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[PMC65]

adneate wrote...

PMC65 wrote...
I've thought about when Shepard becomes old and her body changes, her mind falters, etc. How will that impact Liara? Heck, how will that impact Shepard?

As far as I'm concerned that issue died with ME1 Shepard who was fully human, ME2 forward Shepard is Bio-Synthetic pretty much locked at the age of her death. According to the research terminal all of Shepard's skin is a synthetic weave, hell even her eyes are synthetic replacements. Taking bullets is in the design specs for Shepard's skin, I don't think it'll start sagging due to time.

I wonder what problems she will have in the future because of the Lazarus Project. Can Shepard still have kids? Will the body start rejecting all the Cerberus gifts in time? I guess all that is left to each person's Shepard and headcanon.

[Batlass8]

moreeman06 wrote...

*snip*

*in best announcer voice*  and today's final the Federator vs. Robo-Nadal, this is the 500th meeting between the two here at Wimbledon their first meeting was way back in 2004

This.  I want this for the first story-based DLC.

[moreeman06]

Batlass8 wrote...

moreeman06 wrote...

*snip*

*in best announcer voice*  and today's final the Federator vs. Robo-Nadal, this is the 500th meeting between the two here at Wimbledon their first meeting was way back in 2004

This.  I want this for the first story-based DLC.

press X to swing racket use directional arrows to move on the base line.  press y to switch to spectator mode...  Poor Liara having to sit with Shepard while this goes on...

[adneate]

PMC65 wrote...
I wonder what problems she will have in the future because of the Lazarus Project. Can Shepard still have kids? Will the body start rejecting all the Cerberus gifts in time? I guess all that is left to each person's Shepard and headcanon.

Well that's where I'll leave it but TIM clearly sees Shepard as just a weapon and not really a person, those people parts like emotions and feelings are just things to placate while the weapon does the killing you need. Reaper wars last a long time and you woundn't want this very expensive weapon to crap out in 50 years it would a waste of money. Much in the same way you wouldn't want it to fail due to normally lethal injuries, best to protect your investment by making as many vital parts with redundant back-ups as possible.

Could be interesting either to have Shepard refuse to maintain the cybernetic body not wanting to live radically past her appointed time or having to find a way to deal with outliving all those around her in the same way Liara would.

Modifié par adneate, 06 juillet 2012 - 08:20 .

[PMC65]

Taking Javik to Thessia is a big difference ... I enjoy how he cuts at her, she cuts back and he comments "So you do bite. Good. You will need that."

Yep. The kitten has claws! The pet formally known as the yagh learned that. This is a part of Liara that I've always liked ... her biting tongue when angered.

[karmensandiego]

Oh gawd... I've been back for like 48 hours and I'm already behind again... WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE????

anyhoo... just thought I'd pop in and comment on something a few pages back (you know since I'M NOT CAUGHT UP YET) and prove that I can contribute more to this thread then giant awkward prolonged group hugs and launching blue baby bombardments at PMC and Doozer!

Anyhoo, about the Control-Destroy-Synthesis debate (which DOES have to do with Liara so it's not off topic *side eyes the unseen bioware forum administrator). 

We on this Liara loving thread seem to breakdown into two categories, detroy and control.  I don't think I've seen many, if any, synthesis choosers.  I myself would never choose synthesis, and I think others agree with me, because it basically forces a decision on a trillion other people, forces an evolution that maybe they didn't want.  It seems very egomanical of Shepard, plus Shepard has never before shown any leaning towards approving such a course of action.

So we're just looking at destroy and control.  I'm not arguing for one of the other, they both have merits.  I for one picked destroy because I'm a sucker for happy endings and I wanted my Shep to reunite with Liara.  Destroy was the only choice that allowed this.  It was an easy decision not just because of the living Shep at the end, but because the destroy ending was the one we'd been working towards for 3 whole games.  It seemed in line with what Shepard had always thought and wanted.

