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"I'll always want you in my life." Miranda Lawson in Mass Effect 3


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#45001
Vertigo_1

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enayasoul wrote...

Sanctuary DOES tell you what's been happening with Cerberus and why they are what they are! And who is responsible. Sanctuary is mentioned on the Citadel in endless advertisements. It was important...

If  you really think about it openly... Miranda DID do something important.  She shut down Sanctuary... or at least contained the situation.... nobody else would be mislead by her father's lies... too many lives were lost but still she didn't walk away and stopped it from continuing.  That's something...

;)


You are right of course.  And I see that, but there wasn't enough of that IMO.  Should have been more (like an investigate option for Henry Lawson)

Most of that mission was audio/video logs...

Why not show the brutal process of converting these helpess refugees into husks? And then having them come after you?  Or have one of them plead with you to kill them because they knew they were going to be turned into a husk?

That mission needed to impact the player like the other priority missions do.  Right now there's not much of it.

Modifié par Vertigo_1, 04 avril 2012 - 04:47 .


#45002
MisterJB

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There should have been more of Henry and Oriana and Miranda's issues, of course
It's ironic. We complain and complain about how much Miranda focus on her family issues during the rest of the game and the one time we do want a very lengthy discussion between the Lawson family (and the soon to be newest member Shepard, of course), Bioware fails to deliver.

I would have gladly traded the vidcomm conversation on the Citadel for more lines in this confrontation.

Modifié par MisterJB, 04 avril 2012 - 04:42 .


#45003
yesikareyes

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Nightwriter wrote...

Dr. Doctor wrote...

@ Nightwriter

Bioware really wants you to romance Liara. I did a no romance import and the game was really trying to tell me something

But WHY?!

DAMN IT WHY.

WHY DO THEY WANT ME TO ROMANCE HER.


I wrote an article about that with an explicit argument why! The link is below lol I'm caught up between Liara and Miranda right now :lol:

#45004
goofyomnivore

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Exactly if they were going to go with the Oriana plot hook they could of explored it better. Instead we get barely any dialogue from Henry or Oriana.

#45005
flemm

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MisterJB wrote...

There should have been more of Henry and Oriana and Miranda's issues, of course
It's ironic. We complain and complain about how much Miranda focus on her family issues during the rest of the game and the one time we do want a very lengthy discussion between the Lawson family (and the soon to be newest member Shepard, of course), Bioware fails to deliver.



Indeed. Well, I think it's because her whole appearance, basically, is focused on this confrontation, and then... nothing happens.

It really makes me scratch my head Image IPB

I mean, yes, now he is dead. Ok. But that's not enough to make it significant. There needs to be growth. Finally putting this behind her should have a huge impact on Miranda. It should be liberating, allow her to focus entirely on the bigger picture. Orianna is safe.

And... nothing Image IPB

In essence it's the same issue as with the endings, on a smaller scale.. As players, we know instinctively there should be more/it shouldn't work this way/something is wrong.

Modifié par flemm, 04 avril 2012 - 04:45 .


#45006
Vertigo_1

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Nightwriter wrote...

Dr. Doctor wrote...

@ Nightwriter

Bioware really wants you to romance Liara. I did a no romance import and the game was really trying to tell me something

But WHY?!

DAMN IT WHY.

WHY DO THEY WANT ME TO ROMANCE HER.


Fan favorite and because the writers don't have the difficulty (budget and or time constraints) of coming up with different lines/scenes for the other romances.  Plot armor since ME1 helps too :P

If it were me, I'd get everyone to be on the same level of quality as Liara got in ME3 ;)

#45007
MisterJB

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Vertigo_1 wrote...
If it were me, I'd get everyone to be on the same level of quality as Liara got in ME3 ;)

IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK?!?!?

Well, it might. Bioware shouldn't have have created 14 romances if they were not willing or capable of providing satisfying content for all.

