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[Aristobulus500]

MidnightRaith wrote...

Devil's Advocate here, but what if Shepard is looking for a reason to live through the Suicide Mission? Purposely withholding the SB information not out of any intention to be cruel to Liara but to make sure he/she will try their damnedest to get out of the Collector Base alive in order to reconcile with their true love. Shepard has a pretty strong will to live in any situation, yes, but what if the angst and separation was getting to him/her?

What? That doesn't make sense. If Shepard just wanted to give himself something to come back to, why not go reconcile things with Liara so that, you know, he has Liara to come to for sure, instead "wel maybe we'll get back together maybe not" the way things are before LotSB.

[MidnightRaith]

Aristobulus500 wrote...

MidnightRaith wrote...

Devil's Advocate here, but what if Shepard is looking for a reason to live through the Suicide Mission? Purposely withholding the SB information not out of any intention to be cruel to Liara but to make sure he/she will try their damnedest to get out of the Collector Base alive in order to reconcile with their true love. Shepard has a pretty strong will to live in any situation, yes, but what if the angst and separation was getting to him/her?

What? That doesn't make sense. If Shepard just wanted to give himself something to come back to, why not go reconcile things with Liara so that, you know, he has Liara to come to for sure, instead "wel maybe we'll get back together maybe not" the way things are before LotSB.

I think you're looking at this in hindsight. Shepard doesn't know how things will go if he/she gives Liara the SB info. In all likelihood, it could go from "maybe, maybe not" to finding out that Liara is interested in Feron, finding out that she doesn't want to continue the relationship with you after all the time that's passed, or they could get back together. Shepard could easily fear that the SB info could force their relationship into something that he/she doesn't want. Especially if you believe that Shepard was more affected by the dismal Illium meeting than was outlined by the game. However, the possibility of reconciliation is there and that could be a powerful motivation in any case.

[Aristobulus500]

MidnightRaith wrote...

I think you're looking at this in hindsight. Shepard doesn't know how things will go if he/she gives Liara the SB info. In all likelihood, it could go from "maybe, maybe not" to finding out that Liara is interested in Feron, finding out that she doesn't want to continue the relationship with you after all the time that's passed, or they could get back together. Shepard could easily fear that the SB info could force their relationship into something that he/she doesn't want. Especially if you believe that Shepard was more affected by the dismal Illium meeting than was outlined by the game. However, the possibility of reconciliation is there and that could be a powerful motivation in any case.

Perhaps, but I still think it just makes Shepard seem really selfish. How do you think Liara would react if she found out Shepard withheld that info from her for so long?

[PMC65]

MidnightRaith wrote...

Devil's Advocate here, but what if Shepard is looking for a reason to live through the Suicide Mission? Purposely withholding the SB information not out of any intention to be cruel to Liara but to make sure he/she will try their damnedest to get out of the Collector Base alive in order to reconcile with their true love. Shepard has a pretty strong will to live in any situation, yes, but what if the angst and separation was getting to him/her?

Or you could role play that Shepard feels the information is a little sketchy so she holds on to it until she can be there with Liara ... Knowing that once she gives the info to Liara the stubborn asari won't sit still with it.

EW Shepard would focus on the Collector's first and foremost since they are tied to the reapers somehow. Liara and her mission would not be on her radar until after her mission was complete. So she held on to the info until she could make sure that Liara did not walk into a trap.

There are tons of ways people can RP it ... Not all Shepards with Liara put her needs over stopping the reapers ... and this is Liara's attitude as well. She does not join Shepard because she is focused on the SB ... she does not visit Shepard on Earth because she is focused on the catalyst on Mars.

In my head canon neither goes ga ga in love forgetting what their duties/missions are. They are very independent characters and that is one of the things that I love about them.

To each his own ... and if that makes me a non Liaramancer because I can see withholding that information ... so be it. I've been called worse!   

[MidnightRaith]

Aristobulus500 wrote...

Perhaps, but I still think it just makes Shepard seem really selfish. How do you think Liara would react if she found out Shepard withheld that info from her for so long?

