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[flemm]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

At least Ashley and I will be able to agree on the righteous purging to come after.

I find anyone highly suspect who uses the term "righteous purging" in a non-sarcastic way.

This is the moment in the plot where you have to decide whether to kill/side with either Miranda or Ashley...

Hanging out around here is like getting an early preview of the game 

Modifié par flemm, 09 octobre 2011 - 05:01 .

[Xilizhra]

From a character personality standpoint I can see it. But it makes your Shep just a little evil.

Well, I still choose Samara. I just mourn Morinth's lost potential.

I find anyone highly suspect who uses the term "righteous purging" in a non-sarcastic way.

There might be another name for this, but I call it "kidding on the square." It's kidding about something, but at the same time really meaning it. Basically, I hated Cerberus even back in ME1, and learning more about them in ME2 only made me want to take the fight to them even more. In ME3, I can finally do something about these bastards, and I rather look forward to it; not that I look forward to the killing as such, but to the defeating.

[jtav]

If it was Miranda vs. Kaidan, I'd probably start drinking.

[Xilizhra]

flemm wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

At least Ashley and I will be able to agree on the righteous purging to come after.

I find anyone highly suspect who uses the term "righteous purging" in a non-sarcastic way.

This is the moment in the plot where you have to decide whether to kill/side with either Miranda or Ashley...

Hanging out around here is like getting an early preview of the game 

If Miranda is willing to die to prevent Cerberus' annihilation... well, here's hoping we find a way to resurrect her after this is done.

Modifié par Xilizhra, 09 octobre 2011 - 05:04 .

[Athayniel]

Xilizhra wrote...

From a character personality standpoint I can see it. But it makes your Shep just a little evil.

Well, I still choose Samara. I just mourn Morinth's lost potential.

I imagine there was an interesting story in there where Morinth wasn't just an unspeakably despicable monster. I would have liked that story. It would have made the choice far more difficult.

*edit* Anyways, Morinth is off-topic. I wonder how Miranda would act in a confrontation with Ashley given how we saw her act in the squabble with Jack. She does tend to get defensive and lashes out.

Modifié par Athayniel, 09 octobre 2011 - 05:06 .

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
Ieldra isn't a Trekkie. Here's a pic.

Thanks. Not a look I'd want for Miranda. Looks too much like *successful* implanation of Reaper tech.

Hmm....now I'm thinking of Miranda finding a way to tweak that implant so that she can use it without being taken over by the Reapers. That would be an interesting development.

[Xilizhra]

*edit* Anyways, Morinth is off-topic. I wonder how Miranda would act in a confrontation with Ashley given how we saw her act in the squabble with Jack. She does tend to get defensive and lashes out.

It depends on what it would be about, but I'd be sort of surprised if it did, at least if Miranda resigned.

[jtav]

Realistically, I suspect she's going to have her narrative hands full with Shepard's implants. I just like marring her good looks.

[Athayniel]

Xilizhra wrote...

*edit* Anyways, Morinth is off-topic. I wonder how Miranda would act in a confrontation with Ashley given how we saw her act in the squabble with Jack. She does tend to get defensive and lashes out.

It depends on what it would be about, but I'd be sort of surprised if it did, at least if Miranda resigned.

She might still look proudly on her own work for Cerberus. Saving the Council from a Batarian terrorist attack, resurrecting Shepard. Do we know any other operations she was definitely a part of?

[Xilizhra]

Athayniel wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

*edit* Anyways, Morinth is off-topic. I wonder how Miranda would act in a confrontation with Ashley given how we saw her act in the squabble with Jack. She does tend to get defensive and lashes out.

It depends on what it would be about, but I'd be sort of surprised if it did, at least if Miranda resigned.

She might still look proudly on her own work for Cerberus. Saving the Council from a Batarian terrorist attack, resurrecting Shepard. Do we know any other operations she was definitely a part of?

I don't. I suppose it's possible... well, if Ashley will be attacking her for all that, then I'll be able to roleplay telling them that they're both wrong well enough.

[Ieldra]

Xilizhra wrote...
If Miranda is willing to die to prevent Cerberus' annihilation...

...then you'll end up without her. I, however, will not. And so will anyone who isn't quite as one-sided. Which I'd find appropriate. I, for one, would never sanction the killing of the SR2's crew if they survived the SM, nor the destruction of Cerberus data and material resources. I'd be with Miranda on that, and if Ashley doesn't agree she can go to hell. 

As for the Alliance infiltrated with Cerberus, you can see it the other way round: I would be not at all surprised if there was significant support for Cerberus within the ranks of the Alliance. Before ME3, anyway.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 09 octobre 2011 - 05:16 .

