25715 réponses à ce sujet

[Chun Hei]

ElitePinecone wrote...

Progressive_Stupidity1 wrote...

Or they were just too English to be rude about it.

:lol:

I have to admit the reaction to Cortez video wasn't exactly... positive.

I'm more annoyed that even though it's optional and there are three or four opportunities to back out of the romance, people are absolutely freaking out over the slightest possibility of gayShep.

"oh no I'll never see Sheploo the same way again, RUINED" etc

So much for the "I am fine with gays so long as it is not a RETCON" argument.

[ElitePinecone]

Eternal Dust wrote...

umwhatyousay wrote...

Check out this hot spoiler:

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No idea what I'm doing.

OMGZ Conrad Verner is the Reaper overlord? NOOOOOO!!!!

I KNEW IT.

[Eternal Dust]

Awesomness wrote...

Wait Ash isn't s/s? I thought that the game was exactly the same as the leaked script and there seemed to be femshep/ashley in the script.
Shepard: This is a nice spot, Ash.

Ashley: Yeah. All the shuttles zipping around reminds me of when my Dad would get ready to ship out. My mom would bundle us all up, buy us ice cream, and cart us out to the shipyard to watch his transport depart. I still have to resist waving every time a big Alliance ship flies by.

Shepard: You should bring Sarah up here.
Ashley: I will. When she's ready. She'll like the quiet. She wasn't the loud tomboy crashing around like I was.

Shepard: Sounds like you were a handfull.

Ashley: Maybe. My dad got me. Shame you never met him. He would have liked you.

Shepard: You think so?

Ashley: I do. He would have liked you.

Shepard: A badass military woman?

Ashley: Definitely. He would have tried to use his Irresistible Williams Charm on you.

Shepard: Career military man?
Ashley: Yeah. He would have invited you over, cooked you something on the grill, and talked your ear off.

Shepard: That sounds great, Ash. But right now, I can't focus on anything but you.

Ashley: Well now. Those big, powerful Citadel arms giving you ideas, Commander?

We had something before... a long time ago. Something important.

You've seen me at my worst. Totally embarrassing.

I've... held a gun on you, Shepard.

Just had to kill the moment, didn't you?

So that's a romance dialouge and the bolded line shows femshep can/could have this conversation. So either it's cut or something else.

Makes me wonder if this is one of the things they "fixed."

Unbelievable. <_<

[ElitePinecone]

Kemmer wrote...

RinjiRenee wrote...

A friend is perusing the .tlk files. Steve is voiced by Matthew Del ******.

Ah! I remember him from "United States of Tara"!

Yes! That's where I'd heard the voice!

Thanks, that was bugging me for ages. 

[lankyguy]

Chun Hei wrote...

katerinafm wrote...

Does anybody know the differences when mShep and femShep start a new romance with Kaidan? Dialogue wise?

Apparently in the male Shepard dialog Kaidan mentions that a being from another dimension teleported in on him during a mission and shot him with a gay indoctrination ray. This being (known only as "IsaacShep") then proceeded to drag him to a shower and washing him thoroughly with Old Spice Hair and Body Wash in a very innappropriate yet stimulating manner. Kaidan admits that he kinda liked and hoped that he could do it again with Shepard sometime.

I love this. Thank you.

[Chun Hei]

Who is going to send Allers into the ventilation shaft of the Reaper base (or equivalent situation)?

ASHLEY: Um... Shepard. I do not think that is a good idea.

Female SHEPARD: Do not worry so much, Ashley. She is tough and ready to help save humanity!

ALLERS: Uh... I do not want to go into the shaft!

SHEPARD: [Points evil looking machine gun at her.] Skank! I wanted snuggle-bunnies with Ashley! We do not all get what we want! Now move your ass!

[shepskisaac]

Chun Hei wrote...

So much for the "I am fine with gays so long as it is not a RETCON" argument.

Not like we didn't know they were just using this as an excuse

[ADLegend21]

Chun Hei wrote...

Who is going to send Allers into the ventilation shaft of the Reaper base (or equivalent situation)?

ASHLEY: Um... Shepard. I do not think that is a good idea.

Female SHEPARD: Do not worry so much, Ashley. She is tough and ready to help save humanity!

ALLERS: Uh... I do not want to go into the shaft!

