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[Aristobulus500]

So, I was talking to a friend of mine the other day - discussion started cause I linked him this picture actually http://i.imgur.com/E1xkA.png - and he argued with me about the subject of whether or not Asari would have a concept of sexuality.

He argued that, basically, due to being a mono-gendered society, Asari would really not have had a concept of sexuality anywhere close to like how humans have, and wouldn't have gained one until they ran into other races, which started classifying them as female - especially humans. But that Asari - especially on Thessia , where their culture is strongest, and wouldn't have the influences from other races on them like Asari living on say, the Citadel or especially another alien's homeworld - would still likely have pure Asari culture.

This doesn't mean that Asari wouldn't become physically attracted to other people, but that when they do, they are likely to focus on them as a whole, instead of on specific body parts - and if they do focus on specific body parts, it's due to that Asari's individual tastes - because they haven't had a society and culture that teaches them some body parts are unique and special, because everyone on their planet shares the same body parts. This also wouldn't mean they can't have sex for pleasure, but that when they do, they would also likely focus on whatever acts cause the most pleasure, and once again would likely focus on the entire body of their partner - especially since they can use mind melding to enhance the intensity. This also seems to follow, since the Asari are clearly capable of becoming physically attracted to pretty much any race - they must be considering something different in a partner than say, a human would.

As far as their culture, this would also explain why in comparison to other races and again, especially humanity, they seem to be so much more sexually open, because they come from a society that that simply wasn't really a thing, so there was also no stigma of shame attached to it, and then they found other races would appreciate them for their looks, so they could easily use that to their advantage - which is why a lot become dancers, and Aria even mentions Asari withholding sex to get some other people to do what they wanted them to do.

This also probably means Asari wouldn't have much of a nudity taboo, if one at all. Not that this means Asari would be likely to walk around everywhere naked, because clothing is simply convenient, especially if you're trying to work, but this would explain why their clothing could be so light and such - it's made for pure comfort, unless it is a work uniform which is made for utility purposes to serve a job, and their casual clothing, the Asari would be less concerned about how revealing it is, having no social stigma of shame to make them bothered by that. Nudity might be more common among the Asari, but it would likely be reserved for pure relaxation purposes, and occasions such as swimming, or bathing, or something of that sort - similar to how in Japan, nudity is more accepted at like hot springs and such.

The reason I'm posting this is to see if anyone disagrees - he's pretty much convinced me that most of this makes sense, but considering the amount of detail some people here have put into thinking about the Asari - like that Asari physiological "study" that was posted a while ago - I figure someone here might have something interesting to add, whether or not they agree or disagree. It took me a while to even really grasp what he was trying to argue, because the concept of "no sexuality concept" is pretty, well, alien, but once I started to understand it seemed pretty interesting and yet another way that would have the Asari culture stand out as particularly alien and different from humanity.

[MidnightRaith]

@Ecrulis

I love the side buttons. I was a clicker before, and I just can't get used to pushing the number buttons on the keyboard. Maybe it's because I actually started out as a console gamer, or I just suck, but I can't make myself do it. I bought the Razer as soon as I heard about it just for its side buttons and my efficency has gone up significantly.

What's worse though, is not only did I forget my Razer at home, but I also forgot my ME1 Galactic Checklist. I could print another one, I guess, but I can't remember all the minerals and Prothean discs, etc. I've already gotten. So, I can't play my Vanguard Shep.... This sucks. :/

Modifié par MidnightRaith, 02 mai 2012 - 06:47 .

[Ecrulis]

I usually end up skipping those quests because they make me hurt out of tedium, that and the Mako is the bane of my existence as well as the fact that they have absolutely no bearing on the future games I just cannot bring myself to gather them all XD

Modifié par Ecrulis, 02 mai 2012 - 06:50 .

[MidnightRaith]

Ecrulis wrote...

I usually end up skipping those quests because they make me hurt out of tedium, that and the Mako is the bane of my existence as well as the fact that they have absolutely no bearing on the future games I just cannot bring myself to gather them all XD

Sadly, I have an obsessive compulsive personality. Collection quests are the bane of my existence. Whenever any quest puts something like 0/## on a quest, I have to get them all. It will just... bother me if I don't do it. Add the fact that I get a rush when I get all of whatever I needed to, and I'm hooked....The only reason I was able to get through the speed throughs in order to get all the free charm/intimidate points was because 1. getting all the free points felt like that was in itself a collection quest and 2. I placated myself with the knowledge that my final playthrough would be a 100% run.

[Tyranniac]

MaroAlighieri wrote...

