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[Taboo]

jtav wrote...

Let me put it this way: if Miranda actually appears in a speaking role in future DLC, I will write a oneshot where she and Shep get married and have a baby.

I'll hold you to it.

Modifié par Taboo-XX, 08 août 2012 - 07:17 .

[Lawrence0294]

Taboo-XX wrote...

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

Three Miri's?!....<3:wub:<3:wub:

It's a frame by frame...

Those are used in comparitive shot analysis...

*cough* 

You can use it to pick up certain aspects of the scene. 

You really love comparative shots don't you 

Can't blame you

[Taboo]

kratos0294 wrote...

You really love comparative shots don't you [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/lol.png[/smilie]

Can't blame you

 

I love it so much I just did a variant for Caligula. 

Between the R rated and Unrated. 

Modifié par Taboo-XX, 08 août 2012 - 07:19 .

[flemm]

jtav wrote...

Let me put it this way: if Miranda actually appears in a speaking role in future DLC, I will write a oneshot where she and Shep get married and have a baby.

LoL. Well, that's one more reason to hope it happens


I just can't believe that some of the devs and writers don't understand how... *problematic* some of this stuff is (and I don't just mean Miranda's content). There's too much about this series and quite a few of the characters that I enjoy for there not to be other voices in the room, so to speak.

Also, the sensibility that produced the problems in Miranda's content is responsable for the not-so-good/bad parts of the game, and for nearly ruining the IP (by mishandling the ending in a similarly non-democratic manner).

So... we'll see.

Modifié par flemm, 08 août 2012 - 07:46 .

[Taboo]

flemm wrote...

I just can't believe that some of the devs and writers don't understand how... *problematic* some of this stuff is (and I don't just mean Miranda's content). There's too much about this series and quite a few of the characters that I enjoy for there not to be other voices in the room, so to speak.

Also, the sensibility that produced the problems in Miranda's content is responsable for the not-so-good/bad parts of the game, and for nearly ruining the IP (by mishandling the ending in a similarly non-democratic manner).

So... we'll see.

She had a new writer for this game yes? I believe said writer had advice and guidance from Patrick Weekes. The issue is precedence, the old Miranda is still there, it's simply taken... a back seat.

Do you remember when we talked about using a character trait to further a story at the expense of everything else? That's how I see it. To give closure to Miranda in the simplest manner possible they used her sister to justify her behavior. They even threw in her father. They also made it difficult for her to survive.

The only variable that really exists is whether or not she's in a relationship with Shepard, which I think is the only praiseworthy part of the arc in ME3.

[Dr. Doctor]

 What confuses me is why someone thought that Miranda needed to be "redeemed" in the first place.  The control chip conversation to me seems like it was grasping at straws to find something that she could have done wrong:

Miranda: I'm sorry for something that I thought about doing but didn't actually do.

Shepard: Huh?

Miranda: I thought about putting a control chip in your head but decided not to. Can you forgive me?

Shepard: For..?

Miranda: Having the idea of  putting the chip in your head.

Shepard: Did you stop taking your medication or something?

The only other thing that they attempt to do is make it seem like the fact that her genetic engineering is something that she has to atone for. She isn't normal and she has to pay for it? Isn't this the same game that calls her a miracle of modern science in her codex entry?

[fiendishchicken]

flemm wrote...

jtav wrote...

Let me put it this way: if Miranda actually appears in a speaking role in future DLC, I will write a oneshot where she and Shep get married and have a baby.

LoL. Well, that's one more reason to hope it happens


I just can't believe that some of the devs and writers don't understand how... *problematic* some of this stuff is (and I don't just mean Miranda's content). There's too much about this series and quite a few of the characters that I enjoy for there not to be other voices in the room, so to speak.

Also, the sensibility that produced the problems in Miranda's content is responsable for the not-so-good/bad parts of the game, and for nearly ruining the IP (by mishandling the ending in a similarly non-democratic manner).

So... we'll see.

It's mind-boggling how much they got wrong in ME3, that you have to sit back and sometimes wonder... was it intentional? Probably not, but seriously what the hell was that writing team thinking? 

