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Liara Fans: keep your love blue and true!


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#42651
MidnightRaith

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Aristobulus500 wrote...

http://ferretbrain.c...les/article-876

Don't know if this article has been posted, but it's pretty interesting.


I agree with the vast majority of what this guy has said. However, what he says doesn't make me ambivilent towards the endings, it just makes me not like them nearly as much as I did originally.

One thing I did notice was yet another shot at Liara fans. For God's sake, the vast majority of us did not, in fact, expect Bioware to actually give us blue babies. That's what headcanon is for. I would love an actual reunion, but to expect them to design a pregnant Liara or a baby is a bit much.

#42652
karmensandiego

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Aristobulus500 wrote...

http://ferretbrain.c...les/article-876

Don't know if this article has been posted, but it's pretty interesting.


That article is kinda awesome.

It explains logically and intellectually why Hudson and Walters really failed with their ending. 

Kinda makes me all depressed though...

:(

Oh and I didn't know, since I've been out of the mass effect realm for awhile, that Synthesis was the preferred ending of the devs.

*sad sigh*

#42653
DOsquareZER

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Aristobulus500 wrote...

http://ferretbrain.c...les/article-876

Don't know if this article has been posted, but it's pretty interesting.


pretty much agree with him on most points.  But meh never expected EC to fix it anything - not without sacrificing ''yadda yadda integrity'', so ill take the disneyfied romance feels and discard the rest - i have no further use for catalyst and walter-fied hudson-ated crap.  ...

#42654
Pineappletree

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Hey guys and gals!
It's been a while ... And there seems to be some sort of "reunion party" going on allready :lol:

Hi karmen!
Hi cohina!
Hi to all the others who do or do not know me!


Anyway, with a bit of free time to spend and the EC motivating me to come back to the ME universe, I started to create new Liara "photographies" again.

And since I think I promised to link new stuff as soon as I upload it to DA last time I was here (which I promptly forgot for the Liara portrait last week) here's something fresh from the (photo)shop, hope you like it.

! Beware uncovered skin ! and all that jazz ...
Image IPB



And I just watched Leolein's tribute video. Not a genre I'm toooo fond of
usually but that was just great, very emotional ending. Terrific
work! Waiting for the other characters now :P

Also, so much new fanfic! That "I really need to start reading all this" bookmark list is growing again ... fast.

#42655
Tyrannosaurus Rex

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FdL_Ananas wrote...

Hey guys and gals!
It's been a while ... And there seems to be some sort of "reunion party" going on allready :lol:

Hi karmen!
Hi cohina!
Hi to all the others who do or do not know me!


Anyway, with a bit of free time to spend and the EC motivating me to come back to the ME universe, I started to create new Liara "photographies" again.

And since I think I promised to link new stuff as soon as I upload it to DA last time I was here (which I promptly forgot for the Liara portrait last week) here's something fresh from the (photo)shop, hope you like it.

! Beware uncovered skin ! and all that jazz ...
Image IPB



And I just watched Leolein's tribute video. Not a genre I'm toooo fond of
usually but that was just great, very emotional ending. Terrific
work! Waiting for the other characters now :P

Also, so much new fanfic! That "I really need to start reading all this" bookmark list is growing again ... fast.


I like it. The art style and her pose makes it quite tasteful IMO.

#42656
Obsidian Gryphon

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FdL_Ananas wrote...

Hey guys and gals!
It's been a while ... And there seems to be some sort of "reunion party" going on allready :lol:

Hi karmen!
Hi cohina!
Hi to all the others who do or do not know me!


Anyway, with a bit of free time to spend and the EC motivating me to come back to the ME universe, I started to create new Liara "photographies" again.

And since I think I promised to link new stuff as soon as I upload it to DA last time I was here (which I promptly forgot for the Liara portrait last week) here's something fresh from the (photo)shop, hope you like it.

! Beware uncovered skin ! and all that jazz ...
Image IPB



And I just watched Leolein's tribute video. Not a genre I'm toooo fond of
usually but that was just great, very emotional ending. Terrific
work! Waiting for the other characters now :P

Also, so much new fanfic! That "I really need to start reading all this" bookmark list is growing again ... fast.


