25715 réponses à ce sujet

[Tietj]

TS2Aggie wrote...

Tietj wrote...

Dude, chill.  It's not Kaidan, although he may be one too, it could go either way at this point.

That's what he said.

 lol I would high five you if I could

[mauro2222]

Blacklash93 wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

Hey! Ladies and gentlemen, care to tell me who the **** is Cortez?

I asked three times already, now... I hate you all for ignoring me

He's the Normandy's new shuttle pilot and the S/S option for male Shepard.

Giggity goo! Thanks

[mauro2222]

Yuqi wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Yuqi wrote...

Are you serious... they said that?

Yep: www.destructoid.com/bioware-explains-lack-of-gay-sex-in-mass-effect-2-170051.phtml

So  a lesbian scene is okay for  pg13? How does that logic even work? Since when was mass-effect a disney movie?

As I said before.

****ing Taboos! and **** how "modern" society thinks of sex. Hypocrisy at its finest.
Suck a lemon

Modifié par mauro2222, 28 décembre 2011 - 09:33 .

[MACharlie1]

Yuqi wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Yuqi wrote...

Are you serious... they said that?

Yep: www.destructoid.com/bioware-explains-lack-of-gay-sex-in-mass-effect-2-170051.phtml

So  a lesbian scene is okay for  pg13? How does that logic even work? Since when was mass-effect a disney movie?

It actually makes sense. 

No, not in a socially accepted way. I mean from the developers perspective. They aren't the ones who issue the ratings for their games - otherwise we'd have T rated games through the roof. The people who do these ratings (it's the same deal with movies albeit different people) tend to look at homosexuality (male) as a very mature thing while female homosexuality, art. It's a double-standard and will hopefully be eradicated soon. I can't blame devs for saying that since it's a fact that you are more likely to get a higher rating for male homosexuality then female homosexuality. 

Though truthfully, I don't think it really matters since it's already rated M. Is there a grade higher then M? 

[priestess of blood]

MACharlie1 wrote...

Yuqi wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Yuqi wrote...

Are you serious... they said that?

Yep: www.destructoid.com/bioware-explains-lack-of-gay-sex-in-mass-effect-2-170051.phtml

So  a lesbian scene is okay for  pg13? How does that logic even work? Since when was mass-effect a disney movie?

It actually makes sense. 

No, not in a socially accepted way. I mean from the developers perspective. They aren't the ones who issue the ratings for their games - otherwise we'd have T rated games through the roof. The people who do these ratings (it's the same deal with movies albeit different people) tend to look at homosexuality (male) as a very mature thing while female homosexuality, art. It's a double-standard and will hopefully be eradicated soon. I can't blame devs for saying that since it's a fact that you are more likely to get a higher rating for male homosexuality then female homosexuality. 

Though truthfully, I don't think it really matters since it's already rated M. Is there a grade higher then M? 

Well here in Australia we have MA+ and hopefully sooner rather then later they will get that R18+ rating through as it causes a number of games to get edited or flatout banned here.

Modifié par priestess of blood, 29 décembre 2011 - 12:22 .

[silentassassin264]

priestess of blood wrote...

MACharlie1 wrote...

Yuqi wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Yuqi wrote...

Are you serious... they said that?

Yep: www.destructoid.com/bioware-explains-lack-of-gay-sex-in-mass-effect-2-170051.phtml

So  a lesbian scene is okay for  pg13? How does that logic even work? Since when was mass-effect a disney movie?

It actually makes sense. 

No, not in a socially accepted way. I mean from the developers perspective. They aren't the ones who issue the ratings for their games - otherwise we'd have T rated games through the roof. The people who do these ratings (it's the same deal with movies albeit different people) tend to look at homosexuality (male) as a very mature thing while female homosexuality, art. It's a double-standard and will hopefully be eradicated soon. I can't blame devs for saying that since it's a fact that you are more likely to get a higher rating for male homosexuality then female homosexuality. 

Though truthfully, I don't think it really matters since it's already rated M. Is there a grade higher then M? 

Well here in Australia we have MA+ and hopefully sooner rather then later they will get that R18+ rating through as it causes a number of games to get edited or flatout banned here.

Here in the States there is the AO (adults only) which is tantamount to saying you want your game banned.

[shepskisaac]

MACharlie1 wrote...

No, not in a socially accepted way. I mean from the developers perspective. They aren't the ones who issue the ratings for their games - otherwise we'd have T rated games through the roof. The people who do these ratings (it's the same deal with movies albeit different people) tend to look at homosexuality (male) as a very mature thing while female homosexuality, art. It's a double-standard and will hopefully be eradicated soon. I can't blame devs for saying that since it's a fact that you are more likely to get a higher rating for male homosexuality then female homosexuality. 

