82210 réponses à ce sujet

[jtav]

What I--and I think Ieldra as well--find hard to reconcile is she acts as if using the base for an reason is immoral. Not that TIM is giving her the creeps. Though I do wish she'd been less sheltered. I alternate between having her as a favorite and wanting her dead for my own peace of mind because I reconcile the whole into something truly pathetic.

So, the question is, as always: which Miranda?

[flemm]

jtav wrote...

What I--and I think Ieldra as well--find hard to reconcile is she acts as if using the base for an reason is immoral.

I get that. But it strikes me as a bit of an odd conclusion on your part. I mean, she knows how it will be used and who will be using it. It's not an academic or theoretical question.

[drwells123]

jtav wrote...

I like the Paragon line a lot, just not as a
lead-in to a romance. Someone needs to tell her that often until she
believes it.

[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie]

Miranda: Shepard, untie me. I have work to do.

Shepard: Not until you say it again.

Miranda (rolling her eyes) : Fine. "I own my successes as well as my mistakes."

Shepard: More conviction.

jtav wrote...

I like her making the first move. just wish it didn't come so quick on the heels of beating herself up.

*resigns herself to having fundamentally different view of romance than thread*

If you mean Shepard's helping her with her self-esteem as a lead-in to romance, I agree. At 35, someone with her life experience would not need Shepard to tell her she's "okay".

[Caihn]

To me Miranda is one and only one character, 100% consistent from the beginning to the end of the game.
So "which Miranda" is a completely pointless question, to me.

[jtav]

Because the phrasing is "using anything from this base seems like a betrayal." It's a blanket statement, unlike other party members who specifically cite mistrust of Cerberus.

[flemm]

Well, yeah, but she's in a different position than the others re: Cerberus. Until this decision, she has perceived her goals and those of Cerberus to be aligned. So it makes sense that she wouldn't specify.

primoULTIMO wrote...

Interesting points flemm, just to see if I understood, your considering her undying devotion at the begining of the game with Cerberus as a sentimentalist/ idealist trait? Always thought she was only rational and buisness-like.

Well, I think there is a mixture. Sometimes people refer to Miranda's blind devotion to Cerberus, but I don't think it was ever really blind. On the contrary, she has clearly thought it all through. But that doesn't mean she is being completely lucid. Or completely honest with herself.

Modifié par flemm, 14 septembre 2011 - 10:17 .

[flemm]

Sorry, double post.

Modifié par flemm, 14 septembre 2011 - 10:16 .

[Eyeshield21]

Omega4RelayResident wrote...

flemm wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
So I find myself unable to reconcile this line with Miranda. I think it was put in to make Miranda acceptable for Paragons with complete disregard of her character consistency.

I understand your point of view, but I don't think I really agree. Or, I should say, I agree that we need more information and that Miranda's motivation needs to be further explored in ME3. But I don't agree that it's hard to reconcile this scene with Miranda as we know the character.

One of the things that makes Miranda interesting is that she is ruthless, but within certain bounds. This is in evidence throughout the game. Witness her insistence that the cell running experiments on Jack was "not really Cerberus." And her rationalisations of certain Cerberus activities in conversation with Shepard: We stopped experimenting on the Rachni as soon as we learned they were sentient. Another project was a "tragic mistake," etc.

So, she has a somewhat idealized vision of Cerberus, and that mix of pragmatism and idealism is characteristic of her: "I believe in what Cerberus stands for. I believe in our goals."

So, where does this tendency to idealize and rationalize come from? Well, probably from the fact that Cerberus was originally a refuge from her father. She was dependant on the organisation and needed/wanted to believe that this was her place in the world. On the Collector Ship there is obvious dismay in her voice at the thought that TIM might betray her. "There has to be another explanation."

So, really the resignation scene is partly about Miranda leaving the cocoon of Cerberus and striking out on her own. Or finally admitting that her goals and those of TIM are not identical. "Betrayal" of herself or betrayal of her mission. Or betrayal of the people who would die in Cerberus' next botched experiment. Probably all of the above.

Well it doesnt matter because I am going to kill TIM on all of my profiles... MY UBER **** RENEGADE profile is the one where I hope I can take up TIMs mantle and become the new TIM... That means I am going to have the Shadow Broker's resources and Cerberus resources to work with...

Oh the things I can do with that kind of funding.

Shep: "So Miss Lawson... I hope you enjoy the perks of dating your boss."

Miranda: "Sweetheart we have work to do... can you please not have a one track mind."

Shep:

I approve of this love ending.

[Caihn]

flemm wrote...

Well, yeah, but she's in a different position than the others re: Cerberus. Until this decision, she has perceived her goals and those of Cerberus to be aligned. So it makes sense that she wouldn't specify.

Yeah.

And I can't believe people still compare Miranda to the other squadmates during this scene. The squadmates speak directly to Shepard when they express their opinion about the CB. Miranda never speaks to Shepard, she responds to her boss.
That's why her resignation scene should have been private ... it's just a combination of circumstances that make Shepard assist to this scene, and the fact that TIM forces her to make a choice.

