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[Mister J]

Yeah when they were completing ME3 but I doubt that everyone in 4 is gonna be a green glowing organic-machine hybrid...

[Andrew Lucas]

For old time's sake,



Definitely one of my favorites, Kaymarierose has some pretty good stuff. It saddens me to think that this could've been Shepard and Miranda's scene in ME3.

Well, at least there's some fanfiction, like "Fight For The Lost" and "What The Future Brings" in FF.Net , great ones IMO.

[God]

Eh, I've given up on fan-fiction, mainly because of how terrible most of it is. It's really hard to write something and someone that is in character as well as meshing with the setting.

 

I have one that I came up with somewhere, sitting at about 50 or so pages. It's basically my Shepard's Mass Effect story, and it's incomplete for now. I only got about a quarter the way into ME2. My reasons for stopping were basically the same as what I said above. I hope to continue it one day, since I still have ideas for it spinning in my head, but for now, it'll sit unpublished on one of my 3 hard drives. Some reception from a couple of people was good, but I have a tendency to go on an author tract about my Shepard; he was, somewhat rightfully, considered to be an ubermensch. At least it wasn't a Sue-fic.

 

I haven't even gotten to the part where Shepard and Miranda get together yet.

[wright1978]

Who knows what the characters will be like in the next Mass Effect? It is a possibility that the original characters will be long gone, dead, including Miranda. It's sad. Oh well. New game, new characters, new generation.

 

As much as i love Miranda, I desperately want the game set long enough into the future(hundreds/thousand years etc) that all existing characters are dead. Leave Shep & co futures to players imaginations and let the trainwreck of an ending become blurred by history.

[CrutchCricket]

As much as i love Miranda, I desperately want the game set long enough into the future(hundreds/thousand years etc) that all existing characters are dead. Leave Shep & co futures to players imaginations and let the trainwreck of an ending become blurred by history.

 

"Leave it the **** alone" is precisely my sentiment. Although even hundreds/thousands of years later doesn't solve the problem of the ending consequences necessarily being too divergent to merge or ignore. That and you run into a new problem: set it that far into the future and technology should advance and culture, even locations should be markedly different (except perhaps for asari). Otherwise you get Star Wars Time syndrome where Jedi fight Sith in triangle ships for eternity. With the former, why bother even calling it "Mass Effect" and with the latter it's a tossup at best as to whether people will accept it, and again you still have the issue of nothing ever mattering.

 

To which Bioware's inevitable reply is of course: "But the monies!!"

[wright1978]

"Leave it the **** alone" is precisely my sentiment. Although even hundreds/thousands of years later doesn't solve the problem of the ending consequences necessarily being too divergent to merge or ignore. That and you run into a new problem: set it that far into the future and technology should advance and culture, even locations should be markedly different (except perhaps for asari). Otherwise you get Star Wars Time syndrome where Jedi fight Sith in triangle ships for eternity. With the former, why bother even calling it "Mass Effect" and with the latter it's a tossup at best as to whether people will accept it, and again you still have the issue of nothing ever mattering.

 

To which Bioware's inevitable reply is of course: "But the monies!!"

 

I can understand their desire to monetise the franchise further despite Casey and Mac's attempts to scuttle it. The question really becomes can they get past the trainwreck without angering everyone. As you say there still would be issues to going further forward.The notion of that's been banded about of an expeditionary force to a remote unexplored area could allow them to use the established races without the existing location, though accounting for synthesis or bypassing it would still require nifty footwork.

[God]

I believe it will be set within a certain period of the ending (anywhere from 1 to 50 years after the ending), and that they will address the choice of the ending, but that it will be irrelevant to the game itself.

 

I'm not saying it's what I think or hope they should do, but what they likely will do.

[Lawrence0294]

I honestly don't know what to think regarding the next Mass Effect. The fanboy in me is incredibly excited to possibly go back in this sci-fi universe which I really love. The other part is reminded by the massive mess of Mass Effect 3 and excitement quickly withers. Although, Bioware's latest work, Dragon Age Inquisition, is a great success in my eyes and a great step in a good direction, so that does bring back a little hope. 
In the end, I'm still interested, especially when thinking back of what wonders Mass effect 1 and 2 brought me and seeing that Bioware seems to be moving in the right direction. But it is a different team and time will not erase the mess that was Mass Effect 3, making me severely cautious.