Graceful pose. Love that smile. Image IPB Beautiful!  Image IPB

#42657
Pineappletree

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Aristobulus500 wrote...

http://ferretbrain.c...les/article-876

Don't know if this article has been posted, but it's pretty interesting.

Good article, agree with most all of it.

Though I find myself being surprisingly calm and relaxed regarding all this nowadays.
Not sure if I should call it "healing" or if all the previous rage is just shoved into a dark corner of my mind, ready to come out again in the future ...


€dit
And thanks Lizardviking, Obsidian Gryphon. Glad you like it :)

Modifié par FdL_Ananas, 03 juillet 2012 - 12:56 .


#42658
Aristobulus500

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Your work is certainly talented, Pineapple, and it's very tasteful - especially this new one. Not really my style though, it's too artistic. Note that I don't think artistic and tasteful are synonyms so I'm not asking you to make it less tasteful.

Just to explain my stance, so you don't take me the wrong way, I'll link a similar NWS image.
http://i.imgur.com/1dWC4.jpg

This one, I feel, would be improved by two things - if she looked happier instead of so somber and sad, and if she actually was somewhere, instead of "the void". Like, same pose but say, on a beach or something, and it already looks better.

Similar complaints about yours - though yours at least has Liara looking happy, I'd prefer it to be in color, and I'd prefer her looking more casual in an actual scene, rather than hard posed in a void. It's less artistic, but just as tasteful - and that's my point, I think there can be too much art in a picture.

You probably disagree, but I hope you can at least understand my position even if it's not one you personally prefer, that's all I'm going for. And this isn't a knock against the talent behind your work, again, it certainly is very talented and took some skill to make, I don't argue that! But it's actually precisely because it is so high quality that I even want to voice these complaints.

#42659
karmensandiego

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FdL_Ananas wrote...

Aristobulus500 wrote...

http://ferretbrain.c...les/article-876

Don't know if this article has been posted, but it's pretty interesting.

Good article, agree with most all of it.

Though I find myself being surprisingly calm and relaxed regarding all this nowadays.
Not sure if I should call it "healing" or if all the previous rage is just shoved into a dark corner of my mind, ready to come out again in the future ...


€dit
And thanks Lizardviking, Obsidian Gryphon. Glad you like it :)


FDL ANANAS!!!!!  HOW YOU DOING BUDDY????  *hugs*

See I read the article and it just pissed me off.  I haven't even played the EC yet and now I probably will just to see the Liara/Femshep goodbye scene.

It's like, yay, they fixed the obvious plot holes that were just plain stupid for them not to fix in the orginal release - ie: how the crew members got back to the Normandy, and Joker flying away.

And yay they fixed the two things that pissed people off a lot, letting the relays be "rebuilt" and letting the normandy fly off of the planet.

But they stuck to their guns with the three endings (and threw in the middle finger ending for us).  They didn't change those at all or change how boxed in we were with those "choices".

And reading that article, and how intellectually and logically he/she lays down just exactly why those choices don't work, it just makes me sad, you know?  I totally love the Mass Effect Universe!  And they kinda tarnished the rest of the 95% AMAZING trilogy!

It's like if you don't look at the endings, the starchild, the three choices too closely, don't really try to think logically about them, the ending is fine.  It works, Shep lives, there's a chance for a reunion with Liara.

But if you do love this game enough, and think that it's a very smart, intelligent game as well... Well... *sigh* Guess we're just out of luck. :(

#42660
Aristobulus500

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karmensandiego wrote...
It's like if you don't look at the endings, the starchild, the three choices too closely, don't really try to think logically about them, the ending is fine.  It works, Shep lives, there's a chance for a reunion with Liara.

But if you do love this game enough, and think that it's a very smart, intelligent game as well... Well... *sigh* Guess we're just out of luck. :(


Thing is, I do think the series is a pretty smart, intelligent series - it's just the endings, even with the EC, really aren't.

But at least they aren't the burns the original endings were - even if they are not smart endings, they are still somewhat satisfying endings, and that's really all that matters. If they could be smart on top of it, it would be icing.

And they are satisfying because of exactly what you say - you now actually CAN have an ending that allows for Shep to reunite and live with Liara in the galaxy that's not destroyed beyond all repair.

#42661
DOsquareZER

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*pours a glass of rye whiskey or booze of choice for karmen* the pain dulls with time.

