82210 réponses à ce sujet

[Caihn]

Eyeshield21 wrote...

Eyeshield21 wrote...

Yannkee wrote...

Eyeshield21 wrote...

I ****ed up, for some reason my playthrough where I romanced Miranda got erased

You have 6 months to make a new one. 

I finished that playthrough 3 days ago

Sigh, I'm doing it right now.......

It reminds me that I still have to finish my canon playthrough. :/

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

I guess Overlord is better Pre-SM. I'll still play LOTSB and Arrival Post-SM.
Anyway, lets go back to Miri:wub:!



I have got to get this shirt!

[Eyeshield21]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

I guess Overlord is better Pre-SM. I'll still play LOTSB and Arrival Post-SM.
Anyway, lets go back to Miri:wub:!



I have got to get this shirt!

This put me in a better mood.

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

 I don't blame you. Miri makes us all happy:wub:! Those eyes! That Beauty:wub:! 

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 17 septembre 2011 - 11:08 .

[spirosz]

Yannkee wrote...

flemm wrote...

That's cool. I don't think Miranda needs to be redeemed either. She should retain her capacity to be ruthless and calculating (within certain bounds). But I also think that a powerful sentiment of revulsion due to her experiences on the CB is quite plausible, given what we know about the character, and not a sign that she is suddenly going to become a girly-girl who just can't think straight when there's work to be done.

this

I find completely ridiculous to raise the Paragon Vs Renegade flag everytime we have to discuss this topic.
I play my Shepards like I want without Paragon or Renegade consideration, and I accept the different characters like they are, avoiding any categorization.
I don't want to "paragonized" Miranda, I just want the Miranda created by the Bioware writers. And this includes the aspect of her character showed at the end of the game.

I agree with this as well.  I was actually expecting that sort of line from Miranda near the end of game because of the vibe I was getting and the way my actions were influencing her perspective towards Cerberus.   Is it out of character for her?  Not for me because I still see her as a very independant and strong-willed woman, that is still willing to make sacrifices of a certain level to reach the goal, but still having limits.  Is my opinion the right one, no, but neither is anyone elses because we all have different perspectives towards that situation and what lead up to it. 

[Eyeshield21]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

 I don't blame you. Miri makes us all happy:wub:! Those eyes! That Beauty:wub:! 

Insert Grunt Birthday Party from Halo soundbite here

Modifié par Eyeshield21, 18 septembre 2011 - 12:06 .

[LexieTheT-Rexy]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

 I don't blame you. Miri makes us all happy:wub:! Those eyes! That Beauty:wub:! 

Once more, drawing this in art. I have her body outline done, and I'll be working on her facial features next time we work on it.

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

 I don't blame you. Miri makes us all happy:wub:! Those eyes! That Beauty:wub:! 
*snip*

Once more, drawing this in art. I have her body outline done, and I'll be working on her facial features next time we work on it.

Modifié par MASSEFFECTfanforlife101, 18 septembre 2011 - 01:25 .

[Eyeshield21]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

 I don't blame you. Miri makes us all happy:wub:! Those eyes! That Beauty:wub:! 

Once more, drawing this in art. I have her body outline done, and I'll be working on her facial features next time we work on it.

[naledgeborn]

Really are we back to making quote pyramids of the same picture over and over? Chill with the spam guys. At least post different pics and avoid pyramids...

Modifié par naledgeborn, 18 septembre 2011 - 01:22 .

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Careful now. We shouldn't show the same pic too many times. We wouldn't want this thread, which we work SO DAMN hard to keep alive, to be locked.

[flemm]

I like the pics, but I do think that taking the time to *snip* the pic when you quote the post would be a good idea. No need to repeat the same image over and over on a single page. It's an etiquette thing.

LexieTheT-Rexy wrote...
Once more, drawing this in art. I have her body outline done, and I'll be working on her facial features next time we work on it.

Looking forward to it, Lexie.

Modifié par flemm, 18 septembre 2011 - 01:27 .

[naledgeborn]

flemm wrote...

Looking forward to it, Lexie.

Same. I know MEf4life had a good hand drawn one of Yvonne up ages ago. I actually like the fan stuff more than the screenies. I know a lot of work went into the originals like "injured Shep carries injured Miranda". Those are nice. IMO

[cyborg2501]

spiros9110 wrote...
I agree with this as well.  I was actually expecting that sort of line from Miranda near the end of game because of the vibe I was getting and the way my actions were influencing her perspective towards Cerberus.   Is it out of character for her?  Not for me because I still see her as a very independant and strong-willed woman, that is still willing to make sacrifices of a certain level to reach the goal, but still having limits.  Is my opinion the right one, no, but neither is anyone elses because we all have different perspectives towards that situation and what lead up to it. 