SHEPARD: [Points evil looking machine gun at her.] Skank! I wanted snuggle-bunnies with Ashley! We do not all get what we want! Now move your ass!

if only.

[Chun Hei]

lankyguy wrote...

Chun Hei wrote...

katerinafm wrote...

Does anybody know the differences when mShep and femShep start a new romance with Kaidan? Dialogue wise?

Apparently in the male Shepard dialog Kaidan mentions that a being from another dimension teleported in on him during a mission and shot him with a gay indoctrination ray. This being (known only as "IsaacShep") then proceeded to drag him to a shower and washing him thoroughly with Old Spice Hair and Body Wash in a very innappropriate yet stimulating manner. Kaidan admits that he kinda liked and hoped that he could do it again with Shepard sometime.

I love this. Thank you.

No problem. If gay and s/s role players are happy us straight girls can be happy too. Sharing fictional LIs is no big deal really. I do not know why the whiny boys have so much problems with that concept. Of course Kaidan is definitely "bi" in my head canon because I got a Shepard of each gender for him.

[Arik7]

ElitePinecone wrote...

Progressive_Stupidity1 wrote...

Or they were just too English to be rude about it.

:lol:

I have to admit the reaction to Cortez video wasn't exactly... positive.

I'm more annoyed that even though it's optional and there are three or four opportunities to back out of the romance, people are absolutely freaking out over the slightest possibility of gayShep.

"oh no I'll never see Sheploo the same way again, RUINED" etc

That video was posted in Russia, not exactly a paradise for human rights, and especially not for gay rights.

Modifié par Arik7, 03 mars 2012 - 05:27 .

[BrianWilly]

I feel bad for people who wanted their femshep to get with Ashley...but at the same time, it's not exactly like you're being all that stifled, here.  There were choices being offered for a lesbian romance even way back during ME1 (and no, none of that "Asari aren't technically female" nonsense...just because BioWare fails Ethnography 101 doesn't mean that the rest of us have to).

And I honestly disagree that "Let everyone have anyone they want" is the right way to go about this or even all that much easier to implement.  Look at the amount of people here desperate to know what, if any, differences there would be between getting with Kaidan as a man vs getting with him as a woman; players want to feel like they can engage their love interests in a way that befits their chosen gender, that kind of stuff is what makes makes the romances come to life beyond some monotonous gender-neutral compromise. Even DA2 didn't completely neglect that aspect of its storytelling.  The possibility that my ManShep's romance with Kaidan might go exactly the same way as my FemShep's is what's actually tempting me towards Cortez right now.

Using examples like Skyrim or Fables or the Sims to defend this is a very flawed argument.  Your potential romances in those kinds of games are practically ciphers with no backstory or personality to speak of, much less any involvement in the plot; of course you can let players cherry pick those "characters'" sexualities to be whatever the heck and it wouldn't make a difference to those "characters." BioWare games, on the other hand, provide a cinematic experience with fully-fleshed CHARACTERS and backstories.  Making it so that we can "choose" the canonicity and backstory of these characters other than our personal Shepard would be very specious.

Modifié par BrianWilly, 03 mars 2012 - 05:32 .

[Keller42]

Damn, sorry to hear about Ashley, guys. I was hoping both Kaidan and Ashley would adopt a sort "Shepard-ality" for the grand finale. It seems only fair, they've both been with us pretty much every step of the way.

My best friend just spent the past two weeks making a celibate FemShep just for Ash. ...She will not be pleased if this turns out to be true. 

Modifié par Keller42, 03 mars 2012 - 05:30 .

[ElitePinecone]

Chun Hei wrote...
snip

I think expecting bigots to be consistent is asking too much, honestly. 

Even if the m/m romances were quarantined, even if there was a toggle, even if it was guaranteed that it was impossible to accidentally romance someone, and even if the s/s LIs were only new characters - there'd still be people complaining that the mere presence of a lesbian or gay person on their ship made them uncomfortable or disgusted. 

All of those other complaints are often (in my experience) just excuses concealing genuine unease. In fact, I'm glad something like a toggle *hasn't* been introduced, because it'd be artificially 'hiding the gays' and the complaints and immaturity still wouldn't stop. 

[mione]

No Taili. . .and now no Ash?. . .guess my love will stay blue and true.