Though truthfully, I don't think it really matters since it's already rated M. Is there a grade higher then M? 

Maybe in movie industry, but neither PEGI not ESRB ever increased a rating because of pressence of male homosexual content.

[Red by Full Metal Jacket]

They also might have been afraid of the backlash. I remember the first game was banned in Singapore because of the "lesbian" sex scene. After DA:O was released with little to no backlash about the male/male content, I think Bioware probably decided to add the content into ME3 (as ME2 was already done by then).

This is, of course, speculation.

Modifié par Red by Full Metal Jacket, 29 décembre 2011 - 02:32 .

[shepskisaac]

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

They also might have been afraid of the backlash. I remember the first game was banned in Singapore because of the "lesbian" sex scene. After DA:O was released with little to no backlash about the male/male content, I think Bioware probably decided to add the content into ME3 (as ME2 was already done by then).

This is, of course, speculation.

Singapoure is a small market providing very little influence on sales. And the 'ban' was reversed a week later. Also, in Singapoure male/male homosexual sex is illegal. I'm not joking. It's practically a dead law by now, but nonetheless it exists so it's a very specific example. Up until 2007, even oral sex between heterosexual couples was illegal. So again, very specific country, despite being rich and largely considered to be 'westernized' to a certain degree. 90%+ of BioWare sales (and western games in general) come from NA & Europe and ESRB & PEGI rate games in these regions and they never had any problem with male/male content.

[Blacklash93]

IsaacShep wrote...

Yuqi wrote...

Are you serious... they said that?

Yep: www.destructoid.com/bioware-explains-lack-of-gay-sex-in-mass-effect-2-170051.phtml

If they just said that they didn't want to do it or didn't think it was worth it than I wouldn't have had an issue with this. It would at least be an honest answer and I can appretiate that. Then I could've tolerated Bioware making content that would inevitably appeal to lesbians while leaving gay men out in the cold. It's their right as a company to include or exclude whatever they like. 

It was the constant excuses and PR BS that upset me. Any of that in any similar situation from a company like Bioware is just blatant disrespect toward the fanbase. They owe their fans an honest explanation.

[Tietj]

Blacklash93 wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Yuqi wrote...

Are you serious... they said that?

Yep: www.destructoid.com/bioware-explains-lack-of-gay-sex-in-mass-effect-2-170051.phtml

If they just said that they didn't want to do it or didn't think it was worth it than I wouldn't have had an issue with this. It would at least be an honest answer and I can appretiate that. Then I could've tolerated Bioware making content that would inevitably appeal to lesbians while leaving gay men out in the cold. It's their right as a company to include or exclude whatever they like. 

It was the constant excuses and PR BS that upset me. Any of that in any similar situation from a company like Bioware is just blatant disrespect toward the fanbase. They owe their fans an honest explanation.

While I mainly agree with your point, I don't think that they "owe" us anything at all.  Was it frustrating?  Yes.  But they've decided to include it in the third installment, I'm happy about that, and at this point whatever they said in the past should be water under the bridge.

[Unbannable]

IsaacShep wrote...

neither the statement from Muzyka that Shep is pre-defined heterosexual even though FemShep can bang Kelly and half of Asari population. We just have to forget about these BS quotes and be happy they came to their senses

Actually this makes lots of sense.  Shepard, as Bioware has made him to be, is a predefined heterosexual male, for both marketing and plot related reasons..

If the Mass Effect movie is ever made, you can be certain Shepard will be a heterosexual male.

Why?  Because the best heroes are always heterosexual men, and Western culture loves the masculine hero archetype above all others..  Batman, James Bond, Indiana Jones, Hans Solo, Nathan Drake, Geralt of Rivia, Aragorn, Jon Snow......see a trend here?

Sorry, but no one wants to play a game or watch a movie where the hero is gay.....other than the gays. 

As for FemShep, she is inconsequential.  FemShep is only a reflection of Shepard, but is not considered the real Shepard, because the real Shepard is.............you guessed it, a heterosexual male.

[MACharlie1]

Unbannable wrote...
As for FemShep, she is inconsequential.  FemShep is only a reflection of Shepard, but is not considered the real Shepard, because the real Shepard is.............you guessed it, a heterosexual male.

And, as I said, lesbianism is considered art and everyone loves lesbians. As a former box office attendant, I can easily tell you how many seemingly straight men went to go see Black Swan. A lot. I don't think they went because it was an intense movie about schizoids or ballet. They went because they wanted to see Natalie Portman and Mila Kunis bump uglies. 

