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[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Dude on Fire wrote...

*Throws up at the sight of Tali*

Don't be so sensitive.

[Tyranniac]

Dude on Fire wrote...

*Throws up at the sight of Tali*

That's... a bit rude, isn't it?

[Dude on Fire]

Tyranniac wrote...

Dude on Fire wrote...

*Throws up at the sight of Tali*

That's... a bit rude, isn't it?

What? Am I the only one who um... *drops smokebomb*

[Ecrulis]

Good morning thread

[lillitheris]

I’d totally add the Liara and BLUE CHILDREN banner, but I already feel like half the people on BSN don’t read my posts. I can’t risk the other half just staring at Li instead of reading too

And no hating Mei Mei, she’s awesome. Her thread is evil, but it’s not her fault :happy:

Modifié par lillitheris, 05 mai 2012 - 02:46 .

[Tyranniac]

Ecrulis wrote...

Good morning thread

Good afternoon!

[Mad-Hamlet]

lillitheris wrote...

I’d totally add the Liara and BLUE CHILDREN banner, but I already feel like half the people don’t read what I write. I can’t risk the other half just staring at Li instead of reading too

And no hating Mei Mei, she’s awesome. Her thread is evil, but it’s not her fault :happy:

Oh I read your work. I've not said anything because I've not made up my mind yet. 
I need more input

Tell you what, you read my old work and tell me what you think and I'll re-read yours and give you a thorough critique. I'll probably do that anyway but never say you'll do something for free and I realize I shouldn't have said that. Oh well.

[lillitheris]

Mad-Hamlet wrote...

Oh I read your work. I've not said anything because I've not made up my mind yet. 
I need more input

Tell you what, you read my old work and tell me what you think and I'll re-read yours and give you a thorough critique. I'll probably do that anyway but never say you'll do something for free and I realize I shouldn't have said that. Oh well.

I added ‘clarification’ to my comment above :happy: I meant BSN posts and the detrimental effect an awesome Liara at the bottom would have on people’s attention.

“Hey, my texts are up here!” and so on :happy:

But, I shall hunt your works down and pounce.

[MidnightRaith]

Erenbe wrote...

WaterWar wrote...
Wherether or not krogans are natural biotics I would suspect them to NOT be. In my understanding the also natural biotics are the asari. Tuchunka doesn't have any major eezo sources as far as I remember and therefore the krogran wouldn't have been exposed to it in the same way the asari have been on Thessia.

Maybe natural biotics is the wrong word to use here. How about mutations? The majority of all krogans doesn't seem to be biotics users but there are cases of krogans being able to utilize it and whenever these few cases are mentioned there is no mentioning of any implants whatsoever. 

As far as I understood implants they don't work like "hey put this in and you can use biotics" but like "oh you have some small ability for biotics..here take this to really use it". Kaidan and other human biotics in ME1 were singled out because of their ingrained ability to use biotics....I think the implants helped them to really use it and control it.

*snip*

Implants work because a biotic's nervous system is riddled with Element Zero nodules and their purpose is to simply make them work in unison. Biotics already have all the potential and power to use their abilities. The only reason the implants allow the biotics to be more "powerful" is because some classes of implants allow for more synchronization of the nodes than others. For instance, I'd imagine that the L2 implants forced this synchronization. This would allow the biotic more control and power, but since it's less... natural, then it would result in the side affects. The L3s were probably more conservative and allowed less synchronization, but were ultimately more effective because of the lack of side affects. Learning more about how the nodes are scattered about in our nervous systems presumably permitted the creation of more streamlined, efficient and natural synchronization, thus the creation of the L4 and 5 series.

So, it's not really a "small ability for biotics" that determine the effectiveness of an individual. Yeah, some biotics probably have more nodes than others, however, it is more of the fact that the individual even have nodes to begin with that makes them qualify for an implant, after that it then falls on what kind of implant it is and their own discipline that make more powerful biotics. (Based off of Liara stating that all asari are able to use biotics, but not all are inclined to train their powers.)

Following this, asari don't need implants because they are naturally able to synchronize their nodes independently. This presumably comes from the combination of the Protheans' interference and as they evolved the ability to meld as a form of reproduction. The meld is, in itself, a biotic talent and requires the individual to have their Eezo nodes act in unison to be successful.