Liara and Shepard's relationship is less than optimal at this point. Yes, this would make Shepard pretty selfish, but you have to remember that Liara is pretty inconsiderate of Shepard's feelings as well. Neither seem willing to understand what the other feels about Shepard's death. On one hand, you have Liara that has struggled to put her life back together after mourning for Shepard for two years. She is not going to want to just jump back into the relationship just because Shepard shows up at her door one day. Perhaps she may think that Shepard is being insensitive with her feelings.

However, then you have Shepard. He/she has just found out that they have been dead for the past two years. The cause you died for is not being investigated, people think you are a traitor and no one seems willing to understand that you're struggling to catch up with galactic events. Really, Shepard's life at this point is a mess and it seems very reasonable that he/she is going to look to Liara for some familiarity. After all, Liara would be safe, she's someone Shepard would feel he/she knows without a shadow of a doubt. Liara would relate to Shepard, right? Only, she's not, she isn't and she doesn't.

I like that LofSB doesn't even go into the possibilty that Shepard may have sat on the SB info. It shows that it doesn't really matter. What each thought of the situation and how the reacted is more so. I don't believe for a second that after the fade to black screen they just have sex. They already spoke about how Liara felt about Shepard's death during the mission and during the date. Who's to say that they didn't go into Shepard's feelings before she left? The main problem with their relationship in ME2 is a severe lack of communication. After they plough through it all, I don't think Liara would be too upset with Shepard for fearing the SB information. Especially if Shepard either hints or touches on how messed up he/she felt over the past few months. Forgiveness would be very critical to their relationship at this point.

PMC65 wrote...

Or you could role play that Shepard feels the information is a little sketchy so she holds on to it until she can be there with Liara ... Knowing that once she gives the info to Liara the stubborn asari won't sit still with it.

EW Shepard would focus on the Collector's first and foremost since they are tied to the reapers somehow. Liara and her mission would not be on her radar until after her mission was complete. So she held on to the info until she could make sure that Liara did not walk into a trap.

There are tons of ways people can RP it ... Not all Shepards with Liara put her needs over stopping the reapers ... and this is Liara's attitude as well. She does not join Shepard because she is focused on the SB ... she does not visit Shepard on Earth because she is focused on the catalyst on Mars.

In my head canon neither goes ga ga in love forgetting what their duties/missions are. They are very independent characters and that is one of the things that I love about them.

To each his own ... and if that makes me a non Liaramancer because I can see withholding that information ... so be it. I've been called worse!   

You make a good point and I think it is a facet to what I outlined above. Both are very driven people and would consider their individual missions extremely important. Especially since that Liara considers her vendetta against the SB as a penance and Shepard's Collector mission is the only thing really organizing his or her life at this point. Shepard is, of course, also concerned about the galaxy's welfare and fate of humanity....

[lillitheris]

PMC65 wrote...

Or you could role play that Shepard feels the information is a little sketchy so she holds on to it until she can be there with Liara ... Knowing that once she gives the info to Liara the stubborn asari won't sit still with it.

EW Shepard would focus on the Collector's first and foremost since they are tied to the reapers somehow. Liara and her mission would not be on her radar until after her mission was complete. So she held on to the info until she could make sure that Liara did not walk into a trap.

I can see that, but having that situation just unresolved is a real drain on the psyche, especially if you take the RP view that you’re not going to the IFF immediately because of [some reason] and essentially have free time to do other stuff. Heck, a significant portion of the game goes to resolve other people’s unfinished business so that they’re 100% there.

Again, you can do it, certainly. Or maybe a renegade would get really angry with Liara, and withhold it because of that. Etc.

There are tons of ways people can RP it ... Not all Shepards with Liara put her needs over stopping the reapers ... and this is Liara's attitude as well. She does not join Shepard because she is focused on the SB ... she does not visit Shepard on Earth because she is focused on the catalyst on Mars.

She doesn’t visit Shepard on Earth because Shepard is in military detention without visitation.

There’s two moving parts here…I’m fine delaying the SB side of things, but in that case, I think the intermediary resolution would be necessary.

So rather than the weird brush-off, if they take a moment to agree that they both want to try to reconcile, but it’ll have to wait because they both have aforementioned important missions, that can work.