BUT!!!!  (see the bold and italics and underlining?!!!  That means something important is coming...)

What if even with the Destroy ending Shep died, and the ONLY ending with a possibility of Shep and Liara reuniting, of Shep living was Synthesis. 

My question:

Would you then choose this?

Me: hell yes!  (what?  I didn't say I was a big enough person to let the whole "egomanical, choosing for everyone" moral repercussions stop me from my happy Liara ending dammit!)

[adneate]

karmensandiego wrote...
What if even with the Destroy ending Shep died, and the ONLY ending with a possibility of Shep and Liara reuniting, of Shep living was Synthesis. 

Would you then choose this?

Does Destroy still have the vapourize option where it burns the Earth to a blackened crisp and blows up the Normandy and kills everyone on it? Cause if it does I'll take that over Synthesis.

[lillitheris]

karmensandiego wrote...

What if even with the Destroy ending Shep died, and the ONLY ending with a possibility of Shep and Liara reuniting, of Shep living was Synthesis. 

My question:

Would you then choose this?

Me: hell yes!  (what?  I didn't say I was a big enough person to let the whole "egomanical, choosing for everyone" moral repercussions stop me from my happy Liara ending dammit!)

No.

Although the good thing about Shepard living in Synthesis is that we could put him on trial and have him hanged.

[CrimsonN7]

PMC65 wrote...

Taking Javik to Thessia is a big difference ... I enjoy how he cuts at her, she cuts back and he comments "So you do bite. Good. You will need that."

Yep. The kitten has claws! The pet formally known as the yagh learned that. This is a part of Liara that I've always liked ... her biting tongue when angered.

Yes not bringing Javik along to Thessia is a lesser experience. I love the renegade line on the shuttle there between Javik, Liara and Shep, Javik saying you got to rise above your emotions towards your own people's destruction, Shep agreeing and Liara ignoring their opinions saying I could never be that callous. I love Liara more and more with every playthrough:wub:



Quick question, onboard the Normandy during the evacuation scene who told Joker to leave in yours?I brought Garrus and Liara to the beam so Ashley told Joker to go in mine. I heard its whoever you talk to most frequently on the Normandy excluding those who run with you to the beam, I could be wrong though:whistle:

Modifié par CrimsonN7, 06 juillet 2012 - 08:40 .

[DOsquareZER]

adneate wrote...

karmensandiego wrote...
What if even with the Destroy ending Shep died, and the ONLY ending with a possibility of Shep and Liara reuniting, of Shep living was Synthesis. 

Would you then choose this?

Does Destroy still have the vapourize option where it burns the Earth to a blackened crisp and blows up the Normandy and kills everyone on it? Cause if it does I'll take that over Synthesis.

yes.  or reject, even though its idiotic given the circumstances.  But then again... they all are.  Im not falling for the new ''disneyfied'' endings, the crap that goes on behind that gay(definition: happy) curtain BW put down - it didn't disappear - the underlying wrong-ness of it all is still there and we've all ready undergone why for the past three months.

Modifié par doozer12, 06 juillet 2012 - 08:42 .

[lillitheris]

PMC65 wrote...

Since the asari in their maiden years are all about experiencing life it would not have been out of character though for her to move on from Shepard. Had that happened in LotSB ... "Shepard, I'm only 108 years old ... I am too young to really settle down. We asari do not have a need for nesting until much later ... but if you don't mind sharing me with others." How would the fan base have taken that? It fits the asari cycle …

I don’t think I’d be that prescriptive about it — and there are significant differences between individuals, surely, or Liara would’ve been in Chora’s Den, not Therum…

Just like humans, we tend to have an exciting time between the ages of 15 and 25 (or 30 nowadays), but it’s not in any way uncommon to start long — even lifelong — relationships during that timeframe.

With Thane there was talk if you romanced him that it might be possible for him to live and in LotSB there was a tease that a cure might be available.

They should’ve just left the death out. That way headcanon/fic could have gone any which way on the cure.