Screw you guys. I'm using some 5 dollar mouse made out of cheap plastic and Elmer's children's glue.

Don't worry, I have something similar...

Aristobulus500 wrote...

So, I was talking to a friend of mine the other day - discussion started cause I linked him this picture actually http://i.imgur.com/E1xkA.png - and he argued with me about the subject of whether or not Asari would have a concept of sexuality.

He argued that, basically...

*long post*

 


I agree with a few of the things you're saying, but you're misusing the word sexuality.

Ecrulis wrote...

I usually end up skipping those quests because they make me hurt out of tedium, that and the Mako is the bane of my existence as well as the fact that they have absolutely no bearing on the future games I just cannot bring myself to gather them all XD

 

Actually, one of them (UNC: Asari Writings) has an impact on ME3.

MidnightRaith wrote...

Sadly, I have an obsessive compulsive personality. Collection quests are the bane of my existence. Whenever any quest puts something like 0/## on a quest, I have to get them all. It will just... bother me if I don't do it. Add the fact that I get a rush when I get all of whatever I needed to, and I'm hooked....The only reason I was able to get through the speed throughs in order to get all the free charm/intimidate points was because 1. getting all the free points felt like that was in itself a collection quest and 2. I placated myself with the knowledge that my final playthrough would be a 100% run.

 

I can relate to this. 

Modifié par Tyranniac, 02 mai 2012 - 07:47 .

[Ecrulis]

Ecrulis wrote...

I usually end up skipping those quests because they make me hurt out of tedium, that and the Mako is the bane of my existence as well as the fact that they have absolutely no bearing on the future games I just cannot bring myself to gather them all XD

 

Actually, one of them (UNC: Asari Writings) has an impact on ME3.

Really? what impact does it have?

Modifié par Ecrulis, 02 mai 2012 - 07:15 .

[MidnightRaith]

Liara wasn't too impressed by Adept Shep giving Qu'in's (sp?...) evidence to Anoleis.... RenegadeShep is hard for me, but since AdeptShep is Paragade, I have to do some Renegade stuff... Fortunately, this one was rather funny.

"I gave your evidence to Anoleis."

"You... why?"

"You refused to testify. Obviously you hate justice and deserve this."

"What insane breed of logic is that?"

Lmao.

[Tyranniac]

Ecrulis wrote...

Ecrulis wrote...

I usually end up skipping those quests because they make me hurt out of tedium, that and the Mako is the bane of my existence as well as the fact that they have absolutely no bearing on the future games I just cannot bring myself to gather them all XD

 

Actually, one of them (UNC: Asari Writings) has an impact on ME3.

Really? what impact does it have?

It affects Shepard's interaction with Conrad Verner in ME3.

[Ecrulis]

thats...interesting

[lillitheris]

I'll list a few counters.

Aristobulus500 wrote...

He argued that, basically, due to being a mono-gendered society, Asari would really not have had a concept of sexuality anywhere close to like how humans have, and wouldn't have gained one until they ran into other races, which started classifying them as female - especially humans.

Humans only came about 30 years ago. The others have been in for at least centuries.

Still, being monogendered doesn't really have anything to do with sexuality – one way or another. The basic premise of sexual pleasure is that it's a trait that tends to lead to more offspring than the alternatives.

This doesn't mean that Asari wouldn't become physically attracted to other people, but that when they do, they are likely to focus on them as a whole, instead of on specific body parts - and if they do focus on specific body parts, it's due to that Asari's individual tastes - because they haven't had a society and culture that teaches them some body parts are unique and special, because everyone on their planet shares the same body parts.

Because that's how same-sex human couples are, right? It's a little glib but, again, there's no direct causality. Human bits are special, because they are special. Nudity taboos and their psychological effects are a different matter.

This also wouldn't mean they can't have sex for pleasure, but that when they do, they would also likely focus on whatever acts cause the most pleasure, and once again would likely focus on the entire body of their partner - especially since they can use mind melding to enhance the intensity.

Leaving aside melding (I suspect we have different ideas about it), don't humans also focus on the acts that cause the most pleasure?

This also seems to follow, since the Asari are clearly capable of becoming physically attracted to pretty much any race - they must be considering something different in a partner than say, a human would.

First, I have to contend the use of the word ‘consider’ as it applies to human attraction :happy:

Given that species barriers are basically nonexistent in the ME universe, I don't think we can draw any conclusions about that part.

