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[nitefyre410]

xlI ReFLeX lIx wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

xlI ReFLeX lIx wrote...

Skullheart wrote...

They needed new characters becaus all the squaddie of ME2 might be dead. Their error was adding the buckethead and Garrus, if they are dead you have two wasted squad slots.

You automatically have at least 1 squadmate from ME2 alive, VS and Liara... 3 squadmates for ME3.. And yeah it would suck to only have 3 squadmates, mot much selection but that's the consequence for letting your team die... But yeah, I guess it'd be too much to ask for your choices in ME2 to actually have a big impact in ME3

 

*Snip* 

lol really confused now.. haha

 


Bioware Developer meetings  about how squadmate choices carry over into ME 3 -   It  all boils down to... 

They did not  really thing alot this through as much as they should have. 

[MisterJB]

What really angerts me are the double standards.
Fine, ME2 squadmates have to be sidelined in ME3 because they might be dead. God forbid we actually have divergent paths in an RPG. But this should apply to all squadmates.
Instead, Garrus and Tali have an "Get out of ME2 Free" card.

[ClanMacNab]

Ieldra2 wrote...

ClanMacNab wrote...
All my Shepard wants to do is get all of these beautiful women together in bikinis (or less) around a bonfire on the beach with all three of the moons hanging serenely, in a star lit sky, over the crystal blue waters...that is, as soon as we finish shooting the place up.

You create interesting images, but one of them (the women, not the moons) would be enough for me. Not because of any particular virtue on my part, but the others don't appeal to me in that way.

You know, I would want that as a "secret" ending of ME3, the not-quite-serious one you only see if you watch the credits to the end.

I have given one of my Shepards' a swashbuckling, freewheeling, free love, sort of persona reminiscent of some of the heros in Robert Heinleins' novels. He'd even carry a pair of swords if I could make him do it (probably a pair of wakizashi), and would occasionally dress a little bit like Capt. Malcolm Reynolds. This sort of character can carry on multiple intimate relationships simultaniously.

This particular Shepard is in love with Miranda, but sees the attributes and value of his other crew members of the opposite sex well beyond the obvious skill sets they bring to the squad. He also likes to think that Miranda and most of the other women on the squad (and, ahem, the broader galactic community) see the value in him spreading his genes and emotional support around a bit.

...he's probably wrong about that, though, and his life would definitely not be lacking for interpersonal drama long after the war with the Reapers is over. Like Heinlein, I like to envision a 22nd century a little less parochial than the one we live in now, but some things may never change.

Yes, a secret ending of this sort would be fun to have for those willing to seek it.

Modifié par ClanMacNab, 03 février 2012 - 02:49 .

[nitefyre410]

MisterJB wrote...

What really angerts me are the double standards.
Fine, ME2 squadmates have to be sidelined in ME3 because they might be dead. God forbid we actually have divergent paths in an RPG. But this should apply to all squadmates.
Instead, Garrus and Tali have an "Get out of ME2 Free" card.

 


Because Bioware wanted their cake and eat it too.  

Thats why they made it so easy for you get to "No many left behind" they were telling us that you  want to get keep everyone alive.   

[Nightwriter]

masseffectman123 wrote...

I've been following this thread since its inception, and, having just returned, am saddened that Miranda is not a squadmate in ME3. Also, given Bioware's "voice cast reveal" video, Miranda won't have many lines, as they would certainly have included Yvonne in there with Sheen and the gang if she did.

Whilst people keep saying "be positive" etc etc, let's face it, Miranda is not a squadmate, therefore, there's not much to look forward too for Miranda fans except an (almost guaranteed) tiny amount of dialogue during some short cameos. What a pity.

I guess i'm disappointed that, after Bioware built her character up so much in ME2, they are now shoving Jessica Chobot reporter down our throats. Frankly, couldn't care less about that new character. All things aside, i'm still looking forward to ME3 a bit.

Meh. I don't get the Jessica Chobot uproar. They're introducing a new dark haired reporter character. Why should I be offended by this? If they take away an old character and then add any new character, they've committed cardinal sin? I guess I don't grok it.

