82210 réponses à ce sujet

[Glory_Man]

Love the removal of the visor, exept it looks like one of her eyebrows is massive.. 7 months to go, we are all itching for new info.. Armor wars is as good a topic to discuss as anything else

[jtav]

Something that just popped into my head. Paragon choices with Miranda, when not regarding Cerberus, tend to emphasize what she has in common with unaltered humanity. "Even with all your upgrades, you're human just like the rest of us." Renegade choices tend to play up what makes her exceptional. "I'm the one who put you back together." Shepard puts her on the defensive, and she's Lazarus director once more.

Thoughts?

[The Uncanny]

Interesting. I hadn't thought of it like that but you're quite right. I guess it comes back to the liberal thing of 'We're all in this together' is 'good' whilst 'I'm going to be inherently superior!' is seen as fascistic and 'bad'. Which is, of course, a teeth-grinding over simplification. But also the kind of pseudo Star Wars morality that populist SF invariably falls back on.

[KamikazeShepard]

I don't see why so many people have a problem with the catsuit. It's okay. But when you really think about it, almost everyone had dumb outfits in ME2. Samara/Morinth wear catsuits. Garrus Fights in broken armor. Jack fights half naked. Thane fights in a tight jacket. Kasumi is wearing a pretty tight outfit too. Jacob seems to be fighting in a Cerberus uniform instead of armor. Zaeed, Grunt and Legion are pretty much the only people who have realistic armor.

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
Something that just popped into my head. Paragon choices with Miranda, when not regarding Cerberus, tend to emphasize what she has in common with unaltered humanity. "Even with all your upgrades, you're human just like the rest of us." Renegade choices tend to play up what makes her exceptional. "I'm the one who put you back together." Shepard puts her on the defensive, and she's Lazarus director once more.

Thoughts?

Exactly. That's one of the reasons why I like the Renegade choices better.

[Caihn]

Ieldra2 wrote...

@Yannkee:
Can't see I'm doing anything you aren't doing. You say the armor is not credible, I say that claim is preposterous and the catsuit is less credible. I can understand why you dislike the armor, but I don't have to agree with you. Also posting that smily in response isn't exactly subtle as well.

When I express my opinion, I don't claim to know things better than everyone else. And I force nobody to agree with me.
Can't say the same thing about you.
When you will begin to use words like "I think that" or "In my opinion" and stop denigrate every opinions you don't like in this thread, maybe I will start to respond to you like I do with the respectful members of this thread.

[Ieldra]

The Uncanny wrote...
Interesting. I hadn't thought of it like that but you're quite right. I guess it comes back to the liberal thing of 'We're all in this together' is 'good' whilst 'I'm going to be inherently superior!' is seen as fascistic and 'bad'. Which is, of course, a teeth-grinding over simplification. But also the kind of pseudo Star Wars morality that populist SF invariably falls back on.

That's one aspect. Another is that the Paragon path always appears to support the status quo (status-quo bias is one of common intuitions driving conventional morality) while the Renegade path embraces radical change. Yet another reason to play Renegade

@Yannkee:
If I had the power to force you to agree with me, believe me, I would've used it once in the history of the Miranda threads, and that wouldn't have been a good thing. But I don't need to disqualify my statements by giving equal weight to differing opinions in advance, especially if I don't think they have equal weight. If that bothers you, grow a thicker skin. There's no accounting for taste, but when you start  making claims about what is credible and what is not it's not a matter of taste any more.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 11 août 2011 - 02:24 .

[Caihn]

Melrache wrote...

I didn't like the ass shots, but I still think the two other suits were better than the armor. It took awhile to get used to them, due to the oversexuality, but I can't stand the armor. So I choose the lesser of two evils.

This is one.. Sure the ass is still... Eh..





[img]http://www.google.fi/url?source=imglanding&ct=img&q=http://www.deviantart.com/download/68101657/Female_Ghost_Suit_and_Armor_by_SgtHK.jpg&sa=X&ei=-tJDTrjvCIKZOtjMkcYJ&ved=0CAQQ8wc&usg=AFQjCNFtZ0xOt4Or1G59zOOzRAkwcBw68Q[/img]

I'd prefer something like these.