[ElitePinecone]

Arik7 wrote...

ElitePinecone wrote...

Progressive_Stupidity1 wrote...

Or they were just too English to be rude about it.

:lol:

I have to admit the reaction to Cortez video wasn't exactly... positive.

I'm more annoyed that even though it's optional and there are three or four opportunities to back out of the romance, people are absolutely freaking out over the slightest possibility of gayShep.

"oh no I'll never see Sheploo the same way again, RUINED" etc

That video was posted in Russia, not exactly a paradise for human rights, and especially not for gay rights.

I know many of the intiial commentors were Russian (or using Cyrillic of some sort) but even when it was posted here on the BSN there were more than a few people who took exception to the idea of s/s romances just on principle.

Very often, it was just by posting "EEEEWWWWWWWWWW".

[Eternal Dust]

Chun Hei wrote...

Who is going to send Allers into the ventilation shaft of the Reaper base (or equivalent situation)?

ASHLEY: Um... Shepard. I do not think that is a good idea.

Female SHEPARD: Do not worry so much, Ashley. She is tough and ready to help save humanity!

ALLERS: Uh... I do not want to go into the shaft!

SHEPARD: [Points evil looking machine gun at her.] Skank! I wanted snuggle-bunnies with Ashley! We do not all get what we want! Now move your ass!

I'd do this a thousand times and in a thousand different ways if the result was a giant Gay Ray ™ that I could use on Ash.

[Abispa]

@ BrianWilly -- The MASSIVE flaw in your argument is that Bioware specifically writes their characters to be as open to player's head canons as possible. They are not the robots of Fable or Skyrim, but they are HARDLY fully developed. That is why "gay mods" are almost seamless when inserted into DA and ME. Except for one or two lines and the VA, the romances and other relationships as already written play well for either gender.

It's not just about romance. There are players who SWEAR that Ashley is racist. There are those who say she is religious and probably Christian. In fact she IS in some people's head canon. Not in mine. She mentions her distrust of alien governments in a political sense. She never mentions Jesus so I say she's Jewish.

Is Garrus a really a nice guy who wants to be toughed up by Shepard, or a tough guy who wants to be saved by a heroic Shepard? He's written so you can head canon him any way you want.

In DA:O a player can choose to believe that Morrigan is a lying witch who is playing the Warden for a sucker, or a poor child raised by an abusive mother and just wants to be loved? Again, she is written so you can choose.

Bioware basically gives ups skeletons to flesh out ourselves. To insist that YOUR head canon should be sacred is to miss the point of the Bioware RPG experience.

Modifié par Abispa, 03 mars 2012 - 05:44 .

[devSin]

ElitePinecone wrote...

I know many of the intiial commentors were Russian (or using Cyrillic of some sort) but even when it was posted here on the BSN there were more than a few people who took exception to the idea of s/s romances just on principle.

But why post about it, then? Discussing it here where nearly everybody is supportive of same-sex romance options doesn't seem to serve much purpose...

Unless you just have to get it off your chest, somewhere.

In which case, yes, you're right. It's not exactly inspiring, by any measure.

Modifié par devSin, 03 mars 2012 - 05:51 .

[LoveAsThouWilt]

Abispa wrote...

@ BrianWilly -- The MASSIVE flaw in your argument is that Bioware specifically writes their characters to be as open to player's head canons as possible. They are not the robots of Fable or Skyrim, but they are HARDLY fully developed. That is why "gay mods" are almost seamless when inserted into DA and ME. Except for one or two lines and the VA, the romances and other relationships as already written play well for either gender.

It's not just about romance. There are players who SWEAR that Ashley is racist. There are those who say she is religious and probably Christian. In fact she IS in some people's head canon. Not in mine. She mentions her distrust of alien governments in a political sense. She never mentions Jesus so I say she's Jewish.

Is Garrus a really a nice guy who wants to be toughed up by Shepard, or a tough guy who wants to be saved by a heroic Shepard? He's written so you can head canon him any way you want.

In DA:O a player can choose to believe that Morrigan is a lying witch who is playing the Warden for a sucker, or a poor child raised by an abusive mother and just wants to be loved? Again, she is written so you can choose.

Bioware basically gives ups skeletons to flesh out ourselves. To insist that YOUR head canon should be sacred is to miss the point of the Bioware RPG experience.

