54 réponses à ce sujet

[Gadarr]

Khim1 wrote...

RageGT wrote...

I guess you never played other Bioware's great games?

I have played a little BG and a bit more NWN and NWN2, but I can concede that I have never immersed myself seriously in any of their games. And I realize, of course, that DA:O was meant to be "more of the same, only better", and I'm sure it delivers on that promise. On the other hand, the game has been seriously hyped as the new best RPG, period, not as the new amazing "Bioware RPG". Caveat emptor, I guess. Still, fixing some of my concerns probably could have made the game far better without breaking with tradition.

All IMHO, of course.

Your issue concerning the lack of an explorable world map is actually a viable game design decision, if you think about it. Games with open world maps that offer a great amount of freedom to the player suffer from a weak main storyline. If you can just wander off and do whatever you please and loot totally unrelated dungeons, the storyline will naturally come in little pieces, therefore being much less compelling. On the other hand, cutting back the possibilities of exploration gives room for a driving story that won't get out of the players sight.

So, while you don't have to like this concept of course, it's not a question of finding a cheap way out but of conscious design decision. DA:O is all about the main story.

Oh, by the way, there is an official mod that gives you a storage chest in your camp.

Modifié par Gadarr, 20 novembre 2009 - 11:08 .

[Spaceweed10]

Sunder_2 wrote...

I have played A LOT of CRPGS in my day- started w/ Bard’s Tale & SSI goldbox series have played BG2……..
 
Maybe I believed the hype too much, maybe I can never recapture the feeling I got when I first discovered CRPGS, but hopefully its just that maybe I haven’t given it enough time.
 
*possible minor spoiler*
 
 
 
I have just started night time in Redcliff and I am playing as a rogue and I am level 7.  Maybe I expected too much, but I am not exactly blown away by the plot/story so far and maybe I am just too programmed by D&D, but I am also a little disappointment w/ the lack of variety in classes/character development.  I like that the world seems low magic, but at the same time I am eager to see what exciting and different types of magical equipment, items, devices, ect that are available.  I mean is anything ground breaking?  It has not been a bad experience and it is a good game so far………just not the absolute master piece I was expecting from all I have read.   I  like some of the party banter and passing town folk gossip and such, but something is lacking. 
 
Some games just draw you in and can’t stay away from the keyboard, KOTOR, Rome: Total War, NWN2 were a few that did so for me, but DA:O has failed so far to do as much. So please, tell me it is going to get even better?  Will I see a deeper story?  Will my rogue develope very different from next rogue or even my 1st play thru as a warrior?  Will I get that “sucked in” quality from it? 

Bard's Tale?  Stopped reading there...

[Antikristine]

Sunder_2: I think that you might have too high expectations, and/or that this kind of story-heavy RPG is not really the right genre for you.



As I see it, nothing is really supposed to be groundbreaking in this game. What it does so marvellously, however, is how it makes us become engaged in a pretty traditional fantasy story through the use of simple - but very effective - techniques. The most important of these techniques is how your companions have been carefully designed to provide the feeling that they are real individuals with personalities, agendas, and that develop personally during the game. This might be difficult to spot early in the game, and if you don't like talking to them and developing your relationship to them, you're definitely going to miss out on what makes this game so enthralling. It is not what happens in the world of the game that is the interesting story, it is how the world is affected by the persons living that is what is most interesting about the game.

[Khim1]

Gadarr wrote...

Your issue concerning the lack of an explorable world map is actually a viable game design decision, if you think about it. Games with open world maps that offer a great amount of freedom to the player suffer from a weak main storyline. If you can just wander off and do whatever you please and loot totally unrelated dungeons, the storyline will naturally come in little pieces, therefore being much less compelling. On the other hand, cutting back the possibilities of exploration gives room for a driving story that won't get out of the players sight.

So, while you don't have to like this concept of course, it's not a question of finding a cheap way out but of conscious design decision. DA:O is all about the main story.

Good point. This is a matter of taste, of course, and I guess game world immersion and exploration are just more important to me than a strong main storyline. (and this I say after having spent a silly amount of time playing JRPG:s on console... I guess my taste is changing)

Oh, by the way, there is an official mod that gives you a storage chest in your camp.

Yes, I know about it. I just don't want to experience a completely new game by modding it from the start. It feels somehow wrong.

