25715 réponses à ce sujet

[Abispa]

IsaacShep wrote...

Abispa wrote...

http://www.timhorton...menu/lunch.html

Thanks... Now I'm hungry again

Well, we better get back on topic before I get banned for chatting and not staying on topic. Again.

Um, so, how do you all feel about s/s LIs using hunger / food references toward initiating a tumble? Do you think it would less appropriate for alien s/s partners like Tali, Garrus, and Wreave?

WREAV: I'm hungry, Shepard! BUT NOT FOR FOOD!

GARRUS: Mmmm, tastes like chicken!

TALI: Could use more gravy, I guess.

Modifié par Abispa, 10 août 2011 - 06:27 .

[Clonedzero]

jlb524 wrote...

Clonedzero wrote...
well im not bringing up any other issues i have with the games here because thats not what this thread is about.  why the hell would i start talking about any of that in this thread when its specifically about s/s romances? im not an idiot.

But talking about how 'lore breaking' the Garrus/Tali o/s romances is on topic? 

Strictly, it isn't.

well when specifically discussing the lore breaking aspects of garrus/tali s/s romances it is on topic. i was merely saying how lore breaking shepards relationships with garrus/tali are regardless of sexual orientations and how i hope they wouldnt dig themselves deeper into the lore-shattering hole of team dextros romances by including s/s options for them.

talking about the hetro romances in direct conversation of the s/s romances isn't off topic at all.

what are you talking about? you're grasping at straws here lol

[Servo to the bitter end]

Still really don't get why a human person being physically attracted to Tali is so lore-breaking. Apart from her funny toes, she's conventionally hot with all the usual assets sexualized. Ditto for a relationship with Garrus based on shared history. In any event, I've never heard a good argument against either of them being available for S/S.

Modifié par TommyServo, 10 août 2011 - 06:36 .

[Clonedzero]

TommyServo wrote...

Still really don't get why a human person being physically attracted to Tali is so lore-breaking. Apart from her funny toes, she's conventionally hot with all the usual assets sexualized. Ditto for a relationship with Garrus based on shared history. In any event, I've never heard a good argument against either of them being available for S/S.

i'll bite.

- they are completely biologically incompatable. as in they can make each other very sick with their "stuff".
- they are sexually incompatable. as in no proper way to actually do the deed.
- plausible physical attraction is hard to believe in a realistic mindset.
- logistically the relationship would be extremely strained and stressful due to above issues.
- its unnecessary and causes more issues than it solves.
- plenty of much better choices for s/s romances.
- breaks established character relationships.

i could go on.

[Abispa]

TommyServo wrote...

Still really don't get why a human person being physically attracted to Tali is so lore-breaking. Apart from her funny toes, she's conventionally hot with all the usual assets sexualized. Ditto for a relationship with Garrus based on shared history. In any event, I've never heard a good argument against either of them being available for S/S.

I can see a close romantic relationship developing, but the sexual, bodily fluid swapping aspect bothers me because, while certain characters being STRAIGHT isn't established lore, the vulnerable immune systems of both species is. Turians are very vulnerable to human contamination, just ask the ground keeper, and Quarians are vulnerable to ANY outside contamination, even from their own species.

But Turian groupies and Talimancers can happily romance them and it doesn't bother me. Why? I did not, and will not, hit on Garrus, and even when Tali goes into full Shepard worship, I was still able to tell her "No, you'll get sick." Even if another player does one or the other, my game is fine. I can even keep my "fragile Quarian" lore because if I turn her down, it never happened.

Since I was able to avoid and turn them down in ME2 as a female, it won't ruin my immersion to do it again when I play a male in ME3. IF they are available for s/s, that is.

[Servo to the bitter end]

Clonedzero wrote...

- they are completely biologically incompatable. as in they can make each other very sick with their "stuff".
- they are sexually incompatable. as in no proper way to actually do the deed.
- plausible physical attraction is hard to believe in a realistic mindset.