(“Unity” spoiler: Thane’s death is actually one of the few I retconned out. Kal’Reegar’s also around, the ‘death’ was a ruse.)

[Master Shiori]

CrimsonN7 wrote...


Quick question, onboard the Normandy during the evacuation scene who told Joker to leave in yours?I brought Garrus and Liara to the beam so Ashley told Joker to go in mine. I heard its whoever you talk to most frequently on the Normandy excluding those who run with you to the beam, I could be wrong though:whistle:

It's either Garrus or Ashley, depending on who I brought with me to the beam. And yes, it's the person you talked to the most. 

Now, who was the third person to exit the Normandy on that paradise world for you all? Because, I always get Javik in my games for some odd reason..

[Theodoro]

lillitheris wrote...

karmensandiego wrote...

What if even with the Destroy ending Shep died, and the ONLY ending with a possibility of Shep and Liara reuniting, of Shep living was Synthesis. 

My question:

Would you then choose this?

Me: hell yes!  (what?  I didn't say I was a big enough person to let the whole "egomanical, choosing for everyone" moral repercussions stop me from my happy Liara ending dammit!)

No.

Although the good thing about Shepard living in Synthesis is that we could put him on trial and have him hanged.

Couldn't agree more. I would not impose such an atrocity on everyone like that just because Shepard and Liara could be together - and they wouldn't even be entirely themselves anymore, so what difference does it make? They're homogenized just like everyone else. And Shepard is anything like himself/herself after making that decision, he/she would have to actually live with it for the rest of his/her life.

CrimsonN7 wrote...

Quick question, onboard the Normandy during the evacuation scene who told Joker to leave in yours?I brought Garrus and Liara to the beam so Ashley told Joker to go in mine. I heardits whoever you talk to most frequently on the Normandy excluding thosewho run with you to the beam, I could be wrong though[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png[/smilie]

Well, Javik told Joker to leave in my case, and I it might be so because I got him early in the game and haven't really talked to James that much, and Garrus and Liara were on the run to the beam for me, as well.

Modifié par Theodoro, 06 juillet 2012 - 08:57 .

[Pineappletree]

PMC65 wrote...
FdL_Ananas - The negative to the destroy is that the geth and EDI are wiped out so many people struggle with that choice. They want both Shepard and EDI and the geth to live.

[...]

Yeah, in theory those deaths are the big downside. But because of the way it's presented, they just didn't feel that impactful to me, especially with the EC now.
But different things work for different people. And it obviously did work for your nephew. Poor guy.

Wulfram wrote...
[...]

Though long term I do wonder if an aging Shepard and a still young Liara will still work together. What they want from life may end up drifting apart.

Completely depends on your personal view regarding Shep's aging process I guess. My personal take is similar to PMC's, with Shepard living a full, normal human life but not growing that old. And since Asari are so long lived and patient (remember the Asari in ME2 that talked about simply outliving a bad relationship with a human or salarian) and allready have a philosophical approach to the problem (as Liara tells us in ME1, I think?), a life of 50 or something years together would probably work rather well.

If on the other hand Shep does age rather slowly and it comes down to 100+ years of "pensioner Shep" it might get a bit complicated.

karmensandiego wrote...
[...]

Would you then choose this?

I'd certainly be tempted, but would probably start headcanoning around it in some way instead.
Thanks to the vanilla ME3 ending I had a reasonable amount of training in it after all.

Modifié par FdL_Ananas, 06 juillet 2012 - 08:58 .

[CrimsonN7]

karmensandiego wrote...

So we're just looking at destroy and control.  I'm not arguing for one of the other, they both have merits.  I for one picked destroy because I'm a sucker for happy endings and I wanted my Shep to reunite with Liara.  Destroy was the only choice that allowed this.  It was an easy decision not just because of the living Shep at the end, but because the destroy ending was the one we'd been working towards for 3 whole games.  It seemed in line with what Shepard had always thought and wanted.