[Bluemax151]

Someone else that played the goldbox games! I sort of miss that kind of game minus the archaic controls and translation wheel



Dragon Age is alright not the greatest game ever but I can't think of an RPG I've played recently of it's quality. Voice acting is AMAZING!



class variety is pretty lacking but each class can become very specialized within itself or can diversify for additional utility. It's kind of a mixed bag there for sure.They all work though so I can't really complain.



Redcliffe is a pretty simple area and to an extent the Brescillian Forest is too. Other areas are better depending on how you feel about pretty straight forward linear pathing.



Items get better from the beginning assortment but this isn't Diablo or anything like that so it's a pretty modest selection even towards the end. Tons of "trash" equipment to vendor of course.



To me at least this game seems to be pretty much an update of the NWN series in pretty much all aspects but combat. Combat plays out more like Fallout Tactics with no turn based option and a pause button instead.



You should really give it a chance. I play a few hours everyday and now I'm lvl18 and overall it's been a positive experience.

[Auraad]

DKJaigen wrote...

Auraad wrote...

It's also hard to grasp these things and even harder to write about them - just one thing that itches me is the status-display next to XP bar - this should go NEXT to each char portrait, g*d***it!

why exactly? Have you ever played WOW and raided? trust me this is a good thing maybe 1-3 buffs/debuffs is not a problem but make it 7-10 and it turns into a mess . So bioware learend from the mistakes that WOW made. Good thing they dont listen to people like you

Well, it has been stated several times that you *can not* compare DA:O to WoW ... (well, you can, but it really does not make any sense). And the max I had in DA:O (when I looked) was about 4-5 effects.
Obviously you have never raided in WoW ... coz if you had, you would have noticed that parties in WoW are *just slightly* larger that the mere 4 heros in DA:O ...

On the other hand, it would really help a lot, if this info would be instantly clear so I don't *have* to switch thru all chars all the time ... ya know, there are some peeps out there who mainly play their main char and only switch to NPCs should the need arise (if the combat tactics are used correctly, you don't have to micro manage everyone all the time!)
There you go.

[Mordaedil]

Sunder_2 wrote...
I mean is anything ground breaking?

No. That's not what this game is about. This game isn't meant to "break your world" or "blow your mind".

It's just supposed to be a solid gaming experience. Expecting something else might be selling the game short of what it truly is:

A damn good retro flashback. It's damn good in the same way Mega Man 9 was damn good.

[daem3an]

Wow, I just looked at my game stats and was a little surprised to see that I've only completed 15% of the plot, even though I've been playing now for ~46 hours. I must really like this game. It's obvious a lot of love went into its creation. Most games don't hold my attention this way.

I've also spent a lot of time chatting with the other characters, which surprises me too. At some point for me the game started to take on a different flavour as I experienced it with 'companions' that each have a very detailed history, personality and reactions to the things we do. I usually hate these types of mini-games, I had serious doubts abouty DAO being like the Sims with swords. The added layer of your experiences through the eyes of the companions really adds to the game, if you take the time to let it happen.

The story so far is, I think, superior to most other rpgs, although not ground-breaking. I think the potential variety in character-building offered by this game, while not overly complex, is better than anything I've played to date including D&D. Like everyone I have some personal gripes, but the combat is also some of the best, tactically, I've seen in a crpg. As a Total War fan as well, I find it really satisfying. Most rpg combat bores me.

For me the game experience is much more than simply the sum of all these great things. I liked all of the games you mentioned, although I found NWN2 shallow in comparison to TW or KotoR. I could have simply played through and solved the main plot without really exploring the depths this game has to offer (frankly most games don't even come close) but then I would have missed out on the real beauty of the game. In my opinion.

[Sunder_2]

TheAlarmist wrote...

Sunder_2 wrote...

*feels misquoted*

Thanks for the replies for those that choose not to turn a legitimate topic into a silly exercise in trolling. Please stay on topic and leave pointless observations in the way one should seek their entertainment to your own threads. I seeking opinions on those of similar tastes on what I can expect from the game.

How were you misquoted? Misunderstood perhaps either due to misreading or miscommunication but not misqouted.

Perhaps you should look at the responder before quoting?  As the OP I have the wonder if you even read my post?  I feel misquoted because you quoted someone that responded to me and marked as my quopte..........ots not that hard to figure out- I never said anything about watching TV as i played the game- completely nother postyer- henceforth when you attribute those remarks to me- you misquote me.  Again my thanks for those that contributed to answering my questions about what i can expect going further with the story!

