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[PMC65]

diamondedge wrote...

That's the thing I find so awesome about the whole mind sex thing; it's far easier to sleep with someone (as in sex in human terms) than to let them know our most intimate things about ourselves.
For me, personally, that would be far harder as I am rather private individual. But in case of Liara, there is no forceful requirements - it's about two people in love who trust each other completely, who don't know quite where it's taking them but are convinced this is what they both want.

It's about one's willingness to become and remain vulnerable. I can see how Liara wasn't kidding when she said it can be a life-changing event. I'd die to be able to experience such thing for just once in my life, to be able to share things like that.

And I don't have a problem with others embracing eternity if that were an option in real life. 

I am just speaking for me ... That part of the asari world leaves me shaking my head "no".

A fact that I actually enjoy since it makes the relationship more interesting. To love someone that experiences pleasure in a way that throws you off or makes you absolutely uncomfortable. Talk about a hurdle to a relationship. 

TOP:

Modifié par PMC65, 31 octobre 2011 - 04:27 .

[PMC65]

TMA LIVE wrote...

She's handing her mind to you at the same time. It simple comes down to you not trusting her with you mind.

It's like if your wife is willing to share her secrets, but you're not willing to do the same. She trusts you. You don't.

Trust isn't black or white. There are different levels of trust and people earn each level. As the relationship moves forward you begin to allow them just a little more access to who you are .. or at least I do. Maybe there are people out there who after the first date, first month, first year .. open the doors and say here you go. But in all that process you are deciding.

Everyone has boundaries. I never required or expected my former girlfriend to tell me everything about herself. Just what she wanted to share and I was okay with that. Because of that type of trust we are still friends and can come to each other knowing that we will not be judged.

In the meld we have to give an absolute 100% trust level that what she is saying is true and that she is not seeing or doing things unknown to you. Do you risk it? Some people would while others would decline that ride. There is no right or wrong answer just your own personal choice.

[TMA LIVE]

And your personal choice is that you don't trust her.

[PMC65]

TMA LIVE wrote...

And your personal choice is that you don't trust her.

LOL!!!!

If that makes it easy for you to understand then yes ... "me no trust anyone other than myself up inside my brain."

[Blze001]

PMC65 wrote...
 "me no trust anyone other than myself up inside my brain."

Even that is risky, amirite?

I dunno, any other time I wouldn't want anyone poking my brain... but if the stakes were galactic war and/or extinction I'd probably risk it.

Modifié par Blze001, 31 octobre 2011 - 05:09 .

[Korkki]

@PMC65

I understand your point actually. Every people have secrets they're not willing to share with anyone else. Some people have "darker" secrets than others but still I believe everyone have something they don't want to tell anyone else. I think the melding would be really awesome experience but you have to pick your partner very very carefully, so it's not just someone you've picked up at bar or something. I quess that the key is, that when you're willing to give all you secrets and your whole mind to this other person, she is willing to do it too, so it's all based on mutual 100% trust. I wonder if you're able to control how much of yourself and your mind you're giving to that other person during a meld or is it more like everything or nothing kind of thing...

[RolandX9]

diamondedge wrote...

That's the thing I find so awesome about the whole mind sex thing; it's far easier to sleep with someone (as in sex in human terms) than to let them know our most intimate things about ourselves.

It just hit me - this really drives home Liara's loyalty. Let's think about this for a moment. Romance or no romance, Paragon or Renegade, Therum first or last, Liara's been in Shepard's mind, seen him/her at the best and worst, knows Shep better than anyone except (maybe) Shepard him/herself...and does whatever it takes to rescue the body on the slimmest of chances that Cerberus will pull off a miracle. No matter what.

Not all of my Shepards are romancing her, but every last one of them will make anyone who messes with Liara very, very sorry.

[Pariah Culexus]

Do we even know that the melding transfers concrete information? I though it was more about feelings and emotions.

We know that the asari can transfer specific information either to or from their own mind, as Liara and Shiala does with Shepard and as Banezia does with the Rachni Queen; but neither of those was doing a melding and even in those circumstance it is about very specific pieces of information (the vision, cypher and location of the Mu relay respectively) rather than everything within a persons mind.
Shepard certainly don't know everything about Liara after she has been into his/her mind.

I assumed that a melding or union was more about what we felt than what we thought (for each other, but perhaps also more generally).  

Modifié par Pariah Culexus, 31 octobre 2011 - 05:29 .

[kumquats]

Pariah Culexus wrote...

Do we even know that the melding transfers concrete information? I though it was more about feelings and emotions.

