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[Caihn]

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

I understand that she didn't do this FOR Shepard, that's just how it is portrayed to me if you romance her. My conclusions are from the story I developed, and though it might seem OOC, it is understandable that seeing your race being broken down into nothing more than grey biological waste to be fed into the Reaper is something you want nothing to do with. Having her act as such had her speaking from her own mind, and not the mind that believes everything Cerberus does, is the right thing.

And thank you.

There are also many fans who don't find her decision to support the CB destruction OOC. Don't worry.

[jtav]

Not this again. I think it was horribly OOC/rushed and I'll kill her without a thought if that's ME3 Miranda.

[ViSeiRa]

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

ViSeirA wrote...

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

I understand that she didn't do this FOR Shepard, that's just how it is portrayed to me if you romance her. My conclusions are from the story I developed, and though it might seem OOC, it is understandable that seeing your race being broken down into nothing more than grey biological waste to be fed into the Reaper is something you want nothing to do with. Having her act as such had her speaking from her own mind, and not the mind that believes everything Cerberus does, is the right thing.

Miranda is pragmatic, she should have eventually reached the same conclusion as Mordin and Legion, the base has no moral value, it's just technology and any tech can be repurposed and used for the better, compare the Miranda who resigned from Cerberus with the one who killed Wilson, the one who admitted experminting on Rachni despite knowning they're a sentient race.

That's not one who would choke on such desicion and say "using anything from this base sound like a betrayal".

Hmm, you make a very valid point. I wonder if the game producers will make any attempts to fill that hole for those who have thought through the situation so thoroughly.

Eventually Miranda leaving Cerberus will be canon and I suspect they'll create an event that explains why she left, especially and maybe exclusively in playthroughs where she didn't, hunting Shepard may very well be one of the reasons but I hope it won't be the only one.

[LexieTheT-Rexy]

Though, ViSeirA, I kind of see that OOC aspect as a fault in human nature. She is very practical, but no one can remain practical in every situation they enter. Is it not human nature to care more for your own kind, than any other? If there was a situation where there was a human in danger, and a rat in danger (though they serve their own unique purpose in the ecosystem) you would save the human without a second thought. If the human race were introduced to multiple different species living in intergalactic systems, we would be more prone to protect our own people, because we would see the others as threats (even if they weren't). Like Ashley's point of view, she claims it isn't racism, but more or less being careful. I'm sure if it were a turian or quarian reaper, than Miranda would have been gun-ho for using the tech for better purposes, but physically seeing her people melted down had to jolt her nerves and send her into a defensive outlook on the overall situation.

Though, I might be reading into this a little too much. XD

[Caihn]

jtav wrote...

Not this again. I think it was horribly OOC/rushed and I'll kill her without a thought if that's ME3 Miranda.

I don't care, kill her if you want.
It's part of her character, and I like her also for this.

[LexieTheT-Rexy]

I do agree it was rushed though. I'm hoping with how far back they pushed the game they'll have more time to review all of the character development, and not just work on getting all the bug out.

[ViSeiRa]

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

Though, ViSeirA, I kind of see that OOC aspect as a fault in human nature. She is very practical, but no one can remain practical in every situation they enter. Is it not human nature to care more for your own kind, than any other? If there was a situation where there was a human in danger, and a rat in danger (though they serve their own unique purpose in the ecosystem) you would save the human without a second thought. If the human race were introduced to multiple different species living in intergalactic systems, we would be more prone to protect our own people, because we would see the others as threats (even if they weren't). Like Ashley's point of view, she claims it isn't racism, but more or less being careful. I'm sure if it were a turian or quarian reaper, than Miranda would have been gun-ho for using the tech for better purposes, but physically seeing her people melted down had to jolt her nerves and send her into a defensive outlook on the overall situation.

Though, I might be reading into this a little too much. XD

That is one way to look at it, and it may be true, even Miranda can lose her nerves at some point, but what happens when we go back to the Normandy? we see her asserting her opinion about the destruction of the base even though she should have the time to think it through... if she hasn't thought of it yet then I hope we see that reflected upon in ME3, as in she goes back to working for Cerberus, only much lower in rank and she leaves for another reason entirely, I can live with that. 

