25715 réponses à ce sujet

[Sepewrath]

Ryzaki wrote...

Gillian being legal for a s/s romance isn't on topic? 
Edit: She's apparently legal for both Sheps. Amending my statement.  

Anything is legal in space, that's where they had that Tyson vs Secretariat fight.

darthnick427 wrote...

I personally won't being doing much
S/S romances but I'm all for it. The more options for the players the
better. The people I can def see being Bi are : Jack, Miranda, Kaidan,
Thane, Liara (obviously), Kasumi (If LI), and possibly Tali. If Garrus
and Jacob were Bi I wouldn't really believe it. Jacob clearly wants the
priiiiize and Garrus has always seemed very hetero to me.

Well the same way you say you don't see it for Garrus and Jacob, people say they don't see it for a number of characters and that it would come off forced and unbelievable. The only ones it would believable for is Jack, Vega and I could give Kasumi because even though she showed interest in Jacob and had a boyfriend, since you couldn't have any conversations with her, that's not anything to go on.

The others it would just be forced. Though like I said before, if they completely restructure the system to work like DA2, I can live with it because I can ignore it for the characters where it would be a retcon. But if its still tied up in just being nice to them, then no, I don't want to see it forced on clearly not bisexual characters.

[catharsisboo]

darthnick427 wrote...
If Garrus and Jacob were Bi I wouldn't really believe it. Jacob clearly wants the priiiiize and Garrus has always seemed very hetero to me.

I disagree on the Garrus bit. Garrusmance is essentially FemShep propositioning him and Garrus agreeing to go along with it because of his respect for her, not because of sexual attraction (he doesn't have a "human fetish"). Since ManShep and FemShep are the same character, that means Garrus would have an equal amount of respect for ManShep. Ergo, the same thing could easily happen with ManShep propositioning Garrus. If Garrus is already crossing the species barrier for Shepard ("I've never considered cross-species intercourse"), I don't think something like gender would stand in his way.

This point has probably been made at least several times in this thread, but it bugs me when people say he wouldn't fit when - to me - he's one of the most logical choices from the current LIs along with Kaidan for M/M.

Modifié par catharsisboo, 04 août 2011 - 01:24 .

[ArawnNox]

catharsisboo wrote...

darthnick427 wrote...
If Garrus and Jacob were Bi I wouldn't really believe it. Jacob clearly wants the priiiiize and Garrus has always seemed very hetero to me.

I disagree on the Garrus bit. Garrusmance is essentially FemShep propositioning him and Garrus agreeing to go along with it because of his respect for her, not because of sexual attraction (he doesn't have a "human fetish"). Since ManShep and FemShep are the same character, that means Garrus would have an equal amount of respect for ManShep. Ergo, the same thing could easily happen with ManShep propositioning Garrus. If Garrus is already crossing the species barrier for Shepard ("I've never considered cross-species intercourse"), I don't think something like gender would stand in his way.

This point has probably been made at least several times in this thread, but it bugs me when people say he wouldn't fit when - to me - he's one of the most logical choices from the current LIs along with Kaidan for M/M.

I recently watched a youtube vid of the Garrus "love scene" and I felt that the whole thing was VERY awkward. Regardless, I agree that Shep's gender shouldn't preclude his availability for romance with Shep.

[Arik7]

Sepewrath wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Gillian being legal for a s/s romance isn't on topic? 
Edit: She's apparently legal for both Sheps. Amending my statement.  

Anything is legal in space, that's where they had that Tyson vs Secretariat fight.

darthnick427 wrote...

I personally won't being doing much
S/S romances but I'm all for it. The more options for the players the
better. The people I can def see being Bi are : Jack, Miranda, Kaidan,
Thane, Liara (obviously), Kasumi (If LI), and possibly Tali. If Garrus
and Jacob were Bi I wouldn't really believe it. Jacob clearly wants the
priiiiize and Garrus has always seemed very hetero to me.

Well the same way you say you don't see it for Garrus and Jacob, people say they don't see it for a number of characters and that it would come off forced and unbelievable. The only ones it would believable for is Jack, Vega and I could give Kasumi because even though she showed interest in Jacob and had a boyfriend, since you couldn't have any conversations with her, that's not anything to go on.

The others it would just be forced. Though like I said before, if they completely restructure the system to work like DA2, I can live with it because I can ignore it for the characters where it would be a retcon. But if its still tied up in just being nice to them, then no, I don't want to see it forced on clearly not bisexual characters.

Jack is a believable bisexual, and others would be "retcons"???  So we're just going with stereotypes now?  