Since the Krogan don't have to rely on biotics to survive as a species, I'd imagine that their talents are mutations and that they do need implants to actually use them. The entire reason implants are necessary is because the species in question has not evolved a way for them to consciously have their nodes act in unison, which would presumably require a biological development with the brain across several generations. Perhaps the source of Eezo necessary for biotic development came from ships crashing to the planet during the Krogan Rebellions. Don't know if that happened, though, I can't remember if the Krogan ever had any sort of "navy."

The above is based on the Codex for ME1, what I've heard in game and my own inferences.

[Tyranniac]

MidnightRaith wrote...

Implants work because a biotic's nervous system is riddled with Element Zero nodules and their purpose is to simply make them work in unison. Biotics already have all the potential and power to use their abilities. The only reason the implants allow the biotics to be more "powerful" is because some classes of implants allow for more synchronization of the nodes than others. For instance, I'd imagine that the L2 implants forced this synchronization. This would allow the biotic more control and power, but since it's less... natural, then it would result in the side affects. The L3s were probably more conservative and allowed less synchronization, but were ultimately more effective because of the lack of side affects. Learning more about how the nodes are scattered about in our nervous systems presumably permitted the creation of more streamlined, efficient and natural synchronization, thus the creation of the L4 and 5 series.

So, it's not really a "small ability for biotics" that determine the effectiveness of an individual. Yeah, some biotics probably have more nodes than others, however, it is more of the fact that the individual even have nodes to begin with that makes them qualify for an implant, after that it then falls on what kind of implant it is and their own discipline that make more powerful biotics. (Based off of Liara stating that all asari are able to use biotics, but not all are inclined to train their powers.)

Following this, asari don't need implants because they are naturally able to synchronize their nodes independently. This presumably comes from the combination of the Protheans' interference and as they evolved the ability to meld as a form of reproduction. The meld is, in itself, a biotic talent and requires the individual to have their Eezo nodes act in unison to be successful.

Since the Krogan don't have to rely on biotics to survive as a species, I'd imagine that their talents are mutations and that they do need implants to actually use them. The entire reason implants are necessary is because the species in question has not evolved a way for them to consciously have their nodes act in unison, which would presumably require a biological development with the brain across several generations. Perhaps the source of Eezo necessary for biotic development came from ships crashing to the planet during the Krogan Rebellions. Don't know if that happened, though, I can't remember if the Krogan ever had any sort of "navy."

The above is based on the Codex for ME1, what I've heard in game and my own inferences.

The problem with what you're saying here is that biotic amps need implants to plug in to, and we know amps help biotics to use some of their abilities more efficently, depending on what kind of amps are used. I agree that asari don't need implants, but it is clear that many still use them to enhance their powers.

[lillitheris]

Implants are amplifiers. #4true #checkthewiki

Quoth from previous page.

lillitheris wrote...

‘Implant’ is an internal amplifier. It may or may not have an augment port that is accessible externally. The ‘amp’ upgrades are  external amplifier augmentations, and are connected through the augment port. There are also internal versions of the external augmentations.

[Aristobulus500]

So, if I'm getting this right, humans NEED amplifiers to use biotics. And implants can be those amplifiers. There are internal and external amplifiers, if you use external you need an implant to connect it to - if you use an internal, then it itself is the implant.

Asari do not need amplifiers, but they can choose to use them. They can use some biotics without amplifiers.

Shepard and Kaidan use internal amplifiers.

But what does this mean for characters like Liara and Samara? Do they use amplifiers, and thus have implants of some kind?

It's a bit weird and I don't know the answer to that, because Kaidan constantly talks about the negative drawbacks to implants and you never see one of the Asari complaining about it. But if they don't use it, wouldn't that mean their biotics are not as strong as they could be?

[Tyranniac]

lillitheris wrote...

Implants are amplifiers. #4true #checkthewiki

Quoth from previous page.

lillitheris wrote...

‘Implant’ is an internal amplifier. It may or may not have an augment port that is accessible externally. The ‘amp’ upgrades are  external amplifier augmentations, and are connected through the augment port. There are also internal versions of the external augmentations.

I see, didn't know that, but it doesn't negate what I said.

Aristobulus500 wrote...

