82210 réponses à ce sujet

[CuseGirl]

Flashflame58 wrote...

Spanky Magoo wrote...

well if they made her unnatractive then what was the point of her origin of being created with desirable traits ? Im curious.

My deal is that they obviously made her to sell the game...sex appeal is a very powerful marketing tactic. Think about it. Would new gamers have bought the game if Jack or maybe Grunt were there instead of Miranda?

And considering Yvonne Strahovski doesn't look like Miranda (from the neck down), it's obvious it was deliberate....but it still adds to her story, all of her physical traits are tools to disarm those enemies she's likely to meet. She's also not like Ashley 1.0, she's not in a quarian suit, she's not trying to meld with you, and she's not a fugitive pirate adept. She's hot but just mean enuff that you can't get to her without really working for it.

[CuseGirl]

typoo855 wrote...

Nice pic i think that every other suit besides that one looks s l uty and/or retarded especially the golf ball ass one.

she never wears the white suit on my ship.....it's like the Epcot Center exploded and she caught the brunt of the debris

[LexieTheT-Rexy]

CuseGirl wrote...

Flashflame58 wrote...

Spanky Magoo wrote...

well if they made her unnatractive then what was the point of her origin of being created with desirable traits ? Im curious.

My deal is that they obviously made her to sell the game...sex appeal is a very powerful marketing tactic. Think about it. Would new gamers have bought the game if Jack or maybe Grunt were there instead of Miranda?

And considering Yvonne Strahovski doesn't look like Miranda (from the neck down), it's obvious it was deliberate....but it still adds to her story, all of her physical traits are tools to disarm those enemies she's likely to meet. She's also not like Ashley 1.0, she's not in a quarian suit, she's not trying to meld with you, and she's not a fugitive pirate adept. She's hot but just mean enuff that you can't get to her without really working for it.

Yes, her sex appeal is a large part of her character, and actually gives way to the vulnerability she experiences because of her damaged self-esteem...she is also the Cerberus loyalist, and if you were a hardcore ME1 Alliance fan person, you probably wouldn't be all that thrilled to work for Cerberus if you found out such information before the game released.

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Miri is Beautiful, Intelligent, Strong, and a lot more:wub:!

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 31 août 2011 - 02:48 .

[LexieTheT-Rexy]

I have said before, and I will say again, she is the complete package of perfection in a woman, and I think that it's her imperfections, more than her obvious advantages that make her perfect.

[nitefyre410]

You know I would write a very long rant about it breaks my brain this whole notion of Beauty =/= intelligent and why a Strong Female warrior/spy/fighter for some reason can't have some kind of the sex appeal or GOD forbid a desire to go after a man, woman or alien that she finds attractive but I'll leave that alone.

[LexieTheT-Rexy]

^^ This.

It does seem that any woman above an average beauty has some sort of 'secret agenda' or she's nothing but a stone cold beyotch. Lest it be known that a gorgeous woman can be nothing but trouble. XD

[ISpeakTheTruth]

It does seem that if a woman is shown to be beautiful, smart, strong, and resourceful that most people believe that one or more of those things can't go together.

[cbutz]

Hmm, interesting concept about the importing of a "Paragon" or "Renegade" Miranda( or any other character) to ME 3 based on how you played the game. My question to you fine folks is how would that be determined? Do you think it is based on "Big Decisions" such as the CB, Niket, etc. or through dialogue such as doing the renegade kiss/no-promise or paragon admire/promise scenes?

[flemm]

cbutz wrote...

Hmm, interesting concept about the importing of a "Paragon" or "Renegade" Miranda( or any other character) to ME 3 based on how you played the game. My question to you fine folks is how would that be determined? Do you think it is based on "Big Decisions" such as the CB, Niket, etc. or through dialogue such as doing the renegade kiss/no-promise or paragon admire/promise scenes?

Well, I can't be sure, but my guess would be that the romance will either be flagged or it won't, that's it. The game can then ask you to set the tone once the subject is dealt with in ME3, so there's no real need to import any details.

The CB decision should affect how Shepard himself relates to Cerberus, so I would imagine that it would probably affect Miranda as well. Of all the ME2 choices, I think this is the one most likely to have an impact.

Modifié par flemm, 31 août 2011 - 04:31 .

[Caihn]

I don't want a "Paragon" or "Renegade" Miranda. I want Miranda.
I don't want to lose one of the aspect that made me like the character.


Now, a beautiful fanart made by Asakawa :




http://asakawa.devia...-room-255955660

[100k]

Hehe, nice.

