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[CrutchCricket]

MisterJB wrote...
The Normandy is a Frigate

armed with a Thannix cannon that everyone seems to forget about. You know the same "Imma firin mah lazor" thing that Reapers have? The thing that's took out the Collector Cruiser in two shots?

Obviously Harbinger won't go down so easily. But the Normandy is more than just a pesky fly to it. I would've loved to see the Normady fire at Harbinger and Harbinger give chase. That would've made more sense that it just ****ing standing there while your squad saunters over for a pickup and teary goodby from Shepard.

[Cmdr. Ken Shepard]

CrutchCricket wrote...

MisterJB wrote...
The Normandy is a Frigate

armed with a Thannix cannon that everyone seems to forget about. You know the same "Imma firin mah lazor" thing that Reapers have? The thing that's took out the Collector Cruiser in two shots?

Obviously Harbinger won't go down so easily. But the Normandy is more than just a pesky fly to it. I would've loved to see the Normady fire at Harbinger and Harbinger give chase. That would've made more sense that it just ****ing standing there while your squad saunters over for a pickup and teary goodby from Shepard.

Agreed, where I got bs from Starkid I wanted a face to face "I beat you" moment with Harbinger, like with the Reaper on Rannoch. Harbinger was the epic bad-ass bad guy for basically 2 games, yet no real closure on kicking his ass.

[LanceSolous13]

Harbinger is also the largest and most powerful of all the Reapers. Plus, we don't know what a Reaper Laser would do to another Reaper. For all we know, It could be like tickeling it.

Either way, look at the situation....

Attack Harbinger, the oldest, largest, and most powerful Reaper, and PREY TO GOD that he doesn't crubstomp you in 5 seconds flat

or

Get the injured out of there so that Shepard can activate the Crucible and destroy ALL the Reapers.

[MisterJB]

Every ship in the allied fleet was armed with a Thannix Cannon. It still took a Cruiser at close range (which shouldn't count for anything in space, mind you. No attrition) to damage a Capital Reaper.

Still, ot be fair, Reapers are more vulnerable on planets since they have to drastically lower their masses to enter orbit.

[CrutchCricket]

MisterJB wrote...

Every ship in the allied fleet was armed with a Thannix Cannon.

Or so they claim. I personally didn't see any thannix cannons on our side. There was like a split second of one (maybe) when the Normandy broke through to Earth and it was only against an occulus.

But whatever. The failures of the endings are well known enough by now.

[flemm]

MisterJB wrote...
I can understand wanting the antagonist to be an incomprehensible cosmic force but, like fleem said, that ship has sailed regarding the Reapers. And I am fine with it, ME should be about humanity rising above the Reapers.

One thing that's really been lost in all this discussion is that what the Reapers do is horrific and brutal. That's yet another big problem with how they have been handled.

If they were treated more as a cosmic force then the inhumanity and brutality becomes a strong point because, well, the universe is inhuman and pretty brutal a lot of the time to organic life. It's the order of things.

But when you start trying to say: these creatures exist for practical reasons, what they do makes sense in rational terms, they are not so different from us, then people will balk at that because then the inhumanity and brutality becomes something you have to account for, just as you would if any other sentient beings were accomplishing these horrific acts.

Modifié par flemm, 08 juillet 2012 - 02:36 .

[o Ventus]

LanceSolous13 wrote...

Harbinger is also the largest and most powerful of all the Reapers. Plus, we don't know what a Reaper Laser would do to another Reaper. For all we know, It could be like tickeling it.

Either way, look at the situation....

Attack Harbinger, the oldest, largest, and most powerful Reaper, and PREY TO GOD that he doesn't crubstomp you in 5 seconds flat

or

Get the injured out of there so that Shepard can activate the Crucible and destroy ALL the Reapers.

Harbinger is clinically blind, it can't be that bad.

[Stalker]

LanceSolous13 wrote...

Harbinger is also the largest and most powerful of all the Reapers. Plus, we don't know what a Reaper Laser would do to another Reaper. For all we know, It could be like tickeling it.

Either way, look at the situation....

Attack Harbinger, the oldest, largest, and most powerful Reaper, and PREY TO GOD that he doesn't crubstomp you in 5 seconds flat

or

Land right in it's firing range and PREY TO GOD that he doesn't crubstomp you in 5 seconds flat

fix'd.

Modifié par Mr Massakka, 08 juillet 2012 - 02:38 .

[MisterJB]

Well, you don't shoot the pyjaks that are in the back. First, you shoot the ones that are close to getting to the food stores.

[o Ventus]

MisterJB wrote...

Well, you don't shoot the pyjaks that are in the back. First, you shoot the ones that are close to getting to the food stores.

Harbinger has AT LEAST 5 guns at his disposal. His fault for not utilizing them.

[Stalker]

MisterJB wrote...

Well, you don't shoot the pyjaks that are in the back. First, you shoot the ones that are close to getting to the food stores.

... that's even one more reason for the Normandy to fire at it. It could be a useful distraction for the ground team. 