I don't want to risk moderation or derailment by getting too graphic, but "the deed," and all the the "stuff" that it entails, is not the be all end all. There are other ways of expressing love and affection.

Clonedzero wrote...

- logistically the relationship would be extremely strained and stressful due to above issues.
- its unnecessary and causes more issues than it solves.
- plenty of much better choices for s/s romances.
- breaks established character relationships.

i could go on.

Doesn't cause any issues to speak of if the relationship is not explicitly physical in the ways that a relationship between two humans would be, and it definitely doesn't contradict established character relationships in any way that I can see, unless you consider a friendship segueing to a romance inconsistent. Whether other characters would work better for it is entirely subjective.

Modifié par TommyServo, 10 août 2011 - 07:02 .

[ArawnNox]

*comes back from lurking*
Hey guys, whats going on?
Oh, ClonedZero is flipping out about human/alien romances....
Nevermind
*goes back to lurking*

[gamer_girl]

Clonedzero wrote...

TommyServo wrote...

Still really don't get why a human person being physically attracted to Tali is so lore-breaking. Apart from her funny toes, she's conventionally hot with all the usual assets sexualized. Ditto for a relationship with Garrus based on shared history. In any event, I've never heard a good argument against either of them being available for S/S.

i'll bite.

- they are completely biologically incompatable. as in they can make each other very sick with their "stuff".
- they are sexually incompatable. as in no proper way to actually do the deed.
- plausible physical attraction is hard to believe in a realistic mindset.
- logistically the relationship would be extremely strained and stressful due to above issues.
- its unnecessary and causes more issues than it solves.
- plenty of much better choices for s/s romances.
- breaks established character relationships.

i could go on.

Sorry but that's complete bull crap. Attraction isn't all about being compatible biologcally or sexually. Nor is it always about a physical attraction. Both humans and quarians are capable of having a personality and of interacting with a different alien species (IE eachother) as they speak the same language. A big part of attraction is personality, not just the fact that you can do it with them and reproduce.

[Maugrim]

Clonedzero wrote...

i'll bite.

- they are completely biologically incompatable. as in they can make each other very sick with their "stuff".

True but irrelevant as there are plently of couples in todays world that stay toghther despite only one carrying various dieseases and STD's.  These obstacles do not stop people from having sex/love.

- they are sexually incompatable. as in no proper way to actually do the deed.

Pure supposition while I would doubt the dangly bits and such would be comparable the bottom line is you don't know and are assuming.  Besides not having proper fitting plugs and such doesn't not make people sexually incompatible, sex is more than Insert Tab A into Slot B.

- plausible physical attraction is hard to believe in a realistic mindset.

Just no, people are attracted to all kinds of things in our, thankfully, weird world.  Aliens are one of the more believable, I mean FFS look at how widespread it is and they don't even exist!

- logistically the relationship would be extremely strained and stressful due to above issues.

Supposition, never stoppped anyone before anyways.  There is this thing called the internet, it has all sorts of pictures, video, manuals and such on various ways improve sexual compatability such as say with disabiled persons or how to please your partner who may have different sexual preferences than you.  Explore and have fun!

- its unnecessary and causes more issues than it solves.
- plenty of much better choices for s/s romances.
- breaks established character relationships.

These are purely personal opinions and as such doesn't deserve a reply.

i could go on.

Please don't.

Modifié par makenzieshepard, 10 août 2011 - 07:21 .

[ademska]

Clonedzero wrote...

i'll bite.

- they are completely biologically incompatable. as in they can make each other very sick with their "stuff".
- they are sexually incompatable. as in no proper way to actually do the deed.
- plausible physical attraction is hard to believe in a realistic mindset.
- logistically the relationship would be extremely strained and stressful due to above issues.
- its unnecessary and causes more issues than it solves.
- plenty of much better choices for s/s romances.
- breaks established character relationships.

i could go on.

great argument for why dextro romances were a bad idea in the first place.

terrible argument for why, now that they're in the game, s/s romances don't make sense. you've gotta go all or nothing with this type of argument, zero, and since the "nothing" is off the table after ME2, there's only one other option.