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
Realistically, I suspect she's going to have her narrative hands full with Shepard's implants. I just like marring her good looks.

I don't, as a rule. I like that aspect of her.

[The Elder King]

Xilizhra wrote...


There might be another name for this, but I call it "kidding on the square." It's kidding about something, but at the same time really meaning it. Basically, I hated Cerberus even back in ME1, and learning more about them in ME2 only made me want to take the fight to them even more. In ME3, I can finally do something about these bastards, and I rather look forward to it; not that I look forward to the killing as such, but to the defeating.

While I'm not a Cerberus supporter, I have to say that the other major human and alien organization that have been displayed in ME-ME2 aren't that much better. The Alliance send bombs on other species's space, there's a secret about them that is present in Keji's graybox, and in ME2 they acted as idiots to the Reaper's menace . The Salarian used the Krogan as their tools, and then create (two times) a virus to prevent them to have children. The Turian used the genophage against the Krogans. The Quarians created a AI despite being forbidden, then tried to destroy them, and still some of them spend time on this useless fight. The Geth nearly caused the Quarian's extintion. The Krogan were too greedy and were ready to conquer every other species. The Batarian government is a dictature and linked with terrorism.
We don't know much about Asari government, so I'm not going to judge them. But every ME organization isn't completely good.

[flemm]

Ieldra2 wrote...
As for the Alliance infiltrated with Cerberus, you can see it the other way round: I would be not at all surprised if there was significant support for Cerberus within the ranks of the Alliance. Before ME3, anyway. 
.

Well, given that pretty much the whole Normandy crew in ME2 is ex-Alliance, and Miranda specifically states that much of Cerberus is made up of ex-Alliance personnel, it seems pretty likely that there is at least a pretty big element of Cerberus sympathy in the Alliance.

To the extent that Miranda's father shows up, I suppose it might have something to do with the Alliance/Cerberus connection. We know he's not Cerberus, but was a big supporter at one time.

Modifié par flemm, 09 octobre 2011 - 05:18 .

[Athayniel]

My understanding is that the crew of the Normandy was mostly recruited specifically for the mission. Ken, Gabby, Joker and Dr. Chakwas are certainly only there for Shepard. The rest of the crew seem to be there not because they want to ensure human dominance of the galaxy but to do something for the colonies when the Alliance and the Counil won't.

I could see mmy Sheps making their own surrender and that of the Normandy to the Alliance after Arrival contingent on some sort of amnesty for the crew.

[Xilizhra]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
If Miranda is willing to die to prevent Cerberus' annihilation...

...then you'll end up without her. I, however, will not. And so will anyone who isn't quite as one-sided. Which I'd find appropriate. I, for one, would never sanction the killing of the SR2's crew if they survived the SM, nor the destruction of Cerberus data and material resources. I'd be with Miranda on that, and if Ashley doesn't agree she can go to hell. 

As for the Alliance infiltrated with Cerberus, you can see it the other way round: I would be not at all surprised if there was significant support for Cerberus within the ranks of the Alliance. Before ME3, anyway.

Well, I won't kill her unless the choice is between that and some other squadmate, I think. If she's the only one who might die, then I think it'll be like with Wrex on Virmire and she can be talked down.
I also don't consider the SR2's crew to be Cerberus, especially after blowing up the Collector base; they're mine and I will defend them against whatever I have to, though I seriously doubt Ashley would try anything there. I was more referring to active Cerberus agents within the Alliance when I talked about righteous purging, and I have no actual qualms about destroying Cerberus and picking up and repurposing the pieces. But one thing I refuse to let happen is leave any of Cerberus' command structure intact; I won't allow anything of the organization to survive except for the data and material resources.

[flemm]

Athayniel wrote...

My understanding is that the crew of the Normandy was mostly recruited specifically for the mission. Ken, Gabby, Joker and Dr. Chakwas are certainly only there for Shepard. The rest of the crew seem to be there not because they want to ensure human dominance of the galaxy but to do something for the colonies when the Alliance and the Counil won't.

That would be how TIM operates, though. Isolating cells, keeping people in the dark about certain elements of the organisation's activities, recuiting the disatisfied Alliance people, getting wary individuals to sign up for specific missions, etc.

Pretty much nobody is fully up to date on Cerberus' activites. Even Miranda seems to have a somewhat idealized view of the organisation.

Modifié par flemm, 09 octobre 2011 - 05:23 .

[Athayniel]

flemm wrote...