[Sunder_2]

I have no problem with dissenting points of view- its misquoyed and unwarranted attacks that I resent. Telling me that am wrong or just don't know what i am talking about is not an opinion on the game. I simply asked about what I can expect going forward and rather or not things are different from what i have experienced thus far in the game, I think I have my answers- for those that had something constructive and relevent to say? my thanks. to the rest well.........

[Sunder_2]

Spaceweed10 wrote...

Sunder_2 wrote...

I have played A LOT of CRPGS in my day- started w/ Bard’s Tale & SSI goldbox series have played BG2……..
 
Maybe I believed the hype too much, maybe I can never recapture the feeling I got when I first discovered CRPGS, but hopefully its just that maybe I haven’t given it enough time.
 
*possible minor spoiler*
 
 
 
I have just started night time in Redcliff and I am playing as a rogue and I am level 7.  Maybe I expected too much, but I am not exactly blown away by the plot/story so far and maybe I am just too programmed by D&D, but I am also a little disappointment w/ the lack of variety in classes/character development.  I like that the world seems low magic, but at the same time I am eager to see what exciting and different types of magical equipment, items, devices, ect that are available.  I mean is anything ground breaking?  It has not been a bad experience and it is a good game so far………just not the absolute master piece I was expecting from all I have read.   I  like some of the party banter and passing town folk gossip and such, but something is lacking. 
 
Some games just draw you in and can’t stay away from the keyboard, KOTOR, Rome: Total War, NWN2 were a few that did so for me, but DA:O has failed so far to do as much. So please, tell me it is going to get even better?  Will I see a deeper story?  Will my rogue develope very different from next rogue or even my 1st play thru as a warrior?  Will I get that “sucked in” quality from it? 

Bard's Tale?  Stopped reading there...

Can only assume you think I am referring to Bard's Tale circa 2006.........try the original 3 games circa 1985-1989...........

[aberdash]

My problem with the game is that its too impersonal. There is nothing the makes me feel that my role could not be fulfilled by gray warden #53. Even worse it makes you feel like you are just another gray warden. So really I don't feel there is anything stopping me from just saying "**** this I'm going home. Let someone else deal with it". What made BG2 so great and made you want to keep playing imo was it being so personal. The first scene is of you being tortured which is soon followed by your childhood friend being taken. There was no great calamity facing the world it was all about you, Imoen, and Irenicus.

Modifié par aberdash, 20 novembre 2009 - 02:41 .

[Nighteye2]

Scyles wrote...

I was referring to Cone of Cold, but the same effect can be achieved by cycling paralysis spells such as Mass Paralysis, Sleep, Waking Nightmare, Blizzard, Mind Blast, Blood Wound, Scatteringshot, etc. You get the idea.

Anyway, as Wolfva2 suggested, I am a jaded gamer.

Who played on easy or normal. Try those same spells on Hard and Nightmare - their duration is significantly shorter then.

[Sunder_2]

aberdash wrote...

My problem with the game is that its too impersonal. There is nothing the makes me feel that my role could not be fulfilled by gray warden #53. Even worse it makes you feel like you are just another gray warden. So really I don't feel there is anything stopping me from just saying "**** this I'm going home. Let someone else deal with it". What made BG2 so great and made you want to keep playing imo was it being so personal. The first scene is of you being tortured which is soon followed by your childhood friend being taken. There was no great calamity facing the world it was all about you, Imoen, and Irenicus.

That may be it.  I am a racist, human hating city elf (as much as dialog options allow)........yet I wonder if i play a goody human mage or nuetral dwarf commoner warrior if the game would be really any different other than the origin part of the game.  I read about these story arc affecting choices that can drastically alter the game........is it there?  I think i will just need to play further before really deciding on the game.........not much going on this weekend so I should be able to put 10-12 moire hours into it and maybe I'll be pleasently surprised.

[BluesMan1956]

Sunder_2 wrote...

*feels misquoted*

Thanks for the replies for those that choose not to turn a legitimate topic into a silly exercise in trolling. Please stay on topic and leave pointless observations in the way one should seek their entertainment to your own threads. I seeking opinions on those of similar tastes on what I can expect from the game.

