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[ladyvader]

King Minos wrote...

Robhuzz so if you were Shepard and you saw David in that machine And the galaxy is about to become a victim of a mass organic genocide and keeping David in that machine to save a good couple thoasand innocent lives and you won't do it? One man suffering so thousands of lives is a fair choice, and times like Mass Effect 3, you can't afford to make choices based on good and evil and emotion, you got to think with logic, make choices that will save lives in the long run, David suffering will spare many many families the grief of losing someone close to them. I personally would keep him in if I knew there was a good amount of progress when he was stuck in and with a good chance of actually controlling the geth.

I wouldn't, not with him begging for it to stop the whole time.  There is a right way and a wrong way  of doing things and what Overlord was about is wrong. 

But this is getting off topic. 

[King Minos]

It's a gamble, most choices in mass effect is a gamble, freeing the rachni, keepin the collector station, letting Thanoptis live, overwriting or destroying Geth etc. It's bound to bite you in the ass at some point but with so much at risk you got to make a gamble, it might pay off well or speed up the process of genocide who knows? You can't make difficult decisions just because it's immoral, you got to think of it in the long run, If it works it culd improve chances of survival, if it don't work then we will end up paying for it, same with the Rachni and most obviously the collector station will have huge negatve or positive results.

[King Minos]

Ladyvader, what Mordin did to the Krogans was bad, immoral, infant Krogan die at birth, if they survive then a good chance they are sterile or infertile bu it was the logical choice, the Krogan were a threat. One species downfall saved alot of lives. I agree off topic. *poss imaginary picture of Liaa force feeding Shepard vegetables*.

[JKFerg]

Alright I think I have a topic. A lot of people ask "If you had to choose between your LI and blah blah....." In my case I would definately save Liara no matter what I was choosing her over. However, do you think Liara would do the same? Like if you chose to save Liara over saving a human city, do you think she would do the same if the roles were reversed?

[Robhuzz]

King Minos wrote...

Robhuzz so if you were Shepard and you saw David in that machine And the galaxy is about to become a victim of a mass organic genocide and keeping David in that machine to save a good couple thoasand innocent lives and you won't do it? One man suffering so thousands of lives is a fair choice, and times like Mass Effect 3, you can't afford to make choices based on good and evil and emotion, you got to think with logic, make choices that will save lives in the long run, David suffering will spare many many families the grief of losing someone close to them. I personally would keep him in if I knew there was a good amount of progress when he was stuck in and with a good chance of actually controlling the geth.

Like Ladyvader (think it was her) said, this is going offtopic but I'll answer this one. This whole thing was an experiment to control the geth and it didn't work, David could not handle interfacing with the VI, the latter proving too strong to control with a human mind. We simply don't know what happens if you do an experiment like this. Maybe it'll save lives, maybe we can influence the geth to fight for humanity. In my opinion, these maybe's are what I dislike about Cerberus. The willingness to sacrifice human (and other) lives for a chance to advance humanity. Overlord is no difference. At no time was it suggested that continuing project overlord would be good for humanity. Even if it was guaranteed, I would still get David out of there. No person deserves to be treated like this, no matter what.

[ladyvader]

King Minos wrote...

Ladyvader, what Mordin did to the Krogans was bad, immoral, infant Krogan die at birth, if they survive then a good chance they are sterile or infertile bu it was the logical choice, the Krogan were a threat. One species downfall saved alot of lives. I agree off topic. *poss imaginary picture of Liaa force feeding Shepard vegetables*.

And you noticed that Mordin also was very conflicted about it too.  Especially, after seeing what was going on during his LM.  Which is why he is helping the krogan in ME3.  Or it seems that way during the demo we say on the salarian homeworld.

[ladyvader]

JKFerg wrote...

Alright I think I have a topic. A lot of people ask "If you had to choose between your LI and blah blah....." In my case I would definately save Liara no matter what I was choosing her over. However, do you think Liara would do the same? Like if you chose to save Liara over saving a human city, do you think she would do the same if the roles were reversed?