[JeffZero]

I worked at a theater then as well. I can second that.

[MACharlie1]

This trope is relevant to this discussion. And this one.

Modifié par MACharlie1, 29 décembre 2011 - 06:21 .

[priestess of blood]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Unbannable wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

neither the statement from Muzyka that Shep is pre-defined heterosexual even though FemShep can bang Kelly and half of Asari population. We just have to forget about these BS quotes and be happy they came to their senses

Actually this makes lots of sense.  Shepard, as Bioware has made him to be, is a predefined heterosexual male, for both marketing and plot related reasons..

As for FemShep, she is inconsequential.  FemShep is only a reflection of Shepard, but is not considered the real Shepard, because the real Shepard is.............you guessed it, a heterosexual male.

Why look, another person convinced that there is a "canon Shepard" and that any Shepard who deviates from it is somehow not the "real" Shepard. How amusing.

Well said Cthulhu, it's part of why when I heard about the Mass Effect movie, I'd like it if it didn't have anything to do with Shepard as part of the charm is that there is no canon shep, that we craft our own story.

Maybe they could do something about the first contact war or any number of other expanded ideas.

Modifié par priestess of blood, 29 décembre 2011 - 06:30 .

[Unbannable]

MACharlie1 wrote...

And, as I said, lesbianism is considered art and everyone loves lesbians. As a former box office attendant, I can easily tell you how many seemingly straight men went to go see Black Swan. A lot. I don't think they went because it was an intense movie about schizoids or ballet. They went because they wanted to see Natalie Portman and Mila Kunis bump uglies. 

So art = titilation now?  Heterosexual men often tend to be aroused by girl on girl scenes, nothing new about that.  I certainly would not define lesbianism as art however. 

Anyway, Black Swan was hardly a blockbuster movie, at least compared to movies with stereotypical male leads, ie Batman Begins, LotR, Avatar etc...

[MACharlie1]

Unbannable wrote...

MACharlie1 wrote...

And, as I said, lesbianism is considered art and everyone loves lesbians. As a former box office attendant, I can easily tell you how many seemingly straight men went to go see Black Swan. A lot. I don't think they went because it was an intense movie about schizoids or ballet. They went because they wanted to see Natalie Portman and Mila Kunis bump uglies. 

So art = titilation now?  Heterosexual men often tend to be aroused by girl on girl scenes, nothing new about that.  I certainly would not define lesbianism as art however. 

Anyway, Black Swan was hardly a blockbuster movie, at least compared to movies with stereotypical male leads, ie Batman Begins, LotR, Avatar etc...

I should use quotation marks more liberally. I mean art as in "art". 

Hell, two movies depicting lesbians were big timers at the Oscars this past year (Black Swan and The Kids Are All Right). How many movies depicting man-on-man have been big time Oscars? Brokeback Mountain? I want to be wrong that there has only been one within the past two or three decades....

[Unbannable]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Why look, another person convinced that there is a "canon Shepard" and that any Shepard who deviates from it is somehow not the "real" Shepard. How amusing.

People can make Shepard into whoever they wish him/her to be.  Thats a right that Bioware gives it's customers.

However, Shepard as envisioned by his creators is undoubtedly a heterosexual male.  Whether that makes him canon or not is debateable I suppose, but I think the creator's intent overrides peoples' individual tastes.

[Unbannable]

MACharlie1 wrote...

I should use quotation marks more liberally. I mean art as in "art". 

Hell, two movies depicting lesbians were big timers at the Oscars this past year (Black Swan and The Kids Are All Right). How many movies depicting man-on-man have been big time Oscars? Brokeback Mountain? I want to be wrong that there has only been one within the past two or three decades....

Well, people tend to find lesbians or girl on girl depictions far less threatening/offensive than man on man stuff.  I remember the ridicule that Alexander the Great got due to it's depictions of man on man love.

What about that Harvey Milk movie?  I'm pretty sure that was well received by reviewers, but just like Black Swan, it wasn't a big revenue generator.

The biggest revenue makers tend to be action oriented movies with strong male leads, which is exactly what the Mass Effect movie will be.

Modifié par Unbannable, 29 décembre 2011 - 06:57 .

[MACharlie1]

Unbannable wrote...

MACharlie1 wrote...

I should use quotation marks more liberally. I mean art as in "art". 

Hell, two movies depicting lesbians were big timers at the Oscars this past year (Black Swan and The Kids Are All Right). How many movies depicting man-on-man have been big time Oscars? Brokeback Mountain? I want to be wrong that there has only been one within the past two or three decades....

