82210 réponses à ce sujet

[Burneye Is God]

ThomGau wrote...

Don't worry, as for Miranda's role, even if she is not on the squad, what's coming seems to be good . Without spoiling you anything, it seems we'll still have quite a few interactions / conversations with her, which is the most important thing in my book.
As for her VA, Hudson, I believe confirmed that Yvonne will be back, it'd be idiotic not to be honest about this, hundreds of fans would be greatly displeased about the lead director lying about such an important thing . Also, I think she's already done ME2 VA while recording Chuck .
Moreover, I would find it really inappropriate if they change her VA but not her face, I mean, Miranda has Yvonne's face and voice . So if they change her voice, they have to change her face as well, logical isn't it ?   And I can't see that happening .
Anyway, if her VA has changed it better be good, really good !

dude u got any links to these spoilers?

[CrutchCricket]

Lemon, you'd be hardpressed to point out more than a handful of these mythical "reasonable fans". I'm afraid that fans (especially on the internet) are largely of the type that fit my sig perfectly.

[flemm]

Well, Garrus is the series' permanent sidekick, so he was always going to be there, I 'm sure. And, given that Tali and Garrus have alway been a pair, essentially, I doubt it took much convincing, if any, for the devs to make them both squad members again this time around.

Miranda is a different kind of character, though, so, while I certainly don't believe that the ****ing about the ME2 cast being side-lined is misplaced (I will certainly do some ****ing about that, and already have), the reality is that Miranda is not really a companion character. She's more of a lead character who can no longer be the lead character, so to speak, because she was the lead NPC of the prior game.

So... what makes sense is for her to become essentially the protagonist of a parallel story that intersects with Shepard's story. We talked about this option repeatedly in the thread prior to the leak, and a lot of us really liked the idea, myself included. I was actually sceptical that they would do it that way, as there was really nothing like it in prior games.

Anyway, one reason I'm going to hold off on the negativity is that I think there's a reasonably good chance that we'll get, well... pretty much exactly what we asked for. So... that would be silly, to **** about that too much.

Modifié par flemm, 06 janvier 2012 - 03:40 .

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

11 pages left til 1000. Keep it up! Don't slack!

[JeffZero]

Well said, flemm.

[nitefyre410]

AgitatedLemon wrote...

CrutchCricket wrote...

AgitatedLemon wrote...

@nitefyre

While not necessarily a fan of Garrus and Tali (Well, I like Garrus, indifferent about Tali) it may just be me, but it seems like BioWare just caved under the outrage from these 2's respective bases.

Either that... or maybe the writers themselves are biased towards ME1 characters. Fans are whiny and belligerent but can ultimately only b!tch on forums. Or in rare cases get Subway to sponsor their cause.

I use the term "Fan" incredibly loosely.

If they're a "Fan", they won't complain and **** and moan about every little thing the character may do, -- Like the hefty majority of the Tali/Garrus base does -- They may take concern, but they'd have the self respect and decency to voice their opinions with logic and reasoning, not hate and vitriol. The people BioWare listened to weren't fans, they were the MEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEME people on the forums.

To quote TotalBiscuit, it's OK to not like things, but don't be a dick about it.

 

Exactly....   but see there is Fandom... and then  Fan dumb. 

[CrutchCricket]

flemm you have some good points I happen to agree with. That being said it still sounds like a justification that's on the stretch. Not an unreasonable stretch mind you but a stretch nonetheless. I remember discussing conditions where non-squad would be acceptable but what little spoilerish info has trickled my way does not support the belief that those conditions are met.
It seems we're happy her character is intact. But I for one wanted more. It's like having an awesome computer you know works great and does everything you want it to... but only having access to it for an hour or two.

[AgitatedLemon]

And, given that Tali and Garrus have alway been a pair, essentially, I doubt it took much convincing, if any, for the devs to make them both squad members again this time around.

And here's where I disagree with you. I'll give you Garrus, he does give the vibe of being Robin to Shepard's Batman, but Tali?

It may just be me, when I think of Garrus and Shepard, both of whom are soldiers to the core, I don't think of Tali. I think of someone who isn't afraid to fight, or to die. Someone who doesn't let their emotions override their thoughts and logic process. Tali (As evidenced by her loyalty mission) does these things, given dialogue choice.

If anyone to associate with Garrus and Shepard, it would be Miranda, as cheesy as that sounds, coming from me.

@Crutch, I think a better analogy would be between having a "Decent enough" computer, something that can play Skyrim and BF3 fairly reasonably, and having a military grade supercomputer that can play Skyrim, Crysis 2, and BF3 on all ultra settings at 120 FPS with no hiccups.

[jtav]

It's not really that much of a stretch. She shows up early and keeps showing up throughout the game. She does at least one awesome thing that I hope gets a cutscene, And there are hints that we'll get exactly what we wanted in terms of her future. I'd rather have that than have her be Shepard's pet dog--and that's what she'd be on the Normandy.

[flemm]

CrutchCricket wrote...
It seems we're happy her character is intact. But I for one wanted more. It's like having an awesome computer you know works great and does everything you want it to... but only having access to it for an hour or two.

It's not just her character being intact that I'm talking about, though. I'm talking about her story in the game potentially being more than awesome enough for me not to care if she's a squad member.

Given what's there, I could easily see it being on that level. I can't say it will be, but I think it's... plausible. So... wait and see?

Basically, if the story ends the way it should there won't be much "more" to ask for.

[AgitatedLemon]

jtav wrote...

It's not really that much of a stretch. She shows up early and keeps showing up throughout the game. She does at least one awesome thing that I hope gets a cutscene, And there are hints that we'll get exactly what we wanted in terms of her future. I'd rather have that than have her be Shepard's pet dog--and that's what she'd be on the Normandy.