I like the this armor, but I still think it's a little bit too bulky on the foot and arms parts for Miranda.

[jtav]

Whatever I think of how Miranda got her gifts, the gifts themselves are good. They should be celebrated. Miranda being able to do great things is something to be celebrated. I love her flaws too, but I'd hate for her to become "normal."

[The Uncanny]

Ieldra2 wrote...

The Uncanny wrote...
Interesting. I hadn't thought of it like that but you're quite right. I guess it comes back to the liberal thing of 'We're all in this together' is 'good' whilst 'I'm going to be inherently superior!' is seen as fascistic and 'bad'. Which is, of course, a teeth-grinding over simplification. But also the kind of pseudo Star Wars morality that populist SF invariably falls back on.

That's one aspect. Another is that the Paragon path always appears to support the status quo (status-quo bias is one of common intuitions driving conventional morality) while the Renegade path embraces radical change. Yet another reason to play Renegade

Yes. Well, the two do tend to dovetail.

[The Uncanny]

jtav wrote...

Whatever I think of how Miranda got her gifts, the gifts themselves are good. They should be celebrated. Miranda being able to do great things is something to be celebrated. I love her flaws too, but I'd hate for her to become "normal."

This.

[jtav]

Maybe that will be the big P/R choice for Miranda in ME3. Paragon Miranda is encouraged to become more integrated with the majority. She no longer feels the need to push herself to justify herself. Renegade Miranda realizes her gifts are great and pushes herself harder because she can.

[Caihn]

Ieldra2 wrote...

@Yannkee:
 There's no accounting for taste, but when you start  making claims about what is credible and what is not it's not a matter of taste any more.

No, it's a matter of opinion.
I don't agree with your opinion, and I already explained why I find the the AAP2 armor less credible.

Modifié par Yannkee, 11 août 2011 - 02:47 .

[Melra]

Yannkee wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

@Yannkee:
 There's no accounting for taste, but when you start  making claims about what is credible and what is not it's not a matter of taste any more.

No, it's a matter of opinion.
I don't agree with your opinion, and I already explained why I find the the AAP2 armor less credible.

Don't worry he can never be right about dis. Only mai opinion matters anyhow.

[MisterJB]

Ieldra2 wrote...
 In ME3, no one is too good for any faction that fights the Reapers.

You can use a faction's resources and not actually join them. Shepard proved that much in ME2.

Also, I must defend Cerberus here - their requirements and missions did a lot to hone Miranda's abilities, and they were indeed good enough for her for almost 20 years.

Wasn't talking about her abilities. Cerberus is mostly composed by extremists, xenophobes and just plain old mad scientists. And she shouldn't be a subordinate to anyone, anyhow.

Ieldra2 wrote...
That's one aspect. Another is that the Paragon path always appears to support the status quo (status-quo bias is one of common intuitions driving conventional morality) while the Renegade path embraces radical change. Yet another reason to play Renegade

 Rachni Queen, Genophage cure.

[Caihn]

MisterJB wrote...

You can use a faction's resources and not actually join them. Shepard proved that much in ME2.

My favorite scenario is Miranda who joins a freelance Shepard.
Unfortunately, I don't think it will happen.

Now I just hope she will be working for the Alliance (with or without the possibility of joining them, I don't care). So she can be at Shepard side as soon as possible.

[MisterJB]

jtav wrote...

Maybe that will be the big P/R choice for Miranda in ME3. Paragon Miranda is encouraged to become more integrated with the majority. She no longer feels the need to push herself to justify herself. Renegade Miranda realizes her gifts are great and pushes herself harder because she can.

The two are not mutually exclusive. Miranda no longer feels the need to push herself to justify herself. Instead, she does it because she can and wants to.

Modifié par MisterJB, 11 août 2011 - 03:33 .

[S.A.K]

I'll Just drop this off here.

[DCYNIGR8]

Yannkee wrote...

My favorite scenario is Miranda who joins a freelance Shepard.
Unfortunately, I don't think it will happen.

I would like a Renegade option with Shepard telling the Alliance/Council/Cerberus where to go and declaring that he will not take orders from anyone, take the Normandy as his ship, as well as any recourses they can offer, and set off to stop the Reapers once and for all. Then Shep can go off on his/her own terms and take whoever he/she wants along.