I don't really get why Strahovski's absence in the casting video is so significant, either. Seems safe to assume that not all the voice actors were available for the piece. Actors are busy people. Strahovski's wasn't the only absence. It's probably people's instinct to say "If they could get ahold of Sheen they could get ahold of Strahovski!" but I doubt it works like that. Sometimes a bigger star is available while a smaller star is not.

I'm glum about her not being a squadmate, and envious of those fans who got to have their favorite character in all three games, but I never really expected the pie to get cut in even slices. Can't fit all the LIs in the series onto the same squad, plus non-LIs. Some of the characters were bound to get left out in the cold. That my favorite character was among those is just a stroke of bad luck for me, I guess. I'll go mope for a bit and hopefully get over it. I think I'll hold off on the whole "How dare they include character X instead of character Y!" bit though.

[alxboss78]

For me the breaking point will be the following: I have a playthrough where only Miranda and Thane made it out alive from the suicide mission (i did not try to do that it just happened because i did the upgrades and lyalties half- assed). When i load that playthrough to my ME3 game, if i magically see either Garrus or Tali in Normandy i will pop a vain. I seriously want to make that playthrough with only 3 people (i imagine i will have only Ashley, Liara and (las) Vegas...)

[flemm]

alxboss78 wrote...
When i load that playthrough to my ME3 game, if i magically see either Garrus or Tali in Normandy i will pop a vain.

I don't think that's a concern. In imported games where characters died, those characters will remain dead. Everything seems to confirm this.

Nightwriter wrote...
Meh. I don't get the Jessica Chobot
uproar. They're introducing a new dark haired reporter character. Why
should I be offended by this? If they take away an old character and
then add any new character, they've committed cardinal sin? I guess I don't grok it.

Well, I understand it, conceptually. I doubt, though, that the inclusion of the reporter character affected Miranda's role (or any squad member's role) in any way. She's not on the squad, she's not involved in the plot, etc. So, she's not taking anyone's place.

I mean, whatever it takes to get fired up, I guess. For me personally, that particular angle doesn't really do it.

Modifié par flemm, 03 février 2012 - 02:37 .

[goofyomnivore]

I'm kind of over Miranda's situation. I'm still kind of bummed about the Oriana plothook. The non perma squadmate thing I accepted a while ago. But being an avid Morrigan fan and romancer has hardened me for times like these hah. Oh well at least my Shepard might get some closure with his gal unlike my Warden who is still in limbo somewhere I guess.

Modifié par strive, 03 février 2012 - 02:38 .

[ClanMacNab]

alxboss78 wrote...

For me the breaking point will be the following: I have a playthrough where only Miranda and Thane made it out alive from the suicide mission (i did not try to do that it just happened because i did the upgrades and lyalties half- assed). When i load that playthrough to my ME3 game, if i magically see either Garrus or Tali in Normandy i will pop a vain. I seriously want to make that playthrough with only 3 people (i imagine i will have only Ashley, Liara and (las) Vegas...)

I think I like the outcome to the game you describe with maybe the addition of a couple more survivors. Might be something to shoot for to see how it plays forward.

Yeah, I'll pop a major artery in my brain if Garrus and Tali show up on the Normandy after dying in the suicide mission.

[kainee]

JosephDucreux wrote...

kainee wrote...

I'm also disappointed about Miranda's treatment in Mass Effect 3. She should be a squadmate, but instead we are forced to endure the presence of characters like Tali or Garrus again.
And I consider the addition of the new characters, the ultimate insult.

This is how I feel about Bioware and their shameless pandering. Also, this is how I feel about the buckethead and the blueberry.

Exactly.

[kainee]

flemm wrote...

Well, I understand it, conceptually. I doubt, though, that the inclusion of the reporter character affected Miranda's role (or any squad member's role) in any way. She's not on the squad, she's not involved in the plot, etc. So, she's not taking anyone's place.

I mean, whatever it takes to get fired up, I guess. For me personally, that particular angle doesn't really do it.

What about the writer who worked on this character ? Don't you think this writer could have worked on a ME2 character instead ?
What about the time and money spent for this useless character ?