[Omega4RelayResident]

Here is a question... how would you propose to Miranda as male Shep?

End of ME3... you just saved the galaxy... how are you going to propose to her and live happily ever after?

[Shotokanguy]

jtav wrote...

What I--and I think Ieldra as well--find hard to reconcile is she acts as if using the base for an reason is immoral. Not that TIM is giving her the creeps. Though I do wish she'd been less sheltered. I alternate between having her as a favorite and wanting her dead for my own peace of mind because I reconcile the whole into something truly pathetic.

I don't know if anyone else agrees with me, but I think you and Ieldra have an almost unhealthy way of looking at this stuff. You care a bit too much about whether Miranda will turn out to be the character you think she should be or not.

[TomY90]

Omega4RelayResident wrote...

Here is a question... how would you propose to Miranda as male Shep?

End of ME3... you just saved the galaxy... how are you going to propose to her and live happily ever after?

In a way this sounds like guilting her to say yes but I would do this.

Propose before the final mission (not like in Pirate of the carribean: at world's end) after being together before they could potentially never see eachother ever again or the end of the galaxy as they know it.

That is when I would pop the question you know as potentially the final opportunity to express how they truly feel about eachother.

If she does say yes it would definetly make shepard more determined to save the galaxy... I know I would if I had miranda ready to spend the rest of your life with you.

[Caihn]

Omega4RelayResident wrote...

Here is a question... how would you propose to Miranda as male Shep?

End of ME3... you just saved the galaxy... how are you going to propose to her and live happily ever after?

I'm not sure I want to see a real proposal. Too much cliche for my taste.
But I wouldn't mind an another promise scene, even more meaningful than the one in ME2 (and maybe both will have to promise to each other this time).
And the scene could be different if you already promised her or not, to not die in ME2.

Modifié par Yannkee, 14 septembre 2011 - 10:39 .

[Eyeshield21]

Omega4RelayResident wrote...

Here is a question... how would you propose to Miranda as male Shep?

End of ME3... you just saved the galaxy... how are you going to propose to her and live happily ever after?

not sure, let me think on that one.

[Eyeshield21]

Propose while fighting the reapers and a month later find out you're a father in 9 months.

[naledgeborn]

If there were still bullets in 2187 an engagement ring around it, dead Cerberus commandos littering the landscape, romantic one liner... you do the math.

Modifié par naledgeborn, 14 septembre 2011 - 10:45 .

[mystia]

Eyeshield21 wrote...

Propose while fighting the reapers and a month later find out you're a father in 9 months.

sorry to break your dream but miri is sterile(source lotsb)

[primoULTIMO]

mystia wrote...

Eyeshield21 wrote...

Propose while fighting the reapers and a month later find out you're a father in 9 months.

sorry to break your dream but miri is sterile(source lotsb)

Oh no! Not this topic again

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Let everyone: How happy will YOU be when you see Miri in ME3? Or first footage, etc?

I know how happy I'll be:wub:.

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 14 septembre 2011 - 10:48 .

[Eyeshield21]

mystia wrote...

Eyeshield21 wrote...

Propose while fighting the reapers and a month later find out you're a father in 9 months.

sorry to break your dream but miri is sterile(source lotsb)

somewhat sterile, I also saw that file in the SB DLC, but that might change in ME3, Because it says it's almost impossible to have a kid cause of the perfect genetics(it's ironic you know, designed to be perfect and this happens, not so perfect, huh?) but who knows this early in dev.
I'm hoping she can, but we'll see this march.

Modifié par Eyeshield21, 14 septembre 2011 - 10:49 .

[Omega4RelayResident]

Omega4RelayResident wrote...

Here is a question... how would you propose to Miranda as male Shep?

End of ME3... you just saved the galaxy... how are you going to propose to her and live happily ever after?

As Miri was sleeping I would slip the ring onto her finger before she woke up in the morning...

When she wakes up it should be a nice surprise... even more of a plus in my column that I managed to slip it on her finger without waking her up... I think she would be impressed.

[MisterJB]

Omega4RelayResident wrote...

As Miri was sleeping I would slip the ring onto her finger before she woke up in the morning...

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Omega4RelayResident wrote...


As Miri was sleeping I would slip the ring onto her finger before she woke up in the morning...

When she wakes up it should be a nice surprise... even more of a plus in my column that I managed to slip it on her finger without waking her up... I think she would be impressed.

I would most likely do the same thing:wub:.

[Eyeshield21]

MisterJB wrote...

Omega4RelayResident wrote...

As Miri was sleeping I would slip the ring onto her finger before she woke up in the morning...

the hell?!?

[LexieTheT-Rexy]

Just completed my Sentinel playthrough of ME1. To say the least, by the end of the first game, I go through Miri Withdraw.