82210 réponses à ce sujet

[dazdaz28]

What pic are you talking about?

[MisterJB]

android654 wrote...
Shepard looks like he's never seen a pair of sneakers in his life. I think I know how that contect would go.

Stop selling Shepard short. Even before he received upgrades that allow him to go toe to toe with Yahgs, drink poison, use weapons designed for Krogan, etc, he was already a graduate from the N7 Marines, the top elite soldiers of humanity.
Even Miranda says he is a perfect bloody human specimen.

[android654]

MisterJB wrote...

android654 wrote...
Shepard looks like he's never seen a pair of sneakers in his life. I think I know how that contect would go.

Stop selling Shepard short. Even before he received upgrades that allow him to go toe to toe with Yahgs, drink poison, use weapons designed for Krogan, etc, he was already a graduate from the N7 Marines, the top elite soldiers of humanity.
Even Miranda says he is a perfect bloody human specimen.

Its not my fault the "hero" of this epic has been unimpressive in both his story and appearance. Jacob looked more like a person who constantly prepared for war than Shepard ever did. His body build in thin and gangly. I'd trust him to fix my computer, but if I needed someone to kill aliens, I'd grab anyone from Cerberus, Vega or Williams. Shepard just looks bland.

[jtav]

We *see* him doing physically impressive things. If you want to argue he's a fool with no emotional depth, I'll agree, but he's N7 for a reason.

[android654]

jtav wrote...

We *see* him doing physically impressive things. If you want to argue he's a fool with no emotional depth, I'll agree, but he's N7 for a reason.

Those things are clearly injected for the player but have little root to the character. I simply don't buy him being physically impressive, expecially when compared to other men on the crew. I'm not asking for much, but they could atleast design the guy like he's ever done a pul-up, but Shepard is built like someone who does tech support.

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

What is N7 anyway?

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 13 février 2012 - 02:38 .

[wright1978]

Well i'm happy Shep actually looks like a real soldier but not overbuffed like some bodybuilder.

[MisterJB]

You're passing off your opinions as fact. Because you consider Shepard to be bland and unimpressive, you are going against lore. N7s>all other humans.
Miranda might be the exception because she was designed to be perfect but place her against Shepard or Kai Leng and my money is on the N7s.

One thing is true, Shepard's build is inconsistent. This happens because, when not wearing a armor, his skeleton is the same as everyone else who wears that casual outfit.

[jtav]

My money might be on Miranda depending on the circumstances.

[android654]

MisterJB wrote...

You're passing off your opinions as fact. Because you consider Shepard to be bland and unimpressive, you are going against lore. N7s>all other humans.
Miranda might be the exception because she was designed to be perfect but place her against Shepard or Kai Leng and my money is on the N7s.

One thing is true, Shepard's build is inconsistent. This happens because, when not wearing a armor, his skeleton is the same as everyone else who wears that casual outfit.

Character design is rather important to any type of story telling that has illustration, the two are meant to be consistent. I'm saying by his appearance, he contradicts some of his acts. Inconsistency is kind of a big deal. Without knowing anything between them, If the two met in a bar, who would you honestly think would win a fight Jacob or Shepard. I don't know about you, but I'd bet on the guy who is obviously athletic over the guy who looks like he's going to order his star trek shirt for the next comicon.

For those of you who don't know, there are all types in the military, small, big, and bigger.


So yes, there are soldiers that look like Vega.

[AgitatedLemon]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

What is N7 anyway?

The N designates Special Forces, while the 7 designates what class, with 7 being the highest.

So he's a super-marine, basically.

[AgitatedLemon]

wright1978 wrote...

android654 wrote...

Melrache wrote...

android654 wrote...

She should be carrying him.

Lies.

Think she can't do it?

My shep is happy to carry Miranda if she's injured and happy to be carried if he is injured.

This. I don't doubt that Miranda can carry Shepard, but the only awkward thing I can immediately think of would be the height difference. Of course, Shepard is more than willing to carry Miranda out of battle if he needs to.

[gogatm]

im not in the military or anything, but as a former athlete that excelled at physical sports, ill tell you id take shepard in a fight over the really "buff" guys. when you work out you can people have different objectives, building size or actual strength. i know guys that are smaller that are a lot stronger, but it depends on the various exercises, weight and the amount of repetitions. a lot of times in american football, i know that guys will be really big but they lack mobility and cant make the proper plays and moves because the extra size makes you stiff. as shepard is smaller, he still has lean muscle but retains the agility and quickness someone like vega wouldn't possess, ya know?

