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[MisterJB]

Beard_of_Bees wrote...
Miranda's chat stuff also was bad. Not the idea of it, I have no problem with Miranda wanting to hook up for sex. But if it is for a kid why not a sperm bank? Much easier. Seemed like it was just used to put some funny chat lines in. Which broke my immersion.
 

Her resentment towards her genetic engineering could have lead her to wishing her child's birh to be as natural as possible, including conception.

Mostly, I felt that the SB dossiers and videofiles were a missed opportunity. Here we have a treasure trove of information on everyone in the galaxy. A way of answering and raising questions that actually fits into the plot. And what do we have? Emily Wong dancing, Khellam's advocate yelling to a mirror and how many cigarretes Harper smokes per day. Uh...HELLO?!?!

[Dariansarr]

Beard_of_Bees wrote...

I felt it was too jokey. Grunt's in particular I disliked.

Miranda's chat stuff also was bad. Not the idea of it, I have no problem with Miranda wanting to hook up for sex. But if it is for a kid why not a sperm bank? Much easier. Seemed like it was just used to put some funny chat lines in. Which broke my immersion.

Also some of the chat with Oriana felt too forced, but that is a minor thing.

I think you would need some kind of ID or something to go to a sperm bank and since she is probably wanted it doesn't seem like a good idea + she doesn't want to have sperm from someone who had any kind of disease whatsoever so a sperm bank doesn't seem like a good idea.

Of course her chat with Oriana is forced because she has no idea how to communicate with her sister because she has been trying to stay out of her live for the past 15+ years.

[wright1978]

The simplest means of Miranda having a natural child would seem to me to be Surrogacy. After that it is possible someone brilliant such as Mordin might find a way round the infertility issue. It is possible that she might decide at a later point that the genetic tailoring that created her is worthy of being continued & want to go down the genetic engineering route. The problem is that her father's experiments were it seems rather wasteful(numerous earlier daughters were one presumes killed for failing to meet his expectations if you believe her comment ' i was the first one he kept')
I don't see her wanting to do it if this was the cost of progress.

[Beard_of_Bees]

@MisterJB: maybe it could be explained by wanting a natural conception. Not convinced, but best argument I have heard. Agreed on the missed opportunity.

@Dariansarr: Surely being in Cerberus she could have any number of fake IDs and get around that problem. And the sperm could be screened for defects.
Re: Oriana, sorry I phrased that badly. When I said it was forced I meant the "big sis" routine felt forced by the writers. Also Oriana calling her "Randa". I did not mean that the conversation was uncomfortable. This is just a minor (and personal) niggle though.

[CrutchCricket]

wright1978 wrote...

The simplest means of Miranda having a natural child would seem to me to be Surrogacy. After that it is possible someone brilliant such as Mordin might find a way round the infertility issue. It is possible that she might decide at a later point that the genetic tailoring that created her is worthy of being continued & want to go down the genetic engineering route. The problem is that her father's experiments were it seems rather wasteful(numerous earlier daughters were one presumes killed for failing to meet his expectations if you believe her comment ' i was the first one he kept')
I don't see her wanting to do it if this was the cost of progress.

Yes but you have to ask why the earlier "daughters" were rejected? Yes it could be the Alien Resurrection Nightmare Fuel type where they all came out mutants. Or it could be Okeer's tank-born rejects again, tossed aside because they weren't "perfect". Any of those krogan could've (with proper training) become decent members of their race (though some did go insane).

[Ieldra]

Ah....perhaps I shouldn't have brought this up. Reminds me how much I hate Miranda's infertility.

Also, if I could bring my wishes for Miranda in ME3 into one sentence - a very long time ago, jtav said:

"I want my morally ambiguous superspy back".

That still holds true. I don't want a redemption story, and I don't want personal affairs to dominate her story to the exclusion of everything else.

[jtav]

The question is: what are we going to do if it does? I'm cynical this morning.

[Xilizhra]

Worst-case scenario for you: Cerberus is trashed beyond reasonable hope of recovering personnel, resources or command structure. What does Miranda do next?

[CrutchCricket]

Ieldra2 wrote...
Also, if I could bring my wishes for Miranda in ME3 into one sentence - a very long time ago, jtav said:

"I want my morally ambiguous superspy back".

