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♂♂ • ♀♀ For The Love — The Same-Sex Romance Discussion Thread **may contain spoilers**


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#7101
Abispa

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@ Cathey -- I don't plan on playing gay Shepard much myself, but the thing that REALLY gets on my nerves from s/s critics is not so much their worrying about ninjamances, it's the line that can be paraphrased as "But s/he's my s/s Shepard's buddy/sista/bro!" as though finding out that the person who has fought by your side against incredible odds is now bi wipes away his/her history of heroism/badass.

It isn't even so much that the character is bi since Bioware has said that players will have to basically "turn on" that feature. From their comments that means you will have, let's say, the same old Garrus UNLESS you pick the romance option. He never hits on male Shepard or suddenly wants to massage you in a tent, but just SEEING that "heart" icon or equivalent is enough to ruin immersion.

Modifié par Abispa, 26 juillet 2011 - 08:26 .


#7102
Abispa

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silentassassin264 wrote...

Quething wrote...

I think I would actually shell out $2 US for a DLC that just added lines like that to ME2. "Actually, Aria, I appreciate the thought, but I'd rather have a nice young woman." "Sorry, Shiala, I'm holding out for Kaidan." "I. AM. NOT. INTERESTED. GODDAMNIT."

The only reason I would shell out $2 for Aria lines was if it was my femshep getting to say something along the lines of "Actually, I would much rather have you.":wub:


After playing Dragon Age 2, I REALLY want the option for Shepard to be able to hit on anything with a pulse. NOT because I want more "action," but because I want to have at least a dozen or so people brush him/her off, get mad, or even tell him/her to go to hell. Just because I support expanded romance options doesn't mean I believe Shepard should be able to service anybody.

EXAMPLE --

SHEPARD -- Are there fish in the lakes?

PRESIDIUM GROUNDS KEEPER -- You know, I get that question a lot! Almost as often as I get, "Where's the bathroom?"

SHEPARD *Heart option* -- That's fascinating. You want to have sex?

P.G.K. -- Listen, jackass! You ain't my type! I'm GAY! I only like male Turians! Why don't you get ninjamanced by the Consort? Sheesh!

Modifié par Abispa, 26 juillet 2011 - 08:33 .


#7103
Kaiser_Wilhelm

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Abispa wrote...

silentassassin264 wrote...

Quething wrote...

I think I would actually shell out $2 US for a DLC that just added lines like that to ME2. "Actually, Aria, I appreciate the thought, but I'd rather have a nice young woman." "Sorry, Shiala, I'm holding out for Kaidan." "I. AM. NOT. INTERESTED. GODDAMNIT."

The only reason I would shell out $2 for Aria lines was if it was my femshep getting to say something along the lines of "Actually, I would much rather have you.":wub:


After playing Dragon Age 2, I REALLY want the option for Shepard to be able to hit on anything with a pulse. NOT because I want more "action," but because I want to have at least a dozen or so people brush him/her off, get mad, or even tell him/her to go to hell. Just because I support expanded romance options doesn't mean I believe Shepard should be able to service anybody.

EXAMPLE --

SHEPARD -- Are there fish in the lakes?

PRESIDIUM GROUNDS KEEPER -- You know, I get that question a lot! Almost as often as I get, "Where's the bathroom?"

SHEPARD *Heart option* -- That's fascinating. You want to have sex?

P.G.K. -- Listen, jackass! You ain't my type! I'm GAY! I only like male Turians! Why don't you get ninjamanced by the Consort? Sheesh!


It'd be funny to see Shepard's magical speech skills turned down for once. Kind of like this

Modifié par Kaiser_Wilhelm, 26 juillet 2011 - 08:35 .


#7104
silentassassin264

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I would rather get brushed off than not have the option. I ME(1), I would have much rather have had the option to tell Ashley the "Would you kiss anyone I asked?" option and get brushed off (and run to her Captain's quarters and cry 3 hours straight) than not even have the option. Despite how Casey Hudson tried to spin it, it was not you could play a gay/lesbian shepard and none of the squadmates were receptive to you, it was more of you not having the option at all to have that sexuality. It annoyed me.

