82210 réponses à ce sujet

[Dr. Doctor]

TomY90 wrote...

I imagine it will be a slight change to the outfit probably have those cerberus logo's gone off her outfit.

I guess it will probably have the same design and that but probably wont lose that much of it, might change one or two items on her outfit or slight change of her hair but I will be surprised if its more than that.

I wouldn't mind a non-Cerberus version of her loyalty outfit for when she's not in combat, but during missions I'd like to see her back in her AAP Armor.

[naledgeborn]

Dr. Doctor wrote...

I wouldn't mind a non-Cerberus version of her loyalty outfit for when she's not in combat, but during missions I'd like to see her back in her AAP Armor.

Speaking of which is there a mod for Miranda in FemSheps' armor? Just wondering what she would look like. I like the AAP in prinicple, but it really isn't asthetically pleasing... at all 

[Ieldra]

naledgeborn wrote...

Dr. Doctor wrote...

I wouldn't mind a non-Cerberus version of her loyalty outfit for when she's not in combat, but during missions I'd like to see her back in her AAP Armor.

Speaking of which is there a mod for Miranda in FemSheps' armor? Just wondering what she would look like. I like the AAP in prinicple, but it really isn't asthetically pleasing... at all

Ugh....Miranda wouldn't look good in armor *that* bulky. Also it's not her style.

But that's not the reason no such mod exists. All we can do is retexture armor, but the n7 female armor and Miranda's outfits are different 3d models. No one has found a way yet to move 3d models of armor to different characters. Possibly it's not even possible because characters are modeled in one piece including their outfits. If you change Miranda's outfit in the game, the software doesn't really "put a different armor model on Miranda", it gives you a different Miranda whose face happens to be identical to the old one.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 03 décembre 2011 - 09:01 .

[CrutchCricket]

naledgeborn wrote...

You see you're trying to compare real life experiences to a 60$ simulated one. If I'm paying, might as well do as I please within the realm of possibility and get irritable when my prior decisions are invalidated. That's not me saying the "customer is always right", but if the customer wants to say he/she is unsatisfied or if the voter is pissed off at the economy then the customer, the voter, the consumer, whatever should have the right to voice their opinion.

You've voiced your opinion, several times, on this thread and the other one. Are you obliged to be this belligerent about it, beating people over the head with your salami of misfortune, like your $60 is the only one that matters? And exactly how is getting into fights here or "killing a character" (by playing the game you bought anyway in such a way that an IsDead variable changes from 0 to 1) voicing your discontent at the makers of said game? That's not accomplishing anything because nobody really gives a **** what you do in your game. They do start to get pissed however, if you don't shut up about it.

I also like how you've ignored everything else I've said about Liara being killed by default or you completely abandoning the "journey not destination" mentality you referenced earlier.

[flemm]

spiros9110 wrote...
You should also be open to the idea of them developing the relationship further without even having a few missions concerning them.  The relationship shouldn't be restricted to just being developed over missions, per say.

Well, we are (generally speaking) open to that idea. In fact, prior to the leak, many of us argued that Miranda could have a great role in the game with being on the squad all the time, or even at all. I still think that's true, in the abstract. Amount of interaction (and Miranda's story potential being exploited) are more important than squad presence per se.

But, the reality is, in the leaked script, not being on the squad = not important, while being on the squad = important. That's the way it comes across because you don't have as much interaction with anyone else, and nobody else is onscreen for a significant amount of time (among other things).

spiros9110 wrote...
There is still room for them to spend time with each other and develop more, also for Miranda specfically, she should still be able to go down the path you guys want for her, aka her ideas for humanity developing further, regardless of her being with Shepard or the ship for that matter. 

Agreed, she should. But... she isn't. Her involvement in the script is the ME2 loyalty mission, part 2. She even says at one point, basically, "I need to get this personal issue out of the way before I deal with anything else."  Problem: that's at the beginning of the game, Miranda's mission is towards the end, and she never does anything else.

If what we're seeing is approximately the first half of Miranda's involvement in the game, it could end up being fine, even good. If that's all there is in the final product, then there's a problem.

spiros9110 wrote...
 I don't know, there's so much negativity, it's making me sad! 

I'd rather be enthusiastic about what I'm seeing, believe me. But, on the other hand, I'm not going to pretend it's great if it isn't.

Modifié par flemm, 03 décembre 2011 - 09:07 .

