82210 réponses à ce sujet

[JosephDucreux]

Ieldra2 wrote...

You think the nanite scenario would have no emotional impact? I very much doubt that. Fewer people would get the irony, but what's to "get" about having to kill her to prevent her from transforming into a monster? Everybody gets that!

The nanite scenario was tarnished by the Paul Grayson story. If it weren't, I wouldn't have as much as an issue with it. Also, killing Miranda before she gets warped into a husk by the nanites sounds very zombie movie cliche to me.

[JosephDucreux]

wright1978 wrote...
Have to say i detest drawn out death scenes. Give me a Wash from Serenity harpoon through the chest moment anyday

Not as drawn out as you think. No wailing and chest beating, maybe just a few tears and Shepard gets a bit colder and more ruthless after that. Besides, Miranda would be dying so I don't think she can talk much.

[CrutchCricket]

It's great to see you guys getting into this. I don't condone spamming as it is counter productive and will probably be ignored. That being said, don't limit yourself to just one channel, like Twitter. We need to contact them on all possible media and state our case respectfully and coherently. Don't mean to preach, just saying keep up the good work!

Also I saw Ieldra's post and that it contained spoilers so I was only able to skim it while doing the forum reading version of "la-la-la-la!" ear plug. However I do have one question. At no point is Miranda's death inevitable right? There are (or can be) conditions in which she dies but it is not the case that she dies regardless of player choice, right? I still don't want spoilers but I need to know this because such a scenario is unacceptable.

[jtav]

It seems her death is avoidable, but you might have to work for it.

[flemm]

CrutchCricket wrote...

It's great to see you guys getting into this. I don't condone spamming as it is counter productive and will probably be ignored.

Agreed. But it's easy to avoid spamming (and anything that could be construed as harassment). We just need to keep it positive and not repeat things needlessly.

CrutchCricket wrote...
At no point is Miranda's death inevitable right?

It doesn't appear to be inevitable. Still don't like how it works, though, because it's part of what seems to lock Miranda into the one mission only. Basically, she survives or she doesn't. If she does, she may pop up again in the endgame, but there really doesn't seem to be much beyond that point regardless.

Modifié par flemm, 16 novembre 2011 - 02:34 .

[Ieldra]

Here's a scene that just popped into my mind:


Shepard and Miranda are exploring the Illusive Man's base. All defenders have been killed. In a large room at the center - or top - of the station, covered by a large transparent dome through which the sky can be seen, they find the Illusive Man's old chair, surrounded by the u-shaped holodesk controlling Cerberus' computer network. They proceed to hack it to get at the data within. Miranda has picked up a datapad, apparently lost in thought.

Shepard: What have you found?
Miranda: The old Cerberus manifesto.
Miranda (in a choking voice): Damn it.
Shepard: What is it?
Miranda: I told you I joined Cerberus to protect my sister. This....is why I stayed with them.
Shepard: I've never read it.
Miranda: I was...captured by a dream. To illuminate the dark places, to search out the knowledge out there to benefit humanity. That's what I could get behind, a proper use for my genetic enhancements.
Miranda: And if we had to compete with other species - well, I've always liked a challenge.
Miranda (thoughtful): Was it ever *his* dream? Or was I duped right from the start?
Shepard: I don't know. Perhaps we'll never know. But I do know that you don't need to justify your enhancements.
Miranda (smiles): I know, now. And you had a part in making me believe it.
Miranda (more thoughtfully): But am I naive that I still want this? That I want to continue what he betrayed?
Shepard: Don't you think there's some knowledge better left alone?
Miranda: No. Not even in the face of....all this. What have you been fighting for after all? Wasn't it the knowledge we need to survive?
Shepard: And for you.
Miranda (exasperated smile): Don't be absurd. You'd have done fine without me.
Shepard: Duty and obligation are dry masters. I don't know if I could've done all this without knowing you were out there, somewhere. Didn't even matter if I was never to see you again. Just knowing was enough.
Miranda: You're a hopeless romantic, Commander.
Shepard (grins): Someone has to be, Ms. Lawson.
*they kiss*
*some time later*
Shepard: So...what would you do with all this?
Miranda: You know what's infuriating? That everything we....they...ever achieved could've been done without all this horror.
Miranda (looks around): I'll copy everything we find here. I don't know what I'll do with it, but I won't let it go to waste.

[jtav]

I would very much like that. i don't think we'll get it, but I'd like it. And your Shep speaks for mine. If he saves the galaxy, it's so she can live in it.

[Ieldra]

CrutchCricket wrote...
However I do have one question. At no point is Miranda's death inevitable right? There are (or can be) conditions in which she dies but it is not the case that she dies regardless of player choice, right? I still don't want spoilers but I need to know this because such a scenario is unacceptable.

It appears to be avoidable. It may, however, be required that she comes loyal from ME2 (this is a rumor whose truth I cannot ascertain). Not that that would be a problem for any of us.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 16 novembre 2011 - 03:06 .

