25715 réponses à ce sujet

[slimgrin]

jlb524 wrote...

FoxHound109 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Scenario 4. Make certain NPC's gay. Problem solved.

Doesn't really solve the problem of the straight Shepard having about a billion L.I.'s.

It would if it follows my Scenario 2 (limit all Shepards based on realistic criteria like gender, appearance, morality, etc.).

But slimgrin's still ignoring my question.

Option 2. Because I actually I experience it. We all do.

[jlb524]

slimgrin wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

FoxHound109 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Scenario 4. Make certain NPC's gay. Problem solved.

Doesn't really solve the problem of the straight Shepard having about a billion L.I.'s.

It would if it follows my Scenario 2 (limit all Shepards based on realistic criteria like gender, appearance, morality, etc.).

But slimgrin's still ignoring my question.

Option 2. Because I actually I experience it. We all do.

Option 2 is unfair?

[eroguro]

IsaacShep wrote...

eroguro wrote...

Maybe one or two being bisexual wouldn't be so bad, but everyone single one? Eh I am not for that.

It's not like anyone expect BioWare to make every past LI available. Everyone know it's simply impossible at this point, even if for the fact most of them won't be squadmates so there wouldn't even be time to start a new romance (of any kind). But yes, at least some/few would be very welcomed and is what we realistically hope for.

eroguro wrote...
LI wise, I feel like Fem!Shepard has more options no matter whether she is going for a same-sex or a heterosexual standing based on the player preference. Male!Shepard has hardly anyone, at least in my humble opinion. I also feel that he doesn't have much of a choice for a relationship with an alien partner who isn't female. It would be nice to get some more alien male LI's without thwarting the ones of the original games.

Ah well, one can dream, no?

Straight ManShep: Liara, Ashley, Miranda, Jack, Tali, Kelly + Consort sex + Samara/Morinth/Shiala/Gianna flirting

Straight FemShep: Kaidan, Jacob, Thane, Garrus

Lesbian FemShep: Liara, Kelly + Consort sex + Samara/Morinth/Shiala flirting

Gay ManShep:

That tumbleweed pretty  much sums up how I feel for Gay ManShep. Haha.  

Modifié par eroguro, 20 novembre 2011 - 09:36 .

[slimgrin]

jlb524 wrote...

Option 2 is unfair?

Heh..you're being clever here.

Of course it's potentially unfair. You see a problem with including rejection in the game based on sexual preferance?

Modifié par slimgrin, 20 novembre 2011 - 09:39 .

[jlb524]

slimgrin wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Option 2 is unfair?

Heh..you're being clever here.

Of course it's potentially unfair. You see a problem with including rejection in the game based on sexual preferance?

I'm not being clever.  I asked you which one you think is unfair.   You keep dancing around the question.

I think both Option 2 and 3 are fair while Option 1 is not.

I have no problems with including rejection based on sexual preference as long as rejection based on other realistic criteria is also included for all sexualities.  

[shepskisaac]

slimgrin wrote...

Because I actually I experience it. We all do.

Not in ME trilogy. And that's what we're talking here.

[fdgvdddvdfdfbdfb]

jlb524 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Option 2 is unfair?

Heh..you're being clever here.

Of course it's potentially unfair. You see a problem with including rejection in the game based on sexual preferance?

I'm not being clever.  I asked you which one you think is unfair.   You keep dancing around the question.

I think both Option 2 and 3 are fair while Option 1 is not.

I have no problems with including rejection based on sexual preference as long as rejection based on other realistic criteria is also included for all sexualities.  

I see where you're coming from. But does it have to be an all or nothing approach? It'd be bloody tough to model in 100% true to life human interpersonal relationships. Or impossible.

IsaacShep wrote...

Straight ManShep: Liara, Ashley, Miranda, Jack, Tali, Kelly + Consort sex + Samara/Morinth/Shiala/Gianna flirting

Straight FemShep: Kaidan, Jacob, Thane, Garrus

Lesbian FemShep: Liara, Kelly + Consort sex + Samara/Morinth/Shiala flirting

Gay ManShep:

Hmm well although we all know it's a cheap ploy that Asari are carbon copies of us with blue paint, technically there's still only Kelly, and everything with her is only implied at best. Lol at the tumbleweed though.

Modifié par fdgvdddvdfdfbdfb, 20 novembre 2011 - 10:08 .

[slimgrin]

jlb524 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Option 2 is unfair?

Heh..you're being clever here.

Of course it's potentially unfair. You see a problem with including rejection in the game based on sexual preferance?

I'm not being clever.  I asked you which one you think is unfair.   You keep dancing around the question.

I think both Option 2 and 3 are fair while Option 1 is not.

I have no problems with including rejection based on sexual preference as long as rejection based on other realistic criteria is also included for all sexualities.  

