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[Alessar1288]

flemm wrote...

Alessar1288 wrote...

Honestly after what they did with Cerberus in this game no thanks. If she's gonna end up leading anything it should be something new, her taking over Cerberus is like giving Helena Blake the opportunity to keep running her organization. No amount of "good" will is going to get rid of the stigma behind the name Cerberus. Just my opinion.

I think it would just require the right piece of (good) writing.

For example:

TIM recruits Miranda's father so that he can create an army of indoctrinated slaves (this is already in the game, but nothing really comes of it).

Miranda finds a way to reverse the indoctrination effect and the liberated individuals look to her for leadership after participating in the assault on Chronos Station. She leads them against the Reapers.

I don't trust Bioware when it comes to Cerberus and good writing.

[flemm]

SNascimento wrote...

Hey, I'm going to post my top10 Miranda pictures, most are well known but I guess it can never hurt.

No, definitely not. Pictures are very welcome.

Some of us (such as myself) are very chatty and tend to overlook this aspect

[flemm]

Alessar1288 wrote...

I don't trust Bioware when it comes to Cerberus and good writing.

Well, I can't say I blame you. But... I dunno. It's obvious that a lot of basically decent people have worked/do work for Cerberus. This is true in ME2, and a lot of them are still around in ME3. So I don't think there's anything too outlandish about the idea that some of those people might get together, and, with Miranda and Shepard's help, repurpose what's left of the organisation to fight the Reapers.

Or something more ambitious like the scenario where Miranda reverses the indoctrination effect created for TIM by her father.

Modifié par flemm, 01 avril 2012 - 04:50 .

[Alessar1288]

flemm wrote...

Alessar1288 wrote...

I don't trust Bioware when it comes to Cerberus and good writing.

Well, I can't say I blame you. But... I dunno. It's obvious that a lot of basically decent people have worked/do work for Cerberus. This is true in ME2, and a lot of them are still around in ME3. So I don't think there's anything too outlandish about the idea that some of those people might get together, and, with Miranda and Shepard's help, repurpose what's left of the organisation to fight the Reapers.

Or something more ambitious like the scenario where Miranda reverses the indoctrination effect created for TIM by her father.

I don't doubt that either, but Bioware always tends to skew things to one side when it comes to Cerberus. Yes you have all these ex-cerberus people helping you, but at the same time I felt it was quickly overshadowed by generic baddies. Ofcourse thats mostly on bioware.

[SNascimento]

Number 10:

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This picture shows a more casual Miranda... something that we never saw in the games. It's always cool to see images combines imagination with skill, this one is a fine example.
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Number 9:

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This might not be the best drawn picture, but this uniform is just amazing. It just looks right... like something that could very well be in the game.
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Number 8:

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I have to admit, I love to see miranda holding a assult rifle! And this one just shows that better than any other! I'm sold.
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Number 7:

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Another beautiful drawing. What I like about this one is that it has this Mass Effect feel, with the planet behind Miranda and the sun shinning. Really nice.
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Ok, I'm going to post the other in another post just to avoid any screw up. 

Modifié par SNascimento, 01 avril 2012 - 05:03 .

[Jafryn]

Heh, number 10 is how Orianna should have looked in game.

Modifié par Jafryn, 01 avril 2012 - 05:03 .

[flemm]

enayasoul wrote...

Posted the link to bioware and mass effect2 pages on facebook.  

Cool, thanks enayasoul

[SNascimento]

After much struggle with the site I can continue.
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Number 6:

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Even though this has a wallpaper feel, the drawing is stunning. It's an overall impressive picture with MIranda as the central theme.
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Number 5:

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The first official picture, this was, if I'm not mistaken, the cover of the Mass Effect: Redemption comic number 4. What I like about it is how it shows MIranda as the 'Ice Queen' Wilson taks about. She has this look of 'I'm going to do my job no matter what' and I like it.
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Number 4:

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From the technical stand point this might be the most impressive picture of the list. It's absolutely gorgeous. But it's shown a very empty Miranda, she is just there sitting on something looking pretty.
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Number 3:

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Simply wonderful.Everything about this drawing is amazing, and how everything combine to, Miranda herself, the background, the effects, make it one of my favorite picture of our beloved Cerberus operative.

