82210 réponses à ce sujet

[Ieldra]

AgitatedLemon wrote...

jtav wrote...

Yes, I like the Paragon line there. Miranda needs to be told that she has value and can take pride in her accomplishments until she actually believes it. My problem lies strictly with the flirting.

@bold- And that's why I like the paragon line.

Admittedly that's a line I miss in the Renegade version. But I like its tone better and every other line. Since I cannot get both, I favor the version with more elements I like.

Edit:
Oops, top of the page....

Modifié par Ieldra2, 21 janvier 2012 - 07:34 .

[Ieldra]

android654 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Jesus, do you kill everyone you don't like?

I do. No point in having them on the team if I can't stand to use them. I tried to survive the SM in my renegade with Just Jack, Morinth, Thane, Grunt, Miranda and Mordin. But I guess I prepared too well since I couldn't pull it off.

The closest I could come to that is this:

You'd need two team members unloyal or two missing ship upgrades to get Jacob to die as well.

[JosephDucreux]

Out of all the people, the one you send to open the gates is the easiest to kill. Just pick the wrong leader (irrespective of anybody's loyalty) and it's game over.

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
Do you guys ever stop and think about what Miranda did with Lazarus? I mean, the woman has conquered death. It's no longer permanent. Because of her. She's taken the power normally reserved to gods and nothing bad happened. And that, Lemon, is why I'm so gleeful about killing her. Death, where is thy sting, indeed. She'll reap the rewards of her own research.

I think about it all the time. Which kind of consequences this may have long-term is interesting to speculate about. I believe this could lead to some deep cultural split in humanity, thus my headcanon where Shepard becomes leader of the transhumanist faction that embraces the new technology after the war while Miranda continues to work in the background to develop it further (in different ways in the TIW and Foundation scenarios). Not quite as optimistic, my "Into The Sunset" ending is based on the idea that the technology will not gain acceptance among a significant part of humanity, so that Shepard and Miranda collect the people who support it and leave to found a new human civilization.

@Joseph Ducreux:
Not getting you. Besides, this is a hypothetical scenario based on android's wanted survival pattern. I never played it.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 21 janvier 2012 - 07:57 .

[JosephDucreux]

Ieldra2 wrote...
@Joseph Ducreux:
Not getting you. Besides, this is a hypothetical scenario based on android's wanted survival pattern. I never played it.

If you want someone killed, the easiest way is to send them into the vents and pick a bad secondary fireteam leader.

i.e. Loyal Tali goes into shaft, Loyal samara is FT leader. Tali gets headshot. Get it?

[Ieldra]

AgitatedLemon wrote...

jtav wrote...

All professional means is that you are paid. It's no guarantee of quality. Where I do have a considerable advantage is that I don't have real world budgets or time constraints to worry about. That still doesn't make the romance good.

Professional implies that you're good enough for people to spend money on you, and thus stay in business. I mean, people aren't going to write your checks if you suck.

If you're good enough and stay pro for a long time, your skills naturally improve.

I think much of the perceived suboptimal writing in games comes from the combination of two difficulty factors other media (books, tv/movie) don't have:
(1) Game conversations aren't linear. You need to account for the changed flow of a conversation if you choose different options, how the whole thing comes together again etc..
(2) Player agency extends to character interpretation. What characters say must be distinctive enough to define their core traits, but vague enough that there is room for interpretation. An example: Is the Miranda romance just a fling or not? What is said in the game must leave both options open.

[Td1984]

I think when I do my canon run, I may do Zaeed's LM after the SM for once (never done it that way before). That way, I can take the Paragon route and save the workers at the refinery and kill Zaeed at the end if need be. Usually I take the Renegade route and take out Vido in hopes that in ME3, Zaeed will be the head of the Blue Suns and they'll be an ally. Doesn't look like it'll turn out that way in ME3 though.

[Ieldra]

JosephDucreux wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
@Joseph Ducreux:
Not getting you. Besides, this is a hypothetical scenario based on android's wanted survival pattern. I never played it.