BUT!!!!  (see the bold and italics and underlining?!!!  That means something important is coming...)

What if even with the Destroy ending Shep died, and the ONLY ending with a possibility of Shep and Liara reuniting, of Shep living was Synthesis. 

My question:

Would you then choose this?

Me: hell yes!  (what?  I didn't say I was a big enough person to let the whole "egomanical, choosing for everyone" moral repercussions stop me from my happy Liara ending dammit!)

As much as I love a happy ending, no I would never choose Synthesis ever, it's unethical, contradicts the celebration of all the different races diversity and our unification despite our differences which is a huge concept throughout the series. After reject it is the worst ending, it's repulsive IMO.:sick:The Reapers logic is so warped, who the hell are they to determine what is the pinnicle of evolution, blow the b*stards up:devil:, also with Control the phrase absolute power corrupts absolutely, I could see that happening:whistle: 

Modifié par CrimsonN7, 06 juillet 2012 - 08:58 .

[Ravii]

Master Shiori wrote...

CrimsonN7 wrote...


Quick question, onboard the Normandy during the evacuation scene who told Joker to leave in yours?I brought Garrus and Liara to the beam so Ashley told Joker to go in mine. I heard its whoever you talk to most frequently on the Normandy excluding those who run with you to the beam, I could be wrong though:whistle:

It's either Garrus or Ashley, depending on who I brought with me to the beam. And yes, it's the person you talked to the most. 

Now, who was the third person to exit the Normandy on that paradise world for you all? Because, I always get Javik in my games for some odd reason..

me2. I think you get javik all the time because he has soooo much dialogue with shepard and all other crewmembers. and if you recruit javik righ after the first time you visit the citadel it makes sense.

Modifié par Ravii, 06 juillet 2012 - 08:59 .

[TheMarshal]

CrimsonN7 wrote...
Quick question, onboard the Normandy during the evacuation scene who told Joker to leave in yours?I brought Garrus and Liara to the beam so Ashley told Joker to go in mine. I heard its whoever you talk to most frequently on the Normandy excluding those who run with you to the beam, I could be wrong though:whistle:

I brought Garrus and Liara with me to the beam and wound up having Javik (who I'd never taken with me on a mission) tenderly telling Joker that they had to leave.  It was strange.

[Pineappletree]

CrimsonN7 wrote...
Quick question, onboard the Normandy during the evacuation scene who told Joker to leave in yours?I brought Garrus and Liara to the beam so Ashley told Joker to go in mine. I heard its whoever you talk to most frequently on the Normandy excluding those who run with you to the beam, I could be wrong though:whistle:

Had the same outcome as you. Took Garrus and Liara, had Ash standing behind Joker.
No idea what influences this, though ...

[DOsquareZER]

CrimsonN7 wrote...
Quick question, onboard the Normandy during the evacuation scene who told Joker to leave in yours?I brought Garrus and Liara to the beam so Ashley told Joker to go in mine. I heard its whoever you talk to most frequently on the Normandy excluding those who run with you to the beam, I could be wrong though:whistle:

Took  Garrus and Liara - I get ash for the "lets go joker" scene - and javik for the third out of the normandy scene.  I guess ashley didn't support my decision for my chosen ending as much as javik did?  unless i choose syntehsis - then javik looks very much violated in the memorial scene and Im sure would murder shepard should his/her...essence return to a physical form.

Modifié par doozer12, 06 juillet 2012 - 09:06 .

[lillitheris]

TheMarshal wrote...

CrimsonN7 wrote...
Quick question, onboard the Normandy during the evacuation scene who told Joker to leave in yours?I brought Garrus and Liara to the beam so Ashley told Joker to go in mine. I heard its whoever you talk to most frequently on the Normandy excluding those who run with you to the beam, I could be wrong though:whistle:

I brought Garrus and Liara with me to the beam and wound up having Javik (who I'd never taken with me on a mission) tenderly telling Joker that they had to leave.  It was strange.