And while you are on the topic,

Ratch:  Have a look at my kiosk.
Shep:  You don't seem to hate the aliens
Ratch: I have done enough business off world to know not to turn away paying customers
Shep: Business offworld you say...
Ratch: Yes alien.
Shep flirt icon: Why don't you follow me back to my ship so we can do some business offworld?
Ratch:  What?  Do you mean what I think you mean?  There is not enough ryncol in the world for me to do that.
Shep:  Your loss.
Shep:  I should go.

Modifié par silentassassin264, 26 juillet 2011 - 08:42 .


#7105
Quething

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Abispa wrote...

@ Cathey -- I don't plan on playing gay Shepard much myself, but the thing that REALLY gets on my nerves from s/s critics is not so much their worrying about ninjamances, it's the line that can be paraphrased as "But s/he's my s/s Shepard's buddy/sista/bro!" as though finding out that the person who has fought by your side against incredible odds is now bi wipes away his/her history of heroism/badass.


Well, of course. Because if they're bi, that means they were secretly in love with you that whole time and were never really your bro at all. All that making you laugh and having your back was just an attempt to get your guard down and get in your pants.

It makes me wonder how prevalent Nice Guy™ Syndrome really is, if these people honestly believe that you cannot be friends with someone of their gender(s) of interest without some sex-related ulterior motive. I mean, if your own friendship with women isn't trustworthy, of course you're not going to trust gay men, but... that's not on gay men, dude.

#7106
Sorrel

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... "But s/he's my s/s Shepard's buddy/sista/bro!" as though finding out that the person who has fought by your side against incredible odds is now bi wipes away his/her history of heroism/badass.


Of course, because being bi means you are automatically attracted to everyone of both sexes.
Just like being gay means you're attracted to all men. And being lesbian means you're attracted to all women.

And being straight means you're attracted to all members of the opposite sex. Oh, wait...

#7107
shepskisaac

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silentassassin264 wrote...

Despite how Casey Hudson tried to spin it, it was not you could play a gay/lesbian shepard and none of the squadmates were receptive to you, it was more of you not having the option at all to have that sexuality. It annoyed me.

Nah, my Sheps are all gay as hell and lack of any options didn't stop that, I turned down every chick that tried to jump at him :D

#7108
Abispa

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@ Kaiser_Wilhelm -- It that a mod? I don't remember any of my Shepard's EVER being able to dance that well. If the Asari turned down THAT, how was she impressed by the infamous "Shepard Shuffle"?

#7109
Kaiser_Wilhelm

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Abispa wrote...

@ Kaiser_Wilhelm -- It that a mod? I don't remember any of my Shepard's EVER being able to dance that well. If the Asari turned down THAT, how was she impressed by the infamous "Shepard Shuffle"?


Neither dance was good but the non-charm dance looks better than the Shepard Shuffle.

Modifié par Kaiser_Wilhelm, 26 juillet 2011 - 09:08 .


#7110
Abispa

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silentassassin264 wrote...

I would rather get brushed off than not have the option. I ME(1), I would have much rather have had the option to tell Ashley the "Would you kiss anyone I asked?" option and get brushed off (and run to her Captain's quarters and cry 3 hours straight) than not even have the option. Despite how Casey Hudson tried to spin it, it was not you could play a gay/lesbian shepard and none of the squadmates were receptive to you, it was more of you not having the option at all to have that sexuality. It annoyed me.

And while you are on the topic,

Ratch:  Have a look at my kiosk.
Shep:  You don't seem to hate the aliens
Ratch: I have done enough business off world to know not to turn away paying customers
Shep: Business offworld you say...
Ratch: Yes alien.
Shep flirt icon: Why don't you follow me back to my ship so we can do some business offworld?
Ratch:  What?  Do you mean what I think you mean?  There is not enough ryncol in the world for me to do that.
Shep:  Your loss.
Shep:  I should go.