[flemm]

Yannkee wrote...

I don't want a "Paragon" or "Renegade" Miranda. I want Miranda.
I don't want to lose one of the aspect that made me like the character.

Agreed. And I don't mean to suggest that it would be a different character. More like the same character who has had slightly different experiences or made different choices.

Nice fan art, by the way!

ISpeakTheTruth wrote...

It does seem that if a woman is shown to be beautiful, smart, strong, and resourceful that most people believe that one or more of those things can't go together.

You could add "comfortable and confident in her sexuality" to that list, which, let's face it, is one of those things that will always bother some people, especially when combined with the above.

Modifié par flemm, 31 août 2011 - 04:44 .

[Ieldra]

Dr. Doctor wrote...

jtav wrote...

Oh, I'd love a comment like that. I'm thinking it half the time, Do you kniw what it's like having a character you don't like or respect?

Miranda: So how exactly are you planning on defending yourself at the trial?

Shepard: The same way that we formed the squad for the Omega-4 mission.

Miranda: So the great and mighty Commander Shepard is going to bludgeon his way through diplomacy with his everyman logic?

Shepard: It's worked before.

Miranda: Considering that your idea of arbitration involves out-yelling the prosecution I think that I'd rather take my chances defending myself.

:lol:
Beautiful. And so true.

[Ieldra]

primoULTIMO wrote...

jtav wrote...

I'd like Miranda to continue to be somewhat, ah, difficult to like at times. I enjoyed her prickliness.

I partially disagree. Another aspect of the romance that I liked was that the paragon and renegade choices created different vibes and to a certain extent outcomes when it came to interacting with Miranda (something that I personally think was unique from all LI) . i.e. the paragon choices lightened her up considerably and renegade seemed to 'feed' that perfect/ ice queen persona she had. I think her character should be 'lighter' or 'prickly' depending on the way your Shepard interacts/interacted with her. After all that is what 'character progression' is all about; evolution through interacting with the environment/ characters.

Don't get me wrong. I think she still should have that 'mission comes first' attitude that made her seem really professional, but for Me3 it should either be toned down significantly or else that cold exterioir completely removed. If you think about it the only person she's ever truely become 'close' to was Sherpard, and to a small extent Jacob. The game does a good job in portraying her as being confused as to the changes in her personality (as highlight by Liara at the end of LOTSB and the 'hug' scene), ME 3 in my opinion should emphasise this change in her personality.

I see some attempt to create a slightly different Miranda based on the player's way through the romance in ME2. I like that, but it can't go too far, or the character becomes disintegrated or appears too much under Shepard's influence. I can see emphasizing the detached or the more open Miranda, the one who embraces what she is and the one who reluctantly accepts it, but in no way should any of her core personality traits be completely lost. We've seen the results of that at the Collector base.

[Ieldra]

CuseGirl wrote...

Flashflame58 wrote...

Spanky Magoo wrote...
Well if they made her unnatractive then what was the point of her origin of being created with desirable traits ? Im curious.

My deal is that they obviously made her to sell the game...sex appeal is a very powerful marketing tactic. Think about it. Would new gamers have bought the game if Jack or maybe Grunt were there instead of Miranda?

And considering Yvonne Strahovski doesn't look like Miranda (from the neck down), it's obvious it was deliberate....but it still adds to her story, all of her physical traits are tools to disarm those enemies she's likely to meet. She's also not like Ashley 1.0, she's not in a quarian suit, she's not trying to meld with you, and she's not a fugitive pirate adept. She's hot but just mean enuff that you can't get to her without really working for it.

Yes, being beautiful and exceptionally attractive fits her storyline very well. Why would anyone create a perfect daughter and not include that? But the fact that Miranda is attractive and her presentation in the game are different things. Miranda's attractiveness would work in social situations and would have profited her greatly in her career as an operative. However, as a weapon in open combat it's clearly misapplied, which is one reason why many people have a problem with her outfit.

As often mentioned before, it's partly the style, and partly a matter of dressing for the occasion. An outfit that needs the level of rationalization the catsuits seem to draw is misapplied.

As for marketing, I don't recall who said it, but there was anecdotal evidence that there may be a significant number of people who bought ME2 on an impulse because Miranda was in it. That's OK with me. I don't have a problem with Miranda being presented as very beautiful and attractive in order to draw new players into the games. I only have a problem with the pervasiveness of the style in which it was done in situations where it's clearly inappropriate. 

[Ieldra]

flemm wrote...