The term "retcon" gets thrown around way too often on these boards.   Just because you ASSUME all the characters are straight, it is not an established fact.  None of the characters have implicitely ruled out having attraction to the same sex,  therefore the writers would not be changing any established facts by releaving/developing some of the characters as bisexual.   

[bleetman]

The thing with Garrus is that, to put it simply and obviously, he's a Turian. The typical characteristics we equate with females (slender builds, child bearing hips, breasts, so on and so forth) just don't apply to Turian physiology any more than their distinguishing features apply to us. If he finds female Shepard attractive on any level, it sure as hell ain't gonna be her looks. I'm not sure how him being with a human female is all fine and dandy, but a human male is somehow inconceivable.

Y'know, unless we're applying ill conceived sexuality behaviour stereotypes onto entirely different species as well as our own. That'd be fun.

[Quething]

Shows what you know. FemShep's jaw is clearly much closer to female turian mandibles.

No but really, cis human males have more supportive waists than cis human females, on average, so if that's a marker of femininity for turians and Garrus is generally heterosexual, dudeShep is going to be closer to his aesthetics of interest anyway.

[bleetman]

Quething wrote...

Shows what you know. FemShep's jaw is clearly much closer to female turian mandibles.

That image is going to haunt my sleep for some time. I hope you're proud of yourself

[OSUP]

bleetman wrote...

The thing with Garrus is that, to put it simply and obviously, he's a Turian. The typical characteristics we equate with females (slender builds, child bearing hips, breasts, so on and so forth) just don't apply to Turian physiology any more than their distinguishing features apply to us. If he finds female Shepard attractive on any level, it sure as hell ain't gonna be her looks. I'm not sure how him being with a human female is all fine and dandy, but a human male is somehow inconceivable.

Y'know, unless we're applying ill conceived sexuality behaviour stereotypes onto entirely different species as well as our own. That'd be fun.

Logic?!? LE GASP!

[Terror330]

I'll just say that simply because Garrus may not find all the physical traits of human females attractive does not mean he'd be just as likely to romance a male Shepard.

To but this bluntly, if Garrus doesn't find Turian men attractive (and we don't know whether he does or doesn't) then the odds of him wanting to romance a male Shepard isn't all that likely.

I would never say Garrus cannot be a male s/s option, because I understand there is a chance he could be. I personally believe that anyone who hasn't bluntly stated they aren't gay is a possibility. But simply because Garrus may find human females less attractive then Turian women does not mean he'd be willing to date a man.

[Quething]

Terror330 wrote...

I'll just say that simply because Garrus may not find all the physical traits of human females attractive does not mean he'd be just as likely to romance a male Shepard.

To but this bluntly, if Garrus doesn't find Turian men attractive (and we don't know whether he does or doesn't) then the odds of him wanting to romance a male Shepard isn't all that likely.

I would never say Garrus cannot be a male s/s option, because I understand there is a chance he could be. I personally believe that anyone who hasn't bluntly stated they aren't gay is a possibility. But simply because Garrus may find human females less attractive then Turian women does not mean he'd be willing to date a man.

Allow me to put it this way.

If asari looked exactly the way they look now, and spoke exactly the way they speak now, but they and everyone else referred to them as male rather than female, patriarchs and patrons instead of matriarchs and maidens, and they reproduced by inducing telepathic pregnancy in other species (ie they can get femShep pregnant by going black-eyed and mindlinking rather than femShep being able to get them pregnant)...

would heterosexual female humans magically become more likely to be attracted to them? Or would they, in fact, remain more attractive to human males, because they most closely resemble females from a *human* perspective?

bleetman wrote...
That image is going to haunt my sleep for some time. I hope you're proud of yourself 

Modifié par Quething, 04 août 2011 - 03:18 .

[xassantex]

 

nope, nothing to see... move along. 

[Terror330]

Quething wrote...

Terror330 wrote...

I'll just say that simply because Garrus may not find all the physical traits of human females attractive does not mean he'd be just as likely to romance a male Shepard.

To but this bluntly, if Garrus doesn't find Turian men attractive (and we don't know whether he does or doesn't) then the odds of him wanting to romance a male Shepard isn't all that likely.

I would never say Garrus cannot be a male s/s option, because I understand there is a chance he could be. I personally believe that anyone who hasn't bluntly stated they aren't gay is a possibility. But simply because Garrus may find human females less attractive then Turian women does not mean he'd be willing to date a man.

Allow me to put it this way.

If asari looked exactly the way they look now, and spoke exactly the way they speak now, but they and everyone else referred to them as male rather than female, patriarchs and patrons instead of matriarchs and maidens, and they reproduced by inducing telepathic pregnancy in other species (ie they can get femShep pregnant by going black-eyed and mindlinking rather than femShep being able to get them pregnant)...

would heterosexual female humans magically become more likely to be attracted to them? Or would they, in fact, remain more attractive to human males, because they most closely resemble females from a *human* perspective?