[naledgeborn]

If Liara is killed and it wasn't the result of a choice I made I wouldn't be pleased. I want Shepard to **** up. I want a miscalculation is his decision making to be the catalyst. Especially since she was my Mass Effect 1 LI. It would give the "journey" more weight. But yeah I don't like her either so that decision, if it is a decision, will be that much more enjoyable.

And thanks for making me lol with the salami of misfortune comment.

Modifié par naledgeborn, 03 décembre 2011 - 09:06 .

[CrutchCricket]

flemm wrote...

spiros9110 wrote...
 I don't know, there's so much negativity, it's making me sad! 

I'd rather be enthusiastic about what I'm seeing, believe me. But, on the other hand, I'm not going to pretend it's great if it isn't.

I  think reserving judgement until the game is actually out is the most sensible course. There has been too much gloom on here and it was unwarranted.

naledgeborn wrote...
And thanks for making me lol with the salami of misfortune comment.

Happy to help:D For me the image of somebody getting smacked in the head with hard meat is hilarious. I also realize this comment can't be saved from being interpreted as dirty. I trust you to read it the right way.

Modifié par CrutchCricket, 03 décembre 2011 - 09:12 .

[flemm]

CrutchCricket wrote...
I  think reserving judgement until the game is actually out is the most sensible course. There has been too much gloom on here and it was unwarranted.

I am reserving judgement. Because that is indeed sensible.

Pretending the leaked script isn't there, or that it didn't happen, doesn't strike me as particularly sensible, though. It gives us a sense of where the game was at, pretty deep into development, so it makes sense to comment on it, including what's missing, and what would need to be improved.  

[naledgeborn]

Yep read it the right way. And the sudden spike in aggression is due to RL tough times. Just using BSN as my personal punching bag.

[CrutchCricket]

flemm wrote...
It gives us a sense of where the game was at, pretty deep into development, so it makes sense to comment on it, including what's missing, and what would need to be improved.  

Well then I trust we've said what needed to be said about it and there is no reason to overstate its importance or indeed keep bringing it up? Unless of course a newbie asks about it. For the record though I do trust you to present it as objectively as possible;)

naledgeborn: Sorry bout the tough times man, hope it works out!

[alperez]

CrutchCricket wrote...

I  think reserving judgement until the game is actually out is the most sensible course. There has been too much gloom on here and it was unwarranted.

When the only evidence you have in how Me3 may pan out incorporates almost all the things you feared, then isn't that gloom warranted?

While almost everyone will reserve their final judgement until the game has been released, there have to be reasons at this point in time to be excited or enthused by the game, instead for a some who've read the leaked script they see reasons to be less than happy with how things seem to be shaping up.

So what positives do these people actually have, a possibly old or incomplete version of a script and a possibility that certain things have been changed or added to that script, which when put up against the possibility that the script isn't that old or out of date or that nothing regarding their concerns may indeed be added or changed at best weighs up only evenly.

My biggest annoyance with the whole debacle is that instead of counting the days in excitement until me3 is released just to see how things will end, i'm counting the days down to see what if anything has changed or been added to the parts that i have issues with.

[wright1978]

alperez wrote...

My biggest annoyance with the whole debacle is that instead of counting the days in excitement until me3 is released just to see how things will end, i'm counting the days down to see what if anything has changed or been added to the parts that i have issues with.

Completely with you on that.

[CrutchCricket]

alperez wrote...
When the only evidence you have in how Me3 may pan out incorporates almost all the things you feared, then isn't that gloom warranted?

Nope, for the same reason you can't look at a half-cooked burger and conclude it'll be ****. The rest of your point basically amounts to a glass half full or empty idea, which doesn't work because this isn't static. Things are changing (or at least they were). By the way we're pegging the leaked script as around July (see earlier posts for the reasoning) and a lot can change in 5 months. So really the best thing to do is just be cool and wait for March.

[Ieldra]

Just stumbled upon of the rare Miranda/MShep fanfics. It's AU, but more in a secret-history kind of way, meaning compatible to known events. It's also set in 2172 - for now, and unfinished. Anyway, worth a look.

Hellhound by LivingLow.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 03 décembre 2011 - 11:45 .

[jtav]

I saw that. The summary makes it sound similar-ish to Portrait. Do I need to stay away?

And, yes, I was going to kill her. That lasted until I decided she was still Claire. They deserve a happy end. I assume you still want to see Portrait proper after this?