Ugh... it's as if I never even said anything...<_<

Time to indulge the lighter side.

Xilizhra wrote...
Worst-case scenario for you: Cerberus is trashed beyond reasonable hope of recovering personnel, resources or
command structure. What does Miranda do next?

The Macarena?

Modifié par CrutchCricket, 22 novembre 2011 - 05:44 .

[Beard_of_Bees]

Ieldra2 wrote...

"I want my morally ambiguous superspy back".

That still holds true. I don't want a redemption story, and I don't want personal affairs to dominate her story to the exclusion of everything else.

Very true. Especially when the personal affairs feel forced.

[flemm]

Ieldra2 wrote...

That still holds true. I don't want a redemption story, and I don't want personal affairs to dominate her story to the exclusion of everything else.

To me that last part is really important. More important to me, personally, than any connection to Cerberus specifically. There should be a balance between the professional and the personal where Miranda is concerned (as in ME2). She should care about Oriana and Shepard (especially if romanced, of course), but she should also have ambitious professional goals that make her a player in the bigger picture.

I could see that being reforming Cerberus, or redeeming part of the organisation from TIM's betrayal of her own vision of it. I could see that being wanting to destroy Cerberus and start over with something new later. Or, I could see that being stopping Cerberus and the Reapers, and leaving the future to be dealt with after the dust settles. 

I could get on board with a number of different takes on what Miranda's goals are with regard to the bigger picture (her "professional" goals, so to speak), but she should have some, and they should be important to her. 

Modifié par flemm, 22 novembre 2011 - 06:08 .

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
The question is: what are we going to do if it does? I'm cynical this morning.

Write fanfic. The "retreat into fanfic" scenario is still on the table.

But just to stress that I'm not totally negative today:

[jtav]

Okay, wow. You're making my Jackmance game very difficult here, Ieldra. And that shot's hilarious given Matt's penchant for purple prose regarding Miranda's eyes.

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
Okay, wow. You're making my Jackmance game very difficult here, Ieldra. And that shot's hilarious given Matt's penchant for purple prose regarding Miranda's eyes.

You're telling me Matt's description was *not* inspired by this scene? I'd have taken any bet it was. 

[jtav]

It was, but I'd forgotten how very close to accurate that description is. She's stunning there in a way she is nowhere else.

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
It was, but I'd forgotten how very close to accurate that description is. She's stunning there in a way she is nowhere else.

Well, yes. It is cheesy, but I'm sorry, her eyes actually *are* the color of space as it appears in the background (artificially colored for presentation but let's forget that little detail) and the reflections in her eyes *are* like the stars. Never has a cheesy metaphor been so true.

And that's one of my five or so favorite screenshots of her. Hmm....now thinking which screenshots capture her personality aspects best...

[Dr. Doctor]

I've been wondering what role Mr. Lawson is going to have in ME3, we know that we're going to encounter him but I don't want to just break into his office, shoot him in the head and get TIM's location. I want there to be some interaction between him and Miranda, perhaps even a comment on the romance:

Mr. Lawson: So, the first human Spectre? I approve.

Miranda: I don't need your approval.

Mr. Lawson: Isn't that the reason you staged your little rebellion? You wanted someone who would pat you on the head and tell you "good job" for every little display of mediocrity. Someone-(Shepard punches Mr. Lawson in the stomach and lifts him up by the collar)

Shepard: If it were up to me you'd be lying in a pool of your own blood. The only reason you're not is because she thinks that you can be of some use to us. So I recommend that you stop stroking your ego before I decide to blow your head off, understand?

Mr. Lawson: (struggling to speak) Noted. (Shepard drops him on the floor)

[ubermensch007]

Concerning Ms.Lawson's attitude change toward Commander Shepard once
we get aboard the Normandy SR 2.

Some prefer how she speaks to Shepard while aboard Minuteman Station, and think that BioWare assassinated her character on the Normandy SR 2.

I do not believe that this is so... I do not think that Dr.Wilson's recordings were playable without reason.From his log entries we learn about him and a bit about operative Lawson as well.She gave him the cold shoulder.Even though they were colleagues.She had no interest in getting to know him as a person or befriend him.