[Caihn]

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

I do agree it was rushed though. I'm hoping with how far back they pushed the game they'll have more time to review all of the character development, and not just work on getting all the bug out.

I don't think it was rushed. She is very professional, and she doesn't have to express her doubts in front of Shepard before that.
The character develoment is subtile, but it is there.
That's why she only do this if you pick her for the final mission. You can have her resignation scene only because she's talking with the Illusive Man, it's not Shepard's concern.

And it's also why I think she will resign even if you don't pick her for the final mission. Maybe there will be an explaination at the begining of ME3, but personally I don't need one.

Modifié par Yannkee, 18 août 2011 - 06:17 .

[Ieldra]

Hi everyone. Back from my first GamesCom day.

Played the demo twice, once without any time pressure (!), met Chris Priestley and asked him about Miranda. He said he didn't know what they were prepared to reveal at the Q&A. He also said that Casey Hudson's tweets often contain subtle hints if you read between the lines. Subsequently, I thought about how put our main concern into one short question, and came up with "Will Miranda be a main character in ME3" (like CH said about Liara, the VS, Garrus, Tali and Vega). Unfortunately, I was too late with that to actually ask him this question.

Totally missed the stage show, simply because I didn't know there was to be one today - there was absolutely no advertisement of the event. When it started, I was on my way out after eight hours of GamesCom and glad to be.

Attended the DA2 panel and a presentation of another EA RPG, "Reckoning". Waited an hour to play Skyrim but gave up after I noticed I would have to wait another two.

I'll probably skip tomorrow - this day was long enough - and go back on Saturday for the ME2 panel. I think I may have a chance to get in, unless all the seats get occupied by people with community passes.

As for the demo - it was the Sur'kesh demo with more character options added and the fight with the Atlas mech at the end complete. I liked the different ways to evolve powers they implemented, it looked like they could make a difference, though I couldn't really say because the demo was so easy such things didn't matter. Played as an Engineer. Incinerate and Combat Drone are still mainstay powers, the new turret appears very useful but I can't say for certain because the details of what damaged who were hard to see.
Very noticeable the more 3D design of the level, where you can shoot at enemies a level above and below, climb up and down ladders and such. Very noticeable too that many other games look quite a bit better than ME3. The Atlas mech fight was sort of super-easy, and I didn't manage to figure out how to remove the pilot. Perhaps they disabled that feature.
Disappointing: not a single dialogue choice in the demo. A few words are spoken here and there, but it was nothing but missions progress and comments you couldn't influence.

So, I don't know if there's to be another Twitter Q&A on Saturday parallel to the panel, but if there is, I won't be able to tweet because I'm either in the room or on my way to something else. Perhaps some of you could ask "Will Miranda be a main character".


Edit:
And Miranda's line at the Collector base it out of character. No question about that. A woman like Miranda is trained to act cool under pressure. She wouldn't support destroying the base out of sentimentality. If she gets more like this she won't be the MIranda I came to love anymore.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 18 août 2011 - 06:21 .

[LexieTheT-Rexy]

Yannkee wrote...

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

I do agree it was rushed though. I'm hoping with how far back they pushed the game they'll have more time to review all of the character development, and not just work on getting all the bug out.

I don't think it was rushed. She is very professional, and she doesn't have to express her doubts in front of Shepard before that.
The character develoment is subtile, but it is there.
That's why she only do this if you pick her for the final mission. You can have her resignation scene only because she's talking with the Illusive Man, it's not Shepard's concern.

And it's also why I think she will resigned even if you don't pick her for the final mission. Maybe there will be an explaination at the begining of ME3, but personally I don't need one.

Once more, a very good point.

[Ieldra]

I think Miranda's line at the CB was added to make her more palatable for Paragon players, disregarding the personality she had shown throughout the game.

[Melra]

I still think she's in character when it comes to CB and fortunately my opinion is still the only right one, there's only many variations of my right opinion and then there's the totally wrong opinions. 

[Caihn]

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

Yannkee wrote...

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

I do agree it was rushed though. I'm hoping with how far back they pushed the game they'll have more time to review all of the character development, and not just work on getting all the bug out.