We all know what's fair: we all get to f*ck everybody. Why in the hell should ME3 writers be considering such an option?

Do you get to f*ck whoever you want? Will this fact of nature change in a thousand years? 

No.

[shepskisaac]

slimgrin wrote...

We all know what's fair: we all get to f*ck everybody. Why in the hell should ME3 writers be considering such an option?

Do you get to f*ck whoever you want? Will this fact of nature change in a thousand years? 

No.

Ok, what are you arguing right now? Straight Shep, especially male one seem to be able to f&ck exactly whoever he wants in this franchise. So why the hell shouldn't gay Shep be able to do it in ME3?

[Abispa]

slimgrin wrote...

We all know what's fair: we all get to f*ck everybody. Why in the hell should ME3 writers be considering such an option?

Do you get to f*ck whoever you want? Will this fact of nature change in a thousand years? 

No.

And you still don't get it. Nobody is saying that "all bi" is realistic, only that it is... interesting that the announcement of m/m romances in ME3, maybe *gasp* even with previous LIs, has been the focus of this passionate cry of outrage and demands for more "realistic" or "credible" romances in the series.

As a straight man who doesn't normally do the s/s romances, I have never been bothered by the "unrealistic" nature of the Bioware LIs. I KNOW they're a fan service. When the hell is a video game NOT a fan service? But I enjoy my imperfect, unrealistic fictional romances with Ashley and Isabela. It doesn't bother me that the OP may get her s/s Ashley and that IsaacShep may get his s/s Kaidan. My happiness with a game based on accessorizing and choices doesn't rely on Bioware limiting other players' choices.

I am distressed that you consider it desirable, or even feasible, that Bioware should make the ME series an accurate portrayal of natural law.

Modifié par Abispa, 20 novembre 2011 - 10:11 .

[FoxHound109]

Abispa wrote...

And you still don't get it. Nobody is saying that "all bi" is realistic, only that it is... interesting that the announcement of m/m romances in ME3, maybe *gasp* even with previous LIs, has been the focus of this passionate cry of outrage and demands for more "realistic" or "credible" romances in the series.

Bingo!

Credibility is important and so is some sense of realism, but remember that entertainment is important too. When games get TOO realistic things become awfully boring (e.g. Grand Theft Auto IV). Nobody is trying to argue that all bi L.I.s is realistic or even credible, simply that when you're in for a penny...well, you know the rest. Truth be told, if you want realism then you might as well make a new thread complaining about the entire romance aspect of the Mass Effect series. 

[slimgrin]

IsaacShep wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

We all know what's fair: we all get to f*ck everybody. Why in the hell should ME3 writers be considering such an option?

Do you get to f*ck whoever you want? Will this fact of nature change in a thousand years? 

No.

Ok, what are you arguing right now? Straight Shep, especially male one seem to be able to f&ck exactly whoever he wants in this franchise. So why the hell shouldn't gay Shep be able to do it in ME3?

Are gays and bi's not a minority now? Why do you think that wil change in ME's timeline?

The point of conflict here is I want the writers to adhere to a sense of reality, and the opposing team wants player choice - but at the cost of character integrity.

Modifié par slimgrin, 20 novembre 2011 - 10:17 .

[jlb524]

slimgrin wrote...

We all know what's fair: we all get to f*ck everybody. Why in the hell should ME3 writers be considering such an option?

Do you get to f*ck whoever you want? Will this fact of nature change in a thousand years? 

No.

You do know we aren't talking about real life 

Video games =/= real life.

I actually said that Option 2 and 3 were fair.  Option 2...the one with restrictions.  Did you even read over the options and my last post?

Until they implement Option 2 (which I don't see happening, tbh) Option 3 is preferrable to Option 1 because it's at least fair.  Neither Option 1 or 3 are realistic.  Option 1 is what BW has implemented in every game minus DA2.

Modifié par jlb524, 20 novembre 2011 - 10:22 .

[Abispa]

FoxHound109 wrote...

Abispa wrote...

And you still don't get it. Nobody is saying that "all bi" is realistic, only that it is... interesting that the announcement of m/m romances in ME3, maybe *gasp* even with previous LIs, has been the focus of this passionate cry of outrage and demands for more "realistic" or "credible" romances in the series.

Bingo!

Credibility is important and so is some sense of realism, but remember that entertainment is important too. When games get TOO realistic things become awfully boring (e.g. Grand Theft Auto IV). Nobody is trying to argue that all bi L.I.s is realistic or even credible, simply that when you're in for a penny...well, you know the rest. Truth be told, if you want realism then you might as well make a new thread complaining about the entire romance aspect of the Mass Effect series.

My favorite s/s critic line of whine is, "Now the gheyz have made Bioware LIs so unrealistic by allowing Shepard to kiss Kaidan, Bioware should take away ALL the LIs!" Whatever.