She handed Shepard's body over to Cerberus even though she knew what they were like and would use Shepard for their own needs.  Which they did.

If she still has the 'I can't let you go' feelings, then I see her saving Shepard.  Not sure if she still doesn't have those feeling, but I think she does.

[Robhuzz]

JKFerg wrote...

Alright I think I have a topic. A lot of people ask "If you had to choose between your LI and blah blah....." In my case I would definately save Liara no matter what I was choosing her over. However, do you think Liara would do the same? Like if you chose to save Liara over saving a human city, do you think she would do the same if the roles were reversed?

By the time of ME2, Liara is largely paragade. A good spirited person at heart but aware and willing to make sacrifices. In this case, yes I think Liara would definitely save Shep's life over a human city. First because she won't want to lose Shepard again considering all the pain she went through the first time it happened but also because she sees the bigger picture. The people in this human city won't stop the Reapers, they can't. Shepard however can. So why let the one person who can give you a fighting chance get killed and save a bunch of people who won't make a difference anyway.

In short: Yes, Liara would sacrifice a whole lot to save Shepard, you can count on that. Same is true in reverse. A moment like 'Save your LI and an entire race dies' is of course rediculous and impossible so I'm not worried about that. A certain city or even a planet wiped out at the cost of saving Liara? You bet I'll do it without a backward look.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

ladyvader wrote...

King Minos wrote...

Ladyvader, what Mordin did to the Krogans was bad, immoral, infant Krogan die at birth, if they survive then a good chance they are sterile or infertile bu it was the logical choice, the Krogan were a threat. One species downfall saved alot of lives. I agree off topic. *poss imaginary picture of Liaa force feeding Shepard vegetables*.

And you noticed that Mordin also was very conflicted about it too.  Especially, after seeing what was going on during his LM.  Which is why he is helping the krogan in ME3.  Or it seems that way during the demo we say on the salarian homeworld.

I think Mordin is doing what he does in the ME3 out of sheer practical reasons.

[King Minos]

Ladyvader, who wouldn't be? It was an unfortunate and unavoidable but logical choice, it did stop the Krogan from becoming a serious threat. I would save Liara, unfortunately emotions will get in the way when close ones are in danger and their lives are at stake, but I will save Liara no matter what, she brought Shepard back and Shep needs to repay her. But vice verse? Shepard is an important person, one who can save the galaxy, so many people owe Shepard and many of the conflicting races are possible allies with Shepard. Shepard is the logical choice. But I'm also unsure if Liara has those I can't let you go feelings.

[JKFerg]

Robhuzz wrote...

JKFerg wrote...

Alright I think I have a topic. A lot of people ask "If you had to choose between your LI and blah blah....." In my case I would definately save Liara no matter what I was choosing her over. However, do you think Liara would do the same? Like if you chose to save Liara over saving a human city, do you think she would do the same if the roles were reversed?

By the time of ME2, Liara is largely paragade. A good spirited person at heart but aware and willing to make sacrifices. In this case, yes I think Liara would definitely save Shep's life over a human city. First because she won't want to lose Shepard again considering all the pain she went through the first time it happened but also because she sees the bigger picture. The people in this human city won't stop the Reapers, they can't. Shepard however can. So why let the one person who can give you a fighting chance get killed and save a bunch of people who won't make a difference anyway.

In short: Yes, Liara would sacrifice a whole lot to save Shepard, you can count on that. Same is true in reverse. A moment like 'Save your LI and an entire race dies' is of course rediculous and impossible so I'm not worried about that. A certain city or even a planet wiped out at the cost of saving Liara? You bet I'll do it without a backward look.

I was acutally thinking in Liara's case about sacrificing an asari city, but theres no real difference.  I think she would save shepard as well.  But before LOTSB came out I might have doubted it seeing as how she was boderline obsessed with the shadow broker and wouldn't come with Shep.

[King Minos]

Well if it was an Asari city, Liara would have to think long and hard. Completely understandable if another species city was being ravaged and you don't care but if it was a Human city you would be shocked. I wouldn't lose sleep if a Volus city got nuked.