I don't think it was rushed. She is very professional, and she doesn't have to express her doubts in front of Shepard before that.
The character develoment is subtile, but it is there.
That's why she only do this if you pick her for the final mission. You can have her resignation scene only because she's talking with the Illusive Man, it's not Shepard's concern.

And it's also why I think she will resigned even if you don't pick her for the final mission. Maybe there will be an explaination at the begining of ME3, but personally I don't need one.

Once more, a very good point.

I like Miranda because she's a complex character. I like her character development, and the different aspects of her personality we can see all along the game.
I hope to see all these aspects again in ME3.

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Ieldra2 wrote...

I think Miranda's line at the CB was added to make her more palatable for Paragon players, disregarding the personality she had shown throughout the game.

Oh come on, not this again. When will you realize that others have different opinions. There is NO right or wrong. Just what you want to do for the SM.

No need to bring up old topics anyway.

[Caihn]

I watched the DA2 and ME3 Q&A ... my reaction :

[Ieldra]

If you're talking about the CB again, Yannkee, there is no character development foreshadowing that flip-flop. That's exactly the issue here. The problem is not Cerberus and Miranda's attitude to them, but a sudden switch from the pragmatic to the sentimental on a mission that could be crucial to the galaxy's survival. I would have less of an issue with it had she said something like "I don't trust the Illusive Man any more to use it right".

@101:
I didn't bring up the topic, but when it comes up I won't stay silent about it.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 18 août 2011 - 06:34 .

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Yannkee wrote...

I watched the DA2 and ME3 Q&A ... my reaction :

I know. I figured there would be nothing for Miri.

And no good results from Gamescom so far correct?

[ViSeiRa]

I reckon it was full of questions like "Will we be playing Shepard again?" "Are you gonna show Tali's face?" and the like, nothing good ever comes out of QA sessions.

[enayasoul]

More Miranda<3 coming up!

Modifié par enayasoul, 18 août 2011 - 06:34 .

[Caihn]

Ieldra2 wrote...

If you're talking about the CB again, Yannkee, there is no character development foreshadowing that flip-flop. That's exactly the issue here. The problem is not Cerberus and Miranda's attitude to them, but a sudden switch from the pragmatic to the sentimental. I would have less of an issue with it had she say something like "I don't trust the Illusive Man any more to use it right".

For you maybe, not for me.

And no I don't need that she says something like that to understand why she acted like she did.

[Ieldra]

enayasoul wrote...


More Miranda<3 coming up!

[flemm]

I like Miranda because she's a complex character. I like her character development, and the different aspects of her personality we can see all along the game.
I hope to see all these aspects again in ME3.

Agreed. Not to beleaguer a point that clearly has already been discussed ad nauseum here, but I think either choice is potentially appropriate for Miranda, which speaks to the strength of the character.

Clearly, destroying the base is the Paragon path, and keeping it is Renagade, so the decision flows less smoothly if you suddenly do a face turn on the last mission, but otherwise it works either way. And, I would imagine, both versions of the story will play out in ME2.

An important point is that this choice sets Miranda up as an ally to Shepard re: Cerberus for ME3 no matter what the player chooses.

Modifié par flemm, 18 août 2011 - 06:39 .

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Miri always has a beautiful smile, just like Yvonne.

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 18 août 2011 - 06:37 .

[Melra]

ViSeirA wrote...

I reckon it was full of questions like "Will we be playing Shepard again?" "Are you gonna show Tali's face?" and the like, nothing good ever comes out of QA sessions.

''Can I marry Tali?'' The guy who posted this question had sent several rage messages to them, so they pitied the guy and answered his question. It just seems, there's quite a few Talimancer like that. Oh well... It'll be asked again in the next QA, I am sure of it.

I just wish more useful questions got through, though not that any of that gameplay stuff matters to me, before that one thing is totally cleared up.

[Caihn]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

Yannkee wrote...

I watched the DA2 and ME3 Q&A ... my reaction :

I know. I figured there would be nothing for Miri.

And no good results from Gamescom so far correct?

Many stupid questions.

And contradictions in some answers.

Modifié par Yannkee, 18 août 2011 - 06:42 .