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"I'll always want you in my life." Miranda Lawson in Mass Effect 3


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#63226
Taboo

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hot_heart wrote...

I didn't think I was saying anything particularly novel... :P

Essentially, we needed MORE Miranda.


It's more novel than you think.

The Miranda that we see in ME3 was always there whether people accept it or not.

I not angry about some of it, in fact I like some of it quite a bit.

It has to do with the lack of context in the scenes she's in. We know what's going on, but we really don't know anything up until that point.  What you really truly need is a filler, the issue is practicality. What could you due to justify it's inclusion?

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Modifié par Taboo-XX, 05 août 2012 - 09:59 .


#63227
jtav

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No she wasn't. Excepting a few nice romance bits, emails, and slides, ME3 Miranda should be utterly ignored and disowned as a pale perversion of the character.

#63228
Dr. Doctor

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Ieldra2 wrote...

where Miranda's story went. I'm the same as you: I could walk away and accept that the writers wanted to turn her into a character I don't like any more, but how she was written in ME2 has enough weight to make me stay and say the ME3 writers got her wrong.

It's really strange - the same team that mutilated Miranda also gave us the Synthesis ending... very odd.



To be fair Mac and Casey's version of Synthesis was pretty much a third option that was there for the sake of having a third option. Change the explosion to green and give Joker glowy eyes and job done. The Weekes and Dombrow version in the EC is what turns it into something completely different from Control and Destroy.

jtav wrote...

As for the chip, here's what I want to do with it for story purposes. Shepard was subject to a brute force indoctrination attempt via Object Rho. Prep work Miranda did for the chip slowed it to a virtual standstill, but he's at risk if he's ever exposed to an indoctrination signal again. Liara and Hackett hire Miranda to fix him. Since Shiala is the only person ever freed of indoctrination, the idea is to preemptively "indoctrinate" him via chip. So something like AI shackles?

 

The chip in it's original configuration could have altered Shepard's brain chemistry on demand to make him be more receptive to working with Cerberus or making certain decisions. You could even theoreticaly adjust the neuochemical balace of Shepard's mind to make him trust TIM or Miranda.

Reaper indoctrination tries to instill paranoia, awe, or fear in the subject. The nanites that establish the link between the thrall and the Reapers spread by attaching to adrenaline released into the blood stream. Having a system that could track the the nanites through Shepard's body and adjust his brain chemistry to slow down the indoctrination process might be a viable fix.

#63229
Taboo

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jtav wrote...

No she wasn't. Excepting a few nice romance bits, emails, and slides, ME3 Miranda should be utterly ignored and disowned as a pale perversion of the character.


I should have been clearer.

The problem is lack of context as to the events leading up to the scenes that she is in. It is like a cameo. Pop in, pop out. Except that cameos don't have parts in the plot.

It's evident that she's being Miranda off-screen, the mail from the app relays as much, the difference is is that this material should be available readily, not in a side-product. You have to go outside the game world in order to seek justification for this. She even says good luck after the scene in the apartment.

Should a DLC be implemented properly, it might help give context to what she's been doing all this time and in the time that she and Shepard re-affirmed their feelings for one another.

In short, what you're asking for is not filler material, but an addition for both context (DUH) AND expansion.

It's not so much a perversion of character as it is a lack of context. She appears aloof whenever Shepard appears, but she still gets the job done, just like she always has. That Miranda is still very much there.

The one two punch can come from DLC that applies context to the original scenes, as well as adressing previously established character arcs. The key one that needs to be addressed is Cerberus, not just for Miranda's sake, but Cerberus in general, as they are now mustache twirling villains.

#63230
Caihn

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jtav wrote...

No she wasn't. Excepting a few nice romance bits, emails, and slides, ME3 Miranda should be utterly ignored and disowned as a pale perversion of the character.


Ignore it if you want.

I like this character, both in ME2 and ME3.
And nobody (especially you) will tell me who is or who is not Miranda.

My only complain about Miranda in ME3, is that she should have a 1 hour role instead of a 5 minutes one.

Modifié par Yannkee, 05 août 2012 - 11:20 .


#63231
Td1984

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jtav wrote...

As for the chip, here's what I want to do with it for story purposes. Shepard was subject to a brute force indoctrination attempt via Object Rho. Prep work Miranda did for the chip slowed it to a virtual standstill, but he's at risk if he's ever exposed to an indoctrination signal again. Liara and Hackett hire Miranda to fix him. Since Shiala is the only person ever freed of indoctrination, the idea is to preemptively "indoctrinate" him via chip. So something like AI shackles?

Problem is that if you read Shiala's email in ME3, she says she's certain she's still indoctrinated.

#63232
hot_heart

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Ha. I wouldn't be so sure about that last point...

#63233
Taboo

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^ Eight months ago we didn't know Jacob was such a player.

But who even considered doing that to her in the first place?

#63234
shepskisaac

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jtav wrote...

No she wasn't. Excepting a few nice romance bits, emails, and slides, ME3 Miranda should be utterly ignored and disowned as a pale perversion of the character.

Ok, this is just ridiculous

#63235
flemm

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IsaacShep wrote...

jtav wrote...

No she wasn't. Excepting a few nice romance bits, emails, and slides, ME3 Miranda should be utterly ignored and disowned as a pale perversion of the character.


Ok, this is just ridiculous


It really depends on what you mean. On the surface, especially if you are interested in either continuing the romance or a friendship, it's... ok. Just really lacking in content.

Underneath the surface there are some more serious issues. But those are a result of the fact that the main direction is focused on eliminating Miranda because she was an important part of Cerberus. The game just allows you to maintain a relationship with her if that's what you want.