Modifié par lillitheris, 07 mai 2012 - 05:45 .

[PMC65]

lillitheris wrote...

PMC65 wrote...

Or you could role play that Shepard feels the information is a little sketchy so she holds on to it until she can be there with Liara ... Knowing that once she gives the info to Liara the stubborn asari won't sit still with it.

EW Shepard would focus on the Collector's first and foremost since they are tied to the reapers somehow. Liara and her mission would not be on her radar until after her mission was complete. So she held on to the info until she could make sure that Liara did not walk into a trap.

I can see that, but having that situation just unresolved is a real drain on the psyche, especially if you take the RP view that you’re not going to the IFF immediately because of [some reason] and essentially have free time to do other stuff. Heck, a significant portion of the game goes to resolve other people’s unfinished business so that they’re 100% there.

Again, you can do it, certainly. Or maybe a renegade would get really angry with Liara, and withhold it because of that. Etc.

There are tons of ways people can RP it ... Not all Shepards with Liara put her needs over stopping the reapers ... and this is Liara's attitude as well. She does not join Shepard because she is focused on the SB ... she does not visit Shepard on Earth because she is focused on the catalyst on Mars.

She doesn’t visit Shepard on Earth because Shepard is in military detention without visitation.

There’s two moving parts here…I’m fine delaying the SB side of things, but in that case, I think the intermediary resolution would be necessary.

So rather than the weird brush-off, if they take a moment to agree that they both want to try to reconcile, but it’ll have to wait because they both have aforementioned important missions, that can work.

Liara could have visited Shepard but chose not to ... she even apologizes for not visiting. Poor Shepard is pretty much left alone no matter who (s)he romances. Each for their own reasons. Poor, poor Shepard.

I could see Shepard helping those in her crew so that they are focused on the mission ... Liara can wait in my book. And she does. Poor kid. 

But there is no right or wrong ... its all up to the player on how they want to role play their Shepard & Liara story. I have no problem if you do the LotSB first, middle or last ... I've tried it different ways and I prefer waiting until after the SM. It's your sandbox. Create away! OPA!

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

MidnightRaith wrote...

Aristobulus500 wrote...

MidnightRaith wrote...

Devil's
Advocate here, but what if Shepard is looking for a reason to live
through the Suicide Mission? Purposely withholding the SB information
not out of any intention to be cruel to Liara but to make sure he/she
will try their damnedest to get out of the Collector Base alive in order
to reconcile with their true love. Shepard has a pretty strong will to
live in any situation, yes, but what if the angst and separation was
getting to him/her?

What? That doesn't make sense. If
Shepard just wanted to give himself something to come back to, why not
go reconcile things with Liara so that, you know, he has Liara to come to for sure, instead "wel maybe we'll get back together maybe not" the way things are before LotSB.

I
think you're looking at this in hindsight. Shepard doesn't know how
things will go if he/she gives Liara the SB info. In all likelihood, it
could go from "maybe, maybe not" to finding out that Liara is interested
in Feron, finding out that she doesn't want to continue the
relationship with you after all the time that's passed, or they could
get back together. Shepard could easily fear that the SB info could
force their relationship into something that he/she doesn't want.
Especially if you believe that Shepard was more affected by the dismal
Illium meeting than was outlined by the game. However, the possibility
of reconciliation is there and that could be a powerful motivation in
any case.

So Shepard withholdes the information so he
have something to come back to, but he does not give the information
ASAP because he is afraid that it will break what little they have left?
Does not make much sense to me since Shepard would no matter what be
filled with doubt then, and atleast he if sorts out the whole ordeal
with the SB he can actually gain some closure.

PMC65 wrote...
Or you could role play that Shepard feels the information is a little sketchy so she holds on to it until she can be there with Liara ... Knowing that once she gives the info to Liara the stubborn asari won't sit still with it.

EW Shepard would focus on the Collector's first and foremost since they are tied to the reapers somehow. Liara and her mission would not be on her radar until after her mission was complete. So she held on to the info until she could make sure that Liara did not walk into a trap.

There are tons of ways people can RP it ... Not all Shepards with Liara put her needs over stopping the reapers ... and this is Liara's attitude as well. She does not join Shepard because she is focused on the SB ... she does not visit Shepard on Earth because she is focused on the catalyst on Mars.