[Melra]

android654 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

You're passing off your opinions as fact. Because you consider Shepard to be bland and unimpressive, you are going against lore. N7s>all other humans.
Miranda might be the exception because she was designed to be perfect but place her against Shepard or Kai Leng and my money is on the N7s.

One thing is true, Shepard's build is inconsistent. This happens because, when not wearing a armor, his skeleton is the same as everyone else who wears that casual outfit.

Character design is rather important to any type of story telling that has illustration, the two are meant to be consistent. I'm saying by his appearance, he contradicts some of his acts. Inconsistency is kind of a big deal. Without knowing anything between them, If the two met in a bar, who would you honestly think would win a fight Jacob or Shepard. I don't know about you, but I'd bet on the guy who is obviously athletic over the guy who looks like he's going to order his star trek shirt for the next comicon.

For those of you who don't know, there are all types in the military, small, big, and bigger.


So yes, there are soldiers that look like Vega.

Not every soldier looks like that. Even I've been to military, it doesn't make me a hulk, maybe if it had been something for rest of my life, but still. I think Shepard looks just fine, I can see him lifting things quite easily. Miranda's arms are like little twigs though.

[wright1978]

android654 wrote...

Character design is rather important to any type of story telling that has illustration, the two are meant to be consistent. I'm saying by his appearance, he contradicts some of his acts. Inconsistency is kind of a big deal. Without knowing anything between them, If the two met in a bar, who would you honestly think would win a fight Jacob or Shepard. I don't know about you, but I'd bet on the guy who is obviously athletic over the guy who looks like he's going to order his star trek shirt for the next comicon.

For those of you who don't know, there are all types in the military, small, big, and bigger.

You seem to have some huge prejudices about maleshep that aren't based on facts.

[AgitatedLemon]

gogatm wrote...

im not in the military or anything, but as a former athlete that excelled at physical sports, ill tell you id take shepard in a fight over the really "buff" guys. when you work out you can people have different objectives, building size or actual strength. i know guys that are smaller that are a lot stronger, but it depends on the various exercises, weight and the amount of repetitions. a lot of times in american football, i know that guys will be really big but they lack mobility and cant make the proper plays and moves because the extra size makes you stiff. as shepard is smaller, he still has lean muscle but retains the agility and quickness someone like vega wouldn't possess, ya know?

You do make a number of good points.

[MisterJB]

android654 wrote...
Those things are clearly injected for the player but have little root to the character.

Not true. For example, Shepard managed to knock out two fully armored guards with his bare hands.
You can claim that this was for the player to feel like a badass but it's now canon. You can't simply disregard it as fanservice. Shepard can punch through armor.

android654 wrote...

Character design is rather important to any type of story telling that has illustration, the two are meant to be consistent. I'm saying by his appearance, he contradicts some of his acts. Inconsistency is kind of a big deal. Without knowing anything between them, If the two met in a bar, who would you honestly think would win a fight Jacob or Shepard. I don't know about you, but I'd bet on the guy who is obviously athletic over the guy who looks like he's going to order his star trek shirt for the next comicon.

I agree that Shepard should have had a unique model instead of just recycling from generic NPCs. However, considering that there is not an actual canon for Shepard, this build:

is just as valid as any other.
Hell, you can even make Shepard look as big as Vega if you want to.


Or you can make him look like a lightweight nerd with this outfit.


In conclusion, the closest thing we have to a canon build for Shepard come from promotional images where he is wearing an heavy armor. But the truth is that Shepard can be buffed one second and fit into a lab coat the next when onboard of the Normandy. There should have been consistency. Sadly, Bioware chose not to or simply did not care.
Therefore, I feel it is much more fair to judge him by feats of fitness and strenght in the game rather than how he looks.

Modifié par MisterJB, 13 février 2012 - 03:24 .

[Dr. Doctor]

jtav wrote...

We *see* him doing physically impressive things. If you want to argue he's a fool with no emotional depth, I'll agree, but he's N7 for a reason.

The fool part I can somewhat forgive as a convention of science fiction writing. In most cases your main character needs a degree of idiocy to help explain the world to the player, because not everybody reads the codex.

As for the no emotional depth part, to me that issue would appear to be rectified in ME3. The main problem with Shepard is that he/she is hamstrung by the Paragon/Renegade system in order to get the best results in the game you either need to be a plattitude spitting goody two-shoes or a jerk. DA2 had a better idea of having the friendship/rivalry system where the choice you make isn't good or bad but the reaction to it is based off of the opinions and thoughts of your party members.