Modifié par SNascimento, 01 avril 2012 - 05:17 .

[Dr. Doctor]

flemm wrote...

Alessar1288 wrote...

I don't trust Bioware when it comes to Cerberus and good writing.

Well, I can't say I blame you. But... I dunno. It's obvious that a lot of basically decent people have worked/do work for Cerberus. This is true in ME2, and a lot of them are still around in ME3. So I don't think there's anything too outlandish about the idea that some of those people might get together, and, with Miranda and Shepard's help, repurpose what's left of the organisation to fight the Reapers.

Here's a question. What if Miranda presented the concept of controlling the Reapers instead of TIM? How would your Shepard react?

[SNascimento]

 Number 2:

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This is the most beautiful Miranda picture I've ever seen, not doubt about it. It's not by chance it's the one we can buy. There is only way to top that:
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Number 1:

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And this is my favorite Miranda picture that I could find. Why? Not only it's very pretty, but it shows Miranda from a different point of view. It shows the skillfull, resourcefull and strong woman that Miranda is. And that is why it's number one! 

Modifié par SNascimento, 01 avril 2012 - 05:30 .

[MisterJB]

He would remind her that the risks of them escaping out of our control are simply too great, that placing that kind of power in someone's hand is dangerous and plead for her to find a way to disable them instead thus, leaving all that technology for organics to use.
Also, make sure humans get best bits. He wants Harbinger's intact corpse on a human facility ASAP

And I don't believe she would consider repeating Sanctuary but if she did, he'd say she sacrificed far too much, that he can never look to her face again and if she insisted, he would consider her an enemy.

Modifié par MisterJB, 01 avril 2012 - 05:34 .

[flemm]

MisterJB wrote...
And I don't believe she would consider repeating Sanctuary but if she did, he'd say she sacrificed far too much, that he can never look to her face again and if she insisted, he would consider her an enemy.

Sanctuary is really the key point. I think she would consider control as an option, to stave off the destruction of entire civilisations, but not by experimenting on sentients as is the case in Sanctuary. Could similar technology be developed without such atrocities being committed? Probably. That's what Miranda would try to do.

She led a team of scientists that pulled off Lazarus without any such experiments on sentient beings, whereas other Cerberus cells seem to head in that direction all too swiftly.

But she would also be open to other options. I don't think she would be fixated on control. TIM is, because he sees it as an avenue for gaining personal power. But Miranda would seek to defeat the Reapers outright as a first option ("Everything has a weakness, even the Reapers."). Control maybe as a second, less desirable option.


Edit: the "top 10" pictures is a great idea, I'd be interested in seeing what other people would choose

Modifié par flemm, 01 avril 2012 - 05:42 .

[Jafryn]

Edit: the "top 10" pictures is a great idea, I'd be interested in seeing what other people would choose

I'd go with number 4. I think that's Miranda's reaction after staying up all night to finish ME3.

[Ieldra]

My favorite Miranda picture remains that from the OP:

[Skullheart]

mmm...

from fanart, I like this.


And for screen, this is my fav (Mona Lisa smile)

[ThomGau]

@SNascimento: My two favorites would be #5 and #2 .Thank you all for these nice pictures to look at

@flemm: Thanks for the info, tweeting operation: started.

Modifié par ThomGau, 01 avril 2012 - 10:18 .

[Ieldra]

CrutchCricket wrote...

flemm wrote...
Actually, both are the same. They thought they were being really clever and groundbreaking when they wrote those endings.

As horrible as the RGB is I can see how some incomprehensibly weird mind might see it as some innane artistic... thing. But you can't possibly view Miranda's role as anything other than some thrown-together recycled ME2 material paper ball. There is no plan besides "let's get this over with and move on to something else."

If it's not deliberate, then why the consistent use of certain clichés? I can't look into the writers' minds, but if it isn't a deliberate attempt to put some sort of "redemption" angle into her story at the cost of everything that made her interesting, then it's a half-assed attempt to please everyone by diluting Miranda so far that nobody could reasonably object to what's there, and never mind that she shrinks in the process.

Or it's really nothing more than incompetence. After these endings I don't know what to think anymore. Some basic trust in Bioware's competence has been eroded.