In agreement with you though, this will not happen.

Modifié par DCYNIGR8, 11 août 2011 - 03:37 .

[Ieldra]

DCYNIGR8 wrote...

Yannkee wrote...

My favorite scenario is Miranda who joins a freelance Shepard.
Unfortunately, I don't think it will happen.

I would like a Renegade option with Shepard telling the Alliance/Council/Cerberus where to go and declaring that he will not take orders from anyone, take the Normandy as his ship, as well as any recourses they can offer, and set off to stop the Reapers once and for all. Then Shep can go off on his/her own terms and take whoever he/she wants along.

In agreement with you though, this will not happen.

I am in agreement with you both (in spite of temptation to disagree with Yannkee just because ) with a slightly different slant. I'd prefer that Miranda is a free agent without any faction allegiance who works with whoever appears best for the current task. That includes Shepard. I also want Shepard to be a free agent of that kind.

Sadly, I agree this probably won't happen.

[Ieldra]

MisterJB wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
Also, I must defend Cerberus here - their requirements and missions did a lot to hone Miranda's abilities, and they were indeed good enough for her for almost 20 years.

Wasn't talking about her abilities. Cerberus is mostly composed by extremists, xenophobes and just plain old mad scientists.

I'm despairing of the moral angle always dominating a discussion. I tend to be more results-orienten, even more so given the prevailing bias on these forums

And she shouldn't be a subordinate to anyone, anyhow.

Here I agree.

Ieldra2 wrote...
That's one aspect. Another is that the Paragon path always appears to support the status quo (status-quo bias is one of common intuitions driving conventional morality) while the Renegade path embraces radical change. Yet another reason to play Renegade

 Rachni Queen, Genophage cure.

I didn't say this was the only aspect influencing the Paragon path. I should rework the write-up I made of the different aspects influenced the Paragon/Renegade system. This is covered by the intuition "Do no harm". There are others.

[raziel1980]

Ieldra2 wrote...

DCYNIGR8 wrote...

Yannkee wrote...

My favorite scenario is Miranda who joins a freelance Shepard.
Unfortunately, I don't think it will happen.

I would like a Renegade option with Shepard telling the Alliance/Council/Cerberus where to go and declaring that he will not take orders from anyone, take the Normandy as his ship, as well as any recourses they can offer, and set off to stop the Reapers once and for all. Then Shep can go off on his/her own terms and take whoever he/she wants along.

In agreement with you though, this will not happen.

I am in agreement with you both (in spite of temptation to disagree with Yannkee just because ) with a slightly different slant. I'd prefer that Miranda is a free agent without any faction allegiance who works with whoever appears best for the current task. That includes Shepard. I also want Shepard to be a free agent of that kind.

Sadly, I agree this probably won't happen.

I agree as well...and would LOVE for that renegade option to be available...although since I'm a renegon player that is to be expected...

edit: will soon be expierencing the pc version of ME 1 for the first time in a couple of days( ordered the game on amazon).:happy:

[Filuto]

I would like if shep could work with cerberus as a contractor(something like in me2) freelancer shep sounds intresting but although shepar kick a*s he still need funding for ship,gadgets,weapons etc.

[Ieldra]

Yannkee wrote...
No, it's a matter of opinion.
I don't agree with your opinion, and I already explained why I find the the AAP2 armor less credible.

Well, whatever you think about the armor as such, I disgree with you but I can see where you're coming from. It's where you claim that the catsuit is credible that the argument crosses the line into the preposterous. Really, that and "credible" don't deserve to be mentioned in the same library. Even in-game characters comment on it. Say you like the fanservice and don't care about the plausibility problems and I can do nothing more than disagree and leave the matter alone. But don't try to sell me bullsh*t. At least the others here who prefer the catsuit were honest about that. You may have noticed that I haven't tried to argue against them.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 11 août 2011 - 04:06 .

[Vertigo_1]

Could we please STOP with this armor war?
Or at least respect others opinions on their favorite?

I wouldn't mind seeing a compromise suit for her, lightly armored but still showing off her...well...um...curves