As far as their culture, this would also explain why in comparison to other races and again, especially humanity, they seem to be so much more sexually open, because they come from a society that that simply wasn't really a thing, so there was also no stigma of shame attached to it, and then they found other races would appreciate them for their looks, so they could easily use that to their advantage - which is why a lot become dancers, and Aria even mentions Asari withholding sex to get some other people to do what they wanted them to do.

There're many human cultures where there's no stigma to sexual openness. Plus they've got a couple thousand years of cultural evolution over us.

I mean, hell, think back even 50 years of human sexuality.

The reason I'm posting this is to see if anyone disagrees - he's pretty much convinced me that most of this makes sense, but considering the amount of detail some people here have put into thinking about the Asari - like that Asari physiological "study" that was posted a while ago - I figure someone here might have something interesting to add, whether or not they agree or disagree. It took me a while to even really grasp what he was trying to argue, because the concept of "no sexuality concept" is pretty, well, alien, but once I started to understand it seemed pretty interesting and yet another way that would have the Asari culture stand out as particularly alien and different from humanity.

As the author…I mean as the distributor of said study*, I can say that this is an interesting idea.

There's nothing that's invalid or false about it so it would work perfectly well as a basis for writing. On the other hand, it's as purely conjucture as my take is

To make it slightly more compelling, trying to trace the evolution of their society through some keystones might work.


* I actually put it up on FFN now, by the by: http://www.fanfictio...sari_for_Humans

[kumquats]

Aristobulus500 wrote...

So, I was talking to a friend of mine the other day - discussion started cause I linked him this picture actually http://i.imgur.com/E1xkA.png - and he argued with me about the subject of whether or not Asari would have a concept of sexuality.

Aethyta seemed to get the concept quite well and she seemed to be very attracted to Benezia in a very physical sense. ^.^

[Edit:] Poor Liara, no one wants to have that kind of information about their parents.

Modifié par kumquats, 02 mai 2012 - 07:59 .

[Akernis]

@ lillitheris: I agree with what you said.

lillitheris wrote...
* I actually put it up on FFN now, by the by: http://www.fanfictio...sari_for_Humans

I just took another read through that. It is quite interesting and I liked most of it, I will incorborate my favourites into my headcanon   

Modifié par Akernis, 02 mai 2012 - 08:00 .

[Erenbe]

 You know what's pathetic?
This:
Babystuff

Seriously...is this a bad joke or something? I think they saw too many ME baby pictures being posted and thought this might be a grand idea. <_<
I guess I would like this more if they would have omitted the in-game teasing about blue babies. Now it just feels like "Yeah...in your face!" 

Edit: spelling!

Modifié par Erenbe, 02 mai 2012 - 08:58 .

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Erenbe wrote...

 You know what's pathetic?
This:
Babystuff

Seriously...is this a bad joke or something? I think they saw too many ME baby pictures being posted and thought this might be a grand idea. <_<
I guess I would like this more if they would have omitted the in-game teasing about blue babies. Now it just feels like "Yeah...in your face!" 

Edit: spelling!

I am okay with them selling stuff with the N7 mark, and I can tolerate it in fanart even if I feel it is slightly overused.

My only problem is in the game themselves where N7 is plastered onto everything.

[coatsworth]

frudi wrote...

rubynorman wrote...

m.fanfiction.net/s/5789390/6/
It kills my heart. Don't read it if you don't want to cry.

I read that one a few of days ago, and a couple others from the same author. While I quite like his stories, they can be quite painful to read, given he does like to, hm... veer down some pretty dark paths (I guess that might be due to the fact these stories were written after ME2 but before LotSB, so it might be the author's way of dealing with the shift in Liara's character and demeanour).
There was one scene in this particular story that really didn't sit well with me, I just couldn't imagine Shepard doing what she did at that point. I'm talking about was how harsh her reaction to Liara's outburst on the Normandy was. Even given how estranged the two had seemingly become, even though Liara loses control and slams Shepard with biotics, even with all the frustration and guilt Shepard is feeling over what she thinks she's made Liara become, even if she subconsciously wants to push Liara away to stop her from continuing down that dark path... even with all that, I just can't see Shepard reacting so harshly and cruelly. Especially allowing some random Cerberus crewmen to beat her up, then just having her locked up and giving up on her... just, no.
I doubt I could have continued reading through to the end of that scene and beyond, if I hadn't peeked forward to the last chapter and seen that they had apparently managed to overcome that tragic episode. I suppose it does probably make the eventual reconciliation and rejoining that much more powerful, so I guess it's not entirely without purpose. Still, painful to read through.

