56459 réponses à ce sujet

[MrStoob]

Liara often gets labelled 'Mary Sue' or 'Mary Blue' and I understand what that means, but is there a male equivalent of the label 'Mary Sue'? I'm English so some of these Americanisms are new to me like.

[lillitheris]

MrStoob wrote...

Liara often gets labelled 'Mary Sue' or 'Mary Blue' and I understand what that means, but is there a male equivalent of the label 'Mary Sue'? I'm English so some of these Americanisms are new to me like.

Gary Stu. It’s not an Americanism precisely, it’s something the TVTropes and fanfic wan— weenies overuse all over the place.

[MrStoob]

lillitheris wrote...

MrStoob wrote...

Liara often gets labelled 'Mary Sue' or 'Mary Blue' and I understand what that means, but is there a male equivalent of the label 'Mary Sue'? I'm English so some of these Americanisms are new to me like.

Gary Stu. It’s not an Americanism precisely, it’s something the TVTropes and fanfic wan— weenies overuse all over the place.

Ta, so it's more of a literary term then to describe stock characters?

Anyhoo, my reason for coming here.  RE: contraversial IT.  Wouldn't Liara 'feel' any residue of indoctrination attempts while they merged?

[kyg_20X6]

MrStoob wrote...

Anyhoo, my reason for coming here.  RE: contraversial IT.  Wouldn't Liara 'feel' any residue of indoctrination attempts while they merged?

Doesn't the merging only exchange what the other person sees/feels? So if Shepard sees it just as disconcerting dream, I'm sure Liara sees it in the same way.

[lillitheris]

kyg_20X6 wrote...

MrStoob wrote...

Anyhoo, my reason for coming here.  RE: contraversial IT.  Wouldn't Liara 'feel' any residue of indoctrination attempts while they merged?

Doesn't the merging only exchange what the other person sees/feels? So if Shepard sees it just as disconcerting dream, I'm sure Liara sees it in the same way.

I’d argue she would definitely notice a foreign presence or some type of alteration or mental block, even if she couldn’t immediately pinpoint what it was.

[Aristobulus500]

I really think Liara would notice indoctrination when she melded with Shepard. Not sure if she could tell exactly what it was, but she'd notice it.

[Arcataye]

What are everyones favourite Liara scenes?
For example LotSB interrupt kiss and London gift just to name two.

[villevalo]

Liara was around many of those Prothean and Reaper artifacts as much as Shepard, maybe she is under, on some level, some form of indoctrination or as much that would make her unable to see the indoctrination in Shepard.

This is on the assumption, that along with the technology they use, the Reapers have developed their indoctrination to the level that its almost undetectable until it is too late.

Or maybe the merging shifted any form of indoctrination onto Liara's mind, preventing her from seeing it in Shepard?

[Robhuzz]

Barquiel wrote...

kumquats wrote...

http://social.biowar.../index/12051161

Someone on TBBT, liked the Liara statue. ^.^

nice...even if I don't watch the show

Am I the only one here who doesn't hate the statue?

I don't really hate the statue either but I dislike the fact they're selling it as 'Liara statue' since it's not Liara. It's some random asari with huge.... and a face that looks like she's 12 years old, wearing a gun and Liara's Lotsb outfit...

I really think Liara would notice indoctrination when she melded with Shepard. Not sure if she could tell exactly what it was, but she'd notice it. 

Not sure she could detect it, but when melding she would definitely notice something is wrong. There could be a number of reasons why it's never brought up though. Oversight would be the easiest reason but not every Shepard romances Liara. If Liara brought it up, Shepard would have to try and take some action, possibly altering the entire game based on who you are romancing. BioWare won't go that far.

Modifié par Robhuzz, 23 mai 2012 - 01:48 .

[Theodoro]

Arcataye wrote...

What are everyones favourite Liara scenes?
For example LotSB interrupt kiss and London gift just to name two.

The time capsule scene. It was so touching and beautiful - and it says a lot about Liara and why we all love her. Knowing she went through all of this despite all of the chores she had as the Shadow Broker, especially during the war, just reaffirms what we know about her as a person. However, I wish that it had been expanded on if she's Shepard's LI.

[sharkboy421]

Arcataye wrote...

What are everyones favourite Liara scenes?
For example LotSB interrupt kiss and London gift just to name two.