Gotta throw in a head butt to show affection. Or does that only work on Turians?

#7111
TheMarshal

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Quething wrote...

I think I would actually shell out $2 US for a DLC that just added lines like that to ME2. "Actually, Aria, I appreciate the thought, but I'd rather have a nice young woman." "Sorry, Shiala, I'm holding out for Kaidan." "I. AM. NOT. INTERESTED. GODDAMNIT."

(Oddly I am okay with the smirk in DA2 when you first meet Isabela. That may be unfair bias from my overwhelming love of Isabela.)


I'd have loved a line like "Thanks, but I already have a nice girl...  somewhere..." when dealing with Aria.

#7112
Augoeides

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Ryzaki wrote...

Quething wrote...

Cuddlezarro wrote...

I picked the renegade option and shepard said how he wasnt too frilled with the reward and next thing i know im boinking the consort


Haha, yes. That and the ME1 Kalisah punch are the two most egregious paraphrase fails in the history of paraphrase fail. Nothing in DA2 or ME2 was near that bad. Ninjamancing: not just for companions!

 

Yeah... "oh asking for more money! Cool I could use some more creds." *press "That's it?" dialogue choice*

OMG WHY?!?


It was at this point I turned off my Xbox, bashed myself in the head with my controller a few times and went to the study to look up all the instances where the game would try and hetero-rape my GayShep.

#7113
Abispa

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Augoeides wrote...

It was at this point I turned off my Xbox, bashed myself in the head with my controller a few times and went to the study to look up all the instances where the game would try and hetero-rape my GayShep.


C'mon, man! Asari are mono-gendered! They don't count! Stop ruining the immersion, man!

I'm straight, but as pretty as Asari are, I keep getting creeped out by that squid thing they got going. Other than that and blue skin, they look just like human females which makes it worse for me. I'd be more forgiving if they looked more alien and/or androgynous.

#7114
Augoeides

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Abispa wrote...

Augoeides wrote...

It was at this point I turned off my Xbox, bashed myself in the head with my controller a few times and went to the study to look up all the instances where the game would try and hetero-rape my GayShep.


C'mon, man! Asari are mono-gendered! They don't count! Stop ruining the immersion, man!

I'm straight, but as pretty as Asari are, I keep getting creeped out by that squid thing they got going. Other than that and blue skin, they look just like human females which makes it worse for me. I'd be more forgiving if they looked more alien and/or androgynous.


I see them and can't help but think 'Water genasi in space!'

It would appear very few space-faring races aside from humans developed 'hair' or fur.

#7115
Quething

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It's the backs of the necks that bother me. The vaguely tentacle-y headfringe is okay, but the sort of... wrinkly, ridge-y... I don't even know what's going on there but yeah, they're otherwise human enough that it hits me like seeing someone with a beak for a bellybutton.

Also, they've got so many toxic tropes burned right into their whole concept and presentation that I'm really not fond of them as love interests. I do have a Liaramancing Shep, and another who left her for Thane, but that's because I'm a compulsive completionist. I will be pretty put out with BioWare if they don't give us a human f/f LI in ME3.

#7116
LiaraShepard

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hmmm, have you recognized that the smart and overpowered characters are always females in bioware games? Or is it just me who thinks so? There's Miranda and Morrigan, both are very intuitive, they always find the right conclusions and solutions, and they seem to beat their associated male characters (Jacob and Alistar). Morrigan always beats Alistar in conversations, and is obviously more powerful as a mage, and Jacob always mentiones that Miranda is to strong to be handled, what is very unsexy by the way. I always thought he's a douchebag. It's the same with Bastila and Carth or with Kaidan and Ashley (though it's not that obvious in Mass Effect 1). But the male characters always seem to be reserved and servile... I don't know how to express. Sorry, English isn't my first language. Is there someone else who feels this way? I always hope for a male character who is considered as perfect and maybe a bit arrogant. Yes, I know, there's Zaeed, but that's not what I'm talking about. He doesn't seem to be very important. He may be arrogant but in an unprofessional way. Don't know how to express but I always thought Miranda is very professionally arrogant. xD She seems to be above it all. Just like Bastila or Morrigan or Flemeth...hm, maybe I'm wrong. What do you think? But that's the reason why I always prefer to date female characters and why I hope they're bisexual.

