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[Blacklash93]

Abispa wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

...wait Steve and Samantha are bi?

Who said this?

It's only fair if we get VS.

In a way, I agree, although, in the case of Steve, it can be touchy. Kaidan, in male Shepard's universe, has not established his sexuality yet. Ashley, in female Shepard's universe, has not established her sexuality yet (it is Ashley's SISTER who comments about Kaidan being cute, though female Shepard is allowed to infer that Ashley is interested in him). In the case of Steve, a gay character will be established with both gender's universes. Female Shepard will experience a gay widowed pilot who ignores the women the male characters are oogling over and flirts with Vega. I guess, in his particular case (not sure about Samantha), that would make him pansexual rather than bisexual. Kaidan would just be gay in male Shepard's game, while Steve will be litterally turned "straight" in the female Shepard's game.

Steve never directly says he's gay in the dialogue. They could have easily edited and added a few lines to make him bi.

[Cathey]

ElitePinecone wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...





...wait Steve and Samantha are bi?

No, they aren't, my bad. That wasn't good phrasing.

Phew. Was worried there for a moment!

Modifié par Cathey, 22 février 2012 - 01:34 .

[Collider]

Uh, not sure how you could say Kaidan's gay in male Shepard's game considering Rahna, Liara, Chora's Den, and asari matriarch fetish sites.
Edit: And the novels he read about exploring the galaxy in search of beautiful women.

Modifié par Collider, 22 février 2012 - 01:37 .

[Abispa]

Blacklash93 wrote...

Steve never directly says he's gay in the dialogue. They could have easily edited and added a few lines to make him bi.

Oh, I'm sure it could easily be "fixed" with some editing, since the leaked script wasn't final, but as the script was presented to me, it would be problematic.

[syllogi]

Collider wrote...

Uh, not sure how you could say Kaidan's gay in male Shepard's game considering Rahna, Liara, Chora's Den, and asari matriarch fetish sites.
Edit: And the novels he read about exploring the galaxy in search of beautiful women.

Sensitive man who asks about your feelings.  Also, sweats in your presence.  

[Abispa]

Collider wrote...

Uh, not sure how you could say Kaidan's gay in male Shepard's game considering Rahna, Liara, Chora's Den, and asari matriarch fetish sites.

If Asari lovers don't make female Shepard a lesbian, Asari dancers don't make Kaidan "straight."



As for Rahna, I guess she does count, but Kaidan was a kid at the time and I believe she was his best friend, and as my brother explained his own sexuality to me, it isn't uncommon for "gay" boys to develop crushes on girls once the hormones start kicking in full blast.

[Abispa]

Collider wrote...

Uh, not sure how you could say Kaidan's gay in male Shepard's game considering Rahna, Liara, Chora's Den, and asari matriarch fetish sites.

Edit: And the novels he read about exploring the galaxy in search of beautiful women so they could chase boys, go clothes shopping, and fix each other's hair.

Well, that explains everything.

Modifié par Abispa, 22 février 2012 - 01:48 .

[catharsisboo]

I would prefer it if Steve were gay (simply for the sake of having a kickass gay male in the ME verse), but if he's bisexual in the finished product, I won't mind. I'm still really impressed that the ME writing team had the balls to go right to the subject of gay marriage after avoiding any mention of male homosexuality for the past two games.

Modifié par catharsisboo, 22 février 2012 - 01:48 .

[Aurellia]

Collider wrote...

Uh, not sure how you could say Kaidan's gay in male Shepard's game considering Rahna, Liara, Chora's Den, and asari matriarch fetish sites.
Edit: And the novels he read about exploring the galaxy in search of beautiful women.

No we don't need to assert that Kaiden is gay.  All we need is for Kaidan be bi for there to be no barrier to an SS romance in ME 3.

Modifié par Aurellia, 22 février 2012 - 02:57 .

[Ricvenart]

Collider wrote...

Uh, not sure how you could say Kaidan's gay in male Shepard's game considering Rahna, Liara, Chora's Den, and asari matriarch fetish sites.
Edit: And the novels he read about exploring the galaxy in search of beautiful women.