Also pineapple... wow... i think this is a new favorite coming from you. The pose is just so her, and gawd this is really awesome.

Modifié par doozer12, 03 juillet 2012 - 01:26 .


#42662
karmensandiego

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Aristobulus500 wrote...

karmensandiego wrote...
It's like if you don't look at the endings, the starchild, the three choices too closely, don't really try to think logically about them, the ending is fine.  It works, Shep lives, there's a chance for a reunion with Liara.

But if you do love this game enough, and think that it's a very smart, intelligent game as well... Well... *sigh* Guess we're just out of luck. :(


Thing is, I do think the series is a pretty smart, intelligent series - it's just the endings, even with the EC, really aren't.

But at least they aren't the burns the original endings were - even if they are not smart endings, they are still somewhat satisfying endings, and that's really all that matters. If they could be smart on top of it, it would be icing.

And they are satisfying because of exactly what you say - you now actually CAN have an ending that allows for Shep to reunite and live with Liara in the galaxy that's not destroyed beyond all repair.


I'm with ya Aristo, that's exactly why I'm sad.  95% of this game was incredibly imaginative, intellectual, smart and intriguing.  It's that last 5% that seems like it was written by completely different writers.

And while yes, I'm glad that I can headcanon or read my fanfiction where Liara and Shep reunite and have lots of adorable blue babies, I think that ultimately that's what the original destroy ending also implied, just not as clearly.  I think the devs were surprised we thought the Relays were forever destroyed and that Liara and crew were forever stranded, I think they always meant for Shep and the crew to ultimately reunite. 

So I'm not really giving the EC props for those fixes as I don't really think they were "changes" so much as "clarification."

#42663
karmensandiego

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doozer12 wrote...

*pours a glass of rye whiskey or booze of choice for karmen* the pain dulls with time.

Also pineapple... wow... i think this is a new favorite coming from you. The pose is just so her, and gawd this is really awesome.


*grabs bottle out of Doozer's hand*

gimme.

:crying:

#42664
adneate

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Aristobulus500 wrote...
Thing is, I do think the series is a pretty smart, intelligent series - it's just the endings, even with the EC, really aren't.

But at least they aren't the burns the original endings were - even if they are not smart endings, they are still somewhat satisfying endings, and that's really all that matters. If they could be smart on top of it, it would be icing.


I'm more cynical than most in that I thought the series, as it was originally intended, basically died with Shepard at the opening of ME2. The feel of the two games is so radically different in structure and design that I'd almost put Mass Effect 2 down as one of the worst follow ups in the history of fiction. It discarded nearly everything from Mass Effect, it dumped the cast, the style pretty much every single aspect that defined Mass Effect as a slow plodding Star Trek style of sci-fi in a grounded universe with clear rules and logic.

Now suddenly you're working for a Bond Villian who wears an evil suit, sits in an evil chair in his evil fortress of evil. People run around in cat suits with plunging necklines and have literal magical powers where they can drain people of life force or wirelessly transfer energy. You spend the entirity of that game either trying to get back what you lost at the beginning (Liara) or wasting time with this pointless side mission involving a non-threat known as The Collectors. Then the game ends on the exact same note as the first "The Reapers are coming and I'm going to find a way to stop them."

Shepard's death and reconstruction is absolutely wasted to the point that they actively downplay and make light of what could have been a genuinely interesting and thoughtful look at mortality and transhumanism. Instead it's just cheap one liners like "I got better" and the total flat out refusal to look at the effects of any of the extensive and radical augmentation you read about in the Research Terminal. It instead being just reduced to +10% Health per upgrade, with no thought to what would be complex concepts such as losing your humanity or even transcending the limitations or bonds of the human race as it exists and whether or not that is a geniunely deseriable state of bing.

So after all that wasted potential I just kinda resigned myself to the fact that ME3's story would rely on a Deus Ex Machina to resolve the Reapers since they wasted the second game not finding a way to beat them and the plot would be really weak and stupid. Though they did shock me with how horrible the endings were, I must admit I didn't see that coming since I assumed they'd play it safe and add some pretty generic endings. I really only bought the game because FemShep and Liara would be in it and Liara would be back in the squad, I didn't buy it for the plot.