Well, people tend to find lesbians or girl on girl depictions far less threatening/offensive than man on man stuff.  I remember the ridicule that Alexander the Great got due to it's depictions of man on man love.

What about that Harvey Milk movie?  I'm pretty sure that was well received by reviewers, but just like Black Swan, it wasn't a big revenue generator.

The biggest revenue makers tend to be action oriented movies with strong male leads, which is exactly what the Mass Effect movie will be.

Ooo. I totally forgot about that one. Then again, it's probably due to the fact that I just don't like Sean Pean. Nothing against the actors ability - I just don't like him personally. :innocent:

Anyway...point is, lesbians are actually marketable. Homosexual men...no. 

(SNL makes fun of the Kennedy's with The Roosevelts depicting Eleanor (Helen Mirran) topless and a lesbian.) 

[Yuqi]

Unbannable wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

neither the statement from Muzyka that Shep is pre-defined heterosexual even though FemShep can bang Kelly and half of Asari population. We just have to forget about these BS quotes and be happy they came to their senses

Actually this makes lots of sense.  Shepard, as Bioware has made him to be, is a predefined heterosexual male, for both marketing and plot related reasons..

If the Mass Effect movie is ever made, you can be certain Shepard will be a heterosexual male.

Why?  Because the best heroes are always heterosexual men, and Western culture loves the masculine hero archetype above all others..  Batman, James Bond, Indiana Jones, Hans Solo, Nathan Drake, Geralt of Rivia, Aragorn, Jon Snow......see a trend here?

Sorry, but no one wants to play a game or watch a movie where the hero is gay.....other than the gays. 

As for FemShep, she is inconsequential.  FemShep is only a reflection of Shepard, but is not considered the real Shepard, because the real Shepard is.............you guessed it, a heterosexual male.

Which makes it just another action- game-adaptation movie. The lead for R.E is female.. and more men go to see that then female so *shrug*

At least we get  exclusive s/s options in me3. Which will probably start an ' angry hetro gamer' thread of somesort. 

[ElitePinecone]

Yuqi wrote...
At least we get  exclusive s/s options in me3. Which will probably start an ' angry hetro gamer' thread of somesort. 

While it's not 100% confirmed that they're exclusive, because the script can always change, I think it's extremely likely. 

Funny thing is though, many people who have a problem with s/s romances have suggested that they be confined to one or two exclusively gay or lesbian characters (instead of a range of LIs open to both genders), as a way of backhandedly appeasing people while not actually doing much for them. As far as I'm concerned, they'd be overjoyed that there's an exclusively gay and lesbian character in ME3. 

If the same people who championed exclusive s/s characters made a fuss about them when it came time to play the game, it'd be a tad (ok, very) hypocritical. 

And yes, I fully expect those sort of threads - we've seen enough of them in the past six months or more since the announcement of the inclusion of s/s. But that's Bioware's problem (or opportunity) - they've proven themselves vastly capable of schooling bigots on their own privilege in the past. 

[shepskisaac]

Unbannable wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

neither the statement from Muzyka that Shep is pre-defined heterosexual even though FemShep can bang Kelly and half of Asari population. We just have to forget about these BS quotes and be happy they came to their senses

Actually this makes lots of sense.  Shepard, as Bioware has made him to be, is a predefined heterosexual male, for both marketing and plot related reasons..

If the Mass Effect movie is ever made, you can be certain Shepard will be a heterosexual male.

Why?  Because the best heroes are always heterosexual men, and Western culture loves the masculine hero archetype above all others..  Batman, James Bond, Indiana Jones, Hans Solo, Nathan Drake, Geralt of Rivia, Aragorn, Jon Snow......see a trend here?

Sorry, but no one wants to play a game or watch a movie where the hero is gay.....other than the gays. 

As for FemShep, she is inconsequential.  FemShep is only a reflection of Shepard, but is not considered the real Shepard, because the real Shepard is.............you guessed it, a heterosexual male.

There's no canon Shepard. If there was, he would be a heterosexual male in comics, novels etc. The only reason he will be male in the movie is that it's safer option from the marketing POV. But that's also changing in Hollywood. Angelina Jolie took a role in an action flick written for Tom Cruise and they changed the gender specifically because she has a big box office power. Nice try, better luck next time. It makes absolutely no sense male Shep is heterosexual but FemSHep can be a lesbian, bisexual or heterosexual. No, if the orientation of Commander Shepard is irrelevant to the story, then it applies in all cases (male & female Commander Shepard) and Muzyka's statement remains stupid.