If you want someone killed, the easiest way is to send them into the vents and pick a bad secondary fireteam leader.

i.e. Loyal Tali goes into shaft, Loyal samara is FT leader. Tali gets headshot. Get it?

You didn't think far enough. You can just as easily kill the tech specialist by selecting a bad one, like Garrus. The reason I let Garrus die there is that I need to kill two of the hard hitters so that two characters can die holding the line instead of only one. Loyal Garrus can only be killed here and with a bad biotic specialist, and I needed that slot for another death. This scenario has the maximum possible number of team member deaths under the constraints set by android654.

[schemata]

Td1984 wrote...

I think when I do my canon run, I may do Zaeed's LM after the SM for once (never done it that way before). That way, I can take the Paragon route and save the workers at the refinery and kill Zaeed at the end if need be. Usually I take the Renegade route and take out Vido in hopes that in ME3, Zaeed will be the head of the Blue Suns and they'll be an ally. Doesn't look like it'll turn out that way in ME3 though.

Almost dont think the renegade is that bad tbh. I mean, ok kind of.  But JB pointed out a bajillion pages ago that a point can be made that a clearheaded zaeed is more valueable then the lifes of the factory workers. And to extent thats true. Thats a tad hardcore... and almost why I like it.

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
Here's how I would handle the reunion scene for romanced Shepard:

Shepard is waiting at a prearranged point on the Presidium. Miranda is late. Shepard becomes increasingly agitated. Someone places their hand on his shoulder. He turns. Miranda. She's tired, and wears no makeup, but is visibly unharmed. For a long moment, neither of them can move. "You're here," Shepard whispers. Miranda nods, overcome. The dam breaks, and they're suddenly in each other's arms, crying and kissing furiously.

Before that happens, you would need to give the player an opportunity to determine if he intends to continue Miranda's romance, i.e. if it was serious for him in ME2. 

[Ieldra]

MisterJB wrote...

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...



My own Screenshot I took just now:wub:.

My Shepard's armour matches more than yours. Nahnahnah.

If I may add my "matching armor" screenshot"...

[Ieldra]

Dr. Doctor wrote...
Quick question for those with the PC version of ME2, what are you using to take screenshots?

Fraps. Registered version so that I don't need to convert to jpg in an extra step.

[Ieldra]

AgitatedLemon wrote...
What are some specific expectations anyone else may have of Miranda's story in ME3?

Knowing me, the romance is big one for me, as is the missing ending.

(1) Miranda coming to terms with her origins and embracing her enhancements as something desirable, separate from her father's treatment of her which brought her so much pain. 
(2) An acknowledgement of her dedication to the cause of advancing humanity.
(3) Closure on Miranda's history with Cerberus
(4) An epic contribution to the endgame
(5) An option for a happy ending for the romance that doesn't require me to choose the Paragon endgame option (I would be ok with a requirement NOT to choose that option, which appears a distinct possibility to me - if you want to know more, ask in the spoiler group).

Modifié par Ieldra2, 21 janvier 2012 - 08:53 .

[Cuco9]

So, hang on im not quite sure, the only way for you to end up in a happy ending with miranda is for you to choose the paragon ending (i dont know what happens if you do but im persuming you go all Neo from matrix style and sacrifice yourself) ??

Sorry if im being rude but last time ive been here was around page 830+ and thats alot of pages to go trough. xD

[Ieldra]

Cuco9 wrote...
So, hang on im not quite sure, the only way for you to end up in a happy ending with miranda is for you to choose the paragon ending (i dont know what happens if you do but im persuming you go all Neo from matrix style and sacrifice yourself) ??

I did not want to imply that it is so. The problem is that the endings raise questions about whether or not a romance continuing after the end is possible at all, for different reasons. There is no definitive answer in the leaked script as to whether certain scenarios involve some kind of self-sacrifice or something else that might prevent an after-the-end romance, but they affect Shepard and/or the galaxy in a way that the question is raised.

