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[Jonata]

royceclemens wrote...

Hell, all the female LIs in the game are cool with it if you decide to break it off (with the queen of the amicable break-up being Tali).  Well, Miranda isn't, but she's kind of a special case. 

I must say that I don't like it too much when a game's characters relationship are a little bit too nice. Trying to romance more than one squadmate in ME2 led to harsh reactions from them most of the times. The friendly break-ups of Mass Effect 3 are a little bit too much player-friendly if you ask me. That is nowhere near how commitment works in real life.

Probably Jack wanting to break-up friendly a couple of times isn't because of the game trying to be realistic, it's because of the writers trying to please the players with an easy choice. However, "you make the best mistakes" is one of the best lines in the whole game, so I'm OK with that.

royceclemens wrote...

Note that she does not show up in the destroy ending unless you romanced her, in which case she's looking up at the stars, waiting for you to come back to her.  Say all you want about the EC, but I thought that was sweet.

 

Sweet, you say? Downright delicious I'd say! 

I couldn't praise enough that "implied reunion" they put there. 

Modifié par Jonata, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:46 .

[LanceSolous13]

Yeah, Miri gets the exact same thing. To be honest, Would have prefered an actual goodbye from the ME2 Girls. Can't even be bothered to show up to my funeral.

I say this because of...Just look at the Romantic Tali, Kaidan, Liara, and Garrus goodbyes when you call in an Evac. Never ceases to send chills down my spine and make my eyes water. Slightly jelious of that.

[Jonata]

LanceSolous13 wrote...

Yeah, Miri gets the exact same thing. To be honest, Would have prefered an actual goodbye from the ME2 Girls. Can't even be bothered to show up to my funeral.

I say this because of...Just look at the Romantic Tali, Kaidan, Liara, and Garrus goodbyes when you call in an Evac. Never ceases to send chills down my spine and make my eyes water. Slightly jelious of that.

The fact that the ME2 Romances were put aside compare to the ME3 ones goes without saying at this point, even the EC used far more resources in recording the Tali goodbye dialogue yet BioWare didn't used one dollar to call back Courtenay. I'm okay with the "Stargazing Scene", I love it, but thinking about how better the ME3 Romances were threated makes me feel a little big angry.

[royceclemens]

Jonata wrote...

I must say that I don't like it too much when a game's characters relationship are a little bit too nice. Trying to romance more than one squadmate in ME2 led to harsh reactions from them most of the times. The friendly break-ups of Mass Effect 3 are a little bit too much player-friendly if you ask me. That is nowhere near how commitment works in real life.

Probably Jack wanting to break-up friendly a couple of times isn't because of the game trying to be realistic, it's because of the writers trying to please the players with an easy choice. However, "you make the best mistakes" is one of the best lines in the whole game, so I'm OK with that.

Well, I think that one of the reasons that the breakups by and large are so easy is because BioWare was still dealing with the post-Horizon fallout as well as people complaining about ninja-mancing.  So I guess they just wanted it to be like yanking off a band-aid.  I think it works for Jack because, as I said, she's has grown as a person and I think it compliments the interpersonal work that Shepard did with her.  Jack wants you there, but she doesn't NEED you there.  She's not "fixed," per se, but then again, who among us really is?

And another reason I think it works for Jack in particular is what happens when you contrast her with her old arch-rival Miranda.  After the two of them butted heads all throughout ME2, they kind of rubbed off on each other about as much as Shepard could rub off on either one of them.  In Mass Effect 2, Jack was solitary and lonely with no one to prop her up and she had nothing to feed on but her own rage.  Miranda, on the other hand, was so desperate for someone--ANYONE--to accept her for who she was (after dealing with her father, who wouldn't) that she places herself unquestioningly in the hands anyone who won't try to change her.

Mass Effect 3 rolls around and the roles are reversed.  Jack found meaning in something greater than herself and acceptance in a kind of mother-hen role for an impromptu family of biotic kids.  Miranda, meanwhile, has started trusting herself a little more and is now acting with agency, tracking down a lost sister and getting her revenge on all by herself.  Now dump them.  Jack, who knows she's good enough finally and at long last and doesn't need Shepard to tell her so anymore, plays it off.  Miranda, who at that point has no one else in her life other than you, completely collapses.

I think Jack and Miranda have the most fascinating character dynamic in the entire trilogy.  So while some of us want Jack DLC, and some of us want Miranda DLC, I want Jack AND Miranda DLC.  I want to know what these two think of each other before endgame.

Wow.  I started on one thing and moved on to something else entirely.  I'll shut up now.

[LanceSolous13]

^*blink blink blink*

...I....I never thought of it that way...

[JamesT91]

in my destroy ending i romanced her, and told the stutends to act as support but i still got the cemetary scene.
got her looking at the stars in my synthesis ending

[Kaica]

...Just popping by to express my feelings.