Yes it was, personally i would of shot both of the crewmen. Anyways, it was an interesting read. LONG LIVE LIARA<3 

[Aristobulus500]

[quote]kumquats wrote...
Aethyta seemed to get the concept quite well and she seemed to be very attracted to Benezia in a very physical sense. ^.^

[Edit:] Poor Liara, no one wants to have that kind of information about their parents. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/blushing.png[/smilie]
[/quote]

Yes, but Aethyta doesn't actually disprove the assertion - she - and others like her - were accounted for. Asari ARE said to be introduced to a concept of sexuality like we would understand, once they become integrated with other races. And Aethyta is old and has been all over the place, she's certainly not a - well, - pure Asari anymore. She's got lots of bits of other races culture in her, it's not hard to think she would've also adopted a concept of sexuality over the ages.

That's the thing, keep in mind when I say Asari wouldn't have a concept of sexuality, I'm referring to Asari among their own kind, without influences from non-Asari culture. So, most of this would most likely be seen on more rural parts of Thessia or parts that are populated much more by Asari than any other race.

[quote]lillitheris wrote...

I'll list a few counters.

[quote]Aristobulus500 wrote...

He argued that, basically, due to being a mono-gendered society, Asari would really not have had a concept of sexuality anywhere close to like how humans have, and wouldn't have gained one until they ran into other races, which started classifying them as female - especially humans.[/quote]
Humans only came about 30 years ago. The others have been in for at least centuries.

Still, being monogendered doesn't really have anything to do with sexuality – one way or another. The basic premise of sexual pleasure is that it's a trait that tends to lead to more offspring than the alternatives.[/quote]

Sure, I get that. But all of the other races have male/female genders that would've introduced the Asari to the concept of sexuality.

I'm not sure how you figure being mono-gendered wouldn't impact their views of sexuality, though. A lot of what we get, as humans, is derived from the differences between males/females - Asari do not have that comparison to make. Until they get introduced to other races, of course, but I'm talking pure Asari culture.

[quote]This doesn't mean that Asari wouldn't become physically attracted to other people, but that when they do, they are likely to focus on them as a whole, instead of on specific body parts - and if they do focus on specific body parts, it's due to that Asari's individual tastes - because they haven't had a society and culture that teaches them some body parts are unique and special, because everyone on their planet shares the same body parts.[/quote]
[quote]
Because that's how same-sex human couples are, right? It's a little glib but, again, there's no direct causality. Human bits are special, because they are special. Nudity taboos and their psychological effects are a different matter.[/quote]

Same sex human couples - you have to keep in mind - don't exist in a vacuum. They still exist and live in a society that very clearly shows differences between males/females with a particular focus on genitals as special and unique.

Asari wouldn't have this.

[quote]This also wouldn't mean they can't have sex for pleasure, but that when they do, they would also likely focus on whatever acts cause the most pleasure, and once again would likely focus on the entire body of their partner - especially since they can use mind melding to enhance the intensity.[/quote]
[quote]
Leaving aside melding (I suspect we have different ideas about it), don't humans also focus on the acts that cause the most pleasure?[/quote]

Well, yes, but we have a particular focus on the genitals above all else. I'm not sure Asari would have this kind of particular focus.

[quote]As far as their culture, this would also explain why in comparison to other races and again, especially humanity, they seem to be so much more sexually open, because they come from a society that that simply wasn't really a thing, so there was also no stigma of shame attached to it, and then they found other races would appreciate them for their looks, so they could easily use that to their advantage - which is why a lot become dancers, and Aria even mentions Asari withholding sex to get some other people to do what they wanted them to do.[/quote]
[quote]
There're many human cultures where there's no stigma to sexual openness. Plus they've got a couple thousand years of cultural evolution over us.

I mean, hell, think back even 50 years of human sexuality.[/quote]

Sure, and how does that disprove anything I'm asserting for the Asari?

[quote][quote]The reason I'm posting this is to see if anyone disagrees - he's pretty much convinced me that most of this makes sense, but considering the amount of detail some people here have put into thinking about the Asari - like that Asari physiological "study" that was posted a while ago - I figure someone here might have something interesting to add, whether or not they agree or disagree. It took me a while to even really grasp what he was trying to argue, because the concept of "no sexuality concept" is pretty, well, alien, but once I started to understand it seemed pretty interesting and yet another way that would have the Asari culture stand out as particularly alien and different from humanity.
[/quote]
As the author…I mean as the distributor of said study*, I can say that this is an interesting idea.

There's nothing that's invalid or false about it so it would work perfectly well as a basis for writing. On the other hand, it's as purely conjucture as my take is

To make it slightly more compelling, trying to trace the evolution of their society through some keystones might work.