[bleetman]

TommyServo wrote...


I don't want to risk moderation or derailment by getting too graphic, but "the deed," and all the the "stuff" that it entails, is not the be all end all.

Or, for that matter, the only way of actually pleasuring another person. Garrus and Shepard wouldn't necessarily need to, uh, connect to have a good time.

...

Oh God what have I become

[edit]

makenzieshepard wrote...

Besides not having proper fitting
plugs and such doesn't not make people sexually incompatible, sex it
more than Insert Tab A into Slot B.

Right. That.

Modifié par bleetman, 10 août 2011 - 07:09 .

[Clonedzero]

TommyServo wrote...

Clonedzero wrote...

- they are completely biologically incompatable. as in they can make each other very sick with their "stuff".
- they are sexually incompatable. as in no proper way to actually do the deed.
- plausible physical attraction is hard to believe in a realistic mindset.

I don't want to risk moderation or derailment by getting too graphic, but "the deed," and all the the "stuff" that it entails, is not the be all end all. There are other ways of expressing love and affection.

Clonedzero wrote...

- logistically the relationship would be extremely strained and stressful due to above issues.
- its unnecessary and causes more issues than it solves.
- plenty of much better choices for s/s romances.
- breaks established character relationships.

i could go on.

Doesn't cause any issues to speak of, and it definitely doesn't contradict established character relationships in any way that I can see, unless you consider a friendship segueing to a romance inconsistent. Whether other characters would work better for it is entirely subjective.

the goal of any writer, no matter how fantastical and wild a story is, is to make it believable. whether its sci-fi, fantasy,  mirroring real life, ect.

writing a romance between two characters who have so many ridiculous fundemental issues saying there shouldnt be one makes it extremely hard to believe to anyone who understands the universe where the story takes place.

so, is it wrong for me to want the writers to instead of working on pure stupid fanservice relationships, to focus on well written logical s/s romances, and other areas of the story?

you could say "hey its optionial" and i get that, im not going to get mad or upset if they're s/s options, ill skip that content and pretend it doesnt exist, i'll just be a bit disappointed they wasted there time on something so stupid to appease a bunch of silly fans that dont even understand the actual story is all.

[Twizz089]

jwalker wrote...

Twizz089 wrote...


I agree, I think a personality-based romance system is the way to go, but how is a person's sexual orientiation not part of their personality?  Earlier I defined personality, explain how sexual orientaion is not a behavior trait that falls under that category?

You can define personality the way you want. There are many definitions. Thank you.

But the way I see it, being gay, hetero or bi adds nothing to the personality.
You can say "A" is extrovert. Cool. You can form a picture of that person already. Then you know that "A" is an obsesive perfectionist. Your picture of that person changes

Then you know that person is hetero. What changes ? Nothing. Oops. Not hetero, gay. What changes ? Nothing again. My picture of that person it's the same. Whatever opinion or whatever predictions I could make aren't not modified by sexual preference

Twizz089 wrote...
Sexuality is a behavoiral trait and behavoiral traits make up a persons personality

Extrovert hetero dude goes to a party. He will hit on the first woman available.
Extrovert gay dude goes to a party. He will hit on the first dude available.

What's the difference ? None.
You're prediction on their behavior it's the same. They're  both going to hit on the first person available to them. That's what's matters.

Sorry there is only one definition to the word personality.  Sexuallity is a behavior, personality is a person unique pattern of behavior. 

jwalker wrote...
]Extrovert hetero dude goes to a party. He will hit on the first woman available.
Extrovert gay dude goes to a party. He will hit on the first dude available.

There is a difference, I shouldnt have to tell you want it is. Memebers of the gay community on this forum want their voices heard, thats fine, they want repersentation that is also fine.  But you should not be so eager to settle for the first hack job solution of making every character in the game Bi that has been tossed at them.  Bioware could and should be using unique traits like a person;s sexuality to develop better characters, instead they have opted for the cheaper easier solution (even the lines are recycled) and people are ok with that.  I want immersion, and unique characters that function in the world without my character telling them how to think and feel, Im sorry you are fine with a band aid solution that shallows out the gameplay and lacks depth.