That might be my favorite scene with Liara.  The first kiss was just a reaction to situation and the old feelings Shep and Liara still had for each other.  But the interrupt allows you to make an active decision about their relationship.  Does the rift of the past 2 years stand or are their old feelings strong enough to over come that?

At least this is how I saw it.  Shep knows there are still things to work out, but she still loves Liara and is making the choice to fight for Liara and do whatever she can keep her.  So yeah, I abosolutely love this scene.

[kyg_20X6]

Arcataye wrote...

What are everyones favourite Liara scenes?
For example LotSB interrupt kiss and London gift just to name two.

* The romance scene in ME3, with them finally saying 'I love you' (Liara saying it first for loyal Sheps is a great touch, as is 'show me!').

* All the Shep/Aethyta/Liara dialogue on the Citadel.

* Shepard telling Liara she couldn't get through any of this without her ('flatterer!).

* The near-kiss in ME1.

* The emotional, sparks-flying, tears-streaming-down-face, kiss from LotSB.

I think it'd be a tie, for me, between the first and last of the above for best Liara scene.

Aside: There's a scene in ME3 that doesn't, physically, contain Liara at all but, to me, she is of the upmost importance to it. When my Shepard, bruised and bloody, was sitting next to Anderson (who had just passed), all I could think of was how Shepard is probably just thinking about Liara, about blue-babies... the fatalism of that scene, the hope/despair; I think that was one of the scenes that touched me the most in ME3. I don't think it would have the same emotional ring if my Shep hadn't had that relationship with Liara. And I was hoping the sadness of that scene would be buoyed by a later reunion, which didn't come (hopefully it will come, belatedly, in the EC).

[MrStoob]

kyg_20X6 wrote...

Arcataye wrote...

What are everyones favourite Liara scenes?
For example LotSB interrupt kiss and London gift just to name two.

* The romance scene in ME3, with them finally saying 'I love you' (Liara saying it first for loyal Sheps is a great touch, as is 'show me!').

* All the Shep/Aethyta/Liara dialogue on the Citadel.

* Shepard telling Liara she couldn't get through any of this without her ('flatterer!).

* The near-kiss in ME1.

* The emotional, sparks-flying, tears-streaming-down-face, kiss from LotSB.

I think it'd be a tie, for me, between the first and last of the above for best Liara scene.

Aside: There's a scene in ME3 that doesn't, physically, contain Liara at all but, to me, she is of the upmost importance to it. When my Shepard, bruised and bloody, was sitting next to Anderson (who had just passed), all I could think of was how Shepard is probably just thinking about Liara, about blue-babies... the fatalism of that scene, the hope/despair; I think that was one of the scenes that touched me the most in ME3. I don't think it would have the same emotional ring if my Shep hadn't had that relationship with Liara. And I was hoping the sadness of that scene would be buoyed by a later reunion, which didn't come (hopefully it will come, belatedly, in the EC).

I'd add to the LOTSB ones: Liara straight after killing the SB, her adrenaline filled pained face as she is released from her obsession and starts to return to the Liara we knew.

[Ecrulis]

Can I say all interaction with Liara? cause Im having difficulty chosing.

[IliyaMoroumetz]

Late to the subject, I know, but I don't wait long after I start to get the Shadow Broker mission done, because that way, Liara can really assist Nora Shepard in preparing, since Nora's notorious for being almost OCD when it comes to contingency plans.

[Thessaly77]

Hi All, sorry to butt in with a fanfic question but I have been looking for a fic that I read a few days ago but can't seem to find it now. It's about the story behind Liara being called 'Little Wing' --- when she was very young, she improvised some kind of cloth or something to be able to fly and ended up with a broken arm. It is a really sweet story (and it also includes the other squadmates' stories of themselves when they were younger, I remember laughing at Ashley's 'show n tell' video) and I'd really apreciate it if someone can provide me a link, thanks!

[coatsworth]

Ecrulis wrote...

Can I say all interaction with Liara? cause Im having difficulty chosing.

Agreed. For me just seeing her, knowing she is there:wub:<3
https://encrypted-tb...KMHSLFXxEK_-uuw

[DarkCloudd]

kyg_20X6 wrote...

Arcataye wrote...

What are everyones favourite Liara scenes?
For example LotSB interrupt kiss and London gift just to name two.

* The romance scene in ME3, with them finally saying 'I love you' (Liara saying it first for loyal Sheps is a great touch, as is 'show me!').

* All the Shep/Aethyta/Liara dialogue on the Citadel.

