82210 réponses à ce sujet

[AgitatedLemon]

Ryzaki wrote...

AgitatedLemon wrote...

Skullheart wrote...

Creating more humans like Miranda could be good, only if everyone ic capable of doing it.

The main problem is that it can create a big social gap, generating jealosly (from the naturals who can't affor it) and racism. A good analogy could be Gundam Seed (Naturals vs Coordinators)

there's also this.


though I don't think racism is the right word, just prejudice.

Prejudice already exists and will always exist. The victims will simply change.

I don't see that as a good reason to hold the human race as a whole back.

You seem to like putting words in my mouth, don't you?

[flemm]

In passing, I think one reason why this is such a beautiful and haunting image of Miranda is that the artist draws on some of the ideas we are talking about.

She's definitely a human being, but cradled by technology, almost as if it were the womb:

Modifié par flemm, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:09 .

[AgitatedLemon]

Where is she in that picture, anyway?

The environment almost reminds me of the heretic station, minus her breathing mask.

Modifié par AgitatedLemon, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:10 .

[Ryzaki]

AgitatedLemon wrote...

You seem to like putting words in my mouth, don't you?

And what words pray tell did I put in your mouth? First time I merely asked a question (a bit blunty I admit but it was just a question) and the second time I simply quoted you and pretty much said I don't agree with that reasoning.

But if I did put words in your mouth (I'd like you to show me were so I know not to do it again) I apologize because that wasn't my intention.

My intention was merely to say I didn't find prejudice a sufficent reason for not allowing humans to be developed like Miranda and with all the benefits she enjoys because prejudice is something that isn't going anywhere. Not unless you manage to rewire the entire human race.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:16 .

[flemm]

AgitatedLemon wrote...

Where is she in that picture, anyway?

I dunno. The womb?

Could be a shuttle or something, I guess. But she doesn't seem to be piloting it, or anything.

So, I think it's about themes and stuff

[AgitatedLemon]

Ryzaki wrote...

AgitatedLemon wrote...

You seem to like putting words in my mouth, don't you?

And what words pray tell did I put in your mouth? 

Because if I did so I apologize that wasn't my intention.

My intention was merely to say I didn't find prejudice a sufficent reason for not allowing humans to be developed like Miranda and with all the benefits she enjoys because prejudice is something that isn't going anywhere. Not unless you manage to rewire the entire human race.

Well there's the whole "Holding the human race back". Not once did I say or reference anything about holding humanity back.

And I wouldn't say Miranda exactly enjoys her modifications, unless having an incredibly low self esteem is a sign of happiness.

edit: Prejudice (Which I didn't even bring up, I was correcting Skullheart, there's another one) isn't the only social barrier to artificial birthing.

I'll direct you towards my post about Mordin and the genophage for an idea of my thoughts.

Modifié par AgitatedLemon, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:17 .

[Ryzaki]

AgitatedLemon wrote...

Well there's the whole "Holding the human race back". Not once did I say or reference anything about holding humanity back.

And I wouldn't say Miranda exactly enjoys her modifications, unless having an incredibly low self esteem is a sign of happiness.

Okay then. I apologize.

Actually I'd say her low self esteem is because of her father's abuse. It's very easy to break a young child's spirit and make them feel like dirt.

Ala the genophage: The genophage was a messy solution to a messy problem. The Krogan weren't going to stop until something stopped them. The Salarains decided not to completely eliminate the Krogan. As far as I'm concerned it was the best solution for all involved. The Krogan are prejudiced against because they threatened the galaxy. It's not fair but it's perfectly understandable.

Re artifical birthing: And what is the other barrier? 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:22 .

[AgitatedLemon]

Ryzaki wrote...

AgitatedLemon wrote...

Well there's the whole "Holding the human race back". Not once did I say or reference anything about holding humanity back.

And I wouldn't say Miranda exactly enjoys her modifications, unless having an incredibly low self esteem is a sign of happiness.

Okay then.

Actually I'd say her low self esteem is because of her father's abuse. It's very easy to break a young child's spirit and make them feel like dirt.

"You talk about yourself like you're just a... a tool, to be used by Cerberus, by your father."

"It helps me find purpose in how I was created"

[Ryzaki]

AgitatedLemon wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

AgitatedLemon wrote...

Well there's the whole "Holding the human race back". Not once did I say or reference anything about holding humanity back.

And I wouldn't say Miranda exactly enjoys her modifications, unless having an incredibly low self esteem is a sign of happiness.

Okay then.

Actually I'd say her low self esteem is because of her father's abuse. It's very easy to break a young child's spirit and make them feel like dirt.