 

As to when will the game itself be set, my money is set on some time after the ending, close enough that people still talk about certain of Shepard's action. Regarding the ending choice, I actually think it is not impossible for Bioware to create three different settings that show their affects through out the game. Make everyone glowy green (oh lord), show some reapers in the background and change certain dialogues or simply no reapers and no tech glow. The game won't be on PS3 - 360 so a lot of shackles are removed.

 

Oh, and a classic, because I can

 

[hot_heart]

Hey, so this is still going, huh?

 

Anyone seen the latest Marauder Shields comic (yeah, that's still going too)? Continues Miranda's thread.

http://koobismo.devi...digal-510400236

 

I like that this shifts the 'father/legacy' angle from Henry Lawson to TIM, a much better, subtler approach that serves the character far better.

[Lawrence0294]

Hey, so this is still going, huh?

 

Anyone seen the latest Marauder Shields comic (yeah, that's still going too)? Continues Miranda's thread.

http://koobismo.devi...digal-510400236

 

I like that this shifts the 'father/legacy' angle from Henry Lawson to TIM, a much better, subtler approach that serves the character far better.

I know right ? (though I'm very much happy it is...more or less)

I've indeed read the latest Marauder, though to be honest I've been heavily confused by the plot line for a while so I don't pay much attention. But seeing anything Miranda related always has my interest and like you mentioned, it harkens back to the Miranda - Illusive man relationship, a vastly more interesting relationship that, without surprise, was completely put aside in ME3.

[o Ventus]

Holy crap, this thread is still alive.

 

 

Shepard would let Miranda suck his... Blood... Any day.

[Lawrence0294]

Not sure if people have seen this yet (probably) but the ending mod provided by Mr. Fob now includes Miranda.

 

Although I personally prefer not to use it, I still find the effort quite remarkable.

 

[Mister J]

I've seen the other one were you still got the star child and the three choices, but you got Shepard surviving and embracing Love Interest after putting Andersons name on the wall, and I was surprised at how much I liked it. This one is rather rough around the edges, but I still kinda like it. I never realised how redundant the star child was as a plot element until now, when he doesn't show up.

[o Ventus]

Speaking of MEHEM, v0.5 is up on ModDB.

[God]

Not sure if people have seen this yet (probably) but the ending mod provided by Mr. Fob now includes Miranda.

 

Although I personally prefer not to use it, I still find the effort quite remarkable.

 

 

Indeed. 

 

While I disagree vehemently with the purpose behind it, I do have to admire the technical work put into it.

[wright1978]

Not sure if people have seen this yet (probably) but the ending mod provided by Mr. Fob now includes Miranda.

 

Although I personally prefer not to use it, I still find the effort quite remarkable.

 

 

Looks very cool, the earlier version of MEHEM saved the trilogy for me. Haven't played ME3 in ages but have been in very slow process of replaying from ME1, so this gives me an extra excuse to speed my progress through the series.

[CrutchCricket]

Ultimately not my cup of tea, but I do commend them for the idea and technical skill and hope they keep at it.

 

Maybe one day they'll even figure out how to take out Shepard's scars.

[CrutchCricket]

Alright, I've been growing a bit nostalgic of this place of late. So even though there isn't really anything new to talk about anyone feel like rehashing some old discussions?

 

Miranda's characterization in ME2 and her... lack of it in ME3?

The Suicide Mission?

Sanctuary?

Other Lawsons?

Comparisons to other similar characters in fiction?

etc?

[God]

Why not.

 

Granted, post-Citadel, Miranda actual feels as though she has the best Male Shepard romance now, and definitely the best human romance in ME3.

 

I just didn't like how they changed the character in ME3 compared to her more icy and practical self in ME2. ME2 showed that she has the capacity to care and be warm to someone. ME3 didn't need to go overboard with it.

[Lawrence0294]

Sure why not.