[wright1978]

AgitatedLemon wrote...

gogatm wrote...

im not in the military or anything, but as a former athlete that excelled at physical sports, ill tell you id take shepard in a fight over the really "buff" guys. when you work out you can people have different objectives, building size or actual strength. i know guys that are smaller that are a lot stronger, but it depends on the various exercises, weight and the amount of repetitions. a lot of times in american football, i know that guys will be really big but they lack mobility and cant make the proper plays and moves because the extra size makes you stiff. as shepard is smaller, he still has lean muscle but retains the agility and quickness someone like vega wouldn't possess, ya know?

You do make a number of good points.

Exactly

[AgitatedLemon]

So we have Shepard-

-Engage a yahg in hand-to-hand combat, and win.
-Headbutt a krogan, with no clear signs of discomfort or pain.
-Lift various steel grates that are 5 times his size (Plus the pieces of metal on the CB)

If we're also taking the upgrades into account, then his bone density, muscle weave, and skin weave is around 5x stronger than a normal person. I'd say he's pretty up there in terms of physical strength, especially considering the standard enhancements he's received from the N7 program.

On Shepard being a bit of an idiot... That's kind of necessary. They need Shepard to be a bit slow so that the player knows what's happening (Not everyone reads the codex, y'know). In-universe, Shepard likely has a decent amount of information on all of the "obvious" things he asks and talks about in-game, he just can't convey it because of game mechanics. You may as well be arguing how Shepard can ask the same question 25 times without annoying the person he's speaking to.

edit: In comparison, Miranda is definitely stronger than the average person too, but I'd argue that Shepard is stronger, because of the reasons above. That isn't to say Shepard can punch her and she'd shatter like glass (Not that he even would hit Miranda), but I just can't see Miranda winning in a straight up brawl. Can she carry him out of the battle if he's injured? Probably.

Modifié par AgitatedLemon, 13 février 2012 - 03:43 .

[Jynthor]

Miranda carrying Shepard? Maybe, she doesn't look that strong, just because you're perfect doesn't mean you're the Hulk.
And are you calculating with or without armour? Because if it's the former, no way in hell.

[AgitatedLemon]

Jynthor wrote...

Miranda carrying Shepard? Maybe, she doesn't look that strong, just because you're perfect doesn't mean you're the Hulk.
And are you calculating with or without armour? Because if it's the former, no way in hell.

To be completely fair, we don't even know the extent of Miranda's physical strength. She doesn't ever go into detail about it. She just says that's she's better than the average human. While I'd argue that Shepard is stronger, I'm not going to exclude Miranda. She doesn't do anything particularly exemplary in-game (I don't know about Retribution, haven't read it) to really demonstrate how strong she is.

In a way, she may not even need the brawn. She's certainly more intelligent than Shepard (Not to say Shepard is stupid, he's a bit slow for the player though). She could outsmart a good number of the people she battles.

[Damate]

Sort of just randomly jumping in here ⌐.⌐ But if it helps any with this interesting 'could Miranda carry Shep' discussion: My husband is a marine (he's actually a fairly small guy - slight/wiry - so, yes, they come in all sizes) and I know for a fact that PT (physical training) often involves repetitions of carrying your fellows in various ways. Female marines are required to learn it just as the men do, often learning different techniques that work better for female physiology. The bottom line is: They are very much capable of doing it and, yes, while wearing heavy armor. It may not be some classic romance-novel carry, but if you need to lug someone a person with training/good health/adrenaline can sort it out. I think Miranda more than qualifies in all those departments.

Just my random bit of input.

[AgitatedLemon]

shygravel wrote...

Sort of just randomly jumping in here ⌐.⌐ But if it helps any with this interesting 'could Miranda carry Shep' discussion: My husband is a marine (he's actually a fairly small guy - slight/wiry - so, yes, they come in all sizes) and I know for a fact that PT (physical training) often involves repetitions of carrying your fellows in various ways. Female marines are required to learn it just as the men do, often learning different techniques that work better for female physiology. The bottom line is: They are very much capable of doing it and, yes, while wearing heavy armor. It may not be some classic romance-novel carry, but if you need to lug someone a person with training/good health/adrenaline can sort it out. I think Miranda more than qualifies in all those departments.

Just my random bit of input.