Rahna - A single o/s Relationship from a decade(?) ago, that never got very far. At most he say's how fun she was (not in that way), and how respected and like she was. Mostly talking while playing cards. I've had several women in my life I felt similar towards and even thought I cared about too but possibly because it's what I was taught is "normal". He was young, alone, in a grim situation and maybe just sought comfort in the same way, resulting from that.
Liara - Never says he has any intentions and actually states she isn't his type. Just says she is cute in a certain way.
Chora's Den - As I gay man I have no idea why strip clubs filled with female forms exist and have no reason to feel flustered or embaressed when in them [/sarcasm] And if he is Bi then, it answers itself. In regards to both this and Liara, just because he is attracted to men does not mean he is unable to apprieciate the female form, I know a few exclusively gay men that love a certain aspect of that and tend to surround themselves with women.
Fetish Site - He knows of them, big deal, probably though Joker, the line is neither dissapproving or approving but in context that it's said at a scary moment it's more likely he didn't like it.
Rahna and The one other date - Although I don't think it was brought up to M!shep, if the date took place anyway and went nowhere, something his friends pressured him into, doesn't that say anything to you with a grand total of two fail relationships with women?

As for the books...yes they proved themselves to fall in line with the game so well of late. Although just to make a point, not everything I read/play/watch is gay based creations, I typically dislike what is dubbed "Gay Film" as I find the relationships and portrayals poor, there are exceptions but even though they will be label the same they will typically take focus off the fact the male lead is gay, he just happens to be and the story focuses on his journey in that context rather then him being gay is all the context. Theres also the thing with that area being less available and public, and It's not something I would read/watch in public or just casually mention to everyone I do. Even with the few exceptions not everyone will like it for a variety of reasons.

I'm all for Kaidan being Bi, more then anything, but within the context the game has given us so far, I'm merely pointing out it's possible, no retconning involved, just creating a story or giving us more history which brings new light to an old one. In the same way they could use that information and make Kaidan Gay or Straight depending on the player, in thier own personal ME universe in the same way the Rachni Queen lives or dies but doesn't apply to everyone.

I have a sense of Dejavu, like I've said this all before...

Modifié par Ricvenart, 22 février 2012 - 06:49 .

[People4Peace]

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

MinervaHamster wrote...

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

If they were going to make Ash a romance option for FemShep, they would have done so in the first game. It wouldn't really make sense to change that for ME3.

Well it's funny you say that because they actually DID. They took it out at the last second though.
There is even video of the f/f dialogue...

Which only strengthens my arguement. They want Ash to be straight.

None of us have any idea what Bioware wanted including you. And even if they did, they never said so nor made it canon. As far as I am concerned, when I hear dialogue and the VA between my FemShep and Ash, I can hear the flirtation. Now maybe I am reading into it but I know others have picked up on this as well.

Like someone else mentioned, Garrus and Tali showed no interest in Shep in ME1. And just because Ash doesn't say she is bi/lesbian doesn't mean she isn't. Making the VS bi, in my opinion, completely makes sense. They've been through so much together and heck maybe the VS didn't realize it until Shep died and obviously Horizon wasn't a good time nor place to discuss a possible relationship especially if they weren't going to be a squad mate anyway. And perhaps the VS will even explain this. When I heard the dialogue between FemShep and Ash on Horizon...I could totally see/hear how it could lead to a relationship. Either way, if the VS is bi, it really shouldn't matter. Its not going to detract from the game and it will make a lot of people (including myself) very happy.


PS Ash never rejected my FemSheps (the ones I kept her alive in) and my FemSheps never rejected her since there hasn't been a scene that would allow that anyway. So they still have a (possible) future together

Modifié par People4Peace, 22 février 2012 - 07:14 .

[chazattack]

[/quote]
Like someone else mentioned, Garrus and Tali showed no interest in Shep in ME1. And just because Ash doesn't say she is bi/lesbian doesn't mean she isn't. Making the VS bi, in my opinion, completely makes sense. They've been through so much together and heck maybe the VS didn't realize it until Shep died and obviously Horizon wasn't a good time nor place to discuss a possible relationship especially if they weren't going to be a squad mate anyway. And perhaps the VS will even explain this. When I heard the dialogue between FemShep and Ash on Horizon...I could totally see/hear how it could lead to a relationship. Either way, if the VS is bi, it really shouldn't matter. Its not going to detract from the game and it will make a lot of people (including myself) very happy.