 

Ah... I'm still baffled at so many things done poorly by the writers. They very idea of rehashing Miranda's loyalty mission with her having to chase after her sister as her primary arc in the game feels so amateurish.

And this is not related to the writers (or maybe it is?) but having her wear the exact same outfit from ME2 when she is on the run from Cerby...arg it just feels so inconsistent. Hell if they had put on her the DLC armor it would've been miles better. I understand they wanted to remain with the "iconic" uniforms,  i just find that to be a very poor validation. Changing outfits can also be great as a visual tool to show time and situations have changed and evolved...yes I realize I'm rambling on outfits =p

 

Though on a more positive note, I still look at those Citadel scenes and my heart still sinks. They really made the romance arc feel complete and satisfying.

[Mister J]

^^^ If you wanna talk about the suicide mission & Miranda: one of the reasons why I consider this the finest level in gaming history is that once you understand the machinations behind it, you can very easily remove those characters you don't like and give the ones you do like the hero roles. So in my games the final confrontation against the Reaper is usually with Miranda and one that I want to kill. The latter is not loyal so they die: then it's Miranda that pulls Shepard in when he's hanging from the Normandy airlock.

And before that Miranda is of course the designated person to lead the second platoon, another hero role

 

Another reason why I love this level is the phenomenal soundtrack. After all: music and sound are 60% of your film/game.

 

There was a character in a film that kinda reminded me of Miranda: in the film Prometheus. I forgot her name but she was played by Charlize Theron. Only because of the cold demeanor though: she's as dumb as a doorknob like every person in that silly movie...

[CrutchCricket]

Here's the thing. I actually do have a fondness for "x is so important to me that if you mess with x, I drop everything and end you" scenario/tropes. It's something I actually attribute to my Shepard regarding Miranda.

 

The problem is even that doesn't shine through because there is never any "dropping" of anything. Miranda is never once seen or described as doing anything other than looking for Oriana. And even that is never shown as impressive. As I recall there's some mention of Cerberus assasins but we don't see or even get told much of anything about there. "There were assasins and now there aren't" is the extent of our information on them.

 

So what's really boggling my mind isn't even how the writers are that stupid that they manage to drain all plot relevance from the character most central to the subplot they can't stop shoving in our faces. Once you factor in the endings, that level of incompetence actually becomes plausible. No, what really gets me is that they can't even be superficial and flashy about it. I'm willing to bet quite a few of us wouldn't even have noticed a lot of the flaws and omissions on the first playthrough(s) if instead of just offhandedly mentioning "assassins" and "tracking down leads" we were instead shown what that means. Even in three second cut flashbacks or stock animations disguised with clever angles and quick edits. Or hell, drop the animations and go audio only. A slow zoom on a locked door with sounds of battle, screaming etc then silence. Door opens, Miranda walks out and behind her you see the (bloodless) carnage. Even that's too much? How about just an audio log of Miranda channeling Liam Neeson, patron saint of kidnap victim recovery?

 

Don't get me wrong. Miranda is at the heart of the Cerberus subplot and any omission of that in any form is inexcusible. And yet, you could have amputated her from the plot and kept her character intact. Because we can talk about human advancement and worthy idealistic ambition but at the heart of it all, Miranda isn't always very nice. We have a layered woman here who can conceivably break down into the following: will care deeply about something/someone and will be fiercely loyal to that but the methods she employs to advance/protect that will be ruthless, effective and nothing you'd ever want to be on the wrong end of. And as much of a shame as it would be to narrow that down to just Oriana, if both sides came through, it'd at least still be complete. As it is though... who Stepford'd her and why?

 

As for similar characters in other fiction, one I've encountered recently was Paige from Tron: Uprising. I highly recommend the show if you haven't seen it, it's definitely not kiddie. It's got great animation and a fantastic lineup of voice talent (including Lance Henriksen as the Big Bad). Anyway Paige is an officer in CLU's army and though the circumstances in which she joined are less than ideal she's there because she truly believes CLU's order is the best thing for the Grid. She's tough, she's efficient, she's more than a match for Beck, the protagonist and even though she's a "bad guy" she doesn't callously waste the lives of her troops or civilians and is visibly distressed when others do so. She's also fiercely loyal to Tessler (Henriksen's character) in a relationship that mirrors elements from TIM/Miranda. Fantastic writing on that show, shame Disney ruins things.