In my head canon neither goes ga ga in love forgetting what their duties/missions are. They are very independent characters and that is one of the things that I love about them.

To each his own ... and if that makes me a non Liaramancer because I can see withholding that information ... so be it. I've been called worse!  

But Shepard spends most of his time doing things that are not directly related to the Collectors in ME2. And with the SB you have someone directly related to the Collectors meaning that you could potentially learn something valuable.

[MidnightRaith]

Lizardviking wrote...

So Shepard withholdes the information so he
have something to come back to, but he does not give the information
ASAP because he is afraid that it will break what little they have left?
Does not make much sense to me since Shepard would no matter what be
filled with doubt then, and atleast he if sorts out the whole ordeal
with the SB he can actually gain some closure.

Your version of events assumes that doubt occurs in the absence of hope. Like I said, Shepard does not know what would happen if he/she gave the SB information to Liara. The closure that could occur may be devastating to Shepard if Liara chose to either dump him/her for Feron (if she had been interested in him) or chose to end the relationship because she didn't want to reopen all the feelings she packed away after mourning. What would happen to Shepard's morale if either of the above happened? Shepard could easily speculate that these are a possibility.

He/she may even think that they are unable to give Liara the attention she deserves because of the Collectors hovering over Shepard's head and thus would be unable to properly resolve their issues and make their reconciliation more difficult than if Shepard waited until the mission was complete. Fear can be a powerful deterrent especially if this fear is involved with something precious to Shepard and their relationship issues aren't something Shepard can shoot.

However, Shepard is still able to hope that they could fix their relationship as well. Doubt would exist but so would the hope and hope can be just as powerful as fear. It all depends on how Shepard would view the risks and rewards involved in immediately giving out the information to Liara and that depends on how you RP your Shepard. 

EDIT: I'm going to get some sleep before I continue this discussion. It's a great one, but I don't think I'm at my sharpest at three in the morning....

Modifié par MidnightRaith, 07 mai 2012 - 07:57 .

[Tyranniac]

PMC65 wrote...

But there is no right or wrong ... its all up to the player on how they want to role play their Shepard & Liara story. I have no problem if you do the LotSB first, middle or last ... I've tried it different ways and I prefer waiting until after the SM. It's your sandbox. Create away! OPA!

Can... can I do it in ME1? ...please?

[AlexMBrennan]

But there is no right or wrong ... its all up to the player on how they want to role play their Shepard & Liara story.

Well, no. There's a wrong way - not giving Liara the intel she's been looking for for two years before going on the suicide mission makes no sense.
Telling Liara that Shepard would meet her at her apartment, and going on a suicide mission before actually going there, makes no sense either.

[FRANCESCO84Inn]

Good morning Liara Fans,

i finish 2 days ago ME2 again, whit another Famale Shepard,

and i invite Liara in my cabin after the Suicide Mission,

for me its most amazing the dialogue after the Collector Base.

[EsterCloat]

I'm gonna be honest, this was never a problem for me since my main save was finished long before LotSB came out so all of it was done post-SM. Never realized the RP problem with having the mail arrive earlier.

After thinking about it for a bit, I've come up with a shaky reasoning for holding off LotSB until post-SM. It might have been a case of putting it off until it was too late. See, my Shepard after getting the information would realize that after giving it to her there was a real chance of Liara assaulting the Broker and moving in to god knows what base or fortress or army the Broker would have protecting him. Thus, my Shepard would be set that when he gives her the information, he would follow her wherever it took them.

The thing is, he has the missions of the crew and the Collectors hanging over his head. My Shepard loves Liara but he cares about his crew and their problems are still important. Nothing will happen to Liara while she doesn't know about the data, since apparently she's doing quite well for herself and presumably isn't making sieges or whatever, but the problems of the crew members need to be fixed for this suicide mission to work. The second Liara gets the data she would probably run off and dive head first into attacking the Shadow Broker and Shepard couldn't be sure he'd be able go along with her with these problems and the primary mission happening at the same time.