I just want some pillow talk and back rubbing. Well, if we are going to get really extravagant, I want a "Write your name in the stars" scene for Miranda. And her being present on London before Shepard destroys galactic civilization.

#45008
Dr. Doctor

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@ Nightwriter

Plot-armored like a tank, is available to both male and female Shepard, and when the lead writer likes a character he does what he likes with them. In ME1 she's easily avoidable, same in ME2, in ME3 I just gave up talking to her altogether because if you don't pay attention in most conversations with her you'll wind up triggering the romance.

#45009
Vertigo_1

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MisterJB wrote...

Vertigo_1 wrote...
If it were me, I'd get everyone to be on the same level of quality as Liara got in ME3 ;)

IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK?!?!?

Well, it might. Bioware shouldn't have have created 14 romances if they were not willing or capable of providing satisfying content for all.

I just want some pillow talk and back rubbing. Well, if we are going to get really extravagant, I want a "Write your name in the stars" scene for Miranda. And her being present on London before Shepard destroys galactic civilization.


Yeah they did shoot themselves in the foot for doing that (the quote from Mac Walters: "What were we thinking?!" comes to mind) but they were all good romances (in ME2)  and I'd feel bad saying they should have cut so and so from the LI list...

#45010
Nightwriter

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So she is convenient for them.

Blech.

#45011
goofyomnivore

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Overall I'm okay with Miranda's role, but there are three things that seem simple to me that they could of implemented that would of made it great.

(A) She was wounded and Oriana had to of been really stressed out the very least. Have them treated in the med-bay by Chakwas. Shepard could then hear them banter, dialogue investigate with both, crew interaction. Basically what happened with Mordin and Eve.

(B) A proper romance scene. Either on the Presidium commons or before Cronos station. I would of had the romance scene at the commons, and more of a romantic dialogue/Miranda supporting Shepard emotionally before Cronos Station -- fade to black scene. But I'd been satisfied with just one proper scene.

© Don't have EDI poach her role on Cronos station or at the very least let Miranda be involved over voice comm. You're revealing the Lazarus Project origins to Shepard and you didn't write the director of it into that revelation? It baffles me especially when she has nothing preventing her from doing so. Not to mention it is the demise of Cerberus you know the organization she was second in command of? I just don't get how they thought it was okay not to include her for the fans that kept her alive. It is like denying Tali being on Rannoch for the conclusion of the Geth/Quarian conflict because she has an infection from when you guys infiltrated the dreadnaught.

#45012
Vertigo_1

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Nightwriter wrote...

So she is convenient for them.

Blech.


And likely the canon romance in the Mass Effect movie (if that ever gets done)

#45013
Nightwriter

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Blech.

#45014
MisterJB

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strive wrote...
You're revealing the Lazarus Project origins to Shepard and you didn't write the director of it into that revelation? It baffles me especially when she has nothing preventing her from doing so. 

AND... when Kaidan questions Shepard about the moral and ethics of the people who ressurected him, there's no option to talk about Miranda.

#45015
Totally Not Swaggacide

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MisterJB wrote...

Vertigo_1 wrote...
If it were me, I'd get everyone to be on the same level of quality as Liara got in ME3 ;)

IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK?!?!?

Well, it might. Bioware shouldn't have have created 14 romances if they were not willing or capable of providing satisfying content for all.

I just want some pillow talk and back rubbing. Well, if we are going to get really extravagant, I want a "Write your name in the stars" scene for Miranda. And her being present on London before Shepard destroys galactic civilization.


I can't believe I actually agree with you, this might be the end of world. Even on board romances such as Ashley were severly lacking in content. There were not enough friendship moments between your LI, unless you chose Liara of course. In any case you can romances were not a concern of BWs when making ME3

#45016
flemm

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strive wrote...

Overall I'm okay with Miranda's role, but there are three things that seem simple to me that they could of implemented that would of made it great.