I think we can agree that one of Miranda's traits is independence. That's why it doesn't surprise me when she tells TIM off and I don't find that contrary to her character.  She isn't bound by the same moral codes as other characters, which gives her the freedom to make unpredictable decisions. She's going to do what she and she alone feels is right, and chaining her to the pragmatic side of her character would do more harm than good IMO. Character evolution and dynamism are crucial to a good story. That being said, I'm not sure we even know the true Miranda, she's still shrouded in mystery in my opinion. For all we know she could actually be uber-operative and be playing us all, having discussed the outcome of the base prior to its destruction with TIM and agreeing upon a course of action.

Ieldra2 wrote...
For me it's character assassination of the first order. Good job of ruining my favorite character, if the "betrayal" line is a sign of things to come. I can understand that they needed to get her away from Cerberus if you destroy the base, but why the hell did they give her a line that would, if taken seriously, destroy all of what she had been before, including all of her pragmatism and her competence as an operative?

I don't think her decision as presented necessarily destroys anything. Her achievements and competence as an operative are well-established through years of service and history. If anything, her decision highlights the consistency of her character until this point, effectively closing one chapter to begin another. It makes sense why they tied this decision to the destruction of the collector base. I agree that it would be more revealing of her character if she had resigned at a different time. However, for the sake of the story, I think the writers made the right decision to put it where they did. More drama and questions to be answered. 

Modifié par cyborg2501, 18 septembre 2011 - 02:44 .

[JosephDucreux]

Why does Miranda always have to be either completely ruthless or completely paragon? Can't she play both sides? And pertaining to the CB argument, how do you think Miranda would act if she discovered Auschwitz with all it's prisoners and found out that they were melting prisoners (kids included) alive to make some sort of biological superweapon that could win the war? Would she say 'save it in its entirety', or would she say 'destroy it'?

P.S. Sorry for any typos. Broke my arm in the line of duty yesterday.

[flemm]

Interesting points, cyborg.

cyborg2501 wrote...
She's going to do what she and she alone feels is right, and chaining her to the pragmatic side of her character would do more harm than good IMO. Character evolution and dynamism are crucial to a good story.

 
I agree with the bolded part especially. Basically, if Miranda's reaction to every situation that involves her work as an operative is predictably pragmatic, then you end up with a much more one-dimensional character. Granted, Miranda has a lot going on, so she would have plenty of depth anyway, but having her follow her gut in certain situations adds another element of complexity. And I don't think it means she's abandoned pragmatism and rationality. It's not either/or.

cyborg2501 wrote...
 More drama and questions to be answered. 

There are certainly plenty of those, and I agree that it is probably better that there are so many unanswered questions swirling around Miranda going into the third installment of the series, rather than all of us sitting here feeling comfortable and confident that we know exactly who Miranda is and what role she will be playing. At the same time, I feel like I know a lot about her. That's a sign of good character development imo, when you have a character that is very clearly defined but retains an element of mystery and unpredictability.

EDIT:
@ Joseph, I like the idea of Miranda being a bit of a Paragade, at least potentially. And, man, I hope you're alright, I'm sorry to hear that.

Modifié par flemm, 18 septembre 2011 - 03:14 .

[spirosz]

flemm wrote...

I agree with the bolded part especially. Basically, if Miranda's reaction to every situation that involves her work as an operative is predictably pragmatic, then you end up with a much more one-dimensional character. Granted, Miranda has a lot going on, so she would have plenty of depth anyway, but having her follow her gut in certain situations adds another element of complexity. And I don't think it means she's abandoned pragmatism and rationality. It's not either/or.

cyborg2501 wrote...
 More drama and questions to be answered. 

There are certainly plenty of those, and I agree that it is probably better that there are so many unanswered questions swirling around Miranda going into the third installment of the series, rather than all of us sitting here feeling comfortable and confident that we know exactly who Miranda is and what role she will be playing. At the same time, I feel like I know a lot about her. That's a sign of good character development imo, when you have a character that is very clearly defined but retains an element of mystery and unpredictability.

Yeah I agree.  You can also factor in that since being with Shepard, she's witnessed the aftermath of certain experiments (Pragia, Overlord) and that may change her outlook on certain things.  It's one thing to talk about them (the cerberus side quests in ME1), but to actually see it, is on another level, IMO.   Imagine if Miranda witnessed an experiment on her sister, even if the outcome could be justifiable, would she still allow it to happen knowing its her sister being the victim. 

I also agree with the last bolded part, she ones of the few characters who I believe will really impact ME3's story. 

Modifié par spiros9110, 18 septembre 2011 - 03:47 .

