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[Red by Full Metal Jacket]

Collider wrote...

I like the dialogue for Steve's romance and he seems like the real deal, but if he looks like he was made using the character creator, I am going to rage so hard.

So far - looks like he does.
Not surprised considering how Kelly was the same.

So they spent all this time creating his lines and they didn't bother to at least make him look not generic?

[shepskisaac]

lol perfect Kathy gif xDDD

[SolidBeast]

ElitePinecone wrote...
<snip>

No. You completely missed my point. I wouldn't mind if Cortez were bi at all, provided he wasn't the *only* s/s option. But in this case, expanding a romance to make *yet another* LI for femShep, while we get only 1 choice - yeah, it would make me angry. It would make the lack of choice even more obvious. I wasn't asking for Kaidan and Vega to be bi and Cortez to also be exclusively gay. If we're getting only one choice, the least  they could do is make him exclusive, for the sake of fairness. That is my opinion, though, and you may argue it's selfish, but I can't see how it would be hypocritical. I argue more choice for everyone, or limiting choice for everyone. We are already 2 LIs short compared to f/f options. You might say we should be happy for getting anything at all, but I don't want to be all "yay, more choice for everyone - except us!"

[Atton Rand]

I'm trying to avoid major spoilers until ME3's release, but is there any confirmation of a FemShep/Ashley romance?

Unrelated to the thread at hand: a lot of the posters here have absolutely beautiful same sex signature banners. Here's to hoping for more same sex relationships for both genders -- but especially the guys. You guys have gone too long without one!

[coldSnap]

Atton Rand wrote...

I'm trying to avoid major spoilers until ME3's release, but is there any confirmation of a FemShep/Ashley romance?

Unrelated to the thread at hand: a lot of the posters here have absolutely beautiful same sex signature banners. Here's to hoping for more same sex relationships for both genders -- but especially the guys. You guys have gone too long without one!

No. There's only leaks about 2 exclusively s/s characters. I havent read the ash parts, but from what Ive read of others, she doesnt seem to be available for femShep... hopefully both VS will be bi options, but we'll have to wait and see.

[Atton Rand]

Thanks for the heads up, KaidanLover. Fingers crossed that we both hear good news about our respective ships.

[ElitePinecone]

SolidBeast wrote...

ElitePinecone wrote...
<snip>

snip

I understand the fairness thing, I really do. 

I was just struck that it seems petty to insist on a character's exclusivity *solely* because opening them up to other genders would 'water down' the available options or be considered unequal. Because that only works if you're tallying mShep and femShep LIs. 

In absolute terms, an m/m LI is an m/m LI. What femShep players do with them seems irrelevant, doesn't it? While I do get the fairness issue (one m/m LI against however many other m/f and f/f ones), excluding female players from a Cortez romance *solely* because you think they're already over-entitled is odd, if the aim is eventually to have all LIs romancable by all genders. 

And if the argument is that being bisexual weakens the character, then we're back to the biphobia and "nooo character ruined because bisexual people aren't unique" argument that we've heard so much from s/s detractors.

Personally, I think erring on the side of giving players greater choice where appropriate is never a bad thing. Part of me does appreciate the exclusivity of characters like Sam and Steve, if only because we've literally seen almost nothing of the type in the industry (perhaps Fallout aside?). 

That said, if femShep players really did want to romance Cortez, and Bioware felt compelled to make it work with the character (instead of a grating 'married gay character falls for femShep' scenario) I'd be happy for them in a heartbeat. 

Blacklash93 wrote...
Kelly still managed to look pretty distinctive, though.

Well... until Kenson came along, anyway.

Ugh. Don't remind me. Chakwas and Kelly face mix of doom D:

[SolidBeast]

ElitePinecone wrote...
<snip>

Like I said, I believe it is my right to be unsatisfied with everyone getting more choice than us. I don't see what's petty about it. In my opinion, it would be petty of o/s romancers to whine at us eventually being allowed a s/s romance with Kaidan, for instance, when we already have far less choice than they. As it is, though, I simply cannot be excited for others getting even more, while we're still expected to be happy with crumbs. Obviously, your opinion is different and I think we should just agree to disagree.