It's possible for her to be on the Normandy and not be Shepard's lapdog.


As I've suggested (Some may not agree, but I think it's an OK enough idea), Miranda can join the Normandy and crew after we help her with her personal business.

[Terminatort800]

MASSEFFECTfanforlife101 wrote...

11 pages left til 1000. Keep it up! Don't slack!

wow this thread is really long...nice

[JeffZero]

jtav wrote...

It's not really that much of a stretch. She shows up early and keeps showing up throughout the game. She does at least one awesome thing that I hope gets a cutscene, And there are hints that we'll get exactly what we wanted in terms of her future. I'd rather have that than have her be Shepard's pet dog--and that's what she'd be on the Normandy.

Ah, news to me that she shows up early. Last I heard on the matter, Miranda didn't show up for an unnervingly long time. Mind, all I do spoilers-wise is get the general gist from you kind, spoiler-intensive folks, and that was a ling time ago.

[CrutchCricket]

I don't know. If I really wanted the supercomputer... spent all this time discussing the specs and fantasizing about what it'd be like... I'd still be a tad disappointed with only the "decent" version...
The stuff I was talking about didn't necessarily nail her to the Normandy either. But all of the other scenarios I thought about had a focus on consistent interactivity or at least the option for it. She could be on the other side of the galaxy as long as I had the option to call her up whenever. Can you say that's gonna happen?

[flemm]

AgitatedLemon wrote...
As I've suggested (Some may not agree, but I think it's an OK enough idea), Miranda can join the Normandy and crew after we help her with her personal business.

I'm cool with that idea, of course, and there may be a moment in the game where it makes sense for her to join up. If she doesn't, then that may be irritating.

But, basically they've set up a situation where you meet up with her and talk with her enough that it almost doesn't really matter. There's an important piece missing, at the end, which is really frustrating, because if it were there, I'd be feeling really good about the whole thing. As it is, I can't really say we should be happy about this, but I think there's a reasonably good chance that we will be.

Modifié par flemm, 06 janvier 2012 - 04:03 .

[jtav]

No, she would have to take a pretty severe narrative demotion to join the team. She is not--cannot--be the lead again. The best she can hope for is sidekick. Which isn't a big deal for Tali and Garrus, but is a big deal for Miranda. One of the things I've liked is that she could double as a protagonist in her own right. They appear to have run with that as far as they feasibly could. The only thing that annoys me now is sheer mechanical squad balance.

[wright1978]

flemm wrote...

It's not just her character being intact that I'm talking about, though. I'm talking about her story in the game potentially being more than awesome enough for me not to care if she's a squad member.

Sorry i can't agree at all that her beta leak story content can be described as awesome.

[naledgeborn]

^ I agree.

[CrutchCricket]

jtav wrote...

No, she would have to take a pretty severe narrative demotion to join the team. She is not--cannot--be the lead again.

Explain?

[jtav]

JeffZero wrote...

jtav wrote...

It's not really that much of a stretch. She shows up early and keeps showing up throughout the game. She does at least one awesome thing that I hope gets a cutscene, And there are hints that we'll get exactly what we wanted in terms of her future. I'd rather have that than have her be Shepard's pet dog--and that's what she'd be on the Normandy.

Ah, news to me that she shows up early. Last I heard on the matter, Miranda didn't show up for an unnervingly long time. Mind, all I do spoilers-wise is get the general gist from you kind, spoiler-intensive folks, and that was a ling time ago.

spoiler *You can talk with her in person on the Citadel the first time you're there. You have four conversations with her, either in person or by comm*

[flemm]

CrutchCricket wrote...
Can you say that's gonna happen?

Well, not in those terms, exactly. But... her mission will happen, it seems, around two thirds of the way through the game. This is likely going to be approximately as substantial as her loyalty mission in ME2, maybe more... hard to say, exactly, because it's unfinished.

Prior to that, it seems you speak to her on four separate occasions, starting early in the game. I doubt you'd have more dialogs than that had she been on the Normandy all that time.

And the mission really makes it pretty clear that she was intended, at least at this stage of development, to show up at least one more time prior to the endgame, plus the endgame.

Basically, what we said was that it would be fine for her not to be on the squad as long as interaction was not limited, well, I think that answers the description.

Listen, basically, I will complain, if it is warranted, and loudly. But I won't if it isn't.

Modifié par flemm, 06 janvier 2012 - 04:09 .

[JeffZero]

That's nifty, jtav. Very nifty. Delighted to hear it, all things considered. And you can go to that particular location quite early, yes?

[jtav]

CrutchCricket wrote...

jtav wrote...

No, she would have to take a pretty severe narrative demotion to join the team. She is not--cannot--be the lead again.

Explain?

Precisely what I said. She was lead NPC. That role can no longer be hers because she must be optional. So, they've given her her own little story stretching the entire game.

[flemm]

wright1978 wrote...
Sorry i can't agree at all that her beta leak story content can be described as awesome.

I understand that. And I'm not saying: you should be happy about this.

I may very well not end up beiing happy about it either. And then I will complain.

But we're looking at text files from May or June. And we know it's unfinished, apparently the lead writer hadn't even focused on this yet. So... it's just too early to judge imo.

Modifié par flemm, 06 janvier 2012 - 04:17 .

[CrutchCricket]

jtav wrote...
Precisely what I said. She was lead NPC. That role can no longer be hers because she must be optional. So, they've given her her own little story stretching the entire game.

I guess I'm not getting what you mean by "lead NPC". For example who do you think was the "lead NPC" in ME1?

As for the rest of it I'm not really complaining or saying it's bad. Just that I personally wanted more. Doesn't mean I won't enjoy what's there. After all some is better than none and in the computer analogy if it runs the games you want it to, it's good enough right?