Modifié par Twizz089, 10 août 2011 - 07:11 .

[bleetman]

Clonedzero wrote...

stupid fanservice relationships

*takes a drink*

[Jademoon121]

Aren't Quarians a semi-endangered alien species that live in close-knit, communist environments so sterile that a simple cut in an alien atmosphere could give them a severe allergic reaction at best? Sorry, but Tali dating any Shep just breaks lore in of itself.

[Maugrim]

bleetman wrote...

Clonedzero wrote...

stupid fanservice relationships

*takes a drink*

Dear god man don't play that game during this discussion, you'll die!

[gamer_girl]

Clonedzero wrote...

so, is it wrong for me to want the writers to instead of working on pure stupid fanservice relationships, to focus on well written logical s/s romances, and other areas of the story?

I repeat:
Sorry but that's complete bull crap. Attraction isn't all about being
compatible biologcally or sexually. Nor is it always about a physical
attraction. Both humans and quarians are capable of having a personality
and of interacting with a different alien species (IE eachother) as
they speak the same language. A big part of attraction is personality,
not just the fact that you can do it with them and reproduce.

[Servo to the bitter end]

Twizz089 wrote...

There is a difference, I shouldnt have to tell you want it is. Memebers of the gay community on this forum want their voices heard, thats fine, they want repersentation that is also fine.  But you should not be so eager to settle for the first hack job solution of making every character in the game Bi that has been tossed at them.  Bioware could and should be using unique traits like a person;s sexuality to develop better characters, instead they have opted for the cheaper easier solution (even the lines are recycled) and people are ok with that.  I want immersion, and unique characters that function in the world without my character telling them how to think and feel, Im sorry you are fine with a band aid solution that shallows out the gameplay and lacks depth.

How is a character made better if they are defined by their "unique" sexuality? And what does that even mean?

[jlb524]

Twizz089 wrote...

There is a difference, I shouldnt have to tell you want it is. Memebers of the gay community on this forum want their voices heard, thats fine, they want repersentation that is also fine.  But you should not be so eager to settle for the first hack job solution of making every character in the game Bi that has been tossed at them.  Bioware could and should be using unique traits like a person;s sexuality to develop better characters, instead they have opted for the cheaper easier solution (even the lines are recycled) and people are ok with that.  I want immersion, and unique characters that function in the world without my character telling them how to think and feel, Im sorry you are fine with a band aid solution that shallows out the gameplay and lacks depth.

You are not understanding that the 'straight community' has been settling for 'hack jobs' for years when it comes to romances being generic and not taking anything specific about the PC into account, recycling lines.  BW has always used 'band aid' solutions to romances instead of taking personality, class, race, morality, personal history etc. into consideration.

You act like the het-only romances avoid these issues when they don't...at all.  We want the same amount of 'crappy' choices that the others have always gotten

Again, you are only making this an issue about s/s romances when that isn't really the case.

[Siansonea]

Personally any character who's salient characteristic is their sexuality is generally not going to be a character I find intriguing. Seriously folks, there's more to life than coitus.

[gamer_girl]

Jademoon121 wrote...

Aren't Quarians a semi-endangered alien species that live in close-knit, communist environments so sterile that a simple cut in an alien atmosphere could give them a severe allergic reaction at best? Sorry, but Tali dating any Shep just breaks lore in of itself.

Explanation please. Just because that's the way quarians are does not mean that is how Tali is. She wanted to remain loyal to the fleet, yet they tried her for treason. And who else other than Shepard comes to defend her in her time of need, not just in the trial but helping her during her pilgrimage also. She became attracted not because he is human, or because she wanted to bang him or anything like that - but because he was her knight in shining armour.

Edit:
Also Shep helped comfort her in her time of sorrow when she discovered that her father had died.

SiansoneaII wrote...