There are so many ressources wasted in this game (new characters, multiplayer, kinect support).
What a mess.

Modifié par kainee, 03 février 2012 - 03:13 .

[wright1978]

I'm still pretty livid over the travesty that is Tali & Garrus and the broken squaddie system.
I'm still pretty livid that there's no one on squad to represent an alternative human viewpoint to the Alliance.
I'm still pretty livid over the weak plot hook re-use for Miranda as of the leak.
I'm trying to bottle it up with the hope that the end product will be somewhat better.

[flemm]

kainee wrote...
What about the writer who worked on this character ? Don't you think this writer could have worked on a ME2 character instead ?

Well, the reporter character is going to be like a somewhat more elaborate version of Kelly, from ME2. So, some resources were spent on Kelly in ME2, but it's not as if, say, the VS was going to have a radically different role in ME2 if those resources hadn't been spent on Kelly.

If anything, Kelly or the reporter, that's like an extra feature that's added on because the developers feel they have the resources for it somewhere in mid-development, once the main story is set.

So, my irritation (which will likely be as great as anyone's, I assure you) will be more focused on Miranda's involvement (or lack thereof) in the main story, which would likely have been decided independantly from the addition of Diana.

All the Miranda-related stuff falls along the main story of this game. So, her level of involvement had to be decided fairly early on. The way it's set up, it could (or could have been) extremely awesome. It could also be inexcusably poor. But whichever it is, I'm pretty sure the reporter wasn't a factor.

Modifié par flemm, 03 février 2012 - 03:26 .

[Nightwriter]

It isn't for me to say whether or not a character I've never experienced is useless. But we have no way of knowing whether Miranda's marginalized role was a resource problem or a design choice. It's entirely possible they just weren't interested in going with Miranda as a focal character.

[nitefyre410]

kainee wrote...

flemm wrote...

Well, I understand it, conceptually. I doubt, though, that the inclusion of the reporter character affected Miranda's role (or any squad member's role) in any way. She's not on the squad, she's not involved in the plot, etc. So, she's not taking anyone's place.

I mean, whatever it takes to get fired up, I guess. For me personally, that particular angle doesn't really do it.

What about the writer who worked on this character ? Don't you think this writer could have worked on a ME2 character instead ?
What about the time and money spent for this useless character ?

There are so many ressources wasted in this game (new characters, multiplayer, kinect support).
What a mess.

 


Unfortunately dispite how many want it to be -  multiplayer nor Kinect Support are not going to be the possible downfall of ME 3 and I mean possible because none of us have played the game.   

What is going to be the downfall and this could be scene as far back as ME 1 is the Bioware lack of attention to detail  and bare bones approach to  writing a story.  It may take programing time and money to patch multiplayer and the such. What does not take alot of time and money is go through  do an out line or multiple outlines of various branching arches and see if they make sense . 

Now even before Mulltiplayer ( Which I have absolutely no problem with  love Co - Op).  One of  biggest red flags was not only  TIM falling   in compete antagonist but  the very fact that  Miranda would coud very be considered  TIMS right hand  could be our biggest resource save  EDI could be our biggest resoruces and she is now  sidelined. 

This, has nothing do with Multiplayer,  or  Kinect support. Miranda sidelining is a direct  result of Bioware not paying attention to details  and no one going over this thing with  fine tooth comb.  Which with the sloppiness of  DA 2 and  state in which Deception was in when it hit store is a growing trend at Bioware.

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

You know what this is? BioWare possibly made this game on behalf of the ME1 fanatics and ONLY the ME1 fanatics. They are pampering only the players who have played the series since 2008. What about late starters dammit?

Think about it, Garrus and Tali were in ME1 as well, so even if they could die, BioWare still wanted them there in ME3 special for thos ME1 fanatics.

They wanted to do this crap all along. BioWare wanted to make a plot where it goes back in the ME1 fanatics' favor by placing Shepard back into the Alliance, without even stopping to think that there ARE Players who dislike the Alliance for very good reasons.

BioWare placed us back into the Alliance unwillingly. When diong this, it allowed BioWare to place EVERY damn character of the SR1 back on the Normandy because the Normandy is Alliance again.
They made it seem like the ME2 Characters weren't important all along!