I didn't think much of Jack. To be honest, I disliked her. She seemed selfish and immature. I always shared her hatred for Miranda, "The Cerberus ****", though.

Then I took her with me to complete Miranda's loyalty mission (which, by the way is the only mission I actually hate, for I can't stand listening to Miranda speak).

* SPOILER ALERT, DON'T READ IF YOU MIND *

Asari to Miranda: I'm just waiting for you to get dressed. Or does Cerberus really let you **** around in that outfit?
Jack: I like her. Are we still recruiting?

* End of spoilers *

I laughed my ass off!

Now I'm balancing whether or not to romance Jack (I intended this Shepard to be gay). She has gained incredibly amount of depth since I've started to actually talk to her. She is an awesome character. I really like her.

Just my two cents

[Premier Bromanov]

JamesT91 wrote...

in my destroy ending i romanced her, and told the stutends to act as support but i still got the cemetary scene.
got her looking at the stars in my synthesis ending

Was your EMS low(er) in your Destroy playthrough?

[JamesT91]

Premier Bromanov wrote...

JamesT91 wrote...

in my destroy ending i romanced her, and told the stutends to act as support but i still got the cemetary scene.
got her looking at the stars in my synthesis ending

Was your EMS low(er) in your Destroy playthrough?

no it was the same save,played straight after synthesis ending.   synthesis was first choice, but i wanted to see what the romance would do in destroy since id read that shepard doesnt die in it, so i just loaded the autosave  where im walking towards the beam

Modifié par JamesT91, 01 juillet 2012 - 12:32 .

[teh DRUMPf!!]

royceclemens wrote...

I think you only get the cemetery slide if you chose to have the students go to the frontline instead of using them as support.  Those graves are occupied by her students.  If you chose them for support, she's back on Grissom, looking at her students with her arms crossed.

O.O

Oh wow, that's rough. And here I was thinking "Well, Shepard may be dead, but at least she has her kids." Poor Jack, as if she hasn't suffered enough.

[Jonata]

royceclemens wrote...
And another reason I think it works for Jack in particular is what happens when you contrast her with her old arch-rival Miranda.  After the two of them butted heads all throughout ME2, they kind of rubbed off on each other about as much as Shepard could rub off on either one of them.  In Mass Effect 2, Jack was solitary and lonely with no one to prop her up and she had nothing to feed on but her own rage.  Miranda, on the other hand, was so desperate for someone--ANYONE--to accept her for who she was (after dealing with her father, who wouldn't) that she places herself unquestioningly in the hands anyone who won't try to change her.

Mass Effect 3 rolls around and the roles are reversed.  Jack found meaning in something greater than herself and acceptance in a kind of mother-hen role for an impromptu family of biotic kids.  Miranda, meanwhile, has started trusting herself a little more and is now acting with agency, tracking down a lost sister and getting her revenge on all by herself.  Now dump them.  Jack, who knows she's good enough finally and at long last and doesn't need Shepard to tell her so anymore, plays it off.  Miranda, who at that point has no one else in her life other than you, completely collapses.

I think Jack and Miranda have the most fascinating character dynamic in the entire trilogy.  So while some of us want Jack DLC, and some of us want Miranda DLC, I want Jack AND Miranda DLC.  I want to know what these two think of each other before endgame.

Wow.  I started on one thing and moved on to something else entirely.  I'll shut up now.

Well, these are some very nice concepts, and I see that you're not the only one that likes the Jack/Miranda dynamics.

But while I think you made one hell of a job explaining why these dynamics are so much interesting, I must say that I don't feel it that way. When I played ME2, I don't even saw Miranda as Jack's arch-enemy, but just a Cerberus loyalist. Never saw that much juxtapositio between them, just some inevitable friction because of Miranda's ideals about Cerberus and The Illusive Man.

To be honest, Miranda doesn't convince me at all. During ME2 her character arc is pretty boring, she doesn't change (at all!) after her loyalty mission: she wants someone to "understand" her, but she does never, EVER question Cerberus or The Illusive Man's position until the very end of the game (when she gingerly says that maybe destroying the Collector's Base wasn't such a bad idea).

Just my two cents on the character, though. I'm still thinking that all the ME2 squadmates rocks.

[vX-INSANIAC-Xv]

Jonata wrote...

Just my two cents on the character, though. I'm still thinking that all the ME2 squadmates rocks.

This is so true, apart from Jacob who I didnt really care for all the other ME2 Squadmates were awsome, I mean besides Jack (Who was the best first mate the King boy scout could ask for) we had Thane, Legion, Grunt, Mordin, Samara/Morinth, Miranda and then theres the characters that came back from ME1 which were Garrus and Tali. If you had the DLC you got Kasumi and Zaeed too and their all badasses, its such a shame that ME3 didnt do more for these characters, especially romance wise.

Jack is a prime example because I felt the content she has was some of the best in ME3 but there was so little that if you didnt think it was that good then there were no other moments you could fall back on in the game if you romanced Jack or even if she was just a friend. I won't go into detail about the other characters content shortfalls because this isn't the thread for it but in my opinion Bioware really missed an opportunity with the ME2 Squaddies in ME3.