[Finis Valorum]

Well since Cortez's primary attraction seems to be towards men regardless, I don't really have any problems with him being revealed to be bisexual, but yes if he was also the only gay option I agree that it would make our comparative lack of choice stand out even more.
Still it seems to me that Steve being our only choice is on the whole a pretty weak argument for making him exclusive to MaleShep only, if there are FemShep players who can handle Zevran in reverse why deny them that option?
Zevran was also our only option DA:O, so it's not like this situation is entirely without precedent. Also in DA:O I always had the feeling that Leliana was mostly oriented towards her own sex as well, yet male wardens could still romance her if they chose to do so.
then again I'm all for making all the either bisexual or PCsexual, especially since in all Bioware games to date romance has always been an optional feature to customize our characters, it's never been truly central to the plot anyway so I don't see the harm in opening it up to anyone who wants it.
Sadly due to the reactions to DA2 I don't see all bi Li's happening again in the near future.

In short what I want is more choices and ideally an equal amount of choices for all players regardless of (sexual) preference.
Regardless of how well Steve turns out to be written, He'l always feel like an afterthought to me, because that's what he is. If we cannot get Kaidan or Vega (note personally I still don't care for Vega since barring any major appearance overhaul mods becoming available for this game I'll always be turned off by his appearance) I hope that the consort at least employs some cute male, Human, Turian and Drell acylotes that we can visit this time around since that seems to possibly be the only way at this point that all my ManSheps who don't care to romance Steve can at least get to express their sexuality.

[catharsisboo]

Bi Cortez would only bother me if he ends up being the only m/m option. It's a little petty, yes, but it would honestly make me angry that Bioware had the time to give fem Shep yet another romance option but didn't bother to do the same for gay Shep. If Cortez isn't the only option, though? Sure. Open him up to fem Shep. Sharing is caring.

(Though I personally want to see an unabashedly gay male after the character assassination of Hendel in Deception.)

[Ryzaki]

catharsisboo wrote...

Bi Cortez would only bother me if he ends up being the only m/m option. It's a little petty, yes, but it would honestly make me angry that Bioware had the time to give fem Shep yet another romance option but didn't bother to do the same for gay Shep. If Cortez isn't the only option, though? Sure. Open him up to fem Shep. Sharing is caring.

(Though I personally want to see an unabashedly gay male after the character assassination of Hendel in Deception.)

This. <3

[dgcatanisiri]

Collider wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

If Male Shepards are getting Vega (now rather unlikely), it's likely we have another Zevran scenario.  If Vega did openly mention that he liked men, straight insecure male gamers would get offended.  So Bioware would him drooling over EDI and the asari so nobody would complain.

The one saving grace is that Vega being M/M would break some stereotypes.
But even that would be lessened by him being a horndog towards women.

It's funny, I complained about feeling uncomfortable with Zebran being openly more interested in women than men, but if Vega really is a bi option, I really wouldn't feel all that upset about it. Maybe it's because I picture EDI getting modeled after Tricia Helfer, and I can, as Kaidan once said, admire the view, and the asari are openly considered as being attractive to just about everyone (salarian bachelor party, anyone?). Or maybe it's because it means there's a choice involved either way. That's my sticking point about Cortez's possibility as a LI, that if he's the only option for male Shepards to romance a male, that makes him a 'take it or leave it' option with regards to a M/M relationship. Given the veritable harems for male Shepard (and femShep isn't that far off), I find that insulting.

I'd be willing to put up with him slanting towards women on the bi scale so long as there's a choice involved.

[ElitePinecone]

Finis Valorum wrote...

Regardless of how well Steve turns out to be written, He'l always feel like an afterthought to me, because that's what he is.

But wouldn't a bi Kaidan also be an afterthought, considering he was never intended to be an m/m option?