That's Bull****! There are many reasons why some of those Characters should have little screen time:

1) Liara is the Shadow Broker FFS. She has no reason to be there in your Squad for the Entire Game (if you didn't Romance her).

2) Tali should be Helping her people in the Migrant Fleet, not constantly staying behind Shepard like some crazed Fangirl.

3) Kaindan/Ashley are Spectres now, right? Why do they not have a ship of their own?

4) Garrus should round up some forces on his own. He's a Leader for crying out loud.

BUUUTTT NOOOOOOO.

They're on the Normandy for the ENTIRE damn game, making it another ME1 and SR1.

UGH Mass Effect 3 should be good for EVERYONE, NOT a damn portion of the fans! Wake up BioWare!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 03 février 2012 - 03:50 .

[Art3m]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

You know what this is? BioWare possibly made this game on behalf of the ME1 fanatics and ONLY the ME1 fanatics.

Think about it, Garrus and Tali were in ME1 as well, so even if they could die, BioWare still wanted them there in ME3 special for thos ME1 fanatics.

They wanted to do this crap all along. BioWare wanted to make a plot where it goes back in the ME1 fanatics' favor by placing Shepard back into the Alliance, without even stopping to think that there ARE Players who dislike the Alliance for very good reasons.

BioWare placed us back into the Alliance unwillingly. When diong this, it allowed BioWare to place EVERY damn character of the SR1 back on the Normandy because the Normandy is Alliance again.
They made it seem like the ME2 Characters weren't important all along!

That's Bull****! There are many reasons why some of those Characters should have little screen time:

1) Liara is the Shadow Broker FFS. She has no reason to be there in your Squad for the Entire Game (if you didn't Romance her).

2) Tali should be Helping her people in the Migrant Fleet, not constantly staying behind Shepard like some crazed Fangirl.

3) Kaindan/Ashley are Spectres now, right? Why do they not have a ship of their own?

4) Garrus should round up some forces on his own. He's a Leader for crying out loud.

BUUUTTT NOOOOOOO.

They're on the Normandy for the ENTIRE damn game, making it another ME1 and SR1.

UGH Mass Effect 3 should be good for EVERYONE, NOT a damn portion of the fans! Wake up BioWare!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I just try to remember how people cried and complained about ME2 and all the stuff left in ME

[nitefyre410]

Trilogies tend to go full circle when you come to the very end of it... that is some what there nature.
The Liara point I can agree with - there really is no reason for her to be on the Normandy she can do more from her base as Broker... tons more resources.

Garrus Jane to Shepards Mel

Ashley or Kaiden are the Zoe.

Miranda could have played the part of Amara she fits it alot better.

I think what Bioware missed is that there is structure to things when dealing with a Space Opera or group of hero's synergy is everything. What makes the Avengers and X-men tick and work so well - they are dysfuctionally functional.

[Sigyn2011]

 This, has nothing do with Multiplayer,  or  Kinect support. Miranda sidelining is a direct  result of Bioware not paying attention to details  and no one going over this thing with  fine tooth comb.  Which with the sloppiness of  DA 2 and  state in which Deception was in when it hit store is a growing trend at Bioware.


I thought that Deception was written by another writer who doesn't work for Bioware.  I agree with you that I don't like the fact that the rest of the 'dirty dozen' has gotten sidelined for 'team dextro' and Liara.  They're fine characters, in my opinion, but don't force me to have them as permanent squadmates, especially since that scenario isn't credible in Liara's case.  

[nitefyre410]

Sigyn2011 wrote...

 This, has nothing do with Multiplayer,  or  Kinect support. Miranda sidelining is a direct  result of Bioware not paying attention to details  and no one going over this thing with  fine tooth comb.  Which with the sloppiness of  DA 2 and  state in which Deception was in when it hit store is a growing trend at Bioware.


I thought that Deception was written by another writer who doesn't work for Bioware.  I agree with you that I don't like the fact that the rest of the 'dirty dozen' has gotten sidelined for 'team dextro' and Liara.  They're fine characters, in my opinion, but don't force me to have them as permanent squadmates, especially since that scenario isn't credible in Liara's case.  