So, if I'm getting this right, humans NEED amplifiers to use biotics. And implants can be those amplifiers. There are internal and external amplifiers, if you use external you need an implant to connect it to - if you use an internal, then it itself is the implant.

Asari do not need amplifiers, but they can choose to use them. They can use some biotics without amplifiers.

Shepard and Kaidan use internal amplifiers.

But what does this mean for characters like Liara and Samara? Do they use amplifiers, and thus have implants of some kind?

It's a bit weird and I don't know the answer to that, because Kaidan constantly talks about the negative drawbacks to implants and you never see one of the Asari complaining about it. But if they don't use it, wouldn't that mean their biotics are not as strong as they could be?

 

What you said is correct, and the reason Kaidan complains is because he has L2 implants, an early, human-made model that is flawed.

Modifié par Tyranniac, 05 mai 2012 - 03:22 .

[DarkCloudd]

Dude on Fire wrote...

Tyranniac wrote...

Dude on Fire wrote...

*Throws up at the sight of Tali*

That's... a bit rude, isn't it?

What? Am I the only one who um... *drops smokebomb*

I'm using Tali because this is my insanity playthrough and I need her for her hacking and eletronics skills since my Shep is a plain old soldier. That and I really have no problem with any character in any of the ME universe. They all have their strengths and weaknesses.

[Dude on Fire]

Once again, apologies for being too impulsive.

[PMC65]

DarkCloudd wrote...

Dude on Fire wrote...

Tyranniac wrote...

Dude on Fire wrote...

*Throws up at the sight of Tali*

That's... a bit rude, isn't it?

What? Am I the only one who um... *drops smokebomb*

I'm using Tali because this is my insanity playthrough and I need her for her hacking and eletronics skills since my Shep is a plain old soldier. That and I really have no problem with any character in any of the ME universe. They all have their strengths and weaknesses.

[Dude on Fire]

I die with pride! May the Talimancers all bu- *gets shot*

[MidnightRaith]

Tyranniac wrote...

The problem with what you're saying here is that biotic amps need implants to plug in to, and we know amps help biotics to use some of their abilities more efficently, depending on what kind of amps are used. I agree that asari don't need implants, but it is clear that many still use them to enhance their powers.

The way I see it, amps are sort of like upgrades to the initial implant. The implant allows for the synchronization of nodes so an individual can even use biotics. However, that doesn't mean that the implants are at their optimal level. Sort of like an interaction between hardware and software. You can upgrade software by overwriting it. However hardware requires you to replace it physically. Just look at what the amps actually do in ME1. They affect Power, Duration and Cooldowns. Things that I'd imagine the implants already do. So, perhaps amps simply have the nodes for biotic users act in an order that seems to boost these attributes. The amp itself doesn't cause the cooldown speed to decrease. It is an ability that the user is already capable of, just not conscious of the nodes that actually affect this. The amp overwrites the what the implant would do and the implant synchronizes the nodes that affect whatever it is you are trying to do.

While the asari don't need implants to use biotics, the question is, do they need the amps to affect only one or two aspects of their abilities? Can they consciously synchronize the nodes into specializing in a certain way? We don't know just how much the asari's brain has evolved in order to control their biotics. I think that while they can instinctively use their talents, they may not be as efficient as they could be. In order to keep up with other species that can essentially upgrade their abilities to adapt to the battlefield, the asari are probably outfitted with implants anyway just so they can have access to amps. Or, they have their own unique setup that still allows them to use amps.

Considering that one can't simply rip out the implant to gain a better one, amps provide a way to upgrade the individual's nodule synchronization to the level they desire. Fine tuning, I suppose, without the brain damage. Of course, someone with a superior implant will nearly always be more powerful and efficient, however amps are probably a way to decrease the gap.

[rubynorman]

Tali is fine. She is Liara's good friend. After Thessia mission, she really cares about Liara. It's just some of her fans not all of them and it's not her fault. My friend is a fan of Tali. She and I often talk about ME. We send each other hilarious pictures/vids about Liara or Tali all the times.

[PMC65]

Dude on Fire wrote...

I die with pride! May the Talimancers all bu- *gets shot*

*drags Dude on Fire's body of the Liara Fans thread and down the Liaramancer's pit*

Priest: We are here to say goodbye to misguided ... (looks down pit) ...