* Shepard telling Liara she couldn't get through any of this without her ('flatterer!).

* The near-kiss in ME1.

* The emotional, sparks-flying, tears-streaming-down-face, kiss from LotSB.

I think it'd be a tie, for me, between the first and last of the above for best Liara scene.

These are my top scenes too. I also like the "Goddess how could I be so dense" line from ME1 when you tell her you were joking.

About the IT thing, I'm reminded of ME1 (since I'm working on my NG+ right now), the conversation with the Rachni Queen on Novaria when she talks about songs the color of oily shadows. To me I think thats what it would be like for either Liara or another asari to meld with someone who is under indoctrination. Granted Liara or said asari might not know what is wrong just that its different, but I'm sure they would be able to tell a difference. If they were familiar with the person they are melding with they would definately see it. But I refuse to believe my Sheps or Liara are indoctrinated, they are way too strong to let the reapers control them.

Edit: Thank you for all of the LotSB answers, I think I will play it before the SM and leave the tour till after this time, for variety.

Modifié par DarkCloudd, 23 mai 2012 - 05:18 .

[CrimsonN7]

villevalo wrote...

Liara was around many of those Prothean and Reaper artifacts as much as Shepard, maybe she is under, on some level, some form of indoctrination or as much that would make her unable to see the indoctrination in Shepard.

This is on the assumption, that along with the technology they use, the Reapers have developed their indoctrination to the level that its almost undetectable until it is too late.

Or maybe the merging shifted any form of indoctrination onto Liara's mind, preventing her from seeing it in Shepard?

After watching gamermd83's indoctrination theory loophole 3 part vid, and for anyone intersested here's the link 

I don't believe that Shepard and certainly not Liara were ever under some form of indoctrination due to the fact that for indoctrination to take effect being in contact with indoctrinated devices for short periods of time will have minimal or no effect, it's prolonged periods of direct contact with said devices weeks, months, years that warp the victims mind and turns them into unintelligent mindless husks. Also the first symptoms of indoctrination is you hear whispers, Shep never heard the reapers in his/her ears, yeah Shep had the dreams but they represented Shep's guilt nothing else. 

And if Shepard was indoctrinated on the citadel which I don't believe why would the reapers offer Shep the destruction option and not just control and synthesis when they are trying to indoctrinate him/her, makes NO SENSE! Also if we play along with this theory and if Liara didn't detect any indoctrination in Shep I highly doubt Javik wouldn't notice as he can read you just through touch alone, if it slipped Liara's net Javik would have spotted it.

[adneate]

Though a lot of indoctrination theory is that Shepard isn't indoctrinated from the get go it's that the Reapers are trying to indoctrinate Shepard in the 3 dream attempts each being beaten off by Shepard's subconscious mind when it burns the kid. The end sequence is just the last ditch effort to indoctrinate Shepard by creating this world of illusion where they try to get you to willingly give yourself to them. Destroy doesn't destroy the Reapers it breaks their attempt though that technically leaves ME3 without an ending. Shepard and company still have to turn on the real crucible and destroy the real reapers.

Not that I buy IT myself, but there wouldn't be any indoctrination for Liara to detect because unless you pick control or synthesis Shepard isn't indoctrinated. Indoctrinated people come to willingly agree with the Reapers, their thoughts are in line with the Reapers though they maintain the illusion that they are still their own ideas and motivations. Saren was indoctrinated yet he thought he was helping the reapers for his own reasons, not being able to realize he had no personal reason to help them he had only the reaper's reasons.

Modifié par adneate, 23 mai 2012 - 05:33 .

[lillitheris]

adneate wrote...

Though a lot of indoctrination theory is that Shepard isn't indoctrinated from the get go it's that the Reapers are trying to indoctrinate Shepard in the 3 dream attempts each being beaten off by Shepard's subconscious mind when it burns the kid. The end sequence is just the last ditch effort to indoctrinate Shepard by creating this world of illusion where they try to get you to willingly give yourself to them. Destroy doesn't destroy the Reapers it breaks their attempt though that technically leaves ME3 without an ending. Shepard and company still have to turn on the real crucible and destroy the real reapers.

Indoctrination doesn’t work quite like that, I think. There has to be something in the brain to either generate or receive the signal: they can’t just shoot an indoctrination ray at a person from afar, so the Reaper object contact is necessary to prepare the subject. So regardless of whether Shepard was indoctrinated in the sense of actually under Reaper control, or indoctrinated in the sense that she was made susceptible to receive the control attempts, Liara would be able to tell there’s something off.