I don't know exactly what the point of all this was other than it seems like a lot of people are also lamenting what could have been, just at different times. At one point or another we all had real hope that this was a series that could really be special and it all just slowly rotted away over time. To the point where we had to fight to just be content with the ending to the game as opposed to bitterly disappointed and angry. I bet we'd all have been shocked if you told us months ago we'd have to fight this hard to get something as average as the EC, that we'd all be hoping the series didn't end with Shepard dying for no reason and the galaxy being either trashed or changed beyond all recognition or comprehension.

Someone pass the Scotch and make it the good stuff.

#42665
coatsworth

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adneate wrote...

Aristobulus500 wrote...
Thing is, I do think the series is a pretty smart, intelligent series - it's just the endings, even with the EC, really aren't.

But at least they aren't the burns the original endings were - even if they are not smart endings, they are still somewhat satisfying endings, and that's really all that matters. If they could be smart on top of it, it would be icing.


I'm more cynical than most in that I thought the series, as it was originally intended, basically died with Shepard at the opening of ME2. The feel of the two games is so radically different in structure and design that I'd almost put Mass Effect 2 down as one of the worst follow ups in the history of fiction. It discarded nearly everything from Mass Effect, it dumped the cast, the style pretty much every single aspect that defined Mass Effect as a slow plodding Star Trek style of sci-fi in a grounded universe with clear rules and logic.

Now suddenly you're working for a Bond Villian who wears an evil suit, sits in an evil chair in his evil fortress of evil. People run around in cat suits with plunging necklines and have literal magical powers where they can drain people of life force or wirelessly transfer energy. You spend the entirity of that game either trying to get back what you lost at the beginning (Liara) or wasting time with this pointless side mission involving a non-threat known as The Collectors. Then the game ends on the exact same note as the first "The Reapers are coming and I'm going to find a way to stop them."

Shepard's death and reconstruction is absolutely wasted to the point that they actively downplay and make light of what could have been a genuinely interesting and thoughtful look at mortality and transhumanism. Instead it's just cheap one liners like "I got better" and the total flat out refusal to look at the effects of any of the extensive and radical augmentation you read about in the Research Terminal. It instead being just reduced to +10% Health per upgrade, with no thought to what would be complex concepts such as losing your humanity or even transcending the limitations or bonds of the human race as it exists and whether or not that is a geniunely deseriable state of bing.

So after all that wasted potential I just kinda resigned myself to the fact that ME3's story would rely on a Deus Ex Machina to resolve the Reapers since they wasted the second game not finding a way to beat them and the plot would be really weak and stupid. Though they did shock me with how horrible the endings were, I must admit I didn't see that coming since I assumed they'd play it safe and add some pretty generic endings. I really only bought the game because FemShep and Liara would be in it and Liara would be back in the squad, I didn't buy it for the plot.

I don't know exactly what the point of all this was other than it seems like a lot of people are also lamenting what could have been, just at different times. At one point or another we all had real hope that this was a series that could really be special and it all just slowly rotted away over time. To the point where we had to fight to just be content with the ending to the game as opposed to bitterly disappointed and angry. I bet we'd all have been shocked if you told us months ago we'd have to fight this hard to get something as average as the EC, that we'd all be hoping the series didn't end with Shepard dying for no reason and the galaxy being either trashed or changed beyond all recognition or comprehension.

Someone pass the Scotch and make it the good stuff.

I had high hopes for ME3, Like really high hopes. I'm a die hard fan got most of the Mass Effect stuff. When I finished the game it felt like I had been stabbed then shot. The EC is a 'gift' in which Bioware can say we 'owe' them one. EC makes the endings more tasteful but still felt broken because I had to fight to get an ending thar should of been there in the first thing, also I believe that the endings could have been the best in gaming EVER but alas it was not to be.

Scotch sounds good, maybe after the Bourbon.

Modifié par coatsworth, 03 juillet 2012 - 02:24 .


#42666
MidnightRaith

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Whew! Finally got the second chapter up for Striking. Here be a link for those interested.

#42667
PMC65

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Feels like home week on here today! I even have Karmen nagging me! Image IPB

FdL_Ananas - Really like the piece!

I will never understand why people think that the rejection is a middle finger from Bioware ... the consequence fits the act. You walk away from the only bullet that can bring down the reaper ... our cycle dies. Cinder would pick this based off her personality and although sad ... it fits her story. But to each his own!