“I will throw her out— Wait, she already is outside the airlock. Let us leave, frail pilot man.”

[adneate]

EDIT: As for who told Joker to leave, for me it was Kaidan. Then Liara and Garrus walked out.

frudi wrote...
All the discussion about life spans and ageing... am I the only one that headcanons Shepard actually outliving Liara? Hm, probably am, I can be weird that way.

Not really I thought about the same thing Shepard not being really aware that she's that synthetic, looks in the mirror after 150 years and hasn't aged a day. The Human members of her team start passing away, then the aliens, even the Krogan Wrex and Grunt are gone. Their expected lives being totally reversed as Liara's face grows gaunt with the passing centuries and Shepard still looking like a 30 year old. As the genuine fear starts to set in that she'll out live even Liara and be the last ragged forgotten relic of a war the Galaxy only reads about in textbooks.

A living legacy that nobody will even believe is the actual legendary Commander Shepard, vanquisher of the dread Reapers. Or cursed by the Reapers to see time as they do, as punishment for the defiance of the cycle.

Though that last one is a little magicky, even if the totally shattered endings could support the concept.

Modifié par adneate, 06 juillet 2012 - 09:06 .

[Mavqt]

frudi wrote...
All the discussion about life spans and ageing... am I the only one that headcanons Shepard actually outliving Liara? Hm, probably am, I can be weird that way

I headcanoned Shep living longer, Maybe double to the 150 age expectancy of the me universe.
I doubted the cybernetics would last longer, also depends how they work. If they replace old cells with "new" cells(hard to describe without as HUGE wall of text) or if they keep the same process as we currently do.

[Ravii]

but how does it count for your crewmember talk? everytime you hit spacebar or everytime you hear new dialogue's?

[PMC65]

lillitheris wrote...

PMC65 wrote...

Since the asari in their maiden years are all about experiencing life it would not have been out of character though for her to move on from Shepard. Had that happened in LotSB ... "Shepard, I'm only 108 years old ... I am too young to really settle down. We asari do not have a need for nesting until much later ... but if you don't mind sharing me with others." How would the fan base have taken that? It fits the asari cycle …

I don’t think I’d be that prescriptive about it — and there are significant differences between individuals, surely, or Liara would’ve been in Chora’s Den, not Therum…

Just like humans, we tend to have an exciting time between the ages of 15 and 25 (or 30 nowadays), but it’s not in any way uncommon to start long — even lifelong — relationships during that timeframe.

With Thane there was talk if you romanced him that it might be possible for him to live and in LotSB there was a tease that a cure might be available.

They should’ve just left the death out. That way headcanon/fic could have gone any which way on the cure.

(“Unity” spoiler: Thane’s death is actually one of the few I retconned out. Kal’Reegar’s also around, the ‘death’ was a ruse.)

In playing ME1 and reading the codex I had my doubts about Shepard picking Liara over Kaidan. She was a maiden and Shepard a matron. Seeing how sexually free the asari were made me pause ... along with the age difference. Then when the confrontation came and she didn't bat an eye on the threesome my worry only increased but went forward thinking if in ME2 she moved on so be it.

ME2 made me think that yep, she was off on another adventure ... bye, bye Shepard. I wasn't mad (although Shepard was hurt) and had there been another option (sorry Jacob, Thane & Garrus) Shepard might have moved on out of that hurt. Then came LotSB ... I was waiting on Liara to confirm my suspicions and announce that she liked Feron and reminded Shepard where she was in her life span - The Maiden stage begins at puberty and is marked by the drive to explore and experience. Most young asari are curious and restless. This does fit Liara as she moves about researching the protheans. So she is not really unique and I've never thought that all asari are strippers or mercs ... especially those living in asari space. Strippers are probably not as in demand there.

Had she told Shepard that she was moving on or just wanting to be friends then I would have been ok because it was in line with the asari ... Yes, we have exceptions to every rule but either way would have been ok with me. That is one of the risks of choosing an asari. Luckily it worked out for the best.