155 réponses à ce sujet

[habitat 67]

kyg_20X6 wrote...

I absolutely hated the exploration of the first game. Barren planet with jaggy rocks after barren planet with jaggy rocks, all with their "seen one, seen 'em all" buildings. I liked Overlord's exploration... still large areas but the smaller area allows for more detailed, believable worlds. I'd rather a smaller area teaming with detail and life than a barren rock. And I liked the maneuverability of the Hammerhead more than the Mako but preferred the Mako in combat... it's weapons just added more strategy (not a hell of a lot though).

I liked the first game's rocky repetative terrains, maybe because it had that whole walking the moon for the first time feeling.

The Overlord area was kind of... grassy and Earthlike and I wasn't allowed to get out of the Hammmerhead and walk around. WHY? Other than that, it was overall a step back in the right direction. More exploration please. L.A. Noire spoiled me.

[Amfortas]

Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien wrote...

How much of most of the ME planets had anything of any real interest in it?

They were as interesting as any generic uncharted planet should be. I'm not sure what you really wanted. You're exploring the universe, the universe is a desolate place. ME1 transmitted that perfectly.

[Il Divo]

Amfortas wrote...

They were as interesting as any generic uncharted planet should be. I'm not sure what you really wanted. You're exploring the universe, the universe is a desolate place. ME1 transmitted that perfectly.

That's pretty much the problem. Exploration works much better when your character has something to explore (Ex: Elder Scrolls series). If the best Bioware could do was create the same textures ad infinitum, I think they would have been better off scrapping them all and just adding an extra main quest planet (imo).

[Cancer Puppet]

I guess the OP doesn't remember how boring it was driving on those barren worlds. "Yay! I only need 3 more heavy metals, 5 turian insignias, and 3 salarian medalians! Tarversing 90 degree cliffs for these worthless trinkets is sure fun!"

I liked the overlord vehicle sections though. I just wish getting in and out of the vehicle and saving were options there.

Modifié par Cancer Puppet, 11 juin 2011 - 12:33 .

[Il Divo]

Durka531 wrote...


Well it would work out that way from a purely roll playing angle but honestly the only time in any RPG that I’ve played where going on side quests instead of moving the plot along had any consequence was ME2 after the
reaper IFF mission. Now I know there are those missions that TIM gives you where you cannot skip (that I know of) so those don't count. For example in the old republic I made sure that I finished all the side quests before even
thinking of rescuing Bastila and she was "captured" waiting to be sold or any one of the JRPG with their insane number of sidequests.

P.S Edit for formating, frikkin MS word messed things up.

Ah, a KotOR example! You do bring up a good point with Bastila. But keep in mind, even there, your character's side quests did not encompass scavenging the galaxy. At first, you have no idea where Bastila is. Most of the side quests on Taris were fairly simple and could be completed over the course of the main quest. Ex: The bounty missions.

The problem with side quests is that they require I (the player) to metagame certain interactions. It's ok that I complete every side quest in Mass Effect because I know (most likely) that the plot will not move forward without me. But Shepard doesn't know that. His first concern is Saren, whom he is racing to the Conduit. From an in character perspective, why is Shepard traveling across random star clusters when he knows leads to Saren are on Noveria, Feros, etc? KotOR did not require that to the same degree. On Tatooine, I'm looking for a Star Map. Along the way, I confront a woman looking to sell a wraid plate, which I do and then continue on with my main quest. It just seems much more difficult to justify in Mass Effect.

Modifié par Il Divo, 11 juin 2011 - 12:37 .

[Gabey5]

hell no. i don't want to have to gather resources anymore. all side quests should be related to the reapers in some way. Also why would Commander shepard.. the guy who is gonna gather the fleets of the galaxy have to do the small things like gather resources for the alliance? He is too important for menial work, it was justifiable in previous games as the reapers would unknown or had not arrived yet

Modifié par Gabey5, 11 juin 2011 - 12:41 .

[elitecom]

Someone With Mass wrote...We can go to several spots on the same world and do multiple missions, if that counts.

Yes I saw that, I found it to be most interesting. I'd actually hoped for that for ME2, so it's good to see that we'll be able to do that.

Amfortas wrote...

elitecom wrote...
To give the player the ability to open some new relays leading to places where no citadel species has gone before. Then you can scan the planets, maybe discover a new species, to aid against the reaper threat

I like your ideas OP, but don't use the word scan, it brings back some bad memories.