At first it would have probably started with just thinking about putting it off for a few missions while he finds a time period when he thinks he could go with Liara without the collector mission pulling him away but as more and more members join his crew with more and more problems, it just kept being pushed back and back. Eventually, the problems of crew are mostly fixed, leaving the derelict Reaper left. Figuring finishing off that mission would finally free him up to help Liara, he moves in and that mission happens. He gets Legion and finds out about the whole Reaper virus nearing completion and he can't let that go. He goes and does that and now when he finally has time, the crew is abducted. Thus starts the SM without Shepard having been able to help Liara with LotSB.

It's pretty shaky but it's the best I could come up with on the fly. I could probably make it work better logically given some time to work out the logic paths of it happening.

Modifié par EsterCloat, 07 mai 2012 - 10:05 .

[DarkCloudd]

Argh my nostalgia meter is going through the roof, you all are determined to make me go back and play ME2 again aren't you? Curse you people and your bloody talk of the best piece of DLC I have ever played. Grrrrr why do I have to be stuck at work, I would so boot it up and play if I was home.

[FRANCESCO84Inn]

in the LotSB, i really loved the possibility to drive the taxi, dem, its amazing,

all part of this dlc is amazing, especially appointment whit Liara,
and in this dlc for the first time i'm wathc the ball stasis.

its vary strange, in ME3 not have really appointment whit Liara,

the romance not is also the last night before the last mission,

romance for me its first courtship and appointment whit your Li.

[Tyranniac]

DarkCloudd wrote...

Argh my nostalgia meter is going through the roof, you all are determined to make me go back and play ME2 again aren't you? Curse you people and your bloody talk of the best piece of DLC I have ever played. Grrrrr why do I have to be stuck at work, I would so boot it up and play if I was home.

[chevyguy87]

moreeman06 wrote...

chevyguy87 wrote...

I am a newcomer to this side of the forum and I like this quite a lot, much more peaceful then the general discussion board.

I have read some of the fan fiction linked in this thread and my god the writing behind them is just fantastic. I have noticed though that a good amount of them leave me feeling blue (pardon the pun) after reading them. But the writing is..... wow so many talented folks out there.

oh.... but that's the opposite of how Liara should make you feel.    I and Marshall have some very lighthearted and happy ones,  and Lightspeakers work really follows the narrative of the story but is generally happy 

welcome to the thread:D

Thank You I appreciate the welcome. As for the other fanfics, I haven't really had the time to sit down and really read them. Although I applaud those you write them, very good work.

[CrazyGreggy]

If I could enter this from the PoV of someone who didn't get ME1 or ME2 until long after all the DLC had been released (last August to be precise).

I always do LotSB before the SM, but after reading this thread have left the Normandy tour until after the SM to get the more flavourful conversation. Upgrades to 4 weapon types and resources/locations of resource-rich planets as well as the investment options, advanced training and research facilties are pretty huge in my opinion, so to say Liara doesn't help Shepard with the SB resources if you do LotSB pre-SM is 100% wrong imo.

As for drawing on experience of the real world release schedule, I can see how that would colour your interpretation, but I got ME1/ME2 as a package, played through vanilla once and was so engrossed I ended up paying for/downloading ALL the DLC (including, sigh, Pinnacle Station) in one afternoon. Even got a friend in the States to buy/drink (poor sod) some Dr Pepper so I could get the 3 hats. Once I'd played all the DLC with a post-SM character over the course of the next day or so (stupid work) I felt like something was wrong, like the Suicide Mission really should be the culmination, so I played the DLC once my 2nd Shepard hit 30 and the loyalty missions were done, and that felt right.

The way I see it is this. Liara openly warns Shepard that her office is under observation, that Illium is not a safe place to have an intensely sensitive conversation (and we're mainly talking SB/Collector stuff here) in response to Shepard's "tell me what's really going on". At this point Nyxeris is still around and standing right behind you as well potentially 2 Cerberus operatives (depending on who is in the party right then).