[jtav]

I think it also may depend on something you do several hours earlier. Save early, save often.

[flemm]

jtav wrote...

I would very much like that. i don't think we'll get it, but I'd like it. And your Shep speaks for mine. If he saves the galaxy, it's so she can live in it.

Well, we may not get exactly that... But I feel like more on Cerberus is really needed. Some type of dialog where Miranda talks about her past involvement, what she thinks of it now, and where she sees herself going in the future.

Modifié par flemm, 16 novembre 2011 - 03:06 .

[CrutchCricket]

Ieldra2 wrote...
It appears to be avoidable. It may, however, be required that she comes loyal from ME2 (this is a rumor whose truth I cannot ascertain). Not that that would be a problem for any of us.

Indeed, no worries there. Romance and admiration aside, Miranda's loyalty mission is second only to Kasumi's in terms of enjoyment for me. Dealing with Morinth is probably third.

[flemm]

Ieldra2 wrote...
It appears to be avoidable. It may, however, be required that she comes loyal from ME2 (this is a rumor whose truth I cannot ascertain).

Don't think it can actually work that way... for reasons that I will put in spoiler tags, just in case, though I will be as vague as possible...


Basically, the onscreen death seems to be able to occur even if romanced (implying loyalty). There's a hint in the files of an offscreen death that some have theorized occurs if Miranda is unloyal and never contacts you at the beginning of the game.

Modifié par flemm, 16 novembre 2011 - 03:24 .

[Beard_of_Bees]

jtav wrote...

I think it also may depend on something you do several hours earlier. Save early, save often.

I am trying to avoid spoilers, but this info I would make an exception for. I don't want to play the game terrified that every single choice I make could end up killing Miranda.

If anyone knows/finds out what this is coudl they post it here? In spoiler tags of course.

[flemm]

Beard_of_Bees wrote...

If anyone knows/finds out what this is coudl they post it here? In spoiler tags of course.

Actually, I believe it's not clear at all from the leak what triggers this. I think it's a choice you make on her mission, but the nature of the choice is hazy.

*spoiler incoming*

Basically, she is either killed by Kai Leng, or she fights him off with only an injury. It seems to depend on her knowing he's there or not. Beyond that, nothing is clear. So I would think: tell her about Kai Leng if you can, or just stay with her whenever possible. That's my best guess based on what we know.

[jtav]

flemm, there's a post in-group you might want to see.

[flemm]

jtav wrote...

flemm, there's a post in-group you might want to see.

Thanks, I'll add that detail below... *spoiler*


It seems that you have the opportunity to mention Kai Leng in a vid conversation somewhere earlier in the game. Which puts her on guard against him. So, that could be the one.

*activates cynicism*

I would be careful anyway, though...

Because I could see the devs changing this and nothing else between now and release

Modifié par flemm, 16 novembre 2011 - 03:55 .

[Beard_of_Bees]

Good to know, thanks flem/jtav. Sounds interesting actually, if done well.

These kind of spoilers I need to know, I imagine I am not the only "non-spoiler" person of that opinion!

[James Raynor]

I would like to have an ending where Miranda survives and if you are in a relationship with her a nice ending scene

[Skullheart]

So, no one have said anything about Shepard and Miranda talking about her infertility (if she is romanced). Bioware bringed it in LotSB, they should put a clousure to that too.

[flemm]

Skullheart wrote...

So, no one have said anything about Shepard and Miranda talking about her infertility (if she is romanced). Bioware bringed it in LotSB, they should put a clousure to that too.

No sign of it, but we can't rule it out.

I have no idea what they were thinking with that in the first place, tbh.

[jtav]

Sympathy card/humanization, and rather cheaply done. I'd rather forget the whole thing ever happened, so that's fine by me.

[MisterJB]

Insinuate that genetic tailoring leads to evolutionary dead ends? Give her a physical ailment to earn some simpathy points? Romance material?

[flemm]

jtav wrote...

Sympathy card/humanization

I dunno, she's plenty humanized in the actual game (and much more effectively). Also, the way it's presented, it doesn't really come across that way.

I'd actually be tempted to go more with "dehumanization," especially when considered as part of the file as a whole. If it wasn't Miranda's writer, it may have just ended up being ignored for that reason.

Modifié par flemm, 16 novembre 2011 - 04:59 .

[CrutchCricket]

flemm wrote...
I'd actually be tempted to go more with "dehumanization," especially when considered as part of the file as a whole.

Have to agree here. I was pretty warmed up to Miranda when I first read the file. The whole thing (chat logs, talk with her sister etc.) briefly gave me pause as it was taken from her ice queen days. Can't say I liked that Miranda or thought of her as very human.

[jtav]

I think they were going for comedy for most of it and sympathy with infertility. Only, it backfired. People seemed more turned off than before.