[ladyvader]

King Minos wrote...

Ladyvader, who wouldn't be? It was an unfortunate and unavoidable but logical choice, it did stop the Krogan from becoming a serious threat. I would save Liara, unfortunately emotions will get in the way when close ones are in danger and their lives are at stake, but I will save Liara no matter what, she brought Shepard back and Shep needs to repay her. But vice verse? Shepard is an important person, one who can save the galaxy, so many people owe Shepard and many of the conflicting races are possible allies with Shepard. Shepard is the logical choice. But I'm also unsure if Liara has those I can't let you go feelings.

Actually, I do.  Because she didn't want to try it again until Shepard promises to always come back.  She will make sure Shepard comes back if that is within her power to do so. 

@Lizardviking

Mordin seems very upset before they got back to the Normandy.  But then, Mordin seems to have a the end justifies the means attitude towards things.

[Ophiskc]

If inevitable:
Would you save Liara over Thessia?
Would you save Liara over Earth?

and do you think Liara would save Shepard over Thessia?

Modifié par Ophiskc, 16 septembre 2011 - 06:27 .

[King Minos]

That's not fair Ophiskc Liara over Earth as Earth is doomed fromthe beginning. If Liara had a child then Thessia would be saved and Liara dies but the child carries on her mothers legacy. But Liara over Illium as well because Asari have long life spans and can mate with anyone, Asari are more immune to extinction then other species. If there were a 100 Humans left of varying ages and only one Asari left like Liara for example, Liara will outlive us Humans and Liara will still be young. Infact, I think two Asari's capable of recreating the Asari race, since no genetic material is swapped, incest is impossible unless mating with their own mother but as long as thy mate win the other Asari's children they are fine.

[Korkki]

Ophiskc wrote...

If inevitable:
Would you save Liara over Thessia?
Would you save Liara over Earth?

and do you think Liara would save Shepard over Thessia?

Well the only possible situation where I would save either of those planets instead of Liara would be if I knew that the reapers couldn't be defeated without that planet surviving. So that planet would contain something that is required to destroy the reapers, because in that case saving Liara wouldn't help, the galaxy would be doomed anyway. But in any other situation I would save Liara, I would save her over any planet. If not for any logical reason, just because I want to know how Liara and Shep's story will conclude after the reapers are fought off.

And Yes I think Liara would save Shepard even over Thessia since Shepard is basicly the only person in the galaxy who can unite the races against the reapers and beat them.

[Robhuzz]

Ophiskc wrote...

If inevitable:
Would you save Liara over Thessia?
Would you save Liara over Earth?

and do you think Liara would save Shepard over Thessia?

I can't picture a scene like this so impossible to answer. How can saving 1 person lead to wiping out an entire planet?

Shepard: Liara! What happened to you?
Liara: No time to explain. There are 2 buttons, red and blue over there! *nods*
Shepard: What do they do?
Liara: The blue one releases me but Earth will blow up
Shepard: And the red one?
Liara: You can save Earth by pressing it but I will magically die!

Right... didn't think so:P

[WoolyJoe]

King Minos wrote...

Robhuzz so if you were Shepard and you saw David in that machine And the galaxy is about to become a victim of a mass organic genocide and keeping David in that machine to save a good couple thoasand innocent lives and you won't do it? One man suffering so thousands of lives is a fair choice, and times like Mass Effect 3, you can't afford to make choices based on good and evil and emotion, you got to think with logic, make choices that will save lives in the long run, David suffering will spare many many families the grief of losing someone close to them. I personally would keep him in if I knew there was a good amount of progress when he was stuck in and with a good chance of actually controlling the geth.

Sorry, buddy, but the answer's 'No'. Whether it saves people or not isn't the issue. It's unethical. Same reason a nation would go to war over a few - it's the right thing to do. It's what makes us human

[King Minos]

Somehow I forgot but infact, one single Asari can proberly recreate the Asari race, they literally are immune to extinction unless hunted down one by one, they can mate with anyone and live way longer than any species apart from Krogan, I'm surprised they have not had a population bloom like the Krogan did, the Asari are actually quite a threat to other species.

