152 réponses à ce sujet

[Angeljoe]

The concept of the powerfull mage within any given lore has always existed, it presides in DAO and is done in my oppinion with much thought and consideration from the bioware developers.

The problem seems to be the human factor, while some actually seem to struggle wihin the given paramaters of the game most do agree that a mage cuts through most encounters easily. If you changed the control of the encounters and put them in charge of humans, then the overpowered status of the mage would quickly vanish and present different issues.

As it is your mage can plan even though the enemy can clearly see you, you open a door and the mages furthest away just stand still and await their doom. There were several encounters throughout the game which would have ended in disaster if the AI was endid controlled by a human, it isnt ... its a fairly poor scripted AI where numbers do not equal quality, on the contrary, they merely add to the deathtoll of a well placed combo.

Enemy mages do have crushing prison, they can dispell and protect themselves but hardly ever do it correctly, and I have witnessed AI mages killing their own, while I just stepped out of range. Another example, my ranger sends in a bear against a mage, now everyone in the room heads towards the bear ... it does´nt take long to kill the mage and I direct the bear at half health to the second mage and snipe him out as well, does that make my ranger overpowered? or am I simply abusing the stupidity and inadequacy of the AI?

Also ask yourself, who do you fear most in this game? I would clearly answer mages, for whatever it is worth once in a while the ai does get nasty, especially if I lack concentration and underestimate things. Lower the power of mages and there will be one less thing to fear. The only times I have died is due to my own stupidity and the culprits have always been AI mages.

So unless you make some sort of mmorpg balance where everyone is more or less equal, something I do not wish to see, then you are bound to encounter huge balance issues, since its human vs AI ... and we are a clever bunch, well at least most of us.

The mages are endid overpowered vs the 2 other classes in the game, but not vs the game itself. The problems lie elsewhere and other games have actually been more successfull at implementing a better and more responsive AI. I firmly believe Bioware can do this within the current frames of DAO.

[Wardawg1001]

Overpowered doesn't apply in a single player game. They are more powerful than rogues and warriors when used in a certain way, but that just means they are the most powerful of the three. What I don't understand is all of the people crying about how its ruining the game, when the solution is as simple as not using one, or not grabbing all the super pwnage spells/combos if they would like to play one for roleplaying reasons or simply for fun. Problem solved. Nobody is forcing anybody to use the taunt/force field combo, yet the existence of this mechanic (which is never used by the AI) has apparently ruined the entire game for many people.

[Kahryl]

Wardawg1001 wrote...
What I don't understand is all of the people crying about how its ruining the game, when the solution is as simple as not using one, or not grabbing all the super pwnage spells/combos if they would like to play one for roleplaying reasons or simply for fun.

I have to restrict myself to 2/3 classes because Bioware couldn't be bothered to use game design on their game?

[Shannara13]

The community will undoubtedly make an improved AI mod like they did for NWN and NWN 2.

[Wardawg1001]

No you idiot, pay attention I'll say this again. Don't use the "overpowered" mechanics of the classes IF THEY BOTHER YOU. Most people couldn't care less, and many need them just to make them through the game on easy/normal. But if it irritates you that cone of cold is practically the most powerful spell in the game, then dont train it and dont use it. SIMPLE. Or build your mage to support your warriors/rogues (heals, buffs, single target disables, etc).

[Schyzm]

title of thread "mages aren't overpowered"



first sentence "mages are suppose to be overpowered."



you'd think they'd make fanbois smarter than this

[Angeljoe]

Karyhl, even though I wrote the initial post I do agree with you that all classes and combinations should be viable and even in some cases a "win button", it doesn´t hurt to have that powerfull feeling once in a while, but when its done continuously it becomes trivial.



What you are hoping for is that you couldnt do it, or that the AI can counteract it. To avoid doing it you would have to dump the mages power considerably, since there are plenty of valid combinations and AI overpowering methods. The bear pet example is perfect, add a mage to it even with limited functions and you would still have a poor AI to exploit.

[Schyzm]

Wardawg1001 wrote...

No you idiot, pay attention I'll say this again. Don't use the "overpowered" mechanics of the classes IF THEY BOTHER YOU. Most people couldn't care less, and many need them just to make them through the game on easy/normal. But if it irritates you that cone of cold is practically the most powerful spell in the game, then dont train it and dont use it. SIMPLE. Or build your mage to support your warriors/rogues (heals, buffs, single target disables, etc).

not everyone enjoys intentionally playing like a ****** in the mere hope that you won't accidentally break the combat mechanics.