She was all buisness and very stand - offish... And then here comes Shepard.And she intends on treating him the same way that she has treated other men she has worked with before.But she can't do it.She succeeds for a while.But Shepard is unlike any man that she has known before.She admires him, and as she herself says she has nothing but
respect for all he has accomplished and done for humanity.She joined Cerberus afterall, to essentially become the kind of person that Commander Shepard already is.A hero and friend of humanity.

Now is it just me, or does anyone else think that Miranda kind of seemed to be trying to hard to be curt and abrasive towards Shepard after he first speaks to the Illusive Man?

After Freedom's Progress, when talking to her on the Normandy SR 2.I felt that my suspicions were confirmed.Miri's behavior on Minuteman Station was an act.She tried to put on her emotional armor with Shep.That worked with so many other people in her life.But by the time that Shepard becomes the captain of the new Normandy.It falls off.It
becomes a weight, a burden that she can no longer bare.She comes to find it mentally exhausting to keep up such pretenses.

She likes Shepard.And she wants him to like her and to give Cerberus a
chance to prove thier worth.As she herself tries on many occasions to
prove her worth during the Suicide Mission.

Even when Shep tries to compliment her on her contribuitions to thier objective.

Shepard -And you - The best thing that the Illusive Man did was put
you on my squad.

She downright rebuffs it.Saying that Commander Shepard would have done
fine without her.

Damn Miri, give yourself some credit...

Shepard even says as much himself to her.You brought me back to life.You can crush a mech with your biotics or shoot its head off at one hundred yards.It just saddens me a bit that Miri still sees herself as inadequate and useless in some ways.As though she does not belong at King Arthur's Round Table.

I never really thought that Ash and Miri had next to anything in common, but now I see that Miranda kind of suffers from a sort of low self esstem akin to Ashley in ME1.This desire to prove herself and worth, no matter the cost.

When I think about it she also reminds me of Jenkins. For like Jenkins, Miranda is desparetly trying to make her mark.And it could cost her her life.

[MisterJB]

I do not believe Miranda's behavior at Minuteman station was an act; Shepard didn't meet her at her best, her entire team had just been murdered by a traitor she had failed to identify and it was all because of Shepard, the man she considered to be a gigantic waste of money and resources; but I also don't subscribe to the notion that there is an amazing change between that Miranda and the Miranda we see aboard the Normandy. Her first conversation is still very much professional, she's just not being actively antagonistic which can be explained by Shepard agreeing to work with Cerberus. IMO, Miranda's tone in that first conversation should have been influenced by Shepard's decision regarding Veetor.
That Miranda wants Shepard to trust Cerberus like she does "Cerberus gave you a second chance, commander. Maybe you should do the same for us". could also be relevant.
Basically, Shepard gradually proves his worth to Miranda which makes it much more significant and meaningfull, IMO. Her second conversation even alludes to this: "As far as Cerberus operations go, this is one of the best I've been a part of (which can't be saying much, to be honest)...I suposse you deserve to know."

edit: On a related note, this should be on every Cerberus recrutiment add.

http://imageshack.us...os/850/3dv.mp4/

Modifié par MisterJB, 22 novembre 2011 - 08:48 .

[flemm]

Ieldra2 wrote...
And that's one of my five or so favorite screenshots of her.

Definitely one of my favorites as well. I won't elaborate, as it would be too cheesy.

[Ieldra]

flemm wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
And that's one of my five or so favorite screenshots of her.

Definitely one of my favorites as well. I won't elaborate, as it would be too cheesy.

It would? Now I'm curious. Please elaborate

[flemm]

Ieldra2 wrote...

It would? Now I'm curious. Please elaborate

Sorry, I have certain standards of professionalism in my posts that I try to uphold 
Anyway, keep the screenshots coming, they work better than anything as a cure for leak-induced depression

Modifié par flemm, 22 novembre 2011 - 09:29 .

[Skullheart]

Sharing some pics....










And this one is when Miranda knew about her reduced role...

[flemm]

You were cheering me up until that last one...

[Skullheart]

I was thinking in using the last one for a demotivational... But any text that I thinked was offensive to Bioware...