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Looking up at Miri when waking up in the Med Bay of the Lazarus Station, I think, "HELLLOOOO NURSE<3!"

Imagine yeeling that out loud by accident.

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 08 août 2012 - 07:56 .

[Taboo]

Her genetic makeup has nothing to do with the chip. She feels guilty about wanting to exert complete control over someone whilst resenting her father for it.

It has nothing to do with her not being normal.

She apologizes for hypocritical behavior, like most people do when they feel bad about something.

[jtav]

I have several theories on what happened but they all boil down to underestimating the audience. Which is the worst thing you can do as an artist.

[fiendishchicken]

Dr. Doctor wrote...

 What confuses me is why someone thought that Miranda needed to be "redeemed" in the first place.  The control chip conversation to me seems like it was grasping at straws to find something that she could have done wrong:

Miranda: I'm sorry for something that I thought about doing but didn't actually do.

Shepard: Huh?

Miranda: I thought about putting a control chip in your head but decided not to. Can you forgive me?

Shepard: For..?

Miranda: Having the idea of  putting the chip in your head.

Shepard: Did you stop taking your medication or something?

The only other thing that they attempt to do is make it seem like the fact that her genetic engineering is something that she has to atone for. She isn't normal and she has to pay for it? Isn't this the same game that calls her a miracle of modern science in her codex entry?

I wonder how the more conservative elements of the ME universe would regard her. I see some people (Ashley Williams for example) who would think she was a freak and unnatural due to the method of her conception. Ashley even states this if she was romanced in ME1 and left for Miranda; "I'm a real person. Not sure if that's your thing anymore."

I would imagine she keeps the fact of her genetic engineering a secret. 

Modifié par fiendishchicken, 08 août 2012 - 07:59 .

[Lawrence0294]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

Looking up at Miri when waking up in the Med Bay of the Lazarus Station, I think, "HELLLOOOO NURSE<3!"

Imagine yeeling that out loud by accident.

Lol, Miranda would facepaml and say to Wilson:

......well apparently the brain is still  malfuntcioning

[Taboo]

fiendishchicken wrote...

Ashley even states this if she was romanced in ME1 and left for Miranda; "I'm a real person. Not sure if that's your thing anymore."

wat

That's so horrible. I heard she has a comment on how she dresses as well, something about wearing swimwear into battle.

She's jealous, obviously, but that's just plain mean.

[MisterJB]

On that we agree. That line alone made me start to dislike Ashley.

Being hurt Shepard moved on is understandable. Questioning the validity of Miranda's existence based on how she was born, a factor she simply can't help, is something completely different and hits at a much deeper and close minded belief.

[jtav]

Well, this actual conservative thinks Henry did a very bad thing when he created her, but it isn't her fault, and she he has equal dignity to any other person. I'd like to think most would be like that, but there will be people saying she isn't human.

[wright1978]

Taboo-XX wrote...

She had a new writer for this game yes? I believe said writer had advice and guidance from Patrick Weekes. The issue is precedence, the old Miranda is still there, it's simply taken... a back seat.

Do you remember when we talked about using a character trait to further a story at the expense of everything else? That's how I see it. To give closure to Miranda in the simplest manner possible they used her sister to justify her behavior. They even threw in her father. They also made it difficult for her to survive.

The only variable that really exists is whether or not she's in a relationship with Shepard, which I think is the only praiseworthy part of the arc in ME3.

Agree with bolded portion very much. As far as the rest of her writing goes the complete detachment from the cerberus arc or any reflection on her thoughts on Cerberus makes me very sceptical the new writer wasn't given a directive banning him from writing content of that nature. There's so much filler in her content coupled with so much rehashing of ME2 content it is unbelievable.

Modifié par wright1978, 08 août 2012 - 08:05 .

[Taboo]

jtav wrote...

Well, this actual conservative thinks Henry did a very bad thing when he created her, but it isn't her fault, and she he has equal dignity to any other person. I'd like to think most would be like that, but there will be people saying she isn't human.

She would have been formed in a similar manner. She was grown. The only difference was where.

Does a tube make any difference from a uterus?