We know that the asari can transfer specific information either to or from their own mind, as Liara and Shiala does with Shepard and as Banezia does with the Rachni Queen; but neither of those was doing a melding.

I assumed that a melding or union was more about what we felt than what we thought (for each other, but perhaps also more generally).  

As far as I understood Liara in ME1, a union, is far more than a melding, it merges two personalities into one entity.
My Shepard's reaction was: " That's a little strange for me."
It's hard to understand without experiencing it, that's how I feel about the whole union thing.

[Robhuzz]

kumquats wrote...

Pariah Culexus wrote...

Do we even know that the melding transfers concrete information? I though it was more about feelings and emotions.

We know that the asari can transfer specific information either to or from their own mind, as Liara and Shiala does with Shepard and as Banezia does with the Rachni Queen; but neither of those was doing a melding.

I assumed that a melding or union was more about what we felt than what we thought (for each other, but perhaps also more generally).  

As far as I understood Liara in ME1, a union, is far more than a melding, it merges two personalities into one entity.
My Shepard's reaction was: " That's a little strange for me."
It's hard to understand without experiencing it, that's how I feel about the whole union thing.

Which is why I wouldn't mind to experience it at least once:whistle:

[Pariah Culexus]

kumquats wrote...

Pariah Culexus wrote...

Do we even know that the melding transfers concrete information? I though it was more about feelings and emotions.

We know that the asari can transfer specific information either to or from their own mind, as Liara and Shiala does with Shepard and as Banezia does with the Rachni Queen; but neither of those was doing a melding.

I assumed that a melding or union was more about what we felt than what we thought (for each other, but perhaps also more generally).  

As far as I understood Liara in ME1, a union, is far more than a melding, it merges two personalities into one entity.
My Shepard's reaction was: " That's a little strange for me."
It's hard to understand without experiencing it, that's how I feel about the whole union thing.

DO we know what the difference between a melding and union actually is?, I assume that what Liara and Shepard did after Feros/Virmire was a melding and what they did at the end of the game was a union?.

[kumquats]

Pariah Culexus wrote...

DO we know what the difference between a melding and union actually is?, I assume that what Liara and Shepard did after Feros/Virmire was a melding and what they did at the end of the game was a union?.

Only what Liara tells Shepard in ME1. She talks about the union when you choose the: " A spiritual exchange?" option.
I assume, that melding is an exchange of information, but the union is more about becoming one personality.
But it's all very cryptic for me.

[Edit]

This is from the ME wiki:

An asari's melding ability extends to a mental connection as well, which Liara describes as being the true union between an asari and her partner. It allows the asari to explore her partner's genetic heritage and pass desirable traits on to any offspring. During mating an asari and her partner share memories, thoughts, and feelings. It is also possible for an asari to meld with another for the sole purpose of transferring thoughts, without reproduction. This technique is used by both Liara and Shiala, with varying success; Liara finds the ordeal extremely intense and debilitating.

Modifié par kumquats, 31 octobre 2011 - 06:52 .

[diamondedge]

It just hit me - this really drives home Liara's loyalty. Let's think about this for a moment. Romance or no romance, Paragon or Renegade, Therum first or last, Liara's been in Shepard's mind, seen him/her at the best and worst, knows Shep better than anyone except (maybe) Shepard him/herself...and does whatever it takes to rescue the body on the slimmest of chances that Cerberus will pull off a miracle. No matter what.

Not all of my Shepards are romancing her, but every last one of them will make anyone who messes with Liara very, very sorry.

I agree. Shepard owes Liara - well - everything. Even if not romanced she is by far the most supportive and friendly character out there.

[PMC65]

For me, melding has potential outcomes that make me take a pass ...

A) Melding is 100% consensual and transparent. Both parties understand what each other is doing and can stop the ride at anytime. This is what most people are hoping for ... I think, but who knows.

Melding is controlled exclusively by asari and they can, without your knowledge, see all the corners of your mind. The shame, regret, secrets, etc that you have hidden away for years. This knowledge could be used by the asari to manipulate you (even people who love each other sometimes do this so I am not referencing "evil" asari here). Also in moments of anger your hidden shames could be thrown at you or when you break up ... Oh, the things they have on you.

C) They leave you a depleted corpse (Ardat-Yakshi surprise). 

Risks B & C make me take a pass on trying out the meld if it were in real life. 

But since it is a game, I push my Shepard forward and know that I can always hit replay if needed.

[Soccer FeverMan]

diamondedge wrote...