[slimgrin]

jlb524 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

We all know what's fair: we all get to f*ck everybody. Why in the hell should ME3 writers be considering such an option?

Do you get to f*ck whoever you want? Will this fact of nature change in a thousand years? 

No.

I actually said that Option 2 and 3 were fair.  Option 2...the one with restrictions.  Did you even read over the options and my last post?

Until they implement Option 2 (which I don't see happening, tbh) Option 3 is preferrable to Option 1 because it's at least fair.

You should be fighting for option 2. You should be banging at Bioware's door to write a purely gay romance option.

[jlb524]

slimgrin wrote...

You should be fighting for option 2. You should be banging at Bioware's door to write a purely gay romance option.

So you are an expert on what I should want?

Also, Option 2 doesn't just pertain to gay romances...it pertains to straight ones as well (or bisexual ones).  Option 2 is about adding in realistic restrictions across the board not simply throwing in a bunch of gay romances into a game that already has unrealistic heterosexual romances.  That alone doesn't fix your issue with these romances.

Modifié par jlb524, 20 novembre 2011 - 10:24 .

[FoxHound109]

slimgrin wrote...

Are gays and bi's not a minority now? 

Depends on what you consider to be sexuality. In all honesty, there's a likelihood that most humans are bisexual to some degree or another. I would probably argue that bisexuality is the standard of most organisms, rather than hetero or homosexuality. Social attitudes and a need to label everything and discriminate (not in the derogatory form, but to separate for the sake of understanding) probably prevent more people from admitting that possibility. 

[Abispa]

@ jlb524 -- He is either unwilling or unable to read or comprehend your post.

slimgrin has now taken up the mantle of "master of reality" for ME. Hopefully his title can sustain him, because I now refuse to feed him.

[shepskisaac]

slimgrin wrote...

Are gays and bi's not a minority now?

Can males f*ck every women they want in real life? Do women completly don't mind dating guys who beat other women for no reason? There's NO sense of realism when it comes to the availability of the LIs in ME trilogy and there WILL NOT BE. Maybe in future BioWare games, but not in ME3, the final part of the trilogy. So if there's not gonna be any realism in availability of LIs regarding morals (much more important in the context of the story than sexual orientation) or looks, why do you want to to subduct only sexual orientation under realism criteria?

[jlb524]

Abispa wrote...

@ jlb524 -- He is either unwilling or unable to read or comprehend your post.

slimgrin has now taken up the mantle of "master of reality" for ME. Hopefully his title can sustain him, because I now refuse to feed him.

I guess I can't argue against one with that much power.  

[Ravensword]

Arguments? On my Internet?

[FoxHound109]

I think credibility for the L.I.s went right out the window when Bioware decided to repeatedly state that Liara wasn't a female. That's basically the point of no return.

Modifié par FoxHound109, 20 novembre 2011 - 10:39 .

[Abispa]

FoxHound109 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Are gays and bi's not a minority now? 

Depends on what you consider to be sexuality. In all honesty, there's a likelihood that most humans are bisexual to some degree or another. I would probably argue that bisexuality is the standard of most organisms, rather than hetero or homosexuality. Social attitudes and a need to label everything and discriminate (not in the derogatory form, but to separate for the sake of understanding) probably prevent more people from admitting that possibility. 

I'm not sure I agree, but that really doesn't matter. An DA2-style "all bi" or "hero-sexual" formula is the best way for RPG makers with limited resources who WANT to cater to all persuasions to do so. If they want to invest resources in a large number of restricted options, like they did in ME2, then be prepared to have Garrus tell you he's busy calibrating or Miranda telling you she has a lot of paperwork to get through.

[Olive Oomph]

Also being bisexual doesn't mean that you get to f*ck or even want to f*ck everyone. There is something, what was it again, hmm, yes actual character, that decides wether you are interested in someone or not. Mass Effect doesn't care about character, when it comes to romances, then why should they care about gender? Character is not really relevant in Mass Effect romances, so sexual orientation is not really a factor for character integrity in that context, since it doesn't affect anything beyond the romance part of the game itself. Don't like - don't romance.
But this has basically been said and all of this is mostly going around in circles. I just have been lurking for so long now and I wanted to give my 2 cents.
In a perfect world, you would be able to hit on every damn character and NPC and you would realistically get rejected by a lot of them, but it's a game - they can only write so much romance paths. The best solution is to make every path potentially availabe for any kind of PC.

Modifié par Olive Oomph, 20 novembre 2011 - 10:44 .

[Abispa]

Ravensword wrote...

Arguments? On my Internet?

This is MY internet! All you other suckas owe me rent!

Of course, we could fight for ownership. On BSN that's done by stating your opinion repeatedly with a single minded determination that mirrors George W. Bush's performance in the 2004 debates. The first one to use all caps and creative spelling for explitives to make it around the BSN censors wins.