"You talk about yourself like you're just a... a tool, to be used by Cerberus, by your father."

"It helps me find purpose in how I was created"

And apparently the way her father treated her (and Cerberus) played no part in that? 

People don't develop in a vaccum. Your past experiences affect your adult outlook whether you like it or not. And being abused as a child (particularly emotionally) can and often times will stay with you the rest of your life and affect relationships and self outlook.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:24 .

[Td1984]

flemm wrote...

AgitatedLemon wrote...

Where is she in that picture, anyway?

I dunno. The womb?

Could be a shuttle or something, I guess. But she doesn't seem to be piloting it, or anything.

So, I think it's about themes and stuff

For some reason, everytime I see that pic, it looks to me as though she just stepped out of the shower (her hair looks like it might be wet).

[AgitatedLemon]

Ryzaki wrote...

AgitatedLemon wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

AgitatedLemon wrote...

Well there's the whole "Holding the human race back". Not once did I say or reference anything about holding humanity back.

And I wouldn't say Miranda exactly enjoys her modifications, unless having an incredibly low self esteem is a sign of happiness.

Okay then.

Actually I'd say her low self esteem is because of her father's abuse. It's very easy to break a young child's spirit and make them feel like dirt.

"You talk about yourself like you're just a... a tool, to be used by Cerberus, by your father."

"It helps me find purpose in how I was created"

And apparently the way her father treated her (and Cerberus) played no part in that? 

People don't develop in a vaccum. Your past experiences affect your adult outlook whether you like it or not.

Cerberus (Or, at least, her coworkers in Lazarus) actually treated her like a person, and not a piece of property. Hell, some even tried to befriend her.

I'm done talking to you. You always need to find a reason to challenge my own viewpoints and opinions.

Modifié par AgitatedLemon, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:25 .

[flemm]

Td1984 wrote...

For some reason, everytime I see that pic, it looks to me as though she just stepped out of the shower (her hair looks like it might be wet).

Might also be the fact that she is just wearing something draped over her, almost like a bath towel.

I guess it's some kind of very simple dress, or something. It's hard to tell.

Modifié par flemm, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:25 .

[Ryzaki]

AgitatedLemon wrote...
Cerberus (Or, at least, her coworkers in Lazarus) actually treated her like a person, and not a piece of property.

I'm done talking to you. You always need to find a reason to challenge my own viewpoints and opinions.

Coworkers in Lazarus sure. What about TIM? He would've been close to a replacement father figure. How did he treat her? 

What? Okay whatever. I thought we were having a discussion but if you're getting that agitated about it.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:26 .

[Td1984]

flemm wrote...

Td1984 wrote...

For some reason, everytime I see that pic, it looks to me as though she just stepped out of the shower (her hair looks like it might be wet).

Might also be the fact that she is just wearing something draped over her, almost like a bath towel.

I guess it's some kind of very simple dress, or something. It's hard to tell.

That's true as well.

[AgitatedLemon]

I guess it's some kind of very simple dress, or something. It's hard to tell.

That's what I thought it was.

[ME3WINNING]

I wonder if there is going to be a Miranda love scene, like in ME2 before the suicide mission. She isn't squad mate so it makes me think there won't be one, which would suck.

[jtav]

We don't know, but I hope so. The writers have done the impossible and made me root for the couple. I want them to have sex, and that's a pretty big turnaround for me on a personal level.

[AgitatedLemon]

ME3WINNING wrote...

I wonder if there is going to be a Miranda love scene, like in ME2 before the suicide mission. She isn't squad mate so it makes me think there won't be one, which would suck.

It would be absurd to think that there wouldn't be.

[jtav]

Romance scene, yes. Sex scene is debatable.

[ME3WINNING]

I want a sex scene too

[AgitatedLemon]

I'd be fine with a romantic romance scene. So damn long as Shepard actually tells her "I love you" or something along the lines.

A sex scene can come in too, though.

Modifié par AgitatedLemon, 10 janvier 2012 - 04:28 .

[jtav]

As I said, they've done the impossible and made me want one. Regulars should look out for flying pigs.

[AgitatedLemon]

No, flying rocks.

[UserForFun]

1000 pages? Last time I prowled these forums, there were only 600.

Bioware -should- feel compelled to provide substantial content for Miranda, or a lot of fans will book a DHL courier, and send tons of manure straight to Canada!

[Rdubs]

flemm wrote...

You guys see that this piece was features in (I think the UK version of) PlayStation Magazine?
http://www.flickr.co.../in/photostream

Modifié par Rdubs, 10 janvier 2012 - 04:52 .