Intstead, the Normandy lands there to get 2 random (yes, random and non-essential) injured out of there.

Modifié par Mr Massakka, 08 juillet 2012 - 02:48 .

[Cmdr. Ken Shepard]

Mr Massakka wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Well, you don't shoot the pyjaks that are in the back. First, you shoot the ones that are close to getting to the food stores.

... that's even one more reason for the Normandy to fire at it.
There is next to no chance of Harbinger shooting back then and it could be a useful (and possibly hurting) distraction for the groud team. Is it really that effective to get 2 people put of there? It's not like these 2 are that essential anyway...

It also seems counter productive, if its an everybody for themselves mad dash to the Crucible. Evac the wounded, Shep and other squadie go toward beam.

[LanceSolous13]

Mr Massakka wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Well, you don't shoot the pyjaks that are in the back. First, you shoot the ones that are close to getting to the food stores.

... that's even one more reason for the Normandy to fire at it.
There is next to no chance of Harbinger shooting back then and it could be a useful distraction for the ground team. Is it really that effective to get 2 people out of there? It's not like these 2 are that essential anyway...

Ok, Two reasons I figure Harbinger didn't attack.

1) The Normandy still has the IFF from ME2. Unless Harbinger attacks, Herbinger probably won't attack. Think of it as a glitch or error in the software.

2) The Normandy is taking people AWAY from the Beam, not sending more to it. It isn't posing a threat to the beam at the current time.

3) There are still pleanty of tanks and people charging for the beam in the background. As someone mentioned the Pyjack annology a moment ago, it fits rather well.

[o Ventus]

LanceSolous13 wrote...

1) The Normandy still has the IFF from ME2. Unless Harbinger attacks, Herbinger probably won't attack. Think of it as a glitch or error in the software.

The Reapers chase you on the galaxy map, and the Occuli and Collectors still shoot at the Normandy. Not to mention the Normandy takes fire during the massive space battle at the end. Besides, being invisible to the Reapers would mean the Normandy SHOULD BE firing at Harbinger. Plus as Massakka said, the Rannoch Reaper fires up at the Normandy.

3) There are still pleanty of tanks and people charging for the beam in the background. As someone mentioned the Pyjack annology a moment ago, it fits rather well.

Again, Harbinger has at least 5 main guns. His fault for not using them.

Modifié par o Ventus, 08 juillet 2012 - 02:54 .

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Deleted

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 08 juillet 2012 - 06:28 .

[Stalker]

LanceSolous13 wrote...

Mr Massakka wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Well, you don't shoot the pyjaks that are in the back. First, you shoot the ones that are close to getting to the food stores.

... that's even one more reason for the Normandy to fire at it.
There is next to no chance of Harbinger shooting back then and it could be a useful distraction for the ground team. Is it really that effective to get 2 people out of there? It's not like these 2 are that essential anyway...

Ok, Two reasons I figure Harbinger didn't attack.

1) The Normandy still has the IFF from ME2. Unless Harbinger attacks, Herbinger probably won't attack. Think of it as a glitch or error in the software.

2) The Normandy is taking people AWAY from the Beam, not sending more to it. It isn't posing a threat to the beam at the current time.

3) There are still pleanty of tanks and people charging for the beam in the background. As someone mentioned the Pyjack annology a moment ago, it fits rather well.

1) That system didn't work very well neither on the Collector ship, nor (as it turns out in a side-conversation) on the Rannoch Reaper. Reapers are very well aware of the Normandy's presence

2)  and 3): I refer to my older post. That does only give the Normandy another reason to shoot at it.

[LanceSolous13]

The Rannoch Reaper attacked the Normandy because the Normandy attacked the Rannoch Reaper. It was the very first one to attack the Rannoch Reaper. In the Galexy Map, The Reapers are growing aware that "Hey. That ship with the same presence of a normal Reaper is sending Probes and picking up artifacts/people that our enemies would be interested. Something fishy here...."

You slightly have me there with the Collector Ship though I suppose, with a slight reach of logic, It might have sent that signal out to the ship out as it was being installed, nothing more or something....I don't know there.

About the 5 guns, There are still people going to the beam. I'd just call Gameplay-Story-Segregation of them not being shown in use at all during the cutscene as the laser's sound is really loud and we could probably be unable to hear the heartfelt goodbyes if otherwise.

EDIT: The Normandy is only 'invisable' to the Reaper as long as it doesn't attack. Attack Harbinger, It knows to kill whatever it is that is attacking him, regardless of what it actually is.

Modifié par LanceSolous13, 08 juillet 2012 - 03:01 .

[LanceSolous13]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

Off Topic. I'm currently playing ME1. Some people have said that if you're careful, you'll end up becoming "Ninja-Romanced" (?) by Liara. What exactly do you say that makes this accident happen?

Just reject Liara anytime she brings up a "connection" between the two of you.

Might have her romance flag tipped if you nuke the Squaddie of the opposite sex though. Don't know really as I purposefully romanced Liara in ME1. Partially out of the fact that I left Ashley on Virmire.