[TomY90]

I wonder if cerberus did monitor Shepard before becoming a spectre and if so I wonder if Miranda was ever involved in it?

[alperez]

CrutchCricket wrote...

Nope, for the same reason you can't look at a half-cooked burger and conclude it'll be ****. The rest of your point basically amounts to a glass half full or empty idea, which doesn't work because this isn't static. Things are changing (or at least they were). By the way we're pegging the leaked script as around July (see earlier posts for the reasoning) and a lot can change in 5 months. So really the best thing to do is just be cool and wait for March.

If you've seen someone spit on that burger, drop in on the floor and wipe it against their chest before putting it back on the burner to finish cooking though, then you can pretty much conclude just exactly what type of a burger you may be getting.

As for a glass half full or empty and this not being static, the problem is that's conjecture on your part, we won't know how static it actually is until the game is relased, it could be that it is as it was or its changed, but since we don't know yet which, we can only go on the info we have and wait and see how much of that info is correct or incorrect when the game is released.

The problem with this is we do have previous experience with a leaked script and previous experience with a lot will be changed or its an old build talk and when the game came out we found that not much if anything had changed and the script was pretty much as was in the leak, so what do we do, believe that this time it'll be different based on pretty much the same experiences or treat it with suspicion until we see it for ourselves, fool me once and all that does apply.

While indeed a lot of things can change, the reverse is also true, the problem with the leak is that even where things have been changed, a lot of things stay pretty much the same,so while some things get finetuned the overall scope doesn't change that much.

Example the Vs still plays pretty much the same role in both versions, all that's changed is the outcome or which situations force them to play that role, which in some ways shows more of what may be a problem than actually seeing the entire thing, it shows the direction that characters seem to be taking and the direction that the plot seems to be going, which is pretty much the issue some people have that causes the gloom in the first place.

Regardless at this point we're probably covering more old ground that we and certainly i've covered before, we can all decide to be doom and gloom merchants or we can look on the brightside, that's up to each of us individually, we can buy, not buy, believe the most positive aspects or the most negative aspects of what the script leak means or doesn't, at the end of the day none of us will know one way or another until march anyway.

I can only speak for myself, at this point i'm expecting less than i wanted and hoping for more than i expect, i'll still be buying the game (unless i hear something even more drastic than i have thus far) and i'll judge it after playing, only i'm not as excited about it as i was, which is for me unfortunately a position i didn't expect to be in.

[Ieldra]

jtav wrote...
I saw that. The summary makes it sound similar-ish to Portrait. Do I need to stay away?

There are similarities, yes. I don't know what you're planning for Portrait, so I can't say if you should stay away, but Portrait has already covered the equivalent of the first 10 chapters of "Hellhound". Also it appears to be planned that Shepard works for Cerberus all the time. And this John Shepard is nothing like Matt.

And, yes, I was going to kill her. That lasted until I decided she was still Claire. They deserve a happy end. I assume you still want to see Portrait proper after this?

I would very much like that, yes.

[Ieldra]

TomY90 wrote...
I wonder if cerberus did monitor Shepard before becoming a spectre and if so I wonder if Miranda was ever involved in it?

Several fanfics cover this topic, the two mentioned on this page among them.

[Dr. Doctor]

It could be possible. The major question I have is has Cerberus' background been retconned? In ME1 Admiral Kahoku tells us that Cerberus ran black ops for the Alliance but went rogue. ME2 tells us that Cerberus has always been its own independent organization.

This could either mean that Cerberus and the Alliance had some sort of unofficial agreement between eachother and had a falling out. Or that the whole ME1 story for Cerberus has been wiped out.

[Ieldra]

And we need more Miranda pictures to remind ourselves that we love her... If this outbreak of pessimism continues, I might feel tempted to turn into MEFan101 just to offset it.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 04 décembre 2011 - 12:05 .

[jtav]

Indeed. Please someone remind me why she's worth it. I have yet to take Matt through the game. (He's my Hawke, not my Shep) Why shouldn't he go for Liara or Jack the way things are going?

[flemm]

CrutchCricket wrote...
Well then I trust we've said what needed to be said about it and there is no reason to overstate its importance or indeed keep bringing it up? Unless of course a newbie asks about it. For the record though I do trust you to present it as objectively as possible;)

Well, to each his/her own. The importance of various features of the game will vary a lot according to individual taste, as will the degree to which fans are willing to make lemonade with lemons/be accomodating/make excuses for the devs/look on the bright side, etc. And no doubt myriad other responses as well.