Shepard isn't stupid, being N7, Spectre, all that stuff that you only get with serious amount of grey matter. Hidden geniuses aside, how many of us are going to be that smart? Shepard gets the espionage angle IMMEDIATELY and accepts that there are some places the conversation cannot go, but yes, the heart will be pulling strongly in a direction the head knows it shouldn't. I can't reconcile the kind of lovestruck teenager behaviour that some folks seem to advocate with the character of the (wo)man we're talking about here. The mission comes first, but a few minutes wandering around Illium hacking the odd terminal isn't going to hurt. Taking days/weeks/months out to chase down a lead IS. Which is why I only do LotSB after all the other loyalty missions and after Overlord/Arrival.

Liara's had 2 years to mourn, Shepard still loves Liara with the intensity of only 4-6 weeks' elapsed time and has NOT had to mourn Liara. (S)he knows Liara still cares, the kiss shows that much, but also that Shepard's visit terrified her. How many times have any one of you really, truly believed someone who says "it's all right, I don't hate you"? To the extent that all that fear just evaporates immediately? I certainly haven't. Shepard would feel constrained to give Liara some space and time, and just be there for her. I think even a Paragon would help Liara out on the odd shady deal, just to show her that yes, the love is still there.

To quote Captain Carrot - "personal isn't the same as important". Shepard deals with other peoples stuff first, then goes to Liara with this supposedly helpful piece of info. I tend to do loyalty missions in order of objective importance, so Jack's tends to be last (dealing with leftover issues from years ago), things like Samara's, Thane's, Grunt's (all life-threatening to either the crew member or innocents caught in the crossfire) will take priority.

Shepard handles that stuff first, deals with Hackett's mission and gets a stay on the trial/surrender because the Alliance is losing ships to the Collectors and they know Shepard's their best hope, visits that strange AI project and gets his crew as ready as they possibly can be. Following that line of reasoning I end up with about 4 or 5 side-missions on random planets to do after LotSB, purely so I can trigger the upgrade terminal and save/load scum until I have all 5 guns at 6/6, the only time I really allow metagaming to colour the way I play through.

Once the crew are happy and daddy issues are sorted, Shepard indulges him/herself with a quick information delivery run to Liara in the hope that by giving her some space she'll be ready to talk about the relationship a bit more. Of course, as we know, it turns out much much more involved than that. My interpretation of the thought process Shepard would go through in LotSB.

1) The SB's only previous involvement with Shepard was providing the info that lead to Tali in ME1 and accidentally providing a squad member in Wrex. No reason to hate there.

2) The SB wanted to sell Shepards body to the Collectors. Well Shepard's now alive, has a good strong ship, crew and squad. Not much chance of that now, no need to make it personal.

3) The SB is trying to kill Liara and is holding the person who helped her save Shepard's body to allow him/her to be brought back. The SB is known to still be in league with the Collectors and, big revelation, is shown to have massive numbers of mercenaries (rather than just hiring Wrex), doesn't give a crap about civilian casualties any more (blowing up Drakon Trade Centre) and has at least one corrupted Spectre on the payroll. These facts are all revealed before you leave Illium and commit to taking the Normandy anywhere.

tldr: if you didn't get each bit of the DLC as it was released, I feel it makes sense to go loyalty missions > overlord > arrival > LotSB, finish up upgrades, gogo IFF/SM.

[Tyranniac]

CrazyGreggy wrote...

If I could enter this from the PoV of someone who didn't get ME1 or ME2 until long after all the DLC had been released (last August to be precise).

I always do LotSB before the SM, but after reading this thread have left the Normandy tour until after the SM to...


tldr: if you didn't get each bit of the DLC as it was released, I feel it makes sense to go loyalty missions > overlord > arrival > LotSB, finish up upgrades, gogo IFF/SM.

This all sounds fine and sensible... but... you do Arrival before the SM? ...what? 

[Obsidian Gryphon]

Lol. I did the same too for the last couple of rounds of ME 2; I wanted to end the game with Liara.   All previous initial play throughs ended with Arrival, LotSB was just before it.

[Arcataye]

Akernis wrote...

Up untill they actually mind-melded I was interested but not much more than that. When they joined I began to feel really as part of the stroy, how I could put my shepard (and by extension myself) in her place with Liara, my eyes began to moist about halfway through the joining and I realised that I had tears in them because of how real and true their love felt in the mid-end part of the joining.