Glad that you like it. I was thinking more in the line of ME1's type of planet scan when you scan an uncharted world first, to display information about the planet.

habitat 67 wrote...
I liked the first game's rocky repetative terrains, maybe because it had that whole walking the moon for the first time feeling.

The Overlord area was kind of... grassy and Earthlike and I wasn't allowed to get out of the Hammmerhead and walk around. WHY? Other than that, it was overall a step back in the right direction. More exploration please. L.A. Noire spoiled me.

I agree with the moon feel, that's a very good way to put the feeling you get. I've yet to play Overlod, but I'll try to get it done.

Amfortas wrote...
They were as interesting as any generic uncharted planet should be. I'm not sure what you really wanted. You're exploring the universe, the universe is a desolate place. ME1 transmitted that perfectly.

I agree, most planets in space don't look like Earth, many are barren and rocky.

Cancer Puppet wrote...
I guess the OP doesn't remember how boring it was driving on those barren worlds.

I guess you forgot that there's no such thing as objectivity in matters such as these. That's your opinion, and I happen to not share it with you.

[Bummlmitz2]

ME1 Exploration? Bring it back!

[Gibb_Shepard]

Amfortas wrote...

If ME3's plot is so focused that it doesn't even allow us to make sidequests and explore the world, then I can honestly say that ME3's plot is not good enough. Or at least not adequate for an RPG. It's not worth to have the greatest plot ever if in order to do so you have to sacrifice the rest of the gameplay.

elitecom wrote...
To give the player the ability to open some new relays leading to places where no citadel species has gone before. Then you can scan the planets, maybe discover a new species, to aid against the reaper threat

I like your ideas OP, but don't use the word scan, it brings back some bad memories.

This

[elitecom]

Gabey5 wrote...

hell no. i don't want to have to gather resources anymore. all side quests should be related to the reapers in some way. Also why would Commander shepard.. the guy who is gonna gather the fleets of the galaxy have to do the small things like gather resources for the alliance? He is too important for menial work, it was justifiable in previous games as the reapers would unknown or had not arrived yet

The mining will be tied into the main story. The Alliance has always been in need of resources, what time is more dire for resources than a galactic war? I've already put forth another idea of how resource gathering will have an immediate effect on the main story:

Let's say that a big battle comes up between an Alliance/Citadel fleet and a Reaper fleet. There are three outcomes, based on how many resources you find. Find enough, and the Alliance/Citadel fleet manages to stop the Reaper, gather partially enough, the Reapers are stopped but most of the ships are destoryed, and the final outcome: You don't gather enough resources and the Alliance/Citadel fleet is destoryed while the Reapers advance. This is just an idea of an example of how you could couple resource gathering with the war against the Reapers.

[Conquerthecity]

elitecom wrote...

Gabey5 wrote...

hell no. i don't want to have to gather resources anymore. all side quests should be related to the reapers in some way. Also why would Commander shepard.. the guy who is gonna gather the fleets of the galaxy have to do the small things like gather resources for the alliance? He is too important for menial work, it was justifiable in previous games as the reapers would unknown or had not arrived yet

The mining will be tied into the main story. The Alliance has always been in need of resources, what time is more dire for resources than a galactic war? I've already put forth another idea of how resource gathering will have an immediate effect on the main story:

Let's say that a big battle comes up between an Alliance/Citadel fleet and a Reaper fleet. There are three outcomes, based on how many resources you find. Find enough, and the Alliance/Citadel fleet manages to stop the Reaper, gather partially enough, the Reapers are stopped but most of the ships are destoryed, and the final outcome: You don't gather enough resources and the Alliance/Citadel fleet is destoryed while the Reapers advance. This is just an idea of an example of how you could couple resource gathering with the war against the Reapers.

Hnngh. Fable 3 flashbacks. DON'T BAKE ENOUGH PIES AND YOUR WORLD IS EMPTY.

[Warkupo]

The world exploration segment of Mass Effect 1 is the most boring, repetitive, half-thought out idea in the entire history of ever. I do not consider a new skybox and texture swap to be 'atmospheric'. I do not find going to one of the same three bases, having a short dialog (if that), and then killing everyone inside to be engaging. I do not feel that flailing around in the Mako like a cat in a washing machine to be fun. I do not enjoy aimlessly wandering around a vast wasteland of emptiness for thirty minutes to MAYBE find SOMETHING of interest.