 


It was but  any book like that still has to get through editting and  veting process by the owners and creators of the  IP that the author is writing for.    Deception  if  one just looks at the document of all the errors in the book was not edited or vetted by Bioware at all and if it was... then  are going some serious questions about qualtiy brought in the play.    

[enayasoul]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

You know what this is? BioWare possibly made this game on behalf of the ME1 fanatics and ONLY the ME1 fanatics. They are pampering only the players who have played the series since 2008. What about late starters dammit?

Think about it, Garrus and Tali were in ME1 as well, so even if they could die, BioWare still wanted them there in ME3 special for thos ME1 fanatics.

They wanted to do this crap all along. BioWare wanted to make a plot where it goes back in the ME1 fanatics' favor by placing Shepard back into the Alliance, without even stopping to think that there ARE Players who dislike the Alliance for very good reasons.

BioWare placed us back into the Alliance unwillingly. When diong this, it allowed BioWare to place EVERY damn character of the SR1 back on the Normandy because the Normandy is Alliance again.
They made it seem like the ME2 Characters weren't important all along!

That's Bull****! There are many reasons why some of those Characters should have little screen time:

1) Liara is the Shadow Broker FFS. She has no reason to be there in your Squad for the Entire Game (if you didn't Romance her).

2) Tali should be Helping her people in the Migrant Fleet, not constantly staying behind Shepard like some crazed Fangirl.

3) Kaindan/Ashley are Spectres now, right? Why do they not have a ship of their own?

4) Garrus should round up some forces on his own. He's a Leader for crying out loud.

BUUUTTT NOOOOOOO.

They're on the Normandy for the ENTIRE damn game, making it another ME1 and SR1.

UGH Mass Effect 3 should be good for EVERYONE, NOT a damn portion of the fans! Wake up BioWare!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not sure if I should feel insulted by you picking on the ME1 fan's.  I AM ONE OF THOSE!  I played Mass Effect from the very beginning!   I understand your anger but can we please calm down and stop blaming fans and BioWare because of how they are treating the characters or taking the characters where they see them.  I love all the character some more than others.  But sheesh you people are getting out of hand with your hate.   Everyone won't be satisfied but no need to keep ****ing about it until you actually play the bleeping game!

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

And another thing that bugs me is how DLCs like LOTSB and Overlord were SUPPOSED to be POST SM, yet BioWare made the Missions as if you're still part of Cerberus. Why?

For Example: At the end of Overlord, Shepard says, "The Illusive Man can fire me for all I care."
That doesn't make sense if you destroy the Base.

Plus you tell Liara that Cerberus gave you intel.

[flemm]

Also, it's easy to jump to conclusions about stuff. I'm not criticising anyone for doing that, I've done it myself a few times since the leak.

But I'm just going to take the VA video as an example... In even the most minimalist/pessimistic assessment of Miranda's presence in ME3 based on the leak, it is not going to be a cameo.

They've paid Strahovski a bundle for a VA session or two, why not show a clip of her saying "I had a great experience, love what they've done with the character, blablabla," add a second or two of Miranda footage from the game, and now a bunch more people are excited, while nothing of substance has changed?

As somebody else already mentioned, it's just as likely that she's not in the vid for logistical reasons, or whatever, as anything else.

Modifié par flemm, 03 février 2012 - 04:31 .

[spirosz]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

And another thing that bugs me is how DLCs like LOTSB and Overlord were SUPPOSED to be POST SM, yet BioWare made the Missions as if you're still part of Cerberus. Why?

For Example: At the end of Overlord, Shepard says, "The Illusive Man can fire me for all I care."
That doesn't make sense if you destroy the Base.

Plus you tell Liara that Cerberus gave you intel.

Gameplay/ game code, whatever.  What about the people who do it before the suicide mission.  Should they have to re-write the whole script because of those people? 

Modifié par spiros9110, 03 février 2012 - 04:33 .

[husky husk]

Ya'll need to calm down and eat some nachos. The game is not out yet.