Personally any character who's salient characteristic is their sexuality
is generally not going to be a character I find intriguing. Seriously
folks, there's more to life than coitus

THIS

Modifié par gamer_girl, 10 août 2011 - 07:23 .

[Clonedzero]

ademska wrote...

great argument for why dextro romances were a bad idea in the first place.

terrible argument for why, now that they're in the game, s/s romances don't make sense. you've gotta go all or nothing with this type of argument, zero, and since the "nothing" is off the table after ME2, there's only one other option.

i already said this, but two wrongs dont make a right.
just because they were dumb and caved in to the fanservice in ME2 doesnt mean they have to continue down that path in ME3.

making everyone bi is a waste of resources since theres already a ton of romances, they'd have to record each romance multiple times. having 10 characters all be super attracted to shepard breaks immersion. so its just not really a good idea to do the "everyone is bi" route of DA2, it worked in DA2 since there was only 4 of them. with the 10+ in mass effect thats a ridiculous amount of content to write, record, and put into the game where a majority of people wont see it (since you can only do one romance)

so from a writing and buisness perspective it makes alot more sense to just have a couple s/s romances, makes the most sense. so if they're doing a couple s/s romances, wouldnt it be a good idea to use the ones that make the most sense? the ones that the average person can look at and go "oh well that makes sense i can believe that".

yeah, technically they could go down the route of " theres more to relationships than physical attraction and sex" "there are ways they could make the relationship work" ect. yeah, its all possible. the real question is, should they bother working on such a weird and awkward relationship that wont make sense to most people?

they are a company that is trying to make money. developing romances in the game costs money. so shouldnt they focus on ones that would resonate the most with the fans?

i havent heard a reason for them to be in the game other than "why not?" and theres alot of good reasons why not to.

[LiaraShepard]

If you have a boy friend who is HIV positive you can sleep with him, too. You just have to be careful. But it doesn't mean that your romance with him is unrealistic or stupid. It'd be unrealistic, if Shepard would only go into a relationship with someone he can reproduce with.Love isn't about rationality. It's about feelings and emotions. Of course, he has a job that's really important, but he's still a human...and not perfect. And I think it's not unrealistic to show some humanity. In a way, aliens are human too. Because they have similar feelings like us.

[bleetman]

As I said in another thread, if every Quarian who had sex developed a severe infection or died as a result, there'd be a lot less of them around today. It's reasonable to assume that they can, on some level, prepare in advance in such a way as to minimize the risk. It's also reasonable to assume an environmentally controlled space ship makes for a suitable place to do so. What bothers me isn't that it's apparently possible, but that all it amounts to in Mass Effect 2 is chowing down on some immuno-boosters and getting it on, despite Shepard being human presumably complicating matters more.

Siansonea II wrote...

Seriously folks, there's more to life than coitus.

What! When did this happen? Good God, I've been decieved for my entire adolescent youth! I think I might cry.

Modifié par bleetman, 10 août 2011 - 07:26 .

[gamer_girl]

LiaraShepard wrote...

If you have a boy friend who is HIV positive you can sleep with him, too. You just have to be careful. But it doesn't mean that your romance with him is unrealistic or stupid. It'd be unrealistic, if Shepard would only go into a relationship with someone he can reproduce with.Love isn't about rationality. It's about feelings and emotions. Of course, he has a job that's really important, but he's still a human...and not perfect. And I think it's not unrealistic to show some humanity. In a way, aliens are human too. Because they have similar feelings like us.

Exactly.

Clonedzero wrote...

so from a writing and buisness perspective it makes alot more sense to
just have a couple s/s romances, makes the most sense. so if they're
doing a couple s/s romances, wouldnt it be a good idea to use the ones
that make the most sense? the ones that the average person can look at
and go "oh well that makes sense i can believe that".

While I agree that the best route is to make a few characters s/s and to use the ones that make sense, I think Tali makes a lot of sense for a s/s option. Definitely not as much as Ash does, but still makes sense.

Modifié par gamer_girl, 10 août 2011 - 07:28 .