* I actually put it up on FFN now, by the by: http://www.fanfictio...sari_for_Humans
[/quote]

Of course I realize this is a lot of ***SPECULATION*** but it seems to make sense to me. I'm not seeing a lot that says it's *wrong*. It seems really logical and seems to mesh well with the Asari, to me. Of course there's nothing absolutely proving this as right above anything else that could also make sense...it's just that it *does* make sense.

[Akernis]

rubynorman wrote...

m.fanfiction.net/s/5789390/6/
There was one scene in this particular story that really didn't sit well with me, I just couldn't imagine Shepard doing what she did at that point. I'm talking about was how harsh her reaction to Liara's outburst on the Normandy was. Even given how estranged the two had seemingly become, even though Liara loses control and slams Shepard with biotics, even with all the frustration and guilt Shepard is feeling over what she thinks she's made Liara become, even if she subconsciously wants to push Liara away to stop her from continuing down that dark path... even with all that, I just can't see Shepard reacting so harshly and cruelly. Especially allowing some random Cerberus crewmen to beat her up, then just having her locked up and giving up on her... just, no.
I doubt I could have continued reading through to the end of that scene and beyond, if I hadn't peeked forward to the last chapter and seen that they had apparently managed to overcome that tragic episode. I suppose it does probably make the eventual reconciliation and rejoining that much more powerful, so I guess it's not entirely without purpose. Still, painful to read through.

What the hell is that?
How can one even think up something like this

Modifié par Akernis, 02 mai 2012 - 10:36 .

[The Lightspeaker]

Aristobulus500 wrote...

So, I was talking to a friend of mine the other day - discussion started cause I linked him this picture actually http://i.imgur.com/E1xkA.png - and he argued with me about the subject of whether or not Asari would have a concept of sexuality.

*snip*

I honestly don't get how this friend of yours has made the jump from "they're monogendered" to "they must therefore have no concept of sexuality". All of this stuff about nudity taboos and attraction and all that are equally valid regardless of whether or not asari do or do not inherently have a concept of sexuality. They don't actually support this view.

More to the point biologically it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. In every single species animals are attracted to what are perceived as desirable traits by the individual, whatever those traits might be. The whole argument just disgards some of the most fundamental concepts in biology. Sexual attraction doesn't exist in a vacuum, it is directly related to procreation.

Well, yes, but we have a particular focus on the genitals above
all else. I'm not sure Asari would have this kind of particular focus.

If it is related to intercourse and procreation it is still sexual attraction, whatever features they focus on.

[rgretret]

The've got a new Liara hate thread out there.
I think I prefer to stay here reading some posts of people who actually like Liara. ^^

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Akernis wrote...

rubynorman wrote...

m.fanfiction.net/s/5789390/6/
There was one scene in this particular story that really didn't sit well with me, I just couldn't imagine Shepard doing what she did at that point. I'm talking about was how harsh her reaction to Liara's outburst on the Normandy was. Even given how estranged the two had seemingly become, even though Liara loses control and slams Shepard with biotics, even with all the frustration and guilt Shepard is feeling over what she thinks she's made Liara become, even if she subconsciously wants to push Liara away to stop her from continuing down that dark path... even with all that, I just can't see Shepard reacting so harshly and cruelly. Especially allowing some random Cerberus crewmen to beat her up, then just having her locked up and giving up on her... just, no.
I doubt I could have continued reading through to the end of that scene and beyond, if I hadn't peeked forward to the last chapter and seen that they had apparently managed to overcome that tragic episode. I suppose it does probably make the eventual reconciliation and rejoining that much more powerful, so I guess it's not entirely without purpose. Still, painful to read through.

What the hell is that?
How can one even think up something like this

Kane Lam's stories were pretty dark, but he wrote some really powerful stuff. Alot of my current fanfic is inspired by one of his in fact.

As stated the fic was written before LOTSB was released. So there alot of Liara's character and future was open for interpretation, I guess he had a more dark view in things.

[AlexMBrennan]

You're kinda assuming that there is no other life on Thessia... I'm pretty sure that they'd figure out how things work shortly after discovering animal husbandry and medicine.

Modifié par AlexMBrennan, 02 mai 2012 - 11:14 .

[coatsworth]

rgretret wrote...

The've got a new Liara hate thread out there.
I think I prefer to stay here reading some posts of people who actually like Liara. ^^

Whats to hate? 
She is motivated, smart, determined, sexy and BLUE<3.