[JosephDucreux]

flemm wrote...
EDIT:
@ Joseph, I like the idea of Miranda being a bit of a Paragade, at least potentially. And, man, I hope you're alright, I'm sorry to hear that.

Actually, I always saw Miranda as being a Paragade. Bascially a good person who has to make the best of every situation and cannot afford to fail. And thanks for the concern.

[pancholonita]

JosephDucreux wrote...

flemm wrote...
EDIT:
@ Joseph, I like the idea of Miranda being a bit of a Paragade, at least potentially. And, man, I hope you're alright, I'm sorry to hear that.

Actually, I always saw Miranda as being a Paragade. Bascially a good person who has to make the best of every situation and cannot afford to fail. And thanks for the concern.

I also share your same opinion, and i hope that you recover soon 

[Omega4RelayResident]

JosephDucreux wrote...

Why does Miranda always have to be either completely ruthless or completely paragon? Can't she play both sides? And pertaining to the CB argument, how do you think Miranda would act if she discovered Auschwitz with all it's prisoners and found out that they were melting prisoners (kids included) alive to make some sort of biological superweapon that could win the war? Would she say 'save it in its entirety', or would she say 'destroy it'?

P.S. Sorry for any typos. Broke my arm in the line of duty yesterday.

Dude get better soon... stay safe out there!

[Ieldra]

flemm wrote...
Interesting points, cyborg.

cyborg2501 wrote...
She's going to do what she and she alone feels is right, and chaining her to the pragmatic side of her character would do more harm than good IMO. Character evolution and dynamism are crucial to a good story.

 
I agree with the bolded part especially. Basically, if Miranda's reaction to every situation that involves her work as an operative is predictably pragmatic, then you end up with a much more one-dimensional character. Granted, Miranda has a lot going on, so she would have plenty of depth anyway, but having her follow her gut in certain situations adds another element of complexity. And I don't think it means she's abandoned pragmatism and rationality. It's not either/or.

I agree with this as a general statement. There are only two problems with this if you apply it to the Collector base situation: first, this is a decision that may affect the fate of the galaxy. I'd expect much more impulsive characters than Miranda to take a mental step back and think for a moment at this point, and that she shows this reaction points to a much greater sentimentalism than I find believable. Second, it comes at the end of the game. If it's a one-time reaction to an extreme situation I can live with it though it still undermines her competence, but if it's a sign of where she's going, indicating we may see more of that kind of sentimentalism, then I'm not sure I want to see the result.

[Ieldra]

JosephDucreux wrote...
Why does Miranda always have to be either completely ruthless or completely paragon? Can't she play both sides?

Of course she can (see my previous post). I have never said anything else.

And pertaining to the CB argument, how do you think Miranda would act if she discovered Auschwitz with all it's prisoners and found out that they were melting prisoners (kids included) alive to make some sort of biological superweapon that could win the war? Would she say 'save it in its entirety', or would she say 'destroy it'?

That's different. At the CB, the damage had already been done. There's nothing more to gain by destroying it, those already dead cannot be brought back. Miranda would not support melting down more humans in the base, but she also wouldn't discount the strategic value of the knowledge and advanced technology there - may I remind you that the place is a Reaper factory, that's an unprecedented ability to learn about them.

So, suppose she suspects how TIM will use the base and doesn't agree with it, why doesn't she say *that*? Instead, what she actually says is a blanket condemnation of the technology of the base as such on a flimsy sentiment (which is, I say it again, completely out of character as well as stupid).

Modifié par Ieldra2, 18 septembre 2011 - 06:42 .

[Spanky Magoo]

Ieldra2 wrote...

*snip*

So, suppose she suspects how TIM will use the base and doesn't agree with it, why doesn't she say *that*? Instead, what she actually says is a blanket condemnation of the technology of the base as such on a flimsy sentiment (which is, I say it again, completely out of character as well as stupid).

Thats my thoughts exactly, luckily I mute my sound and use my imagination at that scene.

[Ieldra]

Spanky Magoo wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

*snip*

So, suppose she suspects how TIM will use the base and doesn't agree with it, why doesn't she say *that*? Instead, what she actually says is a blanket condemnation of the technology of the base as such on a flimsy sentiment (which is, I say it again, completely out of character as well as stupid).

Thats my thoughts exactly, luckily I mute my sound and use my imagination at that scene.

You needn't. If you choose the middle or lower option at the first exchange with TIM, you won't get the "betrayal" line. I usually (well, always) choose the middle option ("What will you do with it"?) which I find the only appropriate one for the situation. Miranda still resigns if you choose to destroy the base, but you avoid Miranda's out-of-character moment.

[Ieldra]

And now for something more....emotional....

Modifié par Ieldra2, 18 septembre 2011 - 07:35 .