Modifié par flemm, 06 août 2012 - 02:15 .


#63236
Taboo

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The problem has nothing to do with elimination or Cerberus.

She simply isn't there to give insight. She pops in and out.

She was written into the story that way and it's been that way for a long time, as Mac Walters said the script was written quite a while ago.

She isn't there because the writers didn't want her to be.

#63237
krukow

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Anyone who says you guys complain too much is off base. Coming into ME3, Ash and Miri were my 1/1A romances, but given the differences between the two, I can't even get through a second Miri romance. She's just never, ever there. I get to talk to Ash a ton(comparitively), do all the ending stuff, and take her on missions (and yes, it adds to the romance when your LI gets to blow away Marauders with her revenant while you giggle, it's the equivalent of a couples play date). You don't get to do any of that stuff with Miranda. It's so noticable having done a few Ash playthroughs and it's pretty terrible.

So yeah, let's get more Miranda laready.

Modifié par krukow, 06 août 2012 - 02:35 .


#63238
Taboo

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I suppose you could argue that the entirety of ME2 was that...if you were Mac Walters.

But LOL @ Play dates.

That actually makes me sad though, as she was incredibly useful in combat.

And other situations.

#63239
krukow

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Taboo-XX wrote...

I suppose you could argue that the entirety of ME2 was that...if you were Mac Walters.

But LOL @ Play dates.

That actually makes me sad though, as she was incredibly useful in combat.

And other situations.


Dude, it's sooo much fun to bring em along and kill things. 

Except when I'm an adept, and I use singularity, then Ash steals my kills before I cool down for warp.

#63240
fiendishchicken

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Taboo-XX wrote...

She isn't there because the writers didn't want her to be.


Which begs the question: Why the **** do the writers not want her in the game?

#63241
krukow

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fiendishchicken wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

She isn't there because the writers didn't want her to be.


Which begs the question: Why the **** do the writers not want her in the game?




Duh, she's not asari.  What franchise have you been following?Posted Image

Modifié par krukow, 06 août 2012 - 02:44 .


#63242
Td1984

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fiendishchicken wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

She isn't there because the writers didn't want her to be.


Which begs the question: Why the **** do the writers not want her in the game?



1. She's not blue

2. She wasn't in the ME squad.

3. She was Cerberus

#63243
Taboo

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fiendishchicken wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

She isn't there because the writers didn't want her to be.


Which begs the question: Why the **** do the writers not want her in the game?




Probably because she wasn't considered important enough.

So they gave us someone without any relevance to the plot instead.

Tali ****ing Zorah.

#63244
jtav

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She's human, would force them too admit to shades of grey in Cerberus, and doesn't really fit the new squad.

#63245
Taboo

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jtav wrote...

She's human, would force them too admit to shades of grey in Cerberus, and doesn't really fit the new squad.


And Tali does?

Vega?

EDI?

#63246
fiendishchicken

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krukow wrote...

fiendishchicken wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

She isn't there because the writers didn't want her to be.


Which begs the question: Why the **** do the writers not want her in the game?




Duh, she's not asari.  What franchise have you been following?Posted Image


uh..... KotOR? Chuck?

#63247
jtav

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Taboo-XX wrote...

jtav wrote...

She's human, would force them too admit to shades of grey in Cerberus, and doesn't really fit the new squad.


And Tali does?

Vega?

EDI?


The seven base game squad members are all basically nice people who get along. Miranda introduces inter[ersonal conflict the writers don't seem to want.

#63248
Babi_Siha

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Taboo-XX wrote...

jtav wrote...

She's human, would force them too admit to shades of grey in Cerberus, and doesn't really fit the new squad.


And Tali does?


No, we have those psychotic, stalkers Talimancers responsible for that. She wasn't suppose to be a permanent squad mate.

Vega?


Is there because BioWare is EA's b*tch and because of that is only interested in making money. Since they wanted to bring in new players, they had this stupid logic that a new squad would make new players feel more connected to the game.

EDI?


Should be there only as the ship AI as she was in ME2. Became a bot to do fan service for horny geeks.

Modifié par Babi_Siha, 06 août 2012 - 03:00 .


#63249
Taboo

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jtav wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

jtav wrote...

She's human, would force them too admit to shades of grey in Cerberus, and doesn't really fit the new squad.


And Tali does?

Vega?

EDI?


The seven base game squad members are all basically nice people who get along. Miranda introduces inter[ersonal conflict the writers don't seem to want.


That isn't a very good excuse.

She isn't there because she wasn't wanted in the same capacity.

She still has more than the other ME2 characters, so she wasn't dropped entirely.

#63250
fiendishchicken

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jtav wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

jtav wrote...

She's human, would force them too admit to shades of grey in Cerberus, and doesn't really fit the new squad.


And Tali does?

Vega?

EDI?


The seven base game squad members are all basically nice people who get along. Miranda introduces interpersonal conflict the writers don't seem to want.


I would argue Javik shakes up the boat a bit as only Garrus and James seem to like him, although Garrus thinks he fights war for it's own sake. Tali and Liara are upset at his blunt and callous attitude towards war and death, EDI doesn't like him because of his attitude towards synthetic life, and I have seen no interaction between Javik and the VS.

Beside the point though, Another thing I headcanon is Miranda is still trying to come to terms with her feelings towards Shepard. She hasn't told him about her infertility, she still hasn't really opened up about herself much to him, and she is trying to put some distance between them so that she will not be as badly hurt if he dies.