I mean, assuming hypothetically that he is available: Bioware would've had to adjust their plans for the character after about April or May 2011, when they announced they were doing s/s romances for the game. We know the decision was only made around then because in interviews a month earlier Hudson had said there'd be no new romances. We also know that when he was asked about the disparity between comments, he said their plans changed. This coincided with the delay in ME3's launch and the extra six months of development time. If Kaidan *is* available for mShep, it's because the dialogue was inserted in the last eight months or so of development. 

Surely Steve and Sam are *less* of an afterthought because they were specifically designed for that role?

[Sylvianus]

I support gay characters and m / m romance.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 30 janvier 2012 - 10:22 .

[fighterchick]

Forgive me for being out of the loop a bit, but I thought that Kaidan and Vega seemed like they would be bi options? What happened?

[_Sylar_]

fighterchicks wrote...

Forgive me for being out of the loop a bit, but I thought that Kaidan and Vega seemed like they would be bi options? What happened?

Well the only confirmed s/s LI for MShep is Steve Cortez...and so on ppl are arguing how unfair is to the gay community that FShep and straight Shep have a couple of romances to choose from and gay players may only have one option,as I said in the appearance of Steve.

Modifié par _Sylar_, 30 janvier 2012 - 04:30 .

[fighterchick]

I thought there was a scene in the script between a male Shep and Vega going on a date or something and dancing. What happened with that?

[ElitePinecone]

fighterchicks wrote...

Forgive me for being out of the loop a bit, but I thought that Kaidan and Vega seemed like they would be bi options? What happened?

They still might be. It's too early to tell either way. 

I just think they probably won't be. To paraphrase Liara, it's more like.... a feeling derived from months of discussing it and looking at developer comments. That doesn't necessarily make me pessimistic, I'm still optimistic that they'll be available. 

[Atton Rand]

I'm doing my first replay of the first two Mass Effect games since the release of Mass Effect II so I may not be remembering this correctly, but the only remotely S/S relationships the ladies got were Kelly (which sadly does not sound like it's going to be a lasting S/S relationship the way the ones with the squadies are) and Liara (who is technically not "female", but certainly has enough female physical characteristics for me to see her as one).

As far as lasting relationships seem to go, it sadly looks like lady-loving FemSheps have only really had Liara. And while that's more than what the MaleSheps have had, sadly, I don't think it's fair to people rolling a Shep of either gender who is into S/S relationships. There needs to be more than one option for both male/male couples and female/female couples. As much as I love the FemShep/Liara romance, the inclusion of only a single female S/S option while excluding the male S/S option in Mass Effect 1 made me feel that its addition to the series was less about inclusiveness and more about "hot alien lesbian sex babes".

That said, if Kaidan is a love interest for MaleShep, I am so going to roll my first MaleShep ever and play through all three games just to romance him in the third installment.

Modifié par Atton Rand, 30 janvier 2012 - 03:54 .

[_Sylar_]

fighterchicks wrote...

I thought there was a scene in the script between a male Shep and Vega going on a date or something and dancing. What happened with that?

Maybe you refer to the sparring between Shep and Vega? It was here on the forums though,but still no sign that Vega/or Kaidan is available for m/m romances However to be optimistic there isn't any evidence also that they aren't It is just well hidden for now...maybe we will have some answers with the upcoming demo

Modifié par _Sylar_, 30 janvier 2012 - 04:01 .

[ZehnWaters]

So we have yet ANOTHER f/f (this time exclusively so) and only on m/m? I get that Asari are all pretty much Bi and that alters the statistics, but percentage-wise there are more gay men than women.

[_Sylar_]

ZehnWaters wrote...

So we have yet ANOTHER f/f (this time exclusively so) and only on m/m? I get that Asari are all pretty much Bi and that alters the statistics, but percentage-wise there are more gay men than women.

Well IsaacShep explains it very well to be honest It's at the back pages somewhere if you find it..but to summarise his words,things set up like this:from Mass Effect 2,a possible romance for FShep is Shiala(from Zulu's Hope if I'm not mistaken)+Liara+Samantha(apparently a new character,not a squad member but MAY BE equal to Kelly)..and for the straight girls-Kaidan,Thane,Jacob,Garrus.