Does selective genes make you inhuman? From what I've been lead to understand even Ashley has some of that, to fix near sightedness in her families genes.

[flemm]

Taboo-XX wrote...

wat

That's so horrible. I heard she has a comment on how she dresses as well, something about wearing swimwear into battle.

She's jealous, obviously, but that's just plain mean.

Ashley's comment is fine imo. Perfectly in character.

However, that should be *Ashley's* point of view, not the *game's* point of view. You should be able to say: Miranda is different, but just as "real."

Both points of view should be more or less equally represented.

Too much of the game is designed with the idea apparently in mind that, if the devs gave equal time to each point of view, too many players would not make what some group of devs considers to be the *right* choice.

Modifié par flemm, 08 août 2012 - 08:21 .

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Kaidan is the VS in My Story.

[Taboo]

I can understand being angry about him leaving her, but denying a person's right to life based upon the origin of their birth is a little...much don't you think?

I've heard girls say nasty things about each other but I've never heard one say something like that. The swimsuit comment is in character, the part about her not being a real person is arrogant.

[wright1978]

flemm wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

wat

That's so horrible. I heard she has a comment on how she dresses as well, something about wearing swimwear into battle.

She's jealous, obviously, but that's just plain mean.

Ashley's comment is fine imo. Perfectly in character.

However, that should be *Ashley's* point of view, not the *game's* point of view. You should be able to say: Miranda is different, but just as "real."

Both points of view should be more or less equally represented in the game.

Haven't got round to finishing a runthrough where Ash is alive yet. Does Shep auto respond to the line?

[flemm]

wright1978 wrote...

Haven't got round to finishing a runthrough where Ash is alive yet. Does Shep auto respond to the line?

I forget precisely the mechanics of it. Kaidan is actually the VS in my games. But you don't really get to present the opposite view of Miranda's genetic engineering. (Not just in that conversation.)

Modifié par flemm, 08 août 2012 - 08:23 .

[MisterJB]

Shepard doesn't really say anything worthwile, one way or the other.
Which is a pity. I would have liked an option to support either side.
"She's as real as anyone else." vs "It's not her fault how she was created."

[wright1978]

MisterJB wrote...

Shepard doesn't really say anything worthwile, one way or the other.
Which is a pity. I would have liked an option to support either side.
"She's as real as anyone else." vs "It's not her fault how she was created."

Guessed that would be the case. ME3 really fails to deliver player choices in these sort of situations. Someone slags off my girlfriend or close friend i want the dialogue wheel to be there so i can give them a piece of my mind.

[Dr. Doctor]

fiendishchicken wrote...

I wonder how the more conservative elements of the ME universe would regard her. I see some people (Ashley Williams for example) who would think she was a freak and unnatural due to the method of her conception. Ashley even states this if she was romanced in ME1 and left for Miranda; "I'm a real person. Not sure if that's your thing anymore."

I would imagine she keeps the fact of her genetic engineering a secret. 

Genetic engineering is pretty common among humans in ME. All Alliance soldiers are given modifications to improve strength, stamina, eyesight, etc. Gene therapy has been used to remove genetic disease from the human gene pool and at Huerta Memorial Hospital in ME3 a soldier talks about getting a cloned replacement for a lost limb.

ME1's codex entry for genetic technology goes a lot more in-depth:

In the 22nd century, manipulation of the human genome became commonplace. Techniques for genetic engineering advanced to the point where the rich could custom-build fetuses that grew into stronger, smarter, and more attractive adults. In more permissive regions, custom-designed life forms and "uplifted" animals occupied an ill-defined niche between "property" and "sapient being". 

ENGINEERING: Artificial hybridization of genes from compatible non-human species with human genetic code is illegal. Creation of designed life is broadly legal (and mainly used for terraforming and medical applications), but sentient creatures are heavily regulated, and creation of sapient life is outlawed by both the Systems Alliance and the Citadel Council.

People with tailoring similar to Miranda's exist in 2185 but she's unique in the fact that her father modified a copy of his own X chromosome to create his daughters. Miranda says that Henry "Grew her [Oriana] when I was a teenager." suggesting that the Lawson Process is something that the Alliance and Council would frown upon.