PS Ash never rejected my FemSheps (the ones I kept her alive in) and my FemSheps never rejected her since there hasn't been a scene that would allow that anyway. So they still have a (possible) future together [/quote]

This is my thought exactly. I always suspected the VS didn't fully realise their feelings for Shep until he/she died. Then Horizon was a bit of a shock. Now maybe they'll feel the need to say something.

Life is like that sometimes. Err, exept the coming back from the dead thing

[Knightly_BW]

Oh my... Last night I tried my lesbian shepard on demo for the first time. In his history Kaidan died on Vrimire. You guys can say Kaidan longing while looking behind Male Shep. Ashley's look after female shep is hot. She was practically undressing my shepard with her eyes...

If Ash will be bi in ME3 I guess my Shepard can't resist her.

I wish there were more classes, I am running out of shepards to enjoy all new juicy romances.

[alexdrake]

Well Ricvanart and others summed up the bi Alenko defense so nicely but there are two things I would like to highlight. Firstly, Alenko did mention in no uncertain terms that he loved Rhana. My Sheps have all (not including pure paragon) asked if Alenko got physical with her, mostly to test the waters. He said he would never do that, not lightly anyways, unless I missed something in LotSB I read that as him loving Rhana as a sister.

Next his attraction to asari could be argued as the way I looked at the asari the first time I played mass effect. They could become either gender. I took that to mean during mind sex they could make one feel as though they were a man. That's the only reason I have one hold out Liara hook up because we still have no confirmation on Shenko or Shega and I'm not sold on Steve.

[chazattack]

Even if Kaidan was banging Rhana, it doesn't mean he doesn't want to bang MShep.
He's not gay, but he's never indicated he doesn't like men because he's never been asked.
And just because the VS sexuality wasn't discussed during ME1 it doesn't mean they are strictly straight.
It's a risky thing to hit on your superior. Even more so if they're same sex.

[Frozen83]

Asperius wrote...
I am running out of shepards...

I giggled ... Ask Cerberus to build you a couple of new ones.

OT: It is easy to make them bi in ME3 (funnier thing have happened in my life, why not in games), it is even easy to make it beliveable. Other question is - is it necessary. I think it would be cool for them to flip-flop, but that's it. I can see no in-story reason why should they become romancable for either Shep... Although, "when you died, I realized I felt more for you then just friendship" is cute even if a bit cheesy. M.

[jeweledleah]

asary are monogendered not both gendered and according to Liara, they don't even need physical contact to meld (Morinth corroborates it with her actions), so now, they do not become "males" in relationships. Chora's Den had female human dancers right alongside the asari. he didn't say he would never do that, he said that he takes that sort of thing seriously and that simply didn't have a chance to get that far. and don't even get me started on using stereotypes as some sort of proof.
rationalizing that Kaidan is somehow gay is utterly absurd. you can make an argument that he's bi, but gay? that's one hell of a headcanon, its like rationalizing Zevran as being straight. you can do it all you want, but it will not make it real, merely a self inflicted delusion.
and if Vega is not an LI, or straight LI only, while Kaidan/Ashley are bi? i will have my confirmation of bioware continuing to cater to "straight male gamer", by making a completely avoidable npc and squadmate that is dead in most games their only m/m relationships (essentially hiding their gays), all the while sexing up female characters more then ever before and offering up both straight and "hot lesbian" options galore.

Modifié par jeweledleah, 22 février 2012 - 08:50 .

[Vapaa]

Asperius wrote...

You guys can say Kaidan longing while looking behind Male Shep. Ashley's look after female shep is hot. She was practically undressing my shepard with her eyes...

So I'm not the only one who saw this

The VS are damn hungry in this cut-scene

[goodventure]

ElitePinecone wrote...

The Ashley and Kaidan romance dialogue is gender neutral in any case, and has a strong theme of "I liked you from three years ago, let's get together naow"

(I think Ashley's is particularly well-written, actually. That line about Eden Prime is nice.)

This makes me happy. :]

but wait, is Ashley's romance dialogue written differently from Kaidan's? They were basically the same character in ME2, so I hope in 3 they finally get separated somehow.