It just hit me - this really drives home Liara's loyalty. Let's think about this for a moment. Romance or no romance, Paragon or Renegade, Therum first or last, Liara's been in Shepard's mind, seen him/her at the best and worst, knows Shep better than anyone except (maybe) Shepard him/herself...and does whatever it takes to rescue the body on the slimmest of chances that Cerberus will pull off a miracle. No matter what.

Not all of my Shepards are romancing her, but every last one of them will make anyone who messes with Liara very, very sorry.

I agree. Shepard owes Liara - well - everything. Even if not romanced she is by far the most supportive and friendly character out there.

Shepard does not owe her sh*t, Shepard doesn't owe Cerberus sh*t, Shepard owes no one sh*t, everyone owes Shepard.

Im tired of people saying Shepard owes people especially Liara and Cerberus. In retrospect Shepard and Liara are even considering the fact he saved her on Therum.

[Soccer FeverMan]

Pockles wrote...
I'm certain those fifteen billion people that are left to die because you think Liara is cute will see the undeniable fairness of your argument.

I know I shouldn't expect everyone to have the empathy and emotional maturity required to see a multitude of people as anything more than an abstract concept. Sometimes I'm too optimistic for my own good. We've been over this before though, and it's not a subject that I can discuss politely. Time to press on.

If makes you feel just a little bit better i would sacrifice Liara for the 15 Billion people. Im in line with the way your thinking.

Modifié par Soccer FeverMan, 31 octobre 2011 - 11:02 .

[Pinkflu]

Hey all. New screencap of Liara from tonight's Pulse episode. The quality is bad. Blame Bioware, not me!



Also, I think there's a glimpse of Liara at 2:35 in red armour. The collector's edition reskin?

http://www.livestrea...medium=ui-thumb

[PMC65]

Soccer FeverMan wrote...

Shepard does not owe her sh*t, Shepard doesn't owe Cerberus sh*t, Shepard owes no one sh*t, everyone owes Shepard.

Im tired of people saying Shepard owes people especially Liara and Cerberus. In retrospect Shepard and Liara are even considering the fact he saved her on Therum.

Reading this made me hear Simon & Garfunkel's "I am a Rock".

Shepard did not get to where she is today all on her lonesome. There were influences starting from birth and it continued through the ME events to date.
 
Nihlus picked her for a potential Spectre, Anderson picked her to be on the Normandy (maybe because of Nihlus), Tali showed Saren to be a traitor and as such gave Shepard the opening to become a Spectre, Benezia in a moment of clarity gave intel that helped them get to Ilos, Liara retrieved the Commander's body, Miranda was the project leader to revive the Commander, etc. etc. etc.

Life is a series of dominoes.

No successful person gets to where they are all on their own. Shepard is no exception.

But I agree that while she has had help, she has also saved everyone 10xover to not have to send thank you cards. The galaxy will be saved by Shepard and the teams that she (or he) has led starting with ME1. All of the characters played an important role and should be remembered ... But Shepard was the leader and the hero of the story.

Or at least in my story.

[diamondedge]

Shepard does not owe her sh*t, Shepard doesn't owe Cerberus sh*t, Shepard owes no one sh*t, everyone owes Shepard.

Im tired of people saying Shepard owes people especially Liara and Cerberus. In retrospect Shepard and Liara are even considering the fact he saved her on Therum.

Relax, keyboard warrior.

My Shepard is one of the people aware that he can't do jack sh*t himself and actually apreciates the stuff that's been done for him by others. So yes, I do fu*king think people have done favors to Shepard and made it possible for him to pull it off, and that he/she should be grateful without taking them for granted because he/she happens to be the hero of the galaxy.

EDIT:
It seems I have found other, like minded individuals. Cheers, PMC65.

Modifié par diamondedge, 31 octobre 2011 - 11:22 .

[karmensandiego]

ladyvader wrote...

And I have a bad bad feeling, I'm going to be rewriting my fanfics once ME3 is out.  I think some people won't be there at the end.  (ie, Anderson, Hannah Shepard)

HEY HEY HEY!!!!  Don't rewrite your fanfic!!!  Just write NEW fanfic!!! 

[RolandX9]

Soccer FeverMan wrote...

diamondedge wrote...

It just hit me - this really drives home Liara's loyalty. Let's think about this for a moment. Romance or no romance, Paragon or Renegade, Therum first or last, Liara's been in Shepard's mind, seen him/her at the best and worst, knows Shep better than anyone except (maybe) Shepard him/herself...and does whatever it takes to rescue the body on the slimmest of chances that Cerberus will pull off a miracle. No matter what.

Not all of my Shepards are romancing her, but every last one of them will make anyone who messes with Liara very, very sorry.

I agree. Shepard owes Liara - well - everything. Even if not romanced she is by far the most supportive and friendly character out there.