That would be how TIM operates, though. Isolating cells, keeping people in the dark about certain elements of the organisation's activities, recuiting the disatisfied Alliance people, etc.

Right, which would make it easier for Hackett at least to arrange some sort of amnesty if the crew's only involvement with Cerberus up to that point being the Normandy mission.

As for Cerberus infiltration of the Alliance, I keep thinking back to the SB video of Anderson meeting with a guy in Cerberus uniform on the Presidium. What is that all about...

Modifié par Athayniel, 09 octobre 2011 - 05:24 .

[flemm]

Athayniel wrote...

Right, which would make it easier for Hackett at least to arrange some sort of amnesty if the crew's only involvement with Cerberus up to that point being the Normandy mission.

Oh, agreed, yeah, on the specific point of the Normandy's crew. That's how we'll get a lot of the same NPCs back again

Where Miranda falls in that scenario... well, it's anyone's guess. And it probably means no screenshots until March.

*cries*

(Crying is mature )

Modifié par flemm, 09 octobre 2011 - 05:26 .

[Barquiel]

Xilizhra wrote...

flemm wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

At least Ashley and I will be able to agree on the righteous purging to come after.

I find anyone highly suspect who uses the term "righteous purging" in a non-sarcastic way.

This is the moment in the plot where you have to decide whether to kill/side with either Miranda or Ashley...

Hanging out around here is like getting an early preview of the game 

If Miranda is willing to die to prevent Cerberus' annihilation... well, here's hoping we find a way to resurrect her after this is done.

I can't come up with a scenario where Miranda is willing to die to prevent Cerberus' annihilation. She has her doubts in ME2...and I doubt she approves Cerberus' agenda in ME3.

[jtav]

If the Alliance is at all realistic, they'll want to interrogate her. And we know the Normandy has a brig. Hmm...

[Wuartz]

I hope Miranda doesn't just change her mind about Cerberus and joins the Alliance early in the game. I think she'll stay with Cerberus because of her loyalty to the organization. Cerberus have done a lot good things to her. At first she's okay leaving Shepard behind and continue to work as an officer, but when Cerberus starts attacking Shepard and her former team-mates, she starts to doubt if Cerberus really are doing what's best for the galaxy. She helps Shepard on a mission involving taking down Cerberus and TIM, and joins our hero once again.

And oh, on the Normandy she isn't happy not being "second in command" any longer, but she later accepts it.

[Ieldra]

Wuartz wrote...
I hope Miranda doesn't just change her mind about Cerberus and joins the Alliance early in the game. I think she'll stay with Cerberus because of her loyalty to the organization. Cerberus have done a lot good things to her. At first she's okay leaving Shepard behind and continue to work as an officer, but when Cerberus starts attacking Shepard and her former team-mates, she starts to doubt if Cerberus really are doing what's best for the galaxy.

I don't think we'll get that unless it's 95% off-screen. It would mean a completely different story progression between games where the CB has been destroyed  and Miranda left Cerberus at the end of ME2 and games where it was saved and Miranda didn't leave.

And oh, on the Normandy she isn't happy not being "second in command" any longer, but she later accepts it.

She will be content to contribute where her abilities fit best. It can be as resident scientist, as intelligencer or as second-in-command. Apart from that, I'll always listen to her advice before Ashley's and hope the game will let me express that preference.

[jtav]

I think she'll be filling the same kind of role as Jack: serving on a ship of an organization hostile to her, but there our of necessity.

[flemm]

Wuartz wrote...

I hope Miranda doesn't just change her mind about Cerberus and joins the Alliance early in the game. I think she'll stay with Cerberus because of her loyalty to the organization. Cerberus have done a lot good things to her. At first she's okay leaving Shepard behind and continue to work as an officer, but when Cerberus starts attacking Shepard and her former team-mates, she starts to doubt if Cerberus really are doing what's best for the galaxy. She helps Shepard on a mission involving taking down Cerberus and TIM, and joins our hero once again.

And oh, on the Normandy she isn't happy not being "second in command" any longer, but she later accepts it.

Interesting thoughts. As Ieldra points out, the fact that Miranda resigns from Cerberus at the end of ME2, if you destroy the Collector Base, makes it fairly plausible that she may already be fighting Cerberus, more or less directly, at the beginning of ME3.

But I still think she will be conflicted about her former organisation, as you suggest. More conflicted than anyone else, certainly.

jtav wrote...

I think she'll be filling the same kind of role as Jack: serving on a ship of an organization hostile to her, but there our of necessity.

And therein lies the sweet, irresistable irony...

Modifié par flemm, 09 octobre 2011 - 06:05 .