(A) She was wounded and Oriana had to of been really stressed out the very least. Have them treated in the med-bay by Chakwas. Shepard could then hear them banter, dialogue investigate with both, crew interaction. Basically what happened with Mordin and Eve.

(B) A proper romance scene. Either on the Presidium commons or before Cronos station. I would of had the romance scene at the commons, and more of a romantic dialogue/Miranda supporting Shepard emotionally before Cronos Station -- fade to black scene. But I'd been satisfied with just one proper scene.

© Don't have EDI poach her role on Cronos station or at the very least let Miranda be involved over voice comm. You're revealing the Lazarus Project origins to Shepard and you didn't write the director of it into that revelation? It baffles me especially when she has nothing preventing her from doing so. Not to mention it is the demise of Cerberus you know the organization she was second in command of? I just don't get how they thought it was okay not to include her for the fans that kept her alive. It is like denying Tali being on Rannoch for the conclusion of the Geth/Quarian conflict because she has an infection from when you guys infiltrated the dreadnaught.


Well, clearly point C is the crucial omission. If done properly, point A would take care of itself along the way. That's how it should work, and it's incredibly irritating that this doesn't happen.

Beyond that we would be left with improving the romance content as the main thing.

Modifié par flemm, 04 avril 2012 - 05:14 .


#45017
yesikareyes

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MisterJB wrote...

Vertigo_1 wrote...
If it were me, I'd get everyone to be on the same level of quality as Liara got in ME3 ;)

IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK?!?!?

Well, it might. Bioware shouldn't have have created 14 romances if they were not willing or capable of providing satisfying content for all.

I just want some pillow talk and back rubbing. Well, if we are going to get really extravagant, I want a "Write your name in the stars" scene for Miranda. And her being present on London before Shepard destroys galactic civilization.


LOL That scene where Liara gives that gift and says "write your name in the stars," I was like really?? I broke up with you twice. First, on Hagalaz because I chose Miranda and second when after the mission on Mars. The Asaris don't seem to have the word "no" in their vocabulary. Plus all those scenes kept making me guilty I dumped her! I'm being Ninjamanced :bandit:

#45018
Skullheart

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yesikareyes wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Vertigo_1 wrote...
If it were me, I'd get everyone to be on the same level of quality as Liara got in ME3 ;)

IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK?!?!?

Well, it might. Bioware shouldn't have have created 14 romances if they were not willing or capable of providing satisfying content for all.

I just want some pillow talk and back rubbing. Well, if we are going to get really extravagant, I want a "Write your name in the stars" scene for Miranda. And her being present on London before Shepard destroys galactic civilization.


LOL That scene where Liara gives that gift and says "write your name in the stars," I was like really?? I broke up with you twice. First, on Hagalaz because I chose Miranda and second when after the mission on Mars. The Asaris don't seem to have the word "no" in their vocabulary. Plus all those scenes kept making me guilty I dumped her! I'm being Ninjamanced :bandit:


There's a simple solution. Don't talk to Liara.

#45019
flemm

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By the way, Skullheart, I was reading that other thread and stumbled upon this...

Skullheart wrote...

Regarding Miranda, I think it should work better this way:

Keep the same way it is until the third talk. Remove the "love scene" from there. Let's face it, it isn't a love scene, just an extended version of the third talk. A love scene shouldn't be part of a non romance scene.

At the end of Sanctuary, Miranda and Oriana boards the Normandy, you can talk with both of them on the medical bay (Miranda was injured in her fight againt Leng).

During their stay on the Normandy you can add a discussion betwen Oriana and Miranda. Oriana wants to help to the war effort, helping with the crucible team (remember that Oriana is as smart as Miranda), Miranda wants to send her to a safe colony, away from the reapers. If Shepard has enough reputation he can convince Miranda to let Oriana helps in the Crucible, telling her that there's no point in hiding anymore, the reapers will reach that colony if they don't stop them. If Shepard hasn't enough reputation he can still send Oriana to the Crucible, but it will end the romance with Miranda.