For my part, if there's anything I have little patience for on forums like this, it's people trying too hard to control the conversation one way or another. You make a lot of good points, and I appreciate what you bring to many discussions overall, but the more your perspective amounts to "stop talking about X," the less I'm likely to sympathise.

The reason people are pissed about the leak is not because of crazed fan expectations. It's because Miranda's role in the leaked script sucks: in terms of the size of the role, in terms of what she accomplishes in the small amount of time she would actually be on screen, and because of where she ends up (nowhere). It would be an extremely weak and disappointing way for the character's story to conclude, and, what's more, there would be no reason/excuse for it, given how the story is laid out.

So, I think it's entirely appropriate to wait and see what the final version looks like, but also to articulate that point of view now, as often and as clearly as possible.

alperez wrote...
If you've seen someone spit on that burger, drop in on the floor and wipe it against their chest before putting it back on the burner to finish cooking though, then you can pretty much conclude just exactly what type of a burger you may be getting.

LoL

Where the burger may have been dropped on the floor may very well turn out to be the Suicide Mission, unfortunately. It's not only that the game is going to have to bend over backwards to accomodate the possible absence of all these characters, it's how much development time and resources will be spent making that work, rather than allowing big decisions, like the Rachni and the Collector Base, to play out in interesting ways.

Modifié par flemm, 04 décembre 2011 - 12:17 .

[alperez]

Dr. Doctor wrote...

It could be possible. The major question I have is has Cerberus' background been retconned? In ME1 Admiral Kahoku tells us that Cerberus ran black ops for the Alliance but went rogue. ME2 tells us that Cerberus has always been its own independent organization.

This could either mean that Cerberus and the Alliance had some sort of unofficial agreement between eachother and had a falling out. Or that the whole ME1 story for Cerberus has been wiped out.

Depending on which threads or groups you read, me1 has been completely wiped from existence, not just in relation to cerberus but to other things as well.

But in terms of Cerberus specifically (and speaking as a non fan of them) at times it seems like either they have no idea what they wanted them to be or they've gone back and forth so many times that they don't know what their original plans for them were.

I personally think me1's Kahoku's explanation was originally the route they wanted, but they scrapped it because to tell it correctly required a tad too much complexity or could take them to places they didn't want to go to.

Unfortunately, while they scrapped the idea they forgot to scrap certain things in the story so it becomes a convuluted mess and they want us to forget everything we know and just focus on the cerberus are evil inc, see now we can kill them plotline.

[alperez]

flemm wrote...

Where the burger may have been dropped on the floor may very well turn out to be the Suicide Mission, unfortunately. It's not only that the game is going to have to bend over backwards to accomodate the possible absence of all these characters, it's how much development time and resources will be spent making that work, rather than allowing big decisions, like the Rachni and the Collector Base, to play out in interesting ways.

I was actually having the SM discussion today (guard duty really is boring, luckily no one really wants to assassinate our minister for defence anyway lol), where they made a mistake wasn't imo in the concept but the execution.

Here's what i mean, why not have taken the repurcussions out of our hands, forget loyalty as a reasons for people dying and instead use it for a reason for them dying or living in me3 or the nature of the role they may play, as for upgrades well use them like Thane's or Samara's where they give an advantage in gameplay but not in deciding who lives or dies.

Then in the SM have forced deaths, so where we get to the potential deaths of characters, kill off the extras or non essentials that really shouldn't play a large role in me3, so Zaeed dies irrespective of how you play or you lose Jacob no matter what, things like that, make the ending a victory but not a complete one, so we feel good that we stopped the collectors, but bad because it cost lives to do so.

That way, you'd be able to trim down the squad from the 12 to say a manageable 6, then you do the same again come me3, where you lose half the survivors to smaller roles, but get the other half to play the large roles they probably should.

I know that removes the element of us being why someone lives or dies, but it'd be so much better imo, give Shepard a reason to be a little Angsty in me3, which creates a reason why the LI or certain characters become even more important to Shepard and up's the stakes tension wise in the conflict we're about to face.

Either that or just don't freakin put a SM in the second act of a trilogy, you numpties.

As for the other choices, again if you don't intend them to have consequences that are different then don't put them in, its not rocket science, diverging paths aren't a new thing, they just require them to be plotted out beforehand.