[flemm]

JosephDucreux wrote...

Kid Buu wrote...

JosephDucreux wrote...

Kid Buu wrote...
Someones jealous.

Someone be trollin'. 

o you

Nah you.

Isn't it time the two of you either kill each other or have sex?

This endless foreplay is getting out of hand.

[Cuco9]

Ah i see, thanks for the quick answer. I guess we will have to wait and see but i would be really glad and im pretty sure most of other people will if you could have a all is good and well with teh babies jumping around ending hehe.Mass Effect is a game of choices, it is like you are directing a movie of your own so having different endings from one that is happy to the one were galaxy gets destroyed and reapers win would be really nice to have.

[MisterJB]

Ieldra2 wrote...
Not quite as optimistic, my "Into The Sunset" ending is based on the idea that the technology will not gain acceptance among a significant part of humanity, so that Shepard and Miranda collect the people who support it and leave to found a new human civilization.

I question wether Miranda this is something Miranda would accept. On one hand, it would fit with the Freedom themes of her backstory; in this case, the freedom to make your own choices; but on the other hand, if the great majority of humanity is being left behind, then it could be seen as abandoning them. Cerberus was never one to ask the opinions of their fellow humans before doing something extreme for their good.

Modifié par MisterJB, 21 janvier 2012 - 03:42 .

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

What pisses me off is that even at the beginning of the SM, where Miri volunteered to Lead the 2nd Fire Team, some of the Squad Members (like Garrus and Jack) still don't trust her.

I would yell "SHUT UP" to them.

[Ieldra]

Why, it is completely natural that some team members would not trust Miranda. Jack, for instance. Who's to say that Miranda wouldn't use the opportunity to get rid of an inconvenient antagonist. I'm sure were the situation not so desperate that everyone is needed, Miranda would've thought about it. She's not the type to betray people under her command, but the thought would've occured to her.

@MisterJB:
You have a point. However, it is quite possible that Miranda could come to the conclusion that she'd rather work for people who appreciate her efforts, or at least aren't actively hostile to them. The case of biotics could be made here.

[jtav]

Why should they trust her, especially Jack? They loathe each other and both expressed a desire to kill the other. IRL, I would never assign Miranda to lead either fireteam because of concerns about unit cohesion.

I'm actually sorry that Miranda isn't a team member because her being in the same position Jack was in ME2 would have been interesting.

[MisterJB]

I usually have Shepard take Jack with him during the SM exactly because of concerns about unit cohesion. Sure, I know it won't matter. He doesn't.

Ieldra2 wrote...
@MisterJB:
You have a point. However, it is quite possible that Miranda could come to the conclusion that she'd rather work for people who appreciate her efforts, or at least aren't actively hostile to them. The case of biotics could be made here.

Possibly, but, personally, I would be very dissapointed if she did that. One of the (many) things that I like about Miranda is how uterlly selfless she is. She risks everything for a sister who she does not plan on meeting and works tirelessly everyday for a species that calls her a terrorist.

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Who would replace Jack if she were to be killed in ME2?

Samara? Tali? Thane? Zaeed? jacob?

BioWare wouldn't throw it all in your face by leaving you with a bad ending for ME3 right?

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 21 janvier 2012 - 05:35 .

[Dr. Doctor]

@ MisterJB

The whole "majority of humanity getting left behind" topic reminds me a lot of one of JC Denton's lines in Deus Ex: Invisible War:

"The rich child is privileged by birth, enhanced genetically and nanotechnologically. How can the poorer child hope to compete?"

It seems like her issues with her origins stem from the fact that her father created her as the begining of some sort of genetic aristocrasy. She joins Cerberus so that she can use her gifts for the benefit of humanity instead of stoking her father's ego.  In the event that Miranda gets her own organization I could see
her developing her enhancements for mass consumption. Humanity as a
whole could enjoy the benefits of them rather than a privileged few. 

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Who has had a playthrough where all of the abducted Crew Members die? Is that even possible?

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 21 janvier 2012 - 05:38 .