#7117
ScotGaymer

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Abispa wrote...

C'mon, man! Asari are mono-gendered! They don't count! Stop ruining the immersion, man!

I'm straight, but as pretty as Asari are, I keep getting creeped out by that squid thing they got going. Other than that and blue skin, they look just like human females which makes it worse for me. I'd be more forgiving if they looked more alien and/or androgynous.



The mono gendered excuse is total bull. Seriously.

Mono Gendered does not mean no gendered, or androgynous.

It means having a SINGLE Gender. In this case Female. Thus a FemShep/Liara relationship is still a lesbian relationship for the purposes of FemShep being attracted to a "female".

#7118
Abispa

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Augoeides wrote...

I see them and can't help but think 'Water genasi in space!'

It would appear very few space-faring races aside from humans developed 'hair' or fur.


I keep hoping for furry Quarians. I brought this up in one of the Tali threads and I was immediately labeled a "troll." I am actually serious about this and I meant no disrespect. Granted, it might make designing a "HAWT" Tali for ME3 more difficult, but I'm sure one of the artists could come up with a cool mammal concept for the race.

I wonder where all the gay Talimancers are? I know several of the regulars here have expressed negative feelings about the Tali romance, but that shouldn't stop her fans from joining in. We can disagree in a civil manner.

#7119
ScotGaymer

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Mostly because most of the SS Supporters want it implemented in a realistic and plausible manner; and there is nothing realistic or plausible about the TaliRomance.

Its implemented in a really heavy handed way. In EVERY game she falls in love with ManShep wether he even speaks to her or not in either game. And you cant talk to her without progressing the "romance" with her as a ManShep. Though that is a problem with most of the OS romances in ME2 (I hate the ME2 romances).

Thats not to mention its in violation of established lore that is -reinforced- by Mass Effect 2.

Modifié par FitScotGaymer, 26 juillet 2011 - 11:19 .


#7120
Abispa

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LiaraShepard wrote...

hmmm, have you recognized that the smart and overpowered characters are always females in bioware games? Or is it just me who thinks so? There's Miranda and Morrigan, both are very intuitive, they always find the right conclusions and solutions, and they seem to beat their associated male characters (Jacob and Alistar). Morrigan always beats Alistar in conversations, and is obviously more powerful as a mage, and Jacob always mentiones that Miranda is to strong to be handled, what is very unsexy by the way. I always thought he's a douchebag. It's the same with Bastila and Carth or with Kaidan and Ashley (though it's not that obvious in Mass Effect 1). But the male characters always seem to be reserved and servile... I don't know how to express. Sorry, English isn't my first language. Is there someone else who feels this way? I always hope for a male character who is considered as perfect and maybe a bit arrogant. Yes, I know, there's Zaeed, but that's not what I'm talking about. He doesn't seem to be very important. He may be arrogant but in an unprofessional way. Don't know how to express but I always thought Miranda is very professionally arrogant. xD She seems to be above it all. Just like Bastila or Morrigan or Flemeth...hm, maybe I'm wrong. What do you think? But that's the reason why I always prefer to date female characters and why I hope they're bisexual.


Yeah, they're "strong" women alright. Always ready to ninjamance the male hero who shines a light into their empty existence. The males, however, seem to wander aimlessly until the female hero gives them a backbone and sense of direction. I'm hoping that making all future LIs bi will help do away with the Bioware cliches of the past.

#7121
Abispa

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FitScotGaymer wrote...

Abispa wrote...

C'mon, man! Asari are mono-gendered! They don't count! Stop ruining the immersion, man!