The dreams are just PTSD or CSR.

Modifié par lillitheris, 23 mai 2012 - 06:04 .

[Ecrulis]

lillitheris wrote...

adneate wrote...

Though a lot of indoctrination theory is that Shepard isn't indoctrinated from the get go it's that the Reapers are trying to indoctrinate Shepard in the 3 dream attempts each being beaten off by Shepard's subconscious mind when it burns the kid. The end sequence is just the last ditch effort to indoctrinate Shepard by creating this world of illusion where they try to get you to willingly give yourself to them. Destroy doesn't destroy the Reapers it breaks their attempt though that technically leaves ME3 without an ending. Shepard and company still have to turn on the real crucible and destroy the real reapers.

Indoctrination doesn’t work quite like that, I think. There has to be something in the brain to either generate or receive the signal: they can’t just shoot an indoctrination ray at a person from afar, so the Reaper object contact is necessary to prepare the subject. So regardless of whether Shepard was indoctrinated in the sense of actually under Reaper control, or indoctrinated in the sense that she was made susceptible to receive the control attempts, Liara would be able to tell there’s something off.

The dreams are just PTSD or CSR.

I wanted to have the dreams at least have some sort of meanig so in my fanfic, I have a young shepard have a recurring nightmare that shes lost in dense woods, the nightmare will get worse as the story progresses. So now for me at least theres a reason my cannon shep is dreaming about a random forest.

[CrimsonN7]

If we were to go along with this theory it would have been far more believable to incorporate the stages of reaper indoctrination in Shep throughout the series, not to just slap it in there in the last chapter of the series in the last ten minutes of the game. The indoctrination theory although clever is just fans trying to make some sense of the horrible mess of an abrupt ending bioware left us with.

I get why some people support it, it numbs the pain of the god awful ending but for me believing that the last ten minutes was just in Shep's head I won't buy it, it was just bad writing, also you don't ever introduce a new character into a story in the last ten minutes, trying to set it up as some kind of a twist ending is clichéd, tired and done a million times, lazy, lazy, lazy.

And that stupid godchild A.I for me ruined the allure and the unspeakable horror that were the reapers, they were the most alien of the aliens and I would have preferred to have still seen them as horrific monsters hellbent on destruction and death rather then to know they were some stupid catalyst's play thing and his circular logic that you can't call him out on ugh! Recalling sovereign's epic speech in ME makes me sad when we see what Bioware has done in ME3.

Ah vent over, now back to more pleasant thoughts, on the subject of LOTSB pre or post suicide mission I always go post suicide mission, when my Shep stares at her photo before hitting the relay all those memories and thoughts of happier times with Liara gives her the added incentive to make sure to return alive, to see her again, something to live for.

[Tyranniac]

The Lightspeaker wrote...
I also think Vega has a crush on Cortez, heh.

 

Definantly. 

DarkCloudd wrote...

So I know its a controversial topic but I'm still gonna ask it anyway.

When I get my new Shep to ME2, LotSB before or after the Suicide Mission? I'm just curious how others have played it and what they prefer.

 

I strongly recommend doing it before the Suicide Mission. (Maybe you've already decided by now though ). I do it before and I do the date scene before as well because if you do it after there are several minor story inconsistencies, and I also feel that it works better before because the threat feels more immediate. There is also the additional upgrades and such but that's just a bonus.

Arcataye wrote...

What are everyones favourite Liara scenes?
For example LotSB interrupt kiss and London gift just to name two.

 

ME1:

• Finding her in the statis field 
• Her confession of affection 

ME2:

• "Worried there might be some terminals you need me to hack?"
• Kiss under the sparkly-thingy.
• The smile after asking her to come to the Normandy. 
• All of the date, of course. 

ME3:

• "..I think of what I'd lose if I fail."
• "I don't know if I could do this without you."
• All of the romance scene. Great lines, great acting, great animation, great music. So beautiful. 
• London goodbye. 

Ecrulis wrote...

I wanted to have the dreams at least have some sort of meanig so in my fanfic, I have a young shepard have a recurring nightmare that shes lost in dense woods, the nightmare will get worse as the story progresses. So now for me at least theres a reason my cannon shep is dreaming about a random forest.

 

I decided that the forest was on Mindoir to give it more meaning.