Liara: She really killed him?

Piers: Yep.

Liara: But I thought you were just going to scare him.

Tali: He was a bosh'tet!

Liara:

[Tyranniac]

MidnightRaith wrote...

Tyranniac wrote...

The problem with what you're saying here is that biotic amps need implants to plug in to, and we know amps help biotics to use some of their abilities more efficently, depending on what kind of amps are used. I agree that asari don't need implants, but it is clear that many still use them to enhance their powers.

The way I see it, amps are sort of like upgrades to the initial implant. The implant allows for the synchronization of nodes so an individual can even use biotics. However, that doesn't mean that the implants are at their optimal level. Sort of like an interaction between hardware and software. You can upgrade software by overwriting it. However hardware requires you to replace it physically. Just look at what the amps actually do in ME1. They affect Power, Duration and Cooldowns. Things that I'd imagine the implants already do. So, perhaps amps simply have the nodes for biotic users act in an order that seems to boost these attributes. The amp itself doesn't cause the cooldown speed to decrease. It is an ability that the user is already capable of, just not conscious of the nodes that actually affect this. The amp overwrites the what the implant would do and the implant synchronizes the nodes that affect whatever it is you are trying to do.

While the asari don't need implants to use biotics, the question is, do they need the amps to affect only one or two aspects of their abilities? Can they consciously synchronize the nodes into specializing in a certain way? We don't know just how much the asari's brain has evolved in order to control their biotics. I think that while they can instinctively use their talents, they may not be as efficient as they could be. In order to keep up with other species that can essentially upgrade their abilities to adapt to the battlefield, the asari are probably outfitted with implants anyway just so they can have access to amps. Or, they have their own unique setup that still allows them to use amps.

Considering that one can't simply rip out the implant to gain a better one, amps provide a way to upgrade the individual's nodule synchronization to the level they desire. Fine tuning, I suppose, without the brain damage. Of course, someone with a superior implant will nearly always be more powerful and efficient, however amps are probably a way to decrease the gap.

Ah, yes, I agree with all of this.

Edit:

Why would anyone not like Tali? I like all Mass Effect characters except two (Shouldn't be too hard to figure out which ones...)

Modifié par Tyranniac, 05 mai 2012 - 04:08 .

[Dude on Fire]

PMC65 wrote...

Dude on Fire wrote...

I die with pride! May the Talimancers all bu- *gets shot*

*drags Dude on Fire's body of the Liara Fans thread and down the Liaramancer's pit*

Priest: We are here to say goodbye to misguided ... (looks down pit) ...

Liara: She really killed him?

Piers: Yep.

Liara: But I thought you were just going to scare him.

Tali: He was a bosh'tet!

Liara:

AHA!! Fools, that was but an advanced VI, simulating the outcome of me declaring my thoughts on Tali. You cannot kill me, unless the game suddenly goes into slowmotion for some reason, and I become significantly easier to shoot!

[Erenbe]

Dude on Fire wrote...

PMC65 wrote...

Dude on Fire wrote...

I die with pride! May the Talimancers all bu- *gets shot*

*drags Dude on Fire's body of the Liara Fans thread and down the Liaramancer's pit*

Priest: We are here to say goodbye to misguided ... (looks down pit) ...

Liara: She really killed him?

Piers: Yep.

Liara: But I thought you were just going to scare him.

Tali: He was a bosh'tet!

Liara:

*snipedidip*

AHA!! Fools, that was but an advanced VI, simulating the outcome of me declaring my thoughts on Tali. You cannot kill me, unless the game suddenly goes into slowmotion for some reason, and I become significantly easier to shoot!

-slow mo initiation in 3 seconds-
*starts moving the speed crank*
:innocent:

Modifié par Erenbe, 05 mai 2012 - 04:32 .

[Dude on Fire]

Seriously though, lolz aside. In my honest opinion, I do not find Tali to be such an amazing character. kthxbai?

[DarkCloudd]

Tyranniac wrote...

MidnightRaith wrote...

Tyranniac wrote...

*snip*

*snip*

Edit:

Why would anyone not like Tali? I like all Mass Effect characters except two (Shouldn't be too hard to figure out which ones...)

Starbrat and Harbinger or Hudson and Walter?