[Frozen83]

alexdrake wrote...

My Sheps have all (not including pure paragon) asked if Alenko got physical with her...

About Rhana - paragon (play cards) "yes, we played cards", renegade (getting physical) "no, nothing like that". Liara - paragon (are you interested?) "no, just art appreciation", renegade (remember Alenko, I saw her first) "only by a few seconds".

So is this becoming an Izzy or Izzynot game ? M.

[Knightly_BW]

alexdrake wrote...

Well Ricvanart and others summed up the bi Alenko defense so nicely but there are two things I would like to highlight. Firstly, Alenko did mention in no uncertain terms that he loved Rhana. My Sheps have all (not including pure paragon) asked if Alenko got physical with her, mostly to test the waters. He said he would never do that, not lightly anyways, unless I missed something in LotSB I read that as him loving Rhana as a sister.

Next his attraction to asari could be argued as the way I looked at the asari the first time I played mass effect. They could become either gender. I took that to mean during mind sex they could make one feel as though they were a man. That's the only reason I have one hold out Liara hook up because we still have no confirmation on Shenko or Shega and I'm not sold on Steve.

Also on Asari keep in mind that Barchelor Party talk from 3 guys on Eternity. Each of the guys (Salarian, Human and Turian) saw an Asari very similar to their own race. So maybe Asari has some kind of psychic ability make people attracted to them, like Nymphs of legends.

While those legendary creatures charms only works on males, Asari can use this ability to charm either gender (like Nef's attraction to Morinth). So being with an Asari doesn't show one's sexual preference but their strength of personality (high Paragon or Renegade score for resisting Morinth). Plus how pyhsical an Asari during sex is unknown. They talk about some kind of mind link more than human sexual traditions.

Well at least this is my take on Asari.

[jeweledleah]

Asperius wrote...

alexdrake wrote...

Well Ricvanart and others summed up the bi Alenko defense so nicely but there are two things I would like to highlight. Firstly, Alenko did mention in no uncertain terms that he loved Rhana. My Sheps have all (not including pure paragon) asked if Alenko got physical with her, mostly to test the waters. He said he would never do that, not lightly anyways, unless I missed something in LotSB I read that as him loving Rhana as a sister.

Next his attraction to asari could be argued as the way I looked at the asari the first time I played mass effect. They could become either gender. I took that to mean during mind sex they could make one feel as though they were a man. That's the only reason I have one hold out Liara hook up because we still have no confirmation on Shenko or Shega and I'm not sold on Steve.

Also on Asari keep in mind that Barchelor Party talk from 3 guys on Eternity. Each of the guys (Salarian, Human and Turian) saw an Asari very similar to their own race. So maybe Asari has some kind of psychic ability make people attracted to them, like Nymphs of legends.

While those legendary creatures charms only works on males, Asari can use this ability to charm either gender (like Nef's attraction to Morinth). So being with an Asari doesn't show one's sexual preference but their strength of personality (high Paragon or Renegade score for resisting Morinth). Plus how pyhsical an Asari during sex is unknown. They talk about some kind of mind link more than human sexual traditions.

Well at least this is my take on Asari.

or in other words... Liara romance is not actualy s/s romance according to your interpretation?

[alexdrake]

Hmmm I feel like I just got my head torn off. I think I gave a wrong impression, I didn't mean I thought he was gay just that the bi argument was easy to make and Rhana's story means nothing.

[Knightly_BW]

Vapaä wrote...

Asperius wrote...

You guys can say Kaidan longing while looking behind Male Shep. Ashley's look after female shep is hot. She was practically undressing my shepard with her eyes...

So I'm not the only one who saw this

The VS are damn hungry in this cut-scene

I was expecting her to pounce on Shepard.
 
I can't recall if she did  or not but I get that idea she was about to bite her lower lip which is usually indicates sexually interested woman in art. Can't say much about real life as I didn't interested with women in that way.

[alexdrake]

And I am also not so sure about the total lack of physical contact. Morinth was pretty damn touchy-feely with Shep and her victims. I sincerely doubt that is only to get her targets in the proper frame of mind. Also the sex scene with Liara involved an awful lot of skin to skin as I recall, but it has been a while.