Yeah, the way Rae describes the meld is pretty damn good. They both feel so real and alive, great writing.

I just read her "new" fic written by request: Totally Worth It. Got a few laughs out of it.
"If you read something you don't like, just cover your ears, close your eyes, and start shouting "lalalalalalala" as loud as you can."
-

She has interesting ideas of asari thrown around elsewhere:

Asari pheromones were a powerful thing, and Liara was still a maiden despite her exciting new career. Hormone production usually increased in preparation for (or after) taking a lover, and they had to be strong enough to stimulate the corresponding endocrine systems in completely different species. Shepard was clearly 'marked', whether she knew it or not.

-

I'm drowning in fanfics, my backlog just keeps on growing and I can't just read through them all as most of them are HUGE. I'm going to have to buy somekind of a tablet pc to read stuff, I just can't stare at my monitor for hours and hours.
-

Modifié par Arcataye, 07 mai 2012 - 11:50 .

[CrazyGreggy]

Tyranniac wrote...
This all sounds fine and sensible... but... you do Arrival before the SM? ...what? 

WE know what Arrival entails. Shepard doesn't. To me it makes perfect sense for Shepard to do that before the Reaper IFF. The Collectors are hitting human colonies and abducting thousands of people, yes. But Hackett's briefing is specifically about a REAPER threat, as in the monsters that the Collectors work for and who will kill trillions if/when they arrive. So yes, doing Arrival before the SM makes perfect sense from Shepard's PoV, because the organ-grinders are more important than the monkeys.

[Tyranniac]

CrazyGreggy wrote...

Tyranniac wrote...
This all sounds fine and sensible... but... you do Arrival before the SM? ...what? 

WE know what Arrival entails. Shepard doesn't. To me it makes perfect sense for Shepard to do that before the Reaper IFF. The Collectors are hitting human colonies and abducting thousands of people, yes. But Hackett's briefing is specifically about a REAPER threat, as in the monsters that the Collectors work for and who will kill trillions if/when they arrive. So yes, doing Arrival before the SM makes perfect sense from Shepard's PoV, because the organ-grinders are more important than the monkeys.

It's just that... I think we can be pretty sure the briefing from Hackett is supposed to take place after the SM. The whole mission makes so much more sense after. But you do it whenever you want, this is off-topic anyway!

[CrazyGreggy]

Tyranniac wrote...

It's just that... I think we can be pretty sure the briefing from Hackett is supposed to take place after the SM. The whole mission makes so much more sense after. But you do it whenever you want, this is off-topic anyway!

Except the briefing is auto-triggered the moment you open the private terminal after Horizon. Auto-dialogue ftl.

edit - ToP with THAT? Suppose it's my own fault due to the wall of text on the previous page....

2 shots of Liara (with sunnie's LotSB texture for ME1) with Kira Shepard....

Modifié par CrazyGreggy, 07 mai 2012 - 12:19 .

[The Lightspeaker]

CrazyGreggy wrote...

Except the briefing is auto-triggered the moment you open the private terminal after Horizon. Auto-dialogue ftl.

Ugh...seriously this still?

Look I already explained this. Both LotSB and Arrival are designed primarily with the idea they'd be played after people have already explained the game. In the case of Arrival its because it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever otherwise and has explicitly been set up to lead into ME3. In the case of LotSB the writer's themselves have actually STATED that as a fact.

The fact they're available earlier is simply poor implementation of DLC coupled with the fact that I would assume they wanted to just let people have access to their DLC whenever. However in terms of how the narrative is designed it assumes you don't get the SB information until after the SM and you don't hear from Hackett until after absolutely everything else. For many people (I'd even argue the majority of people) that's exactly what happened because they got the DLC after they finished.


In any case arguing about the specific order missions are played in for a fanfic purpose is completely pointless. A lot of the stuff in the games can be played in any order regardless. So of course any damn fanfic isn't going to necessarily tally with the precise order you did things in; however it CAN tie in with the overall intended narrative design. Which is ME2 into LotSB into Arrival. Which is exactly what I'm doing.

Modifié par The Lightspeaker, 07 mai 2012 - 01:35 .