ISpeakTheTruth wrote...
It does seem that if a woman is shown to be beautiful, smart, strong, and resourceful that most people believe that one or more of those things can't go together.

You could add "comfortable and confident in her sexuality" to that list, which, let's face it, is one of those things that will always bother some people, especially when combined with the above.

No surprise there. Unfortunately, we're wired for such behaviour, and it will likely take constant effort and many generations of cumulative disassociation of sex and reproduction to make it go away.

Of course most people wouldn't openly state they believe that all those traits can't go together and that owning your sexuality is wrong, but it is astonishing how many behaviour patterns persist that grew out of such a belief even in cultures that openly eschew it.

[jtav]

Definitely don't have a problem with fanservice. But Miranda as presented is actually a turn-off. I wanted something more like this trope. I like that she's unapologetically sexual. Very much.

[primoULTIMO]

Truth be told I doubt Shepard and Miranda's time together was enough to change her character to such a large extent, however to observe the extent of the change in her character; observe the way she talks to Shepard after she kills Wilson. Her cold attitude and disdain towards Shepard are particularly highlighted. Compare this to the hug scene. The stark difference in her tone and attitude is amazing.

Regarding the Paragon/ Renegade changes, her cold character is simply a psychological 'defense' that she subliminally enacted to protect her from other people. The fact that she only has Niket and, to an extent, Jacob as her only friends really explains alot about her attitude towards other people in general caused by her childhood. It takes Shepard to break that 'shell' and reveal her true character. It SHOULD depend on the player how much this shell is broken in terms of paragon/ renegade choices throughout Me3. I don't that it is unreasonable to expect something akin to this, if im not mistaken they managed to do it in Kotor 1 and 2.

Modifié par primoULTIMO, 31 août 2011 - 12:19 .

[jtav]

Or it could be--shock, horror--people act differently around lovers than people they just met. Some people are naturally reserved. It's not a shell or defense, simply part of one's character.

[primoULTIMO]

jtav wrote...

Or it could be--shock, horror--people act differently around lovers than people they just met. Some people are naturally reserved. It's not a shell or defense, simply part of one's character.

The loyalty mission is the first glimpse of change that we see. If you consider them to be 'lovers' before the hug scene or, at the most, before they have sex, then we have two different opinions of what a 'lover' is

To be fair (and in my personal opinion) the relationship is still in it's infancy.

Modifié par primoULTIMO, 31 août 2011 - 12:47 .

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
Or it could be--shock, horror--people act differently around lovers than people they just met. Some people are naturally reserved. It's not a shell or defense, simply part of one's character.

This!

I hate all this talk of "it's just a defence" and of how our hero will break it to get at the sweet girl hidden behind the shell. It's disgusting.
:sick:


@PrimoUltimo:
Of course you are more open with your lover. That's just natural. It doesn't mean you aren't naturally reserved to other people, and it doesn't mean what you display to your lover is your "true character". Gods, how I hate that interpretation.... As if a woman could never be reserved for real. I love that trait in Miranda as much as her competence.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 31 août 2011 - 01:15 .

[jtav]

[quote]primoULTIMO wrote...

The loyalty mission is the first glimpse of change that we see. If you consider them to be 'lovers' before the hug scene or, at the most, before they have sex, then we have two different opinions of what a 'lover' is

To be fair (and in my personal opinion) the relationship is still in it's infancy.

[/quote]

You  used the hug scene as a comparison point. And I resent any implication that her behavuir regarding Oriana or romanced Shep is less valid than her behavior on Lazarus or the SM. Behavir is contextual, and reserve isn't something she needs to be cured of.
[/quote]

Modifié par jtav, 31 août 2011 - 01:46 .

[flemm]

I hate all this talk of "it's just a defence" and of how our hero will break it to get at the sweet girl hidden behind the shell. It's disgusting.
:sick:

I don't really buy into that interpretation either. Over the course of the game, Shepard simply learns more about her. But all of the stuff he learns has been present from the beginning (without being obvious to Shepard or the player). For example, her attachment to Oriana, which has nothing to do with Shepard, and her decision to break Cerberus regulations to keep a promise to Jacob, which dates back to their relationship prior to ME2, etc.

She's reserved and detached at times, and she has a lot of deep feelings, as well. Both are equally "true" to the character imo.

I also don't think her opinion on the CB decision has much of anything to do with Shepard's views. Though I recognize that this is a much-debated topic around here.

Modifié par flemm, 31 août 2011 - 03:20 .