[Epantiras]

Hey fellow Jackolytes, I'm briefly back from lurking mode: anyone has a good screenshot of all of Jack's possible ending slides? I've seen the "looking at the stars" and "looking at graves so far", but never the "staying at Grissom Academy"

[KingNothing125]

I haven't seen it in game, but someone's got a screenie of it on deviantart.

[Epantiras]

Synthesis Jack :-)

[Premier Bromanov]

Epantiras wrote...

Synthesis Jack :-)

How do you think she would react to it?  Not well, I think. 

I think her thoughts on the matter would be similar to her thoughts on the Keep/Destroy decision with the Collector base.

EDIT: And welcome back, Epantiras :happy:

Modifié par Premier Bromanov, 01 juillet 2012 - 08:54 .

[vX-INSANIAC-Xv]

I really don't think Jack would take synthesis well, I doubt many would in reality. I wouldn't mind getting implants that help my body fight disease and live longer but on my terms and by my choice, in ME synthesis was Shepard playing God and made him no better than Star brat killing everyone every 50,000 years.

[Premier Bromanov]

vX-INSANIAC-Xv wrote...

I really don't think Jack would take synthesis well, I doubt many would in reality. I wouldn't mind getting implants that help my body fight disease and live longer but on my terms and by my choice, in ME synthesis was Shepard playing God and made him no better than Star brat killing everyone every 50,000 years.

Ah, I didn't mean to start ME3 Ending Debate #1903845092346.  I just wanted to know how Epantiras thinks Jack would react to the effects of Synthesis.

Modifié par Premier Bromanov, 01 juillet 2012 - 09:31 .

[vX-INSANIAC-Xv]

Premier Bromanov wrote...

Ah, I didn't mean to start ME3 Ending Debate #1903845092346.  I just wanted to know how Epantiras thinks Jack would react to the effects of Synthesis.

I didn't intend to start a debate about the ending either, Just saying that I think a lot of people wouldn't agree with it and one of them would be Jack.

[Jonata]

That screen doesn't appear only on Synthesis though. Without the green glowing eyes thing, it is the default Jack screen for every ending if you didn't romanced her and her students were not on the frontline.

[Premier Bromanov]

It makes me so happy to see Jack smile when says, "I've never had a family, but these guys..."!

I wonder how far she'll take her teaching gig. I wonder if she'll even consider joining the Alliance. I could say it would be too formal for her, but she's changing, and her future is wide open.

[Shaleist]

Premier Bromanov wrote...

It makes me so happy to see Jack smile when says, "I've never had a family, but these guys..."!

I wonder how far she'll take her teaching gig. I wonder if she'll even consider joining the Alliance. I could say it would be too formal for her, but she's changing, and her future is wide open.

Grissom Academy is run by the Alliance.. she's an officer now. I know... she's out of uniform lol.   That's actually one thing that bugs me in ME3 that's trivial really... her 'kids' are Ensigns, which means they had to have GRADUATED from a service academy already.  So they can't be students actually,  otherwise they'd be Cadet Prangley and Cadet Rodriguez.  Just a little bothersome detail.

[Premier Bromanov]

It's possible she was brought on as what amounts to a consultant. The rest I suppose still stands, but it's really besides the point. It's fulfilling to see her happy with her students, and it's fun to speculate about what she'll do with the rest of her life, whether Shepard's there at her side or not.

[Jonata]

Premier Bromanov wrote...

It's possible she was brought on as what amounts to a consultant. The rest I suppose still stands, but it's really besides the point. It's fulfilling to see her happy with her students, and it's fun to speculate about what she'll do with the rest of her life, whether Shepard's there at her side or not.

Shepard and Joker makes it clear that she's in the military. She's an Alliance Officer now... the artbook says that she do not like uniforms so she do not wear them (go and try to force her). Just adding my knowledge to that topic!

...speaking of the post-ME3 Jack, since my canon Shep is a Vanguard (hence, a powerful biotic), sometimes I like to imagine a heavy injured Shepard becoming Grissom Academy's own Charles Xavier, with Jack as the school's Jean Grey. 

X-Men parodies aside, I think it's pretty safe to assume she will still work with the Academy for as long as she can, she seem to love what she's doing in ME3.

Modifié par Jonata, 02 juillet 2012 - 03:19 .

[Premier Bromanov]

Jack joining the Alliance and being fast-tracked through rank is a little much for me to accept. The time between ME2 and ME3 must have been very revelatory and productive for her. I'm happy to see her happy, but I don't readily accept she'd throw herself in to such a formal situation so quickly. Or, maybe this is what she wanted all along, but she was so caught up in her fatalistic world-view that she couldn't see it.

Whatever the case is, Jack would look hot in Alliance navy uniform. Especially if she can keep the hair.