[o Ventus]

LanceSolous13 wrote...

The Rannoch Reaper attacked the Normandy because the Normandy attacked the Rannoch Reaper. It was the very first one to attack the Rannoch Reaper.

No. Please don't make me explain why.

In the Galexy Map, The Reapers are growing aware that "Hey. That ship with the same presence of a normal Reaper is sending Probes and picking up artifacts/people that our enemies would be interested. Something fishy here...."

This is reaching.

You slightly have me there with the Collector Ship though I suppose, with a slight reach of logic, It might have sent that signal out to the ship out as it was being installed, nothing more or something....I don't know there.

This... Doesn't make sense.

EDIT: The Normandy is only 'invisable' to the Reaper as long as it doesn't attack. Attack Harbinger, It knows to kill whatever it is that is attacking him, regardless of what it actually is.

See #1.

[LanceSolous13]

Then please do explain. I don't see what's wrong with the logic...

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Deleted

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 08 juillet 2012 - 06:28 .

[LanceSolous13]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

LanceSolous13 wrote...

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

Off Topic. I'm currently playing ME1. Some people have said that if you're careful, you'll end up becoming "Ninja-Romanced" (?) by Liara. What exactly do you say that makes this accident happen?

Just reject Liara anytime she brings up a "connection" between the two of you.

Might have her romance flag tipped if you nuke the Squaddie of the opposite sex though. Don't know really as I purposefully romanced Liara in ME1. Partially out of the fact that I left Ashley on Virmire.

Kaidan survives in my Story. It was...."Cute"(?) the way Liara reacted when I made the joke about her Dissecting me. But...I had to reload because it felt too...."Touchy"(?) I guess. Oh ****, I hope I'm not starting to fall for Liara.

Erm.....If you like Liara, just go with it. The real way Mass Effect should be played is by going with whatever options are infront of you and running with them.

Like, ok, I have a Paragon and Renegade options. The Renegade option will give me more War Assets later in the game but the conflict at hand is something I would take the Paragon Option to. Don't over think every choice there.

In a more in game example, I lean more towards Paragon. During Mordin's Loyalty Quest, I saved Maelon's Data because it would mean the Female Krogan would have died in vein. Evidently, This saves Eve later in ME3.

[o Ventus]

LanceSolous13 wrote...

Then please do explain. I don't see what's wrong with the logic...

That isn't how IFFs work, first of all. Unless Joker just shut it off for whatever reason (assuming that's even possible with the Reaper variant), it would be emitting the signal constantly, or at regular intervals. If the IFF scrambled the Reapers' "vision" into fooling them into thinking the Normandy is a Reaper vessel, not a hostile. As the Catalyst points out, they're just machines and apparently can't reason for themselves.

Again, if the IFF has anything at all to do with Harbinger (or the Destroyer on Earth, for that matter) not shooting at the Normandy, why do the Collectors and Occuli shoot at them? Why do the Reapers follow them on the galaxy map? Even if the Normandy was pinging a different signal than the one emitted from the IFF, the Reapers would have picked up the IFF signal from the Normandy and read it as a Reaper or Reaper vessel.

The Reaper IFF is not a strong excuse for Harbinger ignoring the Normandy.

Modifié par o Ventus, 08 juillet 2012 - 03:26 .

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

LanceSolous13 wrote...


Erm.....If you like Liara, just go with it. The real way Mass Effect should be played is by going with whatever options are infront of you and running with them.

Like, ok, I have a Paragon and Renegade options. The Renegade option will give me more War Assets later in the game but the conflict at hand is something I would take the Paragon Option to. Don't over think every choice there.

In a more in game example, I lean more towards Paragon. During Mordin's Loyalty Quest, I saved Maelon's Data because it would mean the Female Krogan would have died in vein. Evidently, This saves Eve later in ME3.

1) I really don't like Love Triangles.

2) I only have ONE Story. I just want one story. I had this story for more than 2 Years. Vangaurd, War Hero, Spacer. And Miranda has always been my LI.

3) I do not want a different Charcter, as some would call it. I did it once, and finished it (FemShep, Liara as LI). I didn't want it anymore because it was done and over with. Do I dare change my LI indefinitely?

Edit: Had to edit post. Gotta avoid pyramids.

And about the IFF, how can that not be the reason for Harbinger hesitating to attack the Normandy?

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 08 juillet 2012 - 03:27 .

[LanceSolous13]

It may be emmiting the IFF signal and have it flagged as a Reaper Vessel accordingly, but they also can see you scanning planets and evaccuating war assets, a not very Reaper thing to do, so thus they go after you in that instance even though the Reaper IFF says otherwise. Same goes for attacking a Reaper. The Normandy might be flagged as a Reaper Ship, but by attacking a Reaper, you are revealing that you are not a Reaper, regardless of what the Reaper systems have you flagged as.

I don't remember seeing Occuli shooting at the Normandy during the assualt on Earth. But I suppose you do have a point there when they pass through the Omega 4 Relay.

I'm pretty much giving a handwave here, not a brilliant reason on why.