make more game only exclusive in Origin (their new digital download store). now they took Crysis 2 down from Steam. if they are really serious to anticipate in their store, we won't see ME 3 in steam possibly. so you can only buy it from origin or you can go to retail store for getting it. but I don't care whether ME 3 will only be available for origin or not. I already pre-ordered retail version of collector's edition. game is over. but I understand what they try to do. they feel bit of competition against Steam even though Steam is still the biggest digital PC download store in the world. I don't know about D2D though. of course, many people will complain about it if EA will really make a decision not to sell any ME 3 at steam. but business is business. EA still makes tons of money every year. by the way, if they are serious about this, support for PC must be very good as much as Valve. but I doubt.

[Wise guy 05]

Alright this is to all those who have said that valve/steam needs more competition. As I have heard so far people are saying that steam is just too big and to wide...Alright I have a few simple points that you might want to think over before saying that statement yet again. The hole argument is based over the idea that having completion between to company's is a good idea and yes that is a good idea and that is what we had before the damn origin project. Now if steam had full control over the marked the problem is that they can control prices and therefor raise them and buy out any competition it's like a man who sells fish at a market getting a lot of customers and then he begins to buy all the other fish stands until he is the only one selling fish and so he controls the market so he jacks up the price on fish and no one can oppose him. This however is not the case so we need to look at why theory does not match the facts because steam is cheap as hell..I mean look at all the deals we get all the time..Now here is where it gets tricky so pay attention.

Steam and origins are not two company's but two markets so with our fish example from before..alot of people come to one market we call it steam to buy a lot of games very diffent from each other and the price is low because there are a lot of people compeating with prices on steam trying to get people to buy their game instead of someone elses and steam get's rent from all the stands that the sellers set up their game shops at..So the evil EA say's I want in on that..And he sets up his own market and say's to people you can only sell here if you don't sell on steam's market and so we do not get any competition because there are now two markets with only a small amout of games on each..But here theory will save us because where have we seen to markets compeating for selling before..Yes your right in the cold war..The western market vs the communist eastern market and here we can see that one will prevail the one with the best prices and oppertunity...

So next time you say "Well it's good competition get your facts straight because it is not. and to all those who wants a short explernation it's not good compition because there is no compition because the games are not sold equally on both platforms with only the tec from each as the diffence and you know why ? Because EA can't live up to the legacy build by steam because steam has a better customers support and better social interaction.