In short, I would not play ME3 if the 'explore nothing' feature was reintroduced. I would seriously question the psyche evaluations of the entire ME3 staff if they thought bringing back such an obviously rushed concept was a good idea.

Modifié par Warkupo, 12 juin 2011 - 11:58 .

[elitecom]

Warkupo wrote...

The world exploration segment of Mass Effect 1 is the most boring, repetitive, half-thought out idea in the entire history of ever. I do not consider a new skybox and texture swap to be 'atmospheric'. I do not find going to one of the same three bases, having a short dialog (if that), and then killing everyone inside to be engaging. I do not feel that flailing around in the Mako like a cat in a washing machine to be fun. I do enjoy aimlessly wandering around a vast wasteland of emptiness for thirty minutes to MAYBE find SOMETHING of interest.

In short, I would not play ME3 if the 'explore nothing' feature was reintroduced. I would seriously question the psyche evaluations of the entire ME3 staff if they thought bringing back such an obviously rushed concept was a good idea.

All right, well that's your take on these things, people appreciate different things. I think however you're getting a bit extreme when you start to doubt the psyche of the ME3 staff just because they put something which you don't approve of i.e. exploration similar to ME1 back in the game.

[Mand0l1n]

Perhaps the real problem with exploration is the horrendous vehicles we've been given so far. On me1 we bounced around the terrain like a 1kg tonka truck and in me2 we were hopping around llike a frog on lily pads - hardly futuristic travel. Give us something fast and easy to control - I'm thinking like the star wars land speeder.

[elitecom]

Mand0l1n wrote...

Perhaps the real problem with exploration is the horrendous vehicles we've been given so far. On me1 we bounced around the terrain like a 1kg tonka truck and in me2 we were hopping around llike a frog on lily pads - hardly futuristic travel. Give us something fast and easy to control - I'm thinking like the star wars land speeder.

Well a speeder as in Star Wars could workm but it would face similar problems like the Hammerhead did. That is it won't be suitable for rocky terrain, it would be forced to fly above the rocks. Another solution would be to have a Mako like vehicle, just with better dampening so it won't bounce around so much as it did.

[onelifecrisis]

elitecom wrote...

We haven't really had a thread here on the ME3 discussion boards about exploration in ME3, so I might as well start one.
 
Exploration of barren worlds
What I really hope for in regards to exploration in ME3, is to have the vehicle based exploration of Mass Effect 1 back again.

I really hope that we do not have this. Not in any shape or form.
                     

elitecom wrote...

New type of space exploration
However this is just the ground exploration, I was also thinking adding a new type of space exploration to the game.

Again, no. You do realise there's a galaxy to save? If you want to explore, play EVE.

[kyg_20X6]

Warkupo wrote...

The world exploration segment of Mass Effect 1 is the most boring, repetitive, half-thought out idea in the entire history of ever. I do not consider a new skybox and texture swap to be 'atmospheric'. I do not find going to one of the same three bases, having a short dialog (if that), and then killing everyone inside to be engaging. I do not feel that flailing around in the Mako like a cat in a washing machine to be fun. I do enjoy aimlessly wandering around a vast wasteland of emptiness for thirty minutes to MAYBE find SOMETHING of interest.

In short, I would not play ME3 if the 'explore nothing' feature was reintroduced. I would seriously question the psyche evaluations of the entire ME3 staff if they thought bringing back such an obviously rushed concept was a good idea.

QFT

[elitecom]

onelifecrisis wrote...
                     

elitecom wrote...

New type of space exploration
However this is just the ground exploration, I was also thinking adding a new type of space exploration to the game.

Again, no. You do realise there's a galaxy to save? If you want to explore, play EVE.

In ME1 we had a galaxy to save, in ME2 we had a galaxy to save, and what did we have time to in both those games? Exploration among a couple of other things, such as getting drunk on the Citadel. If Shepard has time to get drunk on the Citadel, he has time to explore space as well.

[Warkupo]

elitecom wrote...

Warkupo wrote...