I'm straight, but as pretty as Asari are, I keep getting creeped out by that squid thing they got going. Other than that and blue skin, they look just like human females which makes it worse for me. I'd be more forgiving if they looked more alien and/or androgynous.



The mono gendered excuse is total bull. Seriously.

Mono Gendered does not mean no gendered, or androgynous.

It means having a SINGLE Gender. In this case Female. Thus a FemShep/Liara relationship is still a lesbian relationship for the purposes of FemShep being attracted to a "female".


Yes, I know the whole mono-gendered aren't lesbians argument is lame. And I'm not saying the Asari can't be female, I'm saying they shouldn't fit the human ideal for beauty since human females have evolved to be attractive to human males who love the curves (to varying degrees throughout history, to be sure). Asari have no reason to have developed like blue human supermodels since they are supposed to be mate with almost anything, even non-humanoid lifeforms.

#7122
LiaraShepard

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Abispa wrote...

LiaraShepard wrote...

hmmm, have you recognized that the smart and overpowered characters are always females in bioware games? Or is it just me who thinks so? There's Miranda and Morrigan, both are very intuitive, they always find the right conclusions and solutions, and they seem to beat their associated male characters (Jacob and Alistar). Morrigan always beats Alistar in conversations, and is obviously more powerful as a mage, and Jacob always mentiones that Miranda is to strong to be handled, what is very unsexy by the way. I always thought he's a douchebag. It's the same with Bastila and Carth or with Kaidan and Ashley (though it's not that obvious in Mass Effect 1). But the male characters always seem to be reserved and servile... I don't know how to express. Sorry, English isn't my first language. Is there someone else who feels this way? I always hope for a male character who is considered as perfect and maybe a bit arrogant. Yes, I know, there's Zaeed, but that's not what I'm talking about. He doesn't seem to be very important. He may be arrogant but in an unprofessional way. Don't know how to express but I always thought Miranda is very professionally arrogant. xD She seems to be above it all. Just like Bastila or Morrigan or Flemeth...hm, maybe I'm wrong. What do you think? But that's the reason why I always prefer to date female characters and why I hope they're bisexual.


Yeah, they're "strong" women alright. Always ready to ninjamance the male hero who shines a light into their empty existence. The males, however, seem to wander aimlessly until the female hero gives them a backbone and sense of direction. I'm hoping that making all future LIs bi will help do away with the Bioware cliches of the past.



Sense of direction is a good word. I always thought of a dog, when talking to Jacob (no offense), whereas Miranda seems to has a very strong will and know what she wants.  That makes her (and the other female characters) more sexy in my opinion. It's a bit strange (and unsexy as well) when the female hero always gives the direction and the male characters oriented themselves towards her.

#7123
Devilish12

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Crack a lack bblack jack gay relations in game this world...

#7124
ScotGaymer

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Abispa - not everything needs to be spot on realistic. Any sort of media requires a degree of suspension of disbelief.
The Asari are a homage/spoof of the Green Skinned Alien Babe that pops up in early Science Fiction with regularity, most notably Star Trek.

I can suspend my disbelief for that. And for the psychic mating thing too given that all Asari are "biotic".

What I cant accept is FemShep not counting as Bisexual or Lesbian if she is attracted to Asari.

#7125
Abispa

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@ LiaraShepard -- I've already said before that I thought Miranda was a disappointment. As a concept I found her exciting until the story played out. I was thinking she'd be kind of like the sexy femme fatales of the classic James Bond films and a good renegade romance option, but after one mission she was declawed and started moaning about her lack of self esteem. At every mission that showed the cruel stupidity of Cerberus she always defended them and showed no sign of having second thoughts so I was shocked (and disappointed) when she quit at the Collector Base or expressed disappointment about Shepard saving it.

I think ME2 suffered from having too many characters and the opportunity to fully develop Miranda was squandered, making her yet another Shepard groupie. In a way, over the course of ME2 and LotSB, my opinion of Liara and Miranda traded places. Liara stopped being the typical groupie and developed a sense of independence I appreciated so I gave her a Shepard.