#42668
karmensandiego

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PMC65 wrote...

Feels like home week on here today! I even have Karmen nagging me! Image IPB

FdL_Ananas - Really like the piece!

I will never understand why people think that the rejection is a middle finger from Bioware ... the consequence fits the act. You walk away from the only bullet that can bring down the reaper ... our cycle dies. Cinder would pick this based off her personality and although sad ... it fits her story. But to each his own!


Who the hell is Cinder?

WHAT HAPPENED TO EW????

#42669
moreeman06

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karmensandiego wrote...

doozer12 wrote...

*pours a glass of rye whiskey or booze of choice for karmen* the pain dulls with time.

Also pineapple... wow... i think this is a new favorite coming from you. The pose is just so her, and gawd this is really awesome.


*grabs bottle out of Doozer's hand*

gimme.

:crying:


OMG Karmen's back *gives Karmen hug then throws a blue baby at PMC for old times sake*   and Ananas too.  where the hell did you two go?

I'm just stopping by to say that I'm almost done with the second part of "Recovery"  and to ask for the links to crazygreggy's stuff his and Theo's latest are on my to read list and i accidentally deleted the links i had saved.

and Ananas beautiful job as always :D

Modifié par moreeman06, 03 juillet 2012 - 03:12 .


#42670
Aristobulus500

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If you need Theo's links, they are here.

http://www.fanfictio...Walk_on_Thessia
http://www.fanfictio...Day_to_Remember
http://www.fanfictio...here_You_Belong
http://www.fanfictio...fe_in_the_Skies

#42671
karmensandiego

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moreeman06 wrote...

karmensandiego wrote...

doozer12 wrote...

*pours a glass of rye whiskey or booze of choice for karmen* the pain dulls with time.

Also pineapple... wow... i think this is a new favorite coming from you. The pose is just so her, and gawd this is really awesome.


*grabs bottle out of Doozer's hand*

gimme.

:crying:


OMG Karmen's back *gives Karmen hug then throws a blue baby at PMC for old times sake*   and Ananas too.  where the hell did you two go?

I'm just stopping by to say that I'm almost done with the second part of "Recovery"  and to ask for the links to crazygreggy's stuff his and Theo's latest are on my to read list and i accidentally deleted the links i had saved.

and Ananas beautiful job as always :D


MOREEMAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

IT'S LIKE A REUNION!!!!

GROUP HUG EVERYONE!!!

*grabs PMC, Doozer, Moree, Ananas, Alex, Lizard*

Where's everyone else?  Still in the PETA thread?

#42672
DOsquareZER

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PETA has a thread?  hahaha
Haven't seen kilshrek or maro in awhile (blew themselves up trying to take over bioware HQ im guessing) - jlb was in a few pages back, briefly.

Modifié par doozer12, 03 juillet 2012 - 04:38 .


#42673
moreeman06

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doozer12 wrote...

PETA has a thread?  hahaha
Haven't seen kilshrek or maro in awhile (blew themselves up trying to take over bioware HQ im guessing) - jlb was in a few pages back, briefly.


yeah it does... I haven't seen Hollow at all around here either lately.  Oh well *removes himself from grouphug long enough to pull out a crate of ryncol*  a toast to our fallen brothers.:)

#42674
DOsquareZER

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*holds a drink high towards the flag of PETA by pineapple, a silent salute to fallen members*
http://desmond.image...jpg&res=landing
The depressingly endless endings chatter .....the cost was too high...*remembers maro* ok maybe not that high... *grins*

Ba-Dum! top.
Image IPB
by uberchilli @ deviantart

Modifié par doozer12, 03 juillet 2012 - 05:12 .


#42675
Yuqi

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karmensandiego wrote...
*snip*


OMG  KARMEN HAS RETURNED FROM THE ABYSS!!

ALso welcome back FDL & Cohina.

Image IPB

and more funnies!

Image IPB

Image IPB

@Leolein
I  frikken loved that vid! YOu did such an excellent job. I did however see it on( what I assume is your) tumblr first. Question: Where did the 'You know I love you. I always will.' come from?Is it exclusive to a new romance? (Props for picking control!)

I notice that the female shepards voice almost cracks, in all of the goodbye scenes.(The romance ones anyway.)

Modifié par Yuqi, 03 juillet 2012 - 05:10 .