[o Ventus]

 

Granted, post-Citadel, Miranda actual feels as though she has the best Male Shepard romance now, and definitely the best human romance in ME3.

 

Definitely.

[o Ventus]

Here's the thing. I actually do have a fondness for "x is so important to me that if you mess with x, I drop everything and end you" scenario/tropes. It's something I actually attribute to my Shepard regarding Miranda.

 

I'm in a similar boat, though it's like this for all of Shepard's crew and friends. Shepard is +1 to it when it comes to Miranda though, for obvious reasons.

 

 

 

The problem is even that doesn't shine through because there is never any "dropping" of anything. Miranda is never once seen or described as doing anything other than looking for Oriana. And even that is never shown as impressive. As I recall there's some mention of Cerberus assasins but we don't see or even get told much of anything about there. "There were assasins and now there aren't" is the extent of our information on them.

 

This is really the crux of the problem, is that nothing is seen to show or even indicate that she is in any danger. Add in the lack of player agency in addressing her issue, and it makes both Shepard and Miranda look thoughtless and stupid.

 

"I'm being chased by Cerberus assassins and I need to lay low."

 

It's like Miranda forgot that the Normandy is the most technologically advanced starship in the known galaxy and is commanded by the single most dangerous and efficient person in history, and crewed by the most capable and loyal people a Captain could ask for (plus the Shadow Broker). Not only will no assassins get to you on the Normandy, but with EDI and Liara's help, finding Oriana is practically a non-issue.

 

 

 

 

Don't get me wrong. Miranda is at the heart of the Cerberus subplot and any omission of that in any form is inexcusible. And yet, you could have amputated her from the plot and kept her character intact. Because we can talk about human advancement and worthy idealistic ambition but at the heart of it all, Miranda isn't always very nice. We have a layered woman here who can conceivably break down into the following: will care deeply about something/someone and will be fiercely loyal to that but the methods she employs to advance/protect that will be ruthless, effective and nothing you'd ever want to be on the wrong end of. And as much of a shame as it would be to narrow that down to just Oriana, if both sides came through, it'd at least still be complete. As it is though... who Stepford'd her and why?

 

I would say a combination of Walters and Watamaniuk, given that Walters was the lead writer and that Watamaniuk wrote Miranda. The rest of this I agree with.

 

 

 

As for similar characters in other fiction, one I've encountered recently was Paige from Tron: Uprising. I highly recommend the show if you haven't seen it, it's definitely not kiddie. It's got great animation and a fantastic lineup of voice talent (including Lance Henriksen as the Big Bad). Anyway Paige is an officer in CLU's army and though the circumstances in which she joined are less than ideal she's there because she truly believes CLU's order is the best thing for the Grid. She's tough, she's efficient, she's more than a match for Beck, the protagonist and even though she's a "bad guy" she doesn't callously waste the lives of her troops or civilians and is visibly distressed when others do so. She's also fiercely loyal to Tessler (Henriksen's character) in a relationship that mirrors elements from TIM/Miranda. Fantastic writing on that show, shame Disney ruins things.

 

Black Widow from Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes is similar. In the show, she's a "bad guy" working for HYDRA (though it's implied she's working with them as a double agent, but that subplot was never finished since the show was cancelled), is ruthlessly efficient, and goes to lengths to keep people she cares about out of harm's way (she stopped Baron von Strucker, her "boss" in HYDRA, from killing Hawkeye by knocking him out).

 

Unfortunately, Marvel and Disney needed to promote the Cinematic Universe, so EMH got scrapped in favor for Avengers Assemble, which is a terrible show. Marvel and Disney, for whatever reason, keep cancelling their good shows (EMH is probably the best show they've put out so far) in favor of cheap movie tie-ins.

 

Also, incidentally, Lance Henriksen is in EMH. He plays the Grim Reaper, a HYDRA enforcer with a scythe in place of his left hand.

[ripslip]

This thread brings back memories...haven't popped in here in years. Hello my bbs