So...they are still the same old asari, but they are refered to as men now?  Well, that's slightly different.

I think at first men would be confused by it at first, but they look like girls, sound like girls and have the same parts of a girl so I think they'd get over it. 

As for the women I don't see how it makes any difference.  I don't know if any of the women that persued asari in the ME games were ever heterosexual in the first place.  I think preferences do come into play.  Some women find men more enjoyable and an asari is, well, a woman, whether they want to call themselves a man or not.  Asari also exhibt female behavior so they won't be acting like men either.  Emotionally and physically asari are still women, no matter what they are called.  It's not going to change anything.

I know next to nothing about Turian women, other then that female Turian senator or ambasador I saw on the ME wiki.  I'm sure there are some differences physically between the two Turian sexes, but its hard to compare unless they are standing right next to each other.  Still, there are also emotional differences between the sexes as well and it can't be dismissed.

For example, if I saw a pretty girl I would be physically attracted to her, but if she acted like a man I wouldn't be. 

Modifié par Terror330, 04 août 2011 - 03:44 .

[Ryzaki]

And how pray tell does one act like a man?

[Terror330]

Ryzaki wrote...

And how pray tell does one act like a man?

Drinks, farts, and watches football all day.

[Jake71887]

Terror330 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

And how pray tell does one act like a man?

Drinks, farts, and watches football all day.

Damn, I'm 1/3 

[Ryzaki]

Terror330 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

And how pray tell does one act like a man?

Drinks, farts, and watches football all day.

I was under the impression that was being a slob. 

Sounds more like a boy than a man. 

[OSUP]

Terror330 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

And how pray tell does one act like a man?

Drinks, farts, and watches football all day.

Sounds more like a bro.

[Jake71887]

OSUP wrote...

Terror330 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

And how pray tell does one act like a man?

Drinks, farts, and watches football all day.

Sounds more like a bro.

I'm afraid of bros 

[Terror330]

@Ryzaki

I was joking.

I based it off stereotypes. I.E most men drink, most men like sports and men enjoy farting. Does every man do that? Of course not, but when you think of a slob do you think of a man first or a woman?

My point was I wouldn't want to date a woman that was a walking male stereotype, even if she was attractive.

[Ryzaki]

That's your issue. 

Not Garrus'.

FemShep is not a shining example of sterotypical feminity. So that arguement went sailing out the window a while ago. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 04 août 2011 - 04:16 .

[Quething]

Ryzaki wrote...

And how pray tell does one act like a man?

Oo! I know this one!

Don't talk about your feelings, value strength and honor, be competitive, be handy at fixing things and protective of women and children, prefer to watch sports over romantic comedies, be most comfortable in a well-defined social hierarchy and prefer straightforward physical violence to the complexity of verbal and social warfare, and be sexually attracted to women.

So main!Shep is obvoiusly totally a man!

But... Garrus is totally willing to do it with main!Shep if she hits the right dialog options...

I'm so confused 

[Ryzaki]

Quething wrote...Oo! I know this one!

Don't talk about your feelings, value strength and honor, be competitive, be handy at fixing things and protective of women and children, prefer to watch sports over romantic comedies, be most comfortable in a well-defined social hierarchy and prefer straightforward physical violence to the complexity of verbal and social warfare, and be sexually attracted to women.

So main!Shep is obvoiusly totally a man!

But... Garrus is totally willing to do it with main!Shep if she hits the right dialog options...

I'm so confused 

...Me too. *brain breaks* 

Male Shep and FemShep are both obviously men...but...but...what about when male Shep talks about his feelings? Does he turn into a woman? ...I'm very confused. 

[Jake71887]

Ryzaki wrote...
...Me too. *brain breaks* 

Male Shep and FemShep are both obviously men...but...but...what about when male Shep talks about his feelings? Does he turn into a woman? ...I'm very confused. 

Shep has only two feelings...

Angry, and furious. 

[OSUP]

I think the basic point is since there is no connection between the female anatomy of humans and turians there is no reason to believe Garrus finds FemShep attractive due to physical appearance. This makes it an issue of personality and comparing the way MShep and FShep have been set up there is little besides there physical appearances that differs. Both are strong independent people and are natural born leaders. The player can alter there personality through actions but neither the male or female versions really differ in characterization. Essentially following this logic Garrus is just as likely to be attracted to MShep as FShep making this issue moot. Bi Garrus ftw.

[DarkDragon777]

All these stereotypes are making me angry. Not all men are like that. I know I'm not...even though I'm a boy, not a man.