The world exploration segment of Mass Effect 1 is the most boring, repetitive, half-thought out idea in the entire history of ever. I do not consider a new skybox and texture swap to be 'atmospheric'. I do not find going to one of the same three bases, having a short dialog (if that), and then killing everyone inside to be engaging. I do not feel that flailing around in the Mako like a cat in a washing machine to be fun. I do enjoy aimlessly wandering around a vast wasteland of emptiness for thirty minutes to MAYBE find SOMETHING of interest.

In short, I would not play ME3 if the 'explore nothing' feature was reintroduced. I would seriously question the psyche evaluations of the entire ME3 staff if they thought bringing back such an obviously rushed concept was a good idea.

All right, well that's your take on these things, people appreciate different things. I think however you're getting a bit extreme when you start to doubt the psyche of the ME3 staff just because they put something which you don't approve of i.e. exploration similar to ME1 back in the game.

Read carefully. 

My reaction is an if statement. They havn't added boring exploration, they won't add boring exploration, and the game will be better for it. 

[onelifecrisis]

elitecom wrote...

onelifecrisis wrote...
                     

elitecom wrote...

New type of space exploration
However this is just the ground exploration, I was also thinking adding a new type of space exploration to the game.

Again, no. You do realise there's a galaxy to save? If you want to explore, play EVE.

In ME1 we had a galaxy to save, in ME2 we had a galaxy to save, and what did we have time to in both those games? Exploration among a couple of other things, such as getting drunk on the Citadel. If Shepard has time to get drunk on the Citadel, he has time to explore space as well.

Exactly. This was a problem in both games and it needs to change.

[Rogue Unit]

Driving a mako up a mountain on the same re-colored world, to fight to same enemies in the same bunker is not exploration. It's just tedious.

[elitecom]

Warkupo wrote...

Read carefully.

My reaction is an if statement. They havn't added boring exploration, they won't add boring exploration, and the game will be better for it.

Again that's your take on that kind of exploration, not necessarily shared by me or others.

onelifecrisis wrote...

elitecom wrote...

In ME1 we had a galaxy to save, in ME2 we had a galaxy to save, and what did we have time to in both those games? Exploration among a couple of other things, such as getting drunk on the Citadel. If Shepard has time to get drunk on the Citadel, he has time to explore space as well.

Exactly. This was a problem in both games and it needs to change.

I don't think so, it's how RPGs work. It's the same in KotOR, you have a galaxy to save yet you have time to play Pazaak and drive swoop bikes. If all you could do was following the story 100%, the game would be over too soon. Sidequests are a big part of the RPG experience.

[FluffyScarf]

Those side quests were localised to a particular planet. It's different when Shep can travel to the other side of the galaxy to gather some space rock.

[onelifecrisis]

elitecom wrote...

onelifecrisis wrote...

elitecom wrote...

In ME1 we had a galaxy to save, in ME2 we had a galaxy to save, and what did we have time to in both those games? Exploration among a couple of other things, such as getting drunk on the Citadel. If Shepard has time to get drunk on the Citadel, he has time to explore space as well.

Exactly. This was a problem in both games and it needs to change.

I don't think so, it's how RPGs work. It's the same in KotOR, you have a galaxy to save yet you have time to play Pazaak and drive swoop bikes. If all you could do was following the story 100%, the game would be over too soon. Sidequests are a big part of the RPG experience.

Please, let's not drag this into yet another pointless debate on what an RPG is, especially seeing as ME3 isn't an RPG. You want exploration, I don't. I gave my reasons.

And no, the game would not be over too soon without sidequests. ME2 takes almost 30 hours just to do the main story, which makes it several times the length of the average SP shooter campaign. Don't get me wrong, I love that it's 30 hours long. I'm just saying that your argument (that it's "too short" without side-quests and exploration) doesn't hold water.

Modifié par onelifecrisis, 12 juin 2011 - 12:12 .

[Warkupo]

elitecom wrote...

Warkupo wrote...

Read carefully.

My reaction is an if statement. They havn't added boring exploration, they won't add boring exploration, and the game will be better for it.

Again that's your take on that kind of exploration, not necessarily shared by me or others.

...No, that wasn't my take on exploration. My take on exploration was a reply above the one you're qouting. That is me clarifying my previous statement so that you understand that I don't actually descredit the ME3 teams' ability to make a solid game that isn't full of needlessly boring padding. Rather, my previous comment was ment to demonstrate what a terrible state of mind you'd need to be in to think that adding in exploration akin to ME1 was a good idea.