[ladyvader]

Ophiskc wrote...

If inevitable:
Would you save Liara over Thessia?
Would you save Liara over Earth?

and do you think Liara would save Shepard over Thessia?

By the time Shepard gets back to Earth, it might be a lost cause.

Yes I would save Liara, or atleast Leia would.  Not sure about my other Sheps.

I really don't know about Liara saving Shepard over Thessia.  She might.  That one is tough.

[Ophiskc]

King Minos wrote...

That's not fair Ophiskc Liara over Earth as Earth is doomed fromthe beginning. If Liara had a child then Thessia would be saved and Liara dies but the child carries on her mothers legacy. But Liara over Illium as well because Asari have long life spans and can mate with anyone, Asari are more immune to extinction then other species. If there were a 100 Humans left of varying ages and only one Asari left like Liara for example, Liara will outlive us Humans and Liara will still be young. Infact, I think two Asari's capable of recreating the Asari race, since no genetic material is swapped, incest is impossible unless mating with their own mother but as long as thy mate win the other Asari's children they are fine.

Is suppose we're fighting in ME3 in big part to save Earth also, so i dont think is doomed yet.
Liara has no child and no chance she will decide to give birth to one in the middle of a fight

To save Liara over Thessia is a hard decision for me, asaris keep the balance on the galaxy, them losing political power could eventually doom everything after the war, i imagine races fighting for dominance and those kind of things.
But in the other hand, at this point Liara is the reason why my Shepard is still fighting, so she might act selfish and save Liara without looking back

[HogarthHughes 3]

Ophiskc wrote...

If inevitable:
Would you save Liara over Thessia?
Would you save Liara over Earth?

and do you think Liara would save Shepard over Thessia?

No
No

Hopefully not

Personal feelings have no place in making such decisions.

[King Minos]

WoolyJoe: you would risk thousands of innocent lives, men women and children just to save a single lone man who is possibly so traumatised and physically disabled that it would be more humane just to put a bullet in his head then let him live in his condition? Putting a bullet in his head would be a waste of time, unethical or not you would be saving lives who in turn can be given atleast basic training and sent of to a area to defend those more unfortunate and vulnerable to an invasion. I'm not a Cerberus fan but I believe in their goals, just not the way they try to reach the goals, Jacks situation? There was no need for that at all.

[Korkki]

King Minos wrote...

Somehow I forgot but infact, one single Asari can proberly recreate the Asari race, they literally are immune to extinction unless hunted down one by one, they can mate with anyone and live way longer than any species apart from Krogan, I'm surprised they have not had a population bloom like the Krogan did, the Asari are actually quite a threat to other species.

Well the galaxy is quite big a place, so there should be enough room for everyone. And yes asaris live long lives and they clonise new worlds, BUT unlike the Krogan, they're goal is not to violently destroy and enslave every other race they'll meet. At least IMO they're living quite peacefully with humans and other races on various worlds, for example on Illium, Noveria and the Citadel. With the Krogan the problem was that they met the technological development before cultural one, when they were used in the Rachni wars. It's like Mordin said, like giving nuclear weapons to the cave men.

[WoolyJoe]

ladyvader wrote...

Ophiskc wrote...

If inevitable:
Would you save Liara over Thessia?
Would you save Liara over Earth?

and do you think Liara would save Shepard over Thessia?

By the time Shepard gets back to Earth, it might be a lost cause.

Yes I would save Liara, or atleast Leia would.  Not sure about my other Sheps.

I really don't know about Liara saving Shepard over Thessia.  She might.  That one is tough.

It might depend on the Shepard

A resolute Paragon would want Thessia saved, reagardless of their own safety
A Renegade, however, might think they're worth saving - not a vanity or ego thing, but they could see themselves as the only person who can stop the Reapers

Decisions, decisions....