Shepard does not owe her sh*t, Shepard doesn't owe Cerberus sh*t, Shepard owes no one sh*t, everyone owes Shepard. 

Im tired of people saying Shepard owes people especially Liara and Cerberus. In retrospect Shepard and Liara are even considering the fact he saved her on Therum.

Sure, Shepard rescued Liara, and took some pretty big risks to do so. But a heavily armed marine and his two walking superweapon partners bailing out a potential lead from one krogan and some geth do not equal one traumatized archaeologist and her untrustworthy triple-agent rescuing you from a hyper-advanced species and the galaxy's most powerful fixer...after you're dead...because she cares that much, regardless of romance. This after she helped you hunt down her own mother (and possibly fought with you against her).





My Shepards, Paragon or Renegade, stand by their crewmates. Anyone messes with Liara, though, and Shep will end them.

Modifié par RolandX9, 01 novembre 2011 - 10:38 .

[ladyvader]

karmensandiego wrote...

ladyvader wrote...

And I have a bad bad feeling, I'm going to be rewriting my fanfics once ME3 is out.  I think some people won't be there at the end.  (ie, Anderson, Hannah Shepard)

HEY HEY HEY!!!!  Don't rewrite your fanfic!!!  Just write NEW fanfic!!! 

I'll do that too.  If I'm inspired enough to do so.  Right now, I feel I will still want to be writing.  The story I'm working on now, Hannah's in it quite a bit.  Which is why I really don't want her to die in ME3. 

Shepard/Liara's children need at one grand parent.  I'm still unsure where Aethytha fits in all of this.    Or I haven't written her in yet.  


ETA:
And for those that mess with Liara, well they'll get the yahg treatment.

Modifié par ladyvader, 01 novembre 2011 - 02:59 .

[swordmalice]

Sorry if this has been discussed already but I wanted to know what my fellow Liara fans thought about this - in LoTSB, after killing Tela Vasir Shep confronts Liara about their relationship if you romanced her in ME1. When Shep sarcastically asks if Liara is only glad to have him around because there "might be some terminals you need me to hack...". Liara then accuses him of not being fair, and uses the excuse "You were dead" to explain herself. What exactly is she saying by that? Sure he was dead but Liara knew that he'd be coming back...I dunno, what do you guys think?

[ladyvader]

swordmalice wrote...

Sorry if this has been discussed already but I wanted to know what my fellow Liara fans thought about this - in LoTSB, after killing Tela Vasir Shep confronts Liara about their relationship if you romanced her in ME1. When Shep sarcastically asks if Liara is only glad to have him around because there "might be some terminals you need me to hack...". Liara then accuses him of not being fair, and uses the excuse "You were dead" to explain herself. What exactly is she saying by that? Sure he was dead but Liara knew that he'd be coming back...I dunno, what do you guys think?

Liara only had Cerberus' word that they could bring Shepard back.  Liara also knew at the end of the comic, that Shepard was in bad bad shape and there was a chance Cerberus couldn't do what they said.  After that she focuses on taking out the Shadow Broker.  Liara was still griving for Shepard when Shepard walked into her office on Illium. 

BroShep might have sounded sarcastically(not to me he didn't), but  femShep actually sounded a bit pissed off about it.  At that point both Shepard and Liara were very snippy with each other.  That is how I viewed I from the first time I played.  I was like wow, their first fight.  One dead yahg later, all is right in the galaxy.

[Korkki]

ladyvader wrote...

I'll do that too.  If I'm inspired enough to do so.  Right now, I feel I will still want to be writing.  The story I'm working on now, Hannah's in it quite a bit.  Which is why I really don't want her to die in ME3. 

Shepard/Liara's children need at one grand parent.  I'm still unsure where Aethytha fits in all of this.    Or I haven't written her in yet.  

Hey I just wanted to tell you that I finished reading The Aftermath day before yesterday and I really liked it. It was very very good:wizard: I also read those two chapters of A Family Vacation and I'm now waiting for more. Only problem with your fan fics was that I had some trouble at first to really understand that Shepard is now female because I'm a male Shep player, but that has nothing to do with you or your writing, it's just my problem, not yours

And for all of you, I had this "Mass Effect moment of a day" today when I happened to hear this Don't Fear the Reaper by Blue Oyster Cult. The rest of the day I was just singing "Come on baby don't fear the reaper..." And I know that song has nothing to do with ME but the reaper you know?

Edit: Oh, wait, there is now chapter 3 of A Family Vacation. Yay, something for me to do this evening

Modifié par Korkki, 01 novembre 2011 - 03:25 .