@ThomGau:
Tweeting? What's this about?

Modifié par Ieldra2, 01 avril 2012 - 10:20 .

[ThomGau]

About Tweeting our wishlist and recommandations regarding Miranda's role to a few devs. Flemm told me some of us have already started so I wanted to join. We've got nothing to lose.

[Ieldra]

flemm wrote...

jtav wrote...

Not ruin, but it's pretty clear someone on the team bought into the very clichés we praised Miranda for subverting. Remember our intense debates over the betrayal line? I don't think that was supposed to be divisive. I think it was supposed to be a universal stand up and cheer moment. They don't see it as destruction; they see it as redemption.

I dunno. I mean, yes, somebody really pushed for sticking to a certain cliché with Miranda.

But that line itself... I understand the problems some people have with it. But really, given what TIM plans to do with the base, it's not hard at all for me to imagine Miranda leaving Cerberus at that point and opposing TIM in ME3.

There's so much more that had to be done to the character for it to really become a problem (see the LotSB dossier).

Except that she couldn't have known what TIM would do. And perhaps you've noticed that everthing I said this line could portend for Miranda in ME3 has come to pass? Perhaps not in the worst possible manner (which would've been to outright contradict her ME2 character traits with ME3's writing), but not far from it either, considering the phrasing of the control chip conversation.

[sorentoft]

SNascimento wrote...

Number 10:

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This picture shows a more casual Miranda... something that we never saw in the games. It's always cool to see images combines imagination with skill, this one is a fine example.

I like this one, she's very cute in it.

[enayasoul]

These are all great photos of Miranda. #5 because she gives off that confident, "in charge" kind of attitude. A strong woman who is determined, or can do just about anything she puts her mind to. I think that's what I like most, everything else is icing on the cake in terms of her traits, characterization and looks.

[wright1978]

flemm wrote...

Alessar1288 wrote...

Honestly after what they did with Cerberus in this game no thanks. If she's gonna end up leading anything it should be something new, her taking over Cerberus is like giving Helena Blake the opportunity to keep running her organization. No amount of "good" will is going to get rid of the stigma behind the name Cerberus. Just my opinion.

I think it would just require the right piece of (good) writing.

For example:

TIM recruits Miranda's father so that he can create an army of indoctrinated slaves (this is already in the game, but nothing really comes of it).

Miranda finds a way to reverse the indoctrination effect and the liberated individuals look to her for leadership after participating in the assault on Chronos Station. She leads them against the Reapers.

Yeah that would have been nice. Those who just want to obliterate Cerberus could do so and those with Miranda's loyalty could salvage something of them through her. Would tie in better than the mystery shadow broker intel ex-cerberus group that for some reason doesn't come with her as a war asset.

[jtav]

Because they thought up the squad after they thought up the asset list.

And I simply don't like ME3's Miranda. Not intentional, but between her obsession with Ori, lack of interest in anything outside of her family or Shepard, and a breakup equaling death, she plays into some very bad female stereotypes. I'm only surprised she doesn't commit suicide post-game because she lost her sister and her lover.

[ThomGau]

At first I though that Miranda was one of the luckiest among the ME2 exclusives with relatively more screentime etc... But now that I think of it, she got butchered more than anyone else. The reason being that she was the most important and complex character in ME2 and she is now reduced to this.

Perhaps Miranda commiting suicide would have been too Tali-ish but given how her role was written in ME3 it would have been relevant (it's hurtful to say that).

Modifié par ThomGau, 01 avril 2012 - 01:42 .

[Raizo]

SNascimento wrote...

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Number 4:

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From the technical stand point this might be the most impressive picture of the list. It's absolutely gorgeous. But it's shown a very empty Miranda, she is just there sitting on something looking pretty.

I have always loved this pic, I still get goosebumbs looking at it. Patryk Olejniczak is an amazing artist.
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Number 3:

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Simply wonderful.Everything about this drawing is amazing, and how everything combine to, Miranda herself, the background, the effects, make it one of my favorite picture of our beloved Cerberus operative.

I've never seen this one before but I like it. Miri looks stunning in this pic. I love the hair style and the way it frames her face.