[Medet]

It's also partially due to the large number of (unintelligent) enemies you face. A mage can wipe out a group in seconds that would have overwhelmed a warrior. More area effect skills for melee classes would have been nice. You would still have to get up close, but it would be nice to be able to hit more than one target on near every encounter in the game.

[Wardawg1001]

Schyzm wrote...

Wardawg1001 wrote...

No you idiot, pay attention I'll say this again. Don't use the "overpowered" mechanics of the classes IF THEY BOTHER YOU. Most people couldn't care less, and many need them just to make them through the game on easy/normal. But if it irritates you that cone of cold is practically the most powerful spell in the game, then dont train it and dont use it. SIMPLE. Or build your mage to support your warriors/rogues (heals, buffs, single target disables, etc).

not everyone enjoys intentionally playing like a ****** in the mere hope that you won't accidentally break the combat mechanics.

And not everyone is so incapable of self control that they can't stop using a spell combo when they realize it makes the game boring for them. How are you not getting this? I'm not asking you to do anything except STOP USING (insert overpowered spell/combo here) IF YOU DONT LIKE IT. You dont have to run around not experimenting with the spells, but if you have come to the point where you are so annoyed by how powerful a spell THAT YOU ARE USING is that it has destroyed your gaming experience, then you really have problems and they have nothing to do with DAO.

[TinyTim535]

great topic, I agree completely.

[Schyzm]

Wardawg1001 wrote...

Schyzm wrote...

Wardawg1001 wrote...

No you idiot, pay attention I'll say this again. Don't use the "overpowered" mechanics of the classes IF THEY BOTHER YOU. Most people couldn't care less, and many need them just to make them through the game on easy/normal. But if it irritates you that cone of cold is practically the most powerful spell in the game, then dont train it and dont use it. SIMPLE. Or build your mage to support your warriors/rogues (heals, buffs, single target disables, etc).

not everyone enjoys intentionally playing like a ****** in the mere hope that you won't accidentally break the combat mechanics.

And not everyone is so incapable of self control that they can't stop using a spell combo when they realize it makes the game boring for them. How are you not getting this? I'm not asking you to do anything except STOP USING (insert overpowered spell/combo here) IF YOU DONT LIKE IT. You dont have to run around not experimenting with the spells, but if you have come to the point where you are so annoyed by how powerful a spell THAT YOU ARE USING is that it has destroyed your gaming experience, then you really have problems and they have nothing to do with DAO.

how are you not getting this?  what's the point of treating the game in an intelligent and clever way if you have to constantly stop using things.  it's not like the game lets you respec(not that that would make it alright but it certainly doesn't help).  I guess its offensive to you that some people want an actual functioning balanced combat system and not just a minefield of absurdity.  

I guess fanboi extremism knows no bounds, "you want rich deep combat system! OMG YOU ARE HORRIBLE PERSON I WILL USE CAPS AND EXPLAIN TO YOU WHY THAT WOULD BE A TERRIBLE IDEA!"

[Angeljoe]

Schyzm, as for exploiting the obvious, which I sometimes do myself is almost inevitable in this game, moreso than others.



Even if all the AOE spells got longer timers and reduced damaged I could still through a glyph of repulsion in a doorway and still use them, it wouldnt change things a lot if some of the enemies barely escaped the sat trap. All I would have to do would be ... wait a little longer before entering the next door, you would would actually to dump all spells signigicantelly before the dozens of available exploits wouldn´t be so apparant.

[Medet]

Also, it's not just one spell combo. Using any AOE attack makes the game significantly easier, especially if you apply some strategy (as opposed to the AI, which uses none). As do hexes.

[Magilicotti]

And here we go again... seriously, forum admins would do this community a favor, by deleting these type of threads, AND banning those that insist in repeating their banter, over, and over, and over.



We get it, really.some think mages are overpowered, some think melee are underpowered, some think the game is broken and needs balance... really, we get it, shut it already.

[Angeljoe]

With the current abilities the mage has you would have to slaughter him talentwise in order to avoid many of the exploits in the game, I stand by my initial post, bioware or perhaps the community need to vastly improve the AI.

[Shadow_Viper]

Wardawg1001 wrote...

Overpowered doesn't apply in a single player game. They are more powerful than rogues and warriors when used in a certain way, but that just means they are the most powerful of the three. What I don't understand is all of the people crying about how its ruining the game, when the solution is as simple as not using one, or not grabbing all the super pwnage spells/combos if they would like to play one for roleplaying reasons or simply for fun. Problem solved. Nobody is forcing anybody to use the taunt/force field combo, yet the existence of this mechanic (which is never used by the AI) has apparently ruined the entire game for many people.

QFE, well said.

Sadly alot of people just delight in running to the forums, whining and crying about anything and everything. It's getting to be a real epidemic on these forums(and most other game forums as well). I highly encourage everyone who see a whining thread/post, to simply reply with IFSW.

[Shadow_Viper]

Kahryl wrote...

Wardawg1001 wrote...
What I don't understand is all of the people crying about how its ruining the game, when the solution is as simple as not using one, or not grabbing all the super pwnage spells/combos if they would like to play one for roleplaying reasons or simply for fun.

I have to restrict myself to 2/3 classes because Bioware couldn't be bothered to use game design on their game?

Whether or not you choice to play/use mages is entirely up to you.

However, neither choice requires running to the forums and crying in countless threads about the same topic.

[Schyzm]

Shadow_Viper wrote...

Kahryl wrote...

Wardawg1001 wrote...
What I don't understand is all of the people crying about how its ruining the game, when the solution is as simple as not using one, or not grabbing all the super pwnage spells/combos if they would like to play one for roleplaying reasons or simply for fun.

I have to restrict myself to 2/3 classes because Bioware couldn't be bothered to use game design on their game?

Whether or not you choice to play/use mages is entirely up to you.

However, neither choice requires running to the forums and crying in countless threads about the same topic.

trolling people for their opinions on the game again I see.  

[F-C]

schyzm and kahryl are a couple of the resident trolls when it comes to mages. its just best to ignore them really. if you ignore them they usually go away.

[Shadow_Viper]

Wardawg1001 wrote...

No you idiot, pay attention I'll say this again. Don't use the "overpowered" mechanics of the classes IF THEY BOTHER YOU. Most people couldn't care less, and many need them just to make them through the game on easy/normal. But if it irritates you that cone of cold is practically the most powerful spell in the game, then dont train it and dont use it. SIMPLE. Or build your mage to support your warriors/rogues (heals, buffs, single target disables, etc).

QFE, once again, well said.

It's really too bad that the whiners fail to pay attention to what they read, or just read a sentence or two and then hit the quote button to make an overdramatic reply "OMG Bioware U ruin game 4 me!!!!111!!elven!!11!!!1!"

[Medet]

A simple AI fix would be having AOE spells draw counter battery fire so to say. The second I see an enemy mage cast anything with a setup bar, it gets targeted for a mana clash or crushing prison. If the enemy actually noticed I was about to steamroll them and acted accordingly, I'd have to plan a bit more. Also, they probably shouldn't attack targets with force field on.

[Shadow_Viper]

Schyzm wrote...

Shadow_Viper wrote...

Kahryl wrote...

Wardawg1001 wrote...
What I don't understand is all of the people crying about how its ruining the game, when the solution is as simple as not using one, or not grabbing all the super pwnage spells/combos if they would like to play one for roleplaying reasons or simply for fun.

I have to restrict myself to 2/3 classes because Bioware couldn't be bothered to use game design on their game?

Whether or not you choice to play/use mages is entirely up to you.

However, neither choice requires running to the forums and crying in countless threads about the same topic.

trolling people for their opinions on the game again I see.  

I see you're using your favorite CDM.

[Schyzm]

F-C wrote...

schyzm and kahryl are a couple of the resident trolls when it comes to mages. its just best to ignore them really. if you ignore them they usually go away.

wow both trolls showed up.  you here to flame everyone endlessly for their opinions on the game again?  

[Schyzm]

Shadow_Viper wrote...

Schyzm wrote...

Shadow_Viper wrote...

Kahryl wrote...

Wardawg1001 wrote...
What I don't understand is all of the people crying about how its ruining the game, when the solution is as simple as not using one, or not grabbing all the super pwnage spells/combos if they would like to play one for roleplaying reasons or simply for fun.

I have to restrict myself to 2/3 classes because Bioware couldn't be bothered to use game design on their game?

Whether or not you choice to play/use mages is entirely up to you.

However, neither choice requires running to the forums and crying in countless threads about the same topic.

trolling people for their opinions on the game again I see.  

I see you're using your favorite CDM.

what have you added to this thread? have you expressed an opinion on mages or balance or game mechanics.  no, you've done what you and super troll dimes always do.  you flame people endlessly for having an opinion.  you two are single handed destroyers of threads.