For the straight guys...you all know it here (Both romances from ME1/ME2 ect. Ashley,Jack,Miranda,again Liara,Tali,/a possible hint for a romance of some sort with the agent from Noveria which can be seen in ME2 at Illium/)

And for the gay guys,the only known so far is Steve...

Ofcourse all this is summarised by the previous Mass Effect games+the known info from Mass Effect 3
Excuse me If I'm mistaken somewhere,but the comparison is obvious.

Modifié par _Sylar_, 30 janvier 2012 - 04:28 .

[FoxHound109]

As it stands right now, I really don't think Vega or Kaidan will be M/M romance options. More or less I'm banking on the fact that the leaked script was unfinished and that Bioware hopefully did something last minute to make either of these two a possible romance. More so Vega than Kaidan, and not because I really wish Vega was an option (I do!), but because out of all the L.I.s in the script his romance just seemed to be missing the most lines/completion.

I admit I would be annoyed if only Cortez was M/M. I won't stop from buying and finishing Mass Effect 3 because, honestly, I've invested so much time in this series that it would be pointless not to get to the very end, even if my manShep has to stay FOREVER ALONE. But I would consider that a slap to the face by Bioware to it's gay male gamers (or anybody who wants to enjoy M/M romances). I don't buy the "Bioware isn't required to add M/M romances in the first place, so be thankful that you're getting anything at all" argument. It's true, Bioware isn't required to add more than one (or even any) M/M romances, but I'm also not required to like their choices and accept scraps they throw at me. Not saying that Cortez automatically counts as "scraps": he could be an awesome character, but the enjoyment of Mass Effect, I think we all would agree, is choice. It's pretty much what even Bioware sells the game on: it'd be kind of terrible if straight manShap and straight/lesbian femShep got several romance options and gay manShep only got one. It sort of goes against the reason I fell in love with Mass Effect in the first place.

Modifié par FoxHound109, 30 janvier 2012 - 04:38 .

[_Sylar_]

FoxHound109 wrote...

As it stands right now, I really don't think Vega or Kaidan will be M/M romance options. More or less I'm banking on the fact that the leaked script was unfinished and that Bioware hopefully did something last minute to make either of these two a possible romance. More so Vega than Kaidan, and not because I really wish Vega was an option (I do!), but because out of all the L.I.s in the script his romance just seemed to be missing the most lines/completion.

I admit I would be annoyed if only Cortez was M/M. I won't stop from buying and finishing Mass Effect 3 because, honestly, I've invested so much time in this series that it would be pointless not to get to the very end, even if my manShep has to stay FOREVER ALONE. But I would consider that a slap to the face by Bioware to it's gay male gamers (or anybody who wants to enjoy M/M romances). I don't buy the "Bioware isn't required to add M/M romances in the first place, so be thankful that you're getting anything at all" argument. It's true, Bioware isn't required to add more than one (or even any) M/M romances, but I'm also not required to like their choices and accept scraps they throw at me. Not saying that Cortez automatically counts as "scraps": he could be an awesome character, but the enjoyment of Mass Effect, I think we all would agree, is choice. It's pretty much what even Bioware sells the game on: it'd be kind of terrible if straight manShap and straight/lesbian femShep got several romance options and gay manShep only got one. It sort of goes against the reason I fell in love with Mass Effect in the first place.

You know I read here somewhere the argument that "Kaidan,nor Ashley were implemented to be gay options",but if they weren't,how come Bioware did the recordings of their gay romances for ME1...doesn't matter that they weren't added in the game,simply the fact they,Bioware,did those recordings means for me that it was KEPT IN MIND,that they might be

So yeah..just wanted to write that down and I COMPLETELY agree with you!

Modifié par _Sylar_, 30 janvier 2012 - 04:47 .

[Collider]

how come Bioware did the recordings of their gay romances for ME1

They didn't.