Well said, and why I'd like what can be done with friends/enemies/romances - allies in general in a game as shown by Bioware, there is still a lot more I would have done. But one can not neglect that Bioware has set the frame, the standard to which all RPGs that seek to be of high caliber on an emotional level will have to aim to achieve, or surpass. Quite a challenge.

[Abispa]

devSin wrote...

But why post about it, then? Discussing it here where nearly everybody is supportive of same-sex romance options doesn't seem to serve much purpose...

Unless you just have to get it off your chest, somewhere.

In which case, yes, you're right. It's not exactly inspiring, by any measure.

It is on topic and it helps to remind us just how much Bioware and s/s supporters have to put up with in producing a handful of OPTIONAL m/m LIs in a RPG.

[Abispa]

LoveAsThouWilt wrote...

Well said, and why I'd like what can be done with friends/enemies/romances - allies in general in a game as shown by Bioware, there is still a lot more I would have done. But one can not neglect that Bioware has set the frame, the standard to which all RPGs that seek to be of high caliber on an emotional level will have to aim to achieve, or surpass. Quite a challenge.

The trick for a good Bioware game is to get US help in the development of EVERY characters' story, not jus the PC. The fact that so many s/s critics seem to argue sexuality as the ONLY character trait that MUST be set in stone (and based on some arficial quota system based on demographics) seems so silly to me.

Far from being easy, or lazy, Bioware's character writing in a style that encourages the development of head canons seems incredible difficult and worthy of respect, even when it fails.

[Abispa]

Eternal Dust wrote...

Chun Hei wrote...

Awesomness wrote...

Wait Ash isn't s/s? I thought that the game was exactly the same as the leaked script and there seemed to be femshep/ashley in the script.

We are pretty sure she is NOT s/s but there is a SLIGHT hope that she is. Maybe there were plans at one point but if there were and she is NOT s/s then that means Bioware dropped her for some reason. Maybe because of that reporter chick?

ARGGGG! So much rage at Allers right now. Stupid Chobot. We never asked for her.

She may be a video game celebrity, but I think it is safe to assume that Chobot is a video game fan and who among us wouldn't jump at the chance to be a character in ME3? IF IF IF Bioware did indeed use her character as a reason to not make Ashley a s/s LI, then the fault lies with Bioware, not her. And I'm sure Bioware approached her, not the other way around. It's even possible that she may have requested her character be "bi" as a show of support for s/s LI cause.

[MACharlie1]

Abispa wrote...

Eternal Dust wrote...

Chun Hei wrote...

Awesomness wrote...

Wait Ash isn't s/s? I thought that the game was exactly the same as the leaked script and there seemed to be femshep/ashley in the script.

We are pretty sure she is NOT s/s but there is a SLIGHT hope that she is. Maybe there were plans at one point but if there were and she is NOT s/s then that means Bioware dropped her for some reason. Maybe because of that reporter chick?

ARGGGG! So much rage at Allers right now. Stupid Chobot. We never asked for her.

She may be a video game celebrity, but I think it is safe to assume that Chobot is a video game fan and who among us wouldn't jump at the chance to be a character in ME3? IF IF IF Bioware did indeed use her character as a reason to not make Ashley a s/s LI, then the fault lies with Bioware, not her. And I'm sure Bioware approached her, not the other way around. It's even possible that she may have requested her character be "bi" as a show of support for s/s LI cause.

I don't buy it. IGN probably threw Bioware some cash to plug Allers in. I wouldn't be surprised if Allers worked for a news agency that is called IGN. <_<

[Abispa]

MACharlie1 wrote...

I don't buy it. IGN probably threw Bioware some cash to plug Allers in. I wouldn't be surprised if Allers worked for a news agency that is called IGN.

<_<

Even if that were true, Bioware and EA still had to agree to put her in, and there's no evidence that SHE is the reason Ashley isn't s/s LI. I would be shocked, however, if Bioware made her "bi" without her conscent.

Hmm. Too bad I didn't get to do a shower scene with Shepard...

...Or Wrex or the Krogan princess...

[Espurr]

So, guys. According to Priestly no romances were ever cut from the game. If romances aren't there they never were.

Which makes that femshep/Ashley dialogue about ten time more confusing.