After the talk in the medical bay there should be a talk betwen Shepard, Hackett and Miranda. Hacket will bring the issue of her being a former Cerberus operative, the second-in-command no less. Shepard can say that Miranda just gave them the location of of TIM's base, risking her life while she put a tracker on Leng. Hackett acknoweledges her contribution, saying he got a messagge from certan official about Miranda and some of her contacts taking out Cerberus outposts, and warning the Allience from Cerberus routes and traps. Hackett will offer her a full indult, for whatever she could have or haven't done while she was in Cerberus. He also offers her a position inside the Alliance as a civil consultor on his ship, Shepard can persuade her to take the position or to remain on the Normandy. Depending in the decision, she could be part of the ground team (and squad member) on Earth, or she'll be on board in the Alliance flagship (Hackett's ship?) coordinating assault teams on ground and space fighters during the battle for Earth.

She will still be a squadmate during the assault on TIM's base. The love scene will happen while travelling to TIM's base, just like the favored romances. During the mission she offers new insights about Lazarus project, Shepard cant talk with her about her past with Cerberus. And she'll have confrontation (dialogue) with TIM, something that me (and many of her fans) wanted.

After the attack to Cerberus HQ, when Hacket boards the Normandy, she can remain on the ship, or join Hackett on his ship (depending on the option shepard made before attacking TIM's base}. If she leaves with Hackett, Shepard will give her a passionate kiss before she leaves.

Before the final push to the beam, you can talk with her. Being in person (if she stayed on the Normandy) or holovid (if she left with Hackett), making a promise to stay find each other after the reapers.

I can't talk much about of what could happen as epilogue or in the endings. Just correct that no one from the party and Cortez should be on the Normandy when it crashes on Gilligan's planet (they were on Earth, not in the Normandy). And changing the damn flashback of Liara, I never romanced her and don't have intention of doing it. Walters, keep your waifu away of my Shepard.


You've been holding out on us Image IPB

Would you please send that to Visii as a letter for PAX, it's perfect Image IPB

Modifié par flemm, 04 avril 2012 - 05:43 .


#45020
Skullheart

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Damn flemm, you discovered the 5% of me that still has hope.

#45021
flemm

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Skullheart wrote...

Damn flemm, you discovered the 5% of me that still has hope.


LoL, I knew it was there Image IPB

Really, writing these detailed posts behind our backs and maintaining a façade of total cynicism in the thread...

I should have known Image IPB

#45022
Caihn

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Vertigo_1 wrote...
If it were me, I'd get everyone to be on the same level of quality as Liara got in ME3 ;)


Agreed.

Maybe someone should tell this to Bioware devs during the character panel at PAX.

#45023
Caihn

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I must say : making a tribute video for Miranda in ME3 is a real challenge, I'm more and more pissed off about her lack of screen time.

#45024
Skullheart

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I'm wondering if you can replace models on PC...

#45025
cyborg2501

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Nightwriter wrote...

jtav wrote...

Because she isn't Normandy crew.

I can live with her romance content. I just want her to give a crap about something that isn't her sister or Shepard. I want the woman who wanted to belong to humanity's STG back. I'm dreadful with letter writing. But that's what I want. I loved--love-- Miranda for her mind, for being a positive example of ambition.

Um, there is a romance scene in an apartment. Nothing that happened with Liara on the Normandy couldn't have happened in that bed in the apartment. Shepard's quarters aren't the only place that sex scenes can happen. In fact, Miranda proved that to us quite effectively in ME2.

That's another thing -- I was hoping for some clarification about the engine room. After the quizzical fan reaction it got, I almost expected them to jokingly address it or offer up some kind of explanation.


Meh, I don't think a full romance scene in that apartment would have felt right. No buildup really, more like a meet up and bang kind of thing. At least the romances on the Normandy are before the end run while emotions are running high. If it happened in the apartment I would expect about twice as much dialogue beforehand.