I suggest you really try to "role play".  Get into your character and try to feel what they feel.  The story and acting makes it easy.

This game is like a good book.  You need to sit down and focus your attention on it

[aberdash]

Sunder_2 wrote...

That may be it.  I am a racist, human hating city elf (as much as dialog options allow)........yet I wonder if i play a goody human mage or nuetral dwarf commoner warrior if the game would be really any different other than the origin part of the game.  I read about these story arc affecting choices that can drastically alter the game........is it there?  I think i will just need to play further before really deciding on the game.........not much going on this weekend so I should be able to put 10-12 moire hours into it and maybe I'll be pleasently surprised.

Dont buy into the hype. After the origins its all pretty much the same with some different dialog here and there.

[Nemesis7884]

well there are a lot of lore twists that are interesting - such as the elves being slaves or the dwarfes with their corrupt politics and intrigues BUT they basic story is VERY 0815, very straight, very good vs bads (even all the choices in game are very obvious good vs bad...) and its VERY copied from lord of the rings... so i'd really love to see - for an extension or a sequel - a more interesting not so 0815 fantasy story - eyes of the dragon from stephen king as an example...

[Scyles]

Nighteye2 wrote...
Who played on easy or normal. Try those same spells on Hard and Nightmare - their duration is significantly shorter then.

I am playing on Nightmare.

[daem3an]

BluesMan1956 wrote...
I suggest you really try to "role play".  Get into your character and try to feel what they feel.  The story and acting makes it easy.

This game is like a good book.  You need to sit down and focus your attention on it

This game is fun to roleplay. My character takes his commitment to the Wardens very seriously, after the betrayal at Ostagar, risking his life and now being hunted. We're a band of thieving outlaws, doing whatever it takes to finance our mission, and taking down whoever gets in our way. After all, this is war.

[aberdash]

BluesMan1956 wrote...

I suggest you really try to "role play".  Get into your character and try to feel what they feel.  The story and acting makes it easy.

This game is like a good book.  You need to sit down and focus your attention on it

A good book doesn't take effort on your part to become immersed in the story. It should suck you in. Unfortunately DA doesn't do that.

[Matthew Young CT]

That's entirely subjective, of course. Seems to do it for plenty of people.

[Khim1]

Gadarr wrote...

Oh, by the way, there is an official mod that gives you a storage chest in your camp.

Good thing I happened to re-read your message. I missed the "official" before. Sorry about that. Here's the link for anyone else who has missed it:
http://social.biowar...ct/463/#details

Thanks for the tip!

[Tekbear]

ummmm - not really sure what more you could expect from a game at this point? i think the battles are very well done. at the least a whole lot better than nwn which i thought particulartly annoying at times.

you can always adjust the difficulty level to what fits your playstyle - the story is anything but dull. to me it sounds like the OP is missing the level of high fantasy which to me is actually very refreshing because i am tired of finding yet another epic sword that replaces one of the 100 others i have in my backpack.

[LFDog]

To the OP.



The game over-all (as far as I've played) does not set any new standards for a fantasy story (sorry to those that love it). I wouldn't expect that the game would try to set new standards in this regard though.



What I feel it offers is a solid, expected level of fantasy with a good interactive component. In this regard, I feel it lives up to the hype. It's complelling enough as a story to make you want to move forward and there are surprises you wouldn't expect. (no spoilers from me though!)



Some "sections" of the game appealed to me and some felt a little like "chores". However, I am finding the overall experience to be very engaging and fun (so, yes. it gets better?)



As a caveat, I don't generally like "fantasy" as a genre either. So my interaction with the genre is limited to these games - which aids in being less jaded.



Whew.



Short answer: in my opinion, "yes" it does become more engaging, but not as a fantasy epic - as a fun interactive game.

[Exodus]

I can't really blame people who go to the dalish or redcliffe first after lothering. The dalish elf areas are initially boring but it blossoms into something great. Redcliffe is a bit straightforward. Personally I went to the mage tower first because after playing through and deciding on city elf rogue..I REALLY wanted a healer first(Wynne). I suggest after Lothering goto Mage Tower, then goto Orzammar, redcliffe, dalish forest and then Denerim.



I'll tell you what really made this game for me however...Orzammar + the Deep Roads. Yes, I have